2019 U20 European Championship

[Toruko]

Finally, on the lighter note, I am happy that Goksenin is catching on. I love that clown that pretends to be a basketball player, it's an inside joke between me and some forum guys from the past. The same goes with Yagmur and his infamous Kofta Shake move

Göksenin Köksal, Birkan Batuk and Sertac Sanli are our shame. They should never be counted as basketball player.

[Dreamcatcher]

I remembered a fat Turkish guy Duran playing in this team - does he still play basketball?

[CoachZ]

I remembered a fat Turkish guy Duran playing in this team - does he still play basketball?

I think he was added to Fenerbahce senior team to practice and develop but has been let go this offseason...

[Furkan Korkmaz]

I remembered a fat Turkish guy Duran playing in this team - does he still play basketball?

He plays in the second league, his team was in the playoffs for promotion to the first. Very physical guy. He had a big contribution in the u16 and u17 medals we got, but hasn’t played ever since due to injuries. I don’t know why he didn’t show up this time, becasue as far as I know this time he was healthy. We could have definitely used him.

[Furkan Korkmaz]

Ok Göksenin one last time and I’m closing this subject.

Firstly you should read better, this current rank I gave wasn’t based on the past, in the past we’d actually be a 1-3 catehory team, I think that’s clear. If we would take out our calculators and see the avarage rank for each country over all youth branches with this particular generation I would say Spain Lithuania and Turkey are by far the most consistent teams. Turkey has only not made the top 5 once, the debut u18 when the guys were 1 year younger and the team missed Bitim and Duran who at that time were too important (we missed them more often but their significance had decreased by then). I have not targeted Serbia with a “switcheroo” I just pointed out that we had structurally performed better than you AND almost every other team - and all this while having never played without guys missing. Atar being bad made us 3-5, not 6-8, him being good I would have put us right back at 1-3. And remember this is about category, not actual ranking. Although tempting I would also give you this much credit to not put you in the 13-16 category where you currently are . And no, I have done my best to keep Serbia out of it because we were discussing about Turkey, so don’t come with these terms like “switcheroo”. As for linear development, yes they didnt but that’s where guys like Hazer and Akay who were not even in the shadow of Bitim in the past have surpassed my expectations. Even with a bad Atar this team is not 6-8, nobody who claims to understand basketball can tell me this. Last but not least, Göksenin may be a joke but your predicting skills are no better than his basketball skills. . See you at the u18. You’re in our group and I am looking forward to it.

[TurkfromGermany]

Because Ahmetcan Duran has no future, he couldn´t contribute anything at this level. You could have bad body but then you must find a way to be no black hole in the defense like Alperen Sengün(anyway much better body as Ahmetcan), Mert Konuk etc. And Duran´s offense was overrated.......

Turkish bb must to find modern bigs instead of bigs like Oguz Savas, Ahmetcan Duran etc.

[CoachZ]

Ok Göksenin one last time and I’m closing this subject.

Firstly you should read better, this current rank I gave wasn’t based on the past, in the past we’d actually be a 1-3 catehory team, I think that’s clear. If we would take out our calculators and see the avarage rank for each country over all youth branches with this particular generation I would say Spain Lithuania and Turkey are by far the most consistent teams. Turkey has only not made the top 5 once, the debut u18 when the guys were 1 year younger and the team missed Bitim and Duran who at that time were too important (we missed them more often but their significance had decreased by then). I have not targeted Serbia with a “switcheroo” I just pointed out that we had structurally performed better than you AND almost every other team - and all this while having never played without guys missing. Atar being bad made us 3-5, not 6-8, him being good I would have put us right back at 1-3. And remember this is about category, not actual ranking. Although tempting I would also give you this much credit to not put you in the 13-16 category where you currently are . And no, I have done my best to keep Serbia out of it because we were discussing about Turkey, so don’t come with these terms like “switcheroo”. As for linear development, yes they didnt but that’s where guys like Hazer and Akay who were not even in the shadow of Bitim in the past have surpassed my expectations. Even with a bad Atar this team is not 6-8, nobody who claims to understand basketball can tell me this. Last but not least, Göksenin may be a joke but your predicting skills are no better than his basketball skills. . See you at the u18. You’re in our group and I am looking forward to it.

It is actually quite clear where we are not on the same page:

- I keep talking about predicting Turkish NT standings in this tournament alone
- You keep talking about the overall talent level while backing it with past performances.

Those are two completely different things. Once again, I predicted where Turkish NT will finish and I was pretty much right. On the other hand, your ranking is something you have only known, since you haven't made it public So, tell me is that fair Mr. Korkmaz?

If you want, we can play the prediction game in the upcoming tournament for U18. Of course, I expect you to make your picks before the games are actually played

PS. There is no such thing as Good Atar. He will always be bad. Being able to dominate kids with an accelerant body in youth categories is not something that translates well into talent and future. Since I have watched him, Berke Atar lacks aggressiveness on both offense and defense, is not a willing defender, a terrible rim protector for a guy of his size, limited in the use of both hands around the basket, he constantly gives up the position in the post, he is constantly exposed in the PnR etc. This has been true for him since he emerged in the youth categories and over the years nothing has changed. His physical profile was just too dominant in the younger age groups for his deficiencies to become a huge problem for the team. He will get more and more exposed as he gets older and tries to compete in professional basketball.

[slice me nice]

Serbia is relegated to Division B. With very low level basketball they have performed throughout the tournament, they totally deserved this relegation.

[CoachZ]

Serbia is relegated to Division B. With very low level basketball they have performed throughout the tournament, they totally deserved this relegation.

Yep. Completely deserved relegation and a nice slap for the federation to actually think about who is coaching the U20 guys in the future.

[Furkan Korkmaz]

We are not on the same page, but you still have failed to clarify your initial viewpoint, but at this point I don't really care about it anymore.

You do have a tendency to take my words and spin them out of context though, it seems to be a habit of yours. By "good Atar" I meant for U20 standards ofcourse.
I am aware of his flaws and never claimed that he was a high ceiling prospect, in fact he could only dream to ever wear the Turkish senior NT jersey, he is completely irrelevant to me considering I have guys like Yurtseven, Sengun and Bona to look forward to. However, we can't deny that Atar underperformed this tournament, you may watch him here and draw your conclusions, but I know for a fact he can do much better than this, especially offensively, but we'll see what he gives Banvit the coming season and the degree to which he gets "exposed".

Fine, hows this for a prediction; we know both our U18's are much better than our U20's, that's clear. So we will end higher than our (assumed) 5th and 15th places.
Hmmm, using our u17 world cup match as a reference (86-68 W for Turkey), and taking into consideration Nakic is still not coming....
I would say you will have an honorable battle for the 6-8th places and we will take nothing less than a medal .

[serbianhoops]

Serbia get relegated to Division B. No point in shooting the messenger. Let's rather understand the reasons that led us to this situation. 2 years ago, two thirds of the players were on the roster which took gold medal at the 2017 U18 European Championship (Petrušev, Koprivica, Petrović & Šarenac have been replaced by Stajčić, Đorđević, Simović & Jovičić, a substantial quality loss in my opinion). But the major change was Oliver Popović as head-coach instead of Vlada Jovanović whose curriculum vitae and reputation are far better. Popović's basic mistake was to call up Pecarski from the U19 NT to join the squad few days before the start of the competition and to give him the main role and a total freedom. The addition of Pecarski led to a complete reallocation of responsibilities and roles within the team. During the pre-tournament camp and friendlies, with Gazibegović instead of Pecarski, the team seemed to have a far better inside/perimeter balance. To all that must be added the fact that several college players (Nekić, Šarenac & especially Koprivica who would have very valuable on the defensive end) were unable to join the team due to scholastic obligations. Regarding the domestic league players, perhaps Barna could have made the team in place of Matić, but overall coach Popović has selected the best available players. In the end, no one could have forseen such a bad tournament from some expected leaders (Mišković, Uskoković & Marjanović) .

[serbianhoops]

Filip Barna (Spartak Subotica)

[serbianhoops]

Marko Šarenac (Marshall University NCAA)

[serbianhoops]

Vanja Gazibegović (Spartak Subotica). 2-year old footage. He drop his excessive baby fat and improved a lot his conditionning since turning pro.

[christodoulou76]

Nice win by Greece today. The team played very well against a Slovenian team that was hot from the 3-pt line all game. G. Kalaitzakis got a triple double, 23p, 10r, 11a and 36 EFF. Moraitis flirted with a triple double as well with 12p, 7r, 8a and 19EFF. I was particularly impressed with his passing today. The team as a whole passed the ball well (24 assists) and rebounded well (+10 compared to Slovenia).