Gilas in the next PBA conference

[OjiesIII2]

Chot Reyes is the Perfect Assistant to COach Toroman.. CHot + Dilinger will be a great addition to the Smart-Gilas..

 

[regierr2]

Well said bro... before the Asian Championship this year, I realized that BAP is not the ONLY reason why Philippine basketball failed in the international arena for the last 20 years... PBA has always been taking away the best players in the country before they get a chance to play for the national team... some did manage to play in the SEA Games or SEABA or Asian Championship before entering the league but those players only have one year tour of duty and before the team could form a successful combination... new players replace them because everyone expect them to be in the PBA after one year stint in the national team...

When the PBA started to send national teams and gave the best players in the country to play for flag and country.. those players have only that year to prepare.. and after the major tourney, the team was disbanded... so far, the most prepared team is Chot Reyes' RP Team (2005-2007)... three years of preparation but it wasn't enough to land a place in the play-offs simply because other Asian countries have already surpassed us and yes the "Group of Death"... if that team continue its program for the next two years, just like other posters said before, the 2009 Asian Championship result might've been different...

Our amateurs could have had more international exposure before entering the PBA if only the youths teams had a very organized basketball program similar to SBP's program. There was the under 18 and 21 tournaments which could have trained our best young players to compete internationally.

 

[manu_bol2]

i think we can make a comparison between gilas in this pba conference and yonsei university and RP-cebuana lhuilier in the pba invitationals in 2003 as those guest teams played the best the pba can offer:

game 1
red bull vs yonsei: 106-96
smb vs RP-cebuana: 95-55

game 2
tnt vs yonsei: 121-112

game 3
fedex vs yonsei:93-90


yonsei showed that, with a system, it can be competitive even against pro teams. the tallest player for yonsei is just about 6'6. these korean college kids are also reed thin.

if a college team can give pba teams a scare, why can't smart gilas - the tallest and youngest team in this tournament?

one reason: unlike yonsei, gilas is not playing to win at all costs. toro is experimenting on defense.

another reason: pinoys know how to play other pinoys. i don't think our college champions, ateneo (with norman black's system and all), can even come close to 10 points against TNT.

 

[ogre2]

Best way to help the current national team is to leave them to mature while upgrading the team composition with good players willing to stay with the team for the long term.

 

[OjiesIII2]

Our amateurs could have had more international exposure before entering the PBA if only the youths teams had a very organized basketball program similar to SBP's program. There was the under 18 and 21 tournaments which could have trained our best young players to compete internationally.

Agree with you bro! that what SBP is doing right now!! scouting players abroad, endless international competetions, even trying to host an event like FIBA ASIA.. right now we are on the right track and hope it will not change.

 

[nardy2]

Agree with you bro! that what SBP is doing right now!! scouting players abroad, endless international competetions, even trying to host an event like FIBA ASIA.. right now we are on the right track and hope it will not change.

am praying that the program is not affected by the results of the 2010 Elections and whoever wins would just leave alone the autonamy of the SBP but if they could help in the funding without getting involved in the operations of the NSA it would be appreciated especially in our drive to host FIBA events.

 

[GoldenStallion872]

am praying that the program is not affected by the results of the 2010 Elections and whoever wins would just leave alone the autonamy of the SBP but if they could help in the funding without getting involved in the operations of the NSA it would be appreciated especially in our drive to host FIBA events.

I share your worries. Hope it does not turn into another NCC program. After the Marcos regime was overthrown so did the successful NCC program.

 

[OjiesIII2]

am praying that the program is not affected by the results of the 2010 Elections and whoever wins would just leave alone the autonamy of the SBP but if they could help in the funding without getting involved in the operations of the NSA it would be appreciated especially in our drive to host FIBA events.

Any Presidential candidate that you advise sir?? Noynoy i think love basketball..

 

[lizardking2]

Too much blaming and hating the PBA for the failures since 1975. In my humble opinion, that would not be accurate.

During the earlier years we had a decisive edge in skill. It didn’t matter if we just assembled a squad prior to competition, we could still win because of better skills and a better understanding of the game. But in the decade prior to 1975 the other Asian countries were starting to catch up. Suddenly we didn’t have a monopoly of the Asian crowns. Superior teamplay was starting to make a dent on our skill set. Just be objective guys and take a look at history, we were starting to lose even before the PBA.

Skills can only take you so far. There will come a point when you will lose to less skilled players but better TEAMPLAY. This trend also happened to the US National Teams. It just took longer to hit them in the face because they had something we never had, skills + HEIGHT.

So there we were, already losing our grip. Then came 1975 and the PBA was formed. And yes, we never won again (except for NCC). Was the PBA the real reason. In my opinion, it was the fact that the People’s Republic of China started participating and not only put us on a losing streak, they also put the other countries (Korea and Japan) that were already beating us from time to time on a losing streak as well. The year 1975 was just an unfortunate coincidence.

To counter this disastrous situation, it was the job of BAP to address the problem. It was their job, not the PBA. Blame should be on them, not the PBA. Some will say, how can the BAP form an NT when the amateurs are enticed to turn pro by the lucrative promise of the PBA? My answer would be in this question, how come Danding had the foresight to do it and form a competitive NT even if the PBA existed? I don’t know if Danding’s plan came from BAP but somehow its hard to believe that a businessman pre-occupied with running so many corporations has more time to think creative basketball that BAP people who are supposed to think about basketball all day. But it seems it did happen.

The NCC team brought back glory but it was disbanded. Still we already saw the winning formula. It was not that the PBA was the problem, it was just that we needed a full time NT with corporate backing. The PBA even came in handy as a training ground to hone the NT’s skills. The PBA wasn’t the problem, it was even a part of the solution. It was boot camp for the NT.

Given a road map to success, the NCC formula, did the BAP follow it? No. Binigay na nga yung tamang sagot e ayaw pa mangopya. They wanted shortcuts. They wanted to ask somebody who wasn’t even obligated to help, the PBA. Despite the fact that it aint their job, despite the fact that they lose millions everytime they do so, the PBA helped. Because like you and me, there is a patriotic streak in the men who run the PBA. Of course there were time constraints. The PBA had to strike a balance between earning their livelihood and patriotism. What do we expect, for the PBA to totally ruin their business for a job thats not even theirs. Put in the same situation, would you ruin yours?

 

[DigitalD2]

Good program but the results will

 

[nardy2]

Any Presidential candidate that you advise sir?? Noynoy i think love basketball..

It's not actually particular presidentiable personalities. Am just worried of having an administration that has close connections with BAP personalities, that would mean bad news. But since you asked, I have no idea about Noynoy's sentiments. But Gibo could be a problem due to Pichay and Villafuerte. Also know Villar is close to Pichay and Villafuerte. I am also puzzled on which group who is connecting MVP to Erap.

Anyway as long as they respect the autonomy, then there's no problem.

 

[jesronne2]

It's not actually particular presidentiable personalities. Am just worried of having an administration that has close connections with BAP personalities, that would mean bad news. But since you asked, I have no idea about Noynoy's sentiments. But Gibo could be a problem due to Pichay and Villafuerte. Also know Villar is close to Pichay and Villafuerte. I am also puzzled on which group who is connecting MVP to Erap.

Anyway as long as they respect the autonomy, then there's no problem.

but MVP is considered as one of the VP for lakas-kampi... i doubt villar and gibo could win... it will be noynoy!

 

[alien space bats2]

Too much blaming and hating the PBA for the failures since 1975. In my humble opinion, that would not be accurate.

During the earlier years we had a decisive edge in skill. It didn’t matter if we just assembled a squad prior to competition, we could still win because of better skills and a better understanding of the game. But in the decade prior to 1975 the other Asian countries were starting to catch up. Suddenly we didn’t have a monopoly of the Asian crowns. Superior teamplay was starting to make a dent on our skill set. Just be objective guys and take a look at history, we were starting to lose even before the PBA.

Skills can only take you so far. There will come a point when you will lose to less skilled players but better TEAMPLAY. This trend also happened to the US National Teams. It just took longer to hit them in the face because they had something we never had, skills + HEIGHT.

So there we were, already losing our grip. Then came 1975 and the PBA was formed. And yes, we never won again (except for NCC). Was the PBA the real reason. In my opinion, it was the fact that the People’s Republic of China started participating and not only put us on a losing streak, they also put the other countries (Korea and Japan) that were already beating us from time to time on a losing streak as well. The year 1975 was just an unfortunate coincidence.

To counter this disastrous situation, it was the job of BAP to address the problem. It was their job, not the PBA. Blame should be on them, not the PBA. Some will say, how can the BAP form an NT when the amateurs are enticed to turn pro by the lucrative promise of the PBA? My answer would be in this question, how come Danding had the foresight to do it and form a competitive NT even if the PBA existed? I don’t know if Danding’s plan came from BAP but somehow its hard to believe that a businessman pre-occupied with running so many corporations has more time to think creative basketball that BAP people who are supposed to think about basketball all day. But it seems it did happen.

The NCC team brought back glory but it was disbanded. Still we already saw the winning formula. It was not that the PBA was the problem, it was just that we needed a full time NT with corporate backing. The PBA even came in handy as a training ground to hone the NT’s skills. The PBA wasn’t the problem, it was even a part of the solution. It was boot camp for the NT.

Given a road map to success, the NCC formula, did the BAP follow it? No. Binigay na nga yung tamang sagot e ayaw pa mangopya. They wanted shortcuts. They wanted to ask somebody who wasn’t even obligated to help, the PBA. Despite the fact that it aint their job, despite the fact that they lose millions everytime they do so, the PBA helped. Because like you and me, there is a patriotic streak in the men who run the PBA. Of course there were time constraints. The PBA had to strike a balance between earning their livelihood and patriotism. What do we expect, for the PBA to totally ruin their business for a job thats not even theirs. Put in the same situation, would you ruin yours?

The decline of Philippine basketball in the asian and international scene never became more evident when the PBA came to existence. now this is not a conclusive fact. It could be that the PBA came at a really really wrong time when RP basketball was about to be surpassed by the other nations at any rate. All the same, its existence is still the single, easiest explanation for our decline just for existing around the same time when other asian nations began surpassing the philippines in a consistent alarming capacity. Res ipsa loquitur, my old friend. The burden of proving that it is not their fault tips toward their side, and not ours- or mine for that matter.

No matter, PBA has been given a full 35 years to prove that it is part of the solution rather than the problem. It has so far failed to convince a reasonable mind otherwise. In view thereof, I am convinced that by preponderance of evidence--- which is not exactly evidence beyond reasonable doubt but only evidence which might lead a reasonable mind to assume that one evidence is of greater weight than the evidence which is offered in opposition to it---the PBA is the reason why we degenerated in basketball.

 

[donmar2]

The decline of Philippine basketball in the asian and international scene never became more evident when the PBA came to existence. now this is not a conclusive fact. It could be that the PBA came at a really really wrong time when RP basketball was about to be surpassed by the other nations at any rate. All the same, its existence is still the single, easiest explanation for our decline just for existing around the same time when other asian nations began surpassing the philippines in a consistent alarming capacity. Res ipsa loquitur, my old friend. The burden of proving that it is not their fault tips toward their side, and not ours- or mine for that matter.

No matter, PBA has been given a full 35 years to prove that it is part of the solution rather than the problem. It has so far failed to convince a reasonable mind otherwise. In view thereof, I am convinced that by preponderance of evidence--- which is not exactly evidence beyond reasonable doubt but only evidence which might lead a reasonable mind to assume that one evidence is of greater weight that the evidence which is offered in opposition to it---the PBA is the reason why we degenerated in basketball.

Well said bro... delusional PBA fans should accept the fact that for the last 20 years or 30 years, along with BAP, PBA are one of the reasons why Philippine basketball fucks up.. simple as that...

Yes, it was the job of BAP to deliver but how the fuck would BAP able to form a competitive national team if the fucking PBA keeps snatching the best players in the country...

 

[rycorpz2]

Well said bro... delusional PBA fans should accept the fact that for the last 20 years or 30 years, along with BAP, PBA are one of the reasons why Philippine basketball fucks up.. simple as that...

Yes, it was the job of BAP to deliver but how the fuck would BAP able to form a competitive national team if the fucking PBA keeps snatching the best players in the country...

I surely 100% agree Donnie that Devil's Advocate you know what that league IS

 

[lizardking2]

The decline of Philippine basketball in the asian and international scene never became more evident when the PBA came to existence. now this is not a conclusive fact. It could be that the PBA came at a really really wrong time when RP basketball was about to be surpassed by the other nations at any rate. All the same, its existence is still the single, easiest explanation for our decline just for existing around the same time when other asian nations began surpassing the philippines in a consistent alarming capacity. Res ipsa loquitur, my old friend. The burden of proving that it is not their fault tips toward their side, and not ours- or mine for that matter..

Hmm, lots of legalese, seems like we have a lawyer in the forum. That’s great.

You say the PBAs existence is still the single, easiest explanation for our decline? I beg to disagree. The problem with your reasoning my friend, in my opinion, is that it is a narrow, ethnocentric view of what is really an international event. You only consider local factors, have you considered the other countries were playing against, especially China. In your argument that the PBAs existence is still the single, easiest explanation for our decline, you make it appear that the only way the Philippines could lose and did lose is because we effectively let China win when we formed the PBA. Look at the entire scheme of things. Give China effing credit man. Not only did they whip our ass, they whipped the asses of the guys who were already beating us before the PBA existed.

China just joined in 1975 or thereabouts and whooped ass and theyre still at it. Now they got several NBA players. That’s res ipsa loquitur, those facts speaks for themselves. The entire world sees that and acknowledges that China improved to become a basketball power. But no, some in the Philippines don’t see it that way. They don’t give China (or other countries) credit. These people only see one side of the coin. They act like egocentric crybabies and fool themselves into believing were still the best and its just the PBA’s fault. Wake up to reality man. People improve, catch-up and sometimes surpass others. It’s the nature of things.

As I said in my previous post, heaping the blame on the PBA is NOT ACCURATE. Meaning, there may be a shred of truth to it but not entirely true. Because the main fault lies in the fact that we did not form a full time NT to counter the rise of China and the East Asians. Now, the West Asians as well. This is the identified problem and not the PBA. And that is why we have SG.

 

[lizardking2]

No matter, PBA has been given a full 35 years to prove that it is part of the solution rather than the problem. It has so far failed to convince a reasonable mind otherwise. In view thereof, I am convinced that by preponderance of evidence--- which is not exactly evidence beyond reasonable doubt but only evidence which might lead a reasonable mind to assume that one evidence is of greater weight than the evidence which is offered in opposition to it---the PBA is the reason why we degenerated in basketball.

Just nineteen (19) years since the Jawo team bro. Pros were previously not allowed to compete in FIBA.

The PBA is the very reason we have a very large pool of developed players compared to other Asian countries (except for China I think). That is because you, me and other used to be kids, grew up watching the PBA and wanting to be basketball heroes. Large pool = more potential talent in all levels = more possible NT members. All you need is a program to harness and maximize that talent. The PBA is the reason we degenerated in basketball? No sir, it does not follow. The lack of a program is.

Still, nice healthy exchange of ideas. Keep it up Attorney.

 

[ogre2]

Just nineteen (19) years since the Jawo team bro. Pros were previously not allowed to compete in FIBA.

The PBA is the very reason we have a very large pool of developed players compared to other Asian countries (except for China I think). That is because you, me and other used to be kids, grew up watching the PBA and wanting to be basketball heroes. Large pool = more potential talent in all levels = more possible NT members. All you need is a program to harness and maximize that talent. The PBA is the reason we degenerated in basketball? No sir, it does not follow. The lack of a program is.

Still, nice healthy exchange of ideas. Keep it up Attorney.

I think the reason for the large pool is MICAA. And it was Lou Salvador's, King Caloy's, Florencio's and our other heroes' battles and success made basketball really interesting for us. MICAA back them is also like the PBA but without the "professional" title and when the main clubs bolted out and founded the PBA, MICAA died and our best players were not allowed to play internationally because of the "Professional" title.

 

[lizardking2]

Well said bro... delusional PBA fans should accept the fact that for the last 20 years or 30 years, along with BAP, PBA are one of the reasons why Philippine basketball fucks up.. simple as that...

Yes, it was the job of BAP to deliver but how the fuck would BAP able to form a competitive national team if the fucking PBA keeps snatching the best players in the country...

With all due respect sir, but the fucking PBA did not snatch the best players, the best players applied voluntarily. The BAP could form a competitive NT with just the simple solution of finding a corporate sponsor. As history will show, we don't have a shortage of those corporations who would like to help.

 

[Red Baron2]

Having PBA has pros and cons, but i believe that PBA feeds the passion for the basketball game of the young filipino... i think biggest solution is to have a program and a good recruitment of player for the NT. I still believe that filipino are one of the best player in the world... For you guys just have faith to our national team and glory will follow.