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Thread: Lithuanian talents.

  1. #1

    Default Lithuanian talents.

    The reason i started this thread is this article:
    http://www.krepsinis.net/news.php?news_id=79009

    J. Vainauskas (Rytas owner) and some lithuanian coaches are saying that Lithuania is lacking real talents at the moment. The talents ended up with Macijauskas and Siskauskas. Generally, they think that Lithuania has a bad period now. Some coaches disagree, but generally the article means- there's no new talents in Lithuania at the moment.

    As for me, i completely disagree with that and even would say that Lithuanian basketball never was in better situation than current. Why:

    We have some extra talented players like L. Kleiza, J. Maciulis, P. Jankunas which already made influence in NT.. L. Kleiza is about 23 now and we never had such young player wich would be a real power in NBA would be one of the leaders in NT.

    More over, we have such players like Maciulis, Jankunas (Jomantas, Kalnietis) which are already doing great stuff in Euroleague.

    We have some extra talented players which might become very good players in the future- Gecevicius, Motiejunas, Vasiliauskas, Janavicius.

    And the main point which is crucial here- Jasikevicus, Siskauskas, Stombergas became super players being over 25. That's why i think Vainauskas and athers are wrong.

    What's your opinion on that?
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  2. #2
    Senior Member sashikas's Avatar
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    I think the main reason of Vainauskas' opinion about the lack of talents is that all the greatest talents of this generation are condensed in one team - Žalgiris-A.Sabonio mokykla, and he has no hopes to get them on the bench of Lietuvos rytas.

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by sashikas
    I think the main reason of Vainauskas' opinion about the lack of talents is that all the greatest talents of this generation are condensed in one team - Žalgiris-A.Sabonio mokykla, and he has no hopes to get them on the bench of Lietuvos rytas.
    Yeah, but Vainauskas' "dirty" opinion is the least interesting for me. Kairys and Nickus surprised me very much. What about their opinion? And what's your opinion about Lithuanian basketball situation generally? I don't give a damn about boring ZAL-RYT wars on this issue.
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    Senior Member re5pectas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward
    Yeah, but Vainauskas' "dirty" opinion is the least interesting for me. Kairys and Nickus surprised me very much. What about their opinion? And what's your opinion about Lithuanian basketball situation generally? I don't give a damn about boring ZAL-RYT wars on this issue.
    I think the topic of that article is just to attract readers
    And I don't think that it's "sooo bad". Even the quotes don't say so.

    Anyway, the idea that I would like to take from the article - Lithuanian basketball strategy, with federation and clubs involved. This is what we need a.t.m., imho.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member Test's Avatar
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    Well super intelligent zalgiris fans, I think that you think that Vainauskas opinion is bad only because he is Rytas owner LOL. It is funny to read your posts when you already know what you will write.

    Vainauskas opinion is very nice and accurate. Tell me at least one contrargument. Jaska, Stomba and Siskauskas became superplayers only at age 25?
    Siska was playing in Sydney olympics so you are wrong, my friend.
    Jasikevicius and Stomba? I agree, but to make your opinion on 2/3000000 peoples career is just ridiculous.

    My opinion is that I am glad we have different basketball philosophy that others. We dont have super stars who dunk 360 dunks or grab 20 rebound every game. We have universal people who can play like team thats why we win. We don't depend on one player (except PG position) and that makes us very strong, because basketball is not AND1, but team sport.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Test's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sashikas
    I think the main reason of Vainauskas' opinion about the lack of talents is that all the greatest talents of this generation are condensed in one team - Žalgiris-A.Sabonio mokykla, and he has no hopes to get them on the bench of Lietuvos rytas.
    yes, maybe you are right, but what would you like more? That Lithuanians play in Rytas and then in NT or just rott on zalgiris bench while the funny guy DC and Marcus are shooting from 9 meters?

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Test
    Well super intelligent zalgiris fans, I think that you think that Vainauskas opinion is bad only because he is Rytas owner LOL. It is funny to read your posts when you already know what you will write.

    Vainauskas opinion is very nice and accurate. Tell me at least one contrargument. Jaska, Stomba and Siskauskas became superplayers only at age 25?
    Siska was playing in Sydney olympics so you are wrong, my friend.
    Jasikevicius and Stomba? I agree, but to make your opinion on 2/3000000 peoples career is just ridiculous.

    My opinion is that I am glad we have different basketball philosophy that others. We dont have super stars who dunk 360 dunks or grab 20 rebound every game. We have universal people who can play like team thats why we win. We don't depend on one player (except PG position) and that makes us very strong, because basketball is not AND1, but team sport.
    Vainaskas' opinion isn't interesting for me cause he's ranking everything trought Rytas position. Why he doesn't see Kleiza, Maciulis, Jankunas when we talk about lithuanian talents?

    It isn't only about Jasikevicius and Stombergas. It's the same about M. Zukauskas, M. Timinskas, E. Zukauskas, D. Songaila and athers.

    I agree about your opinion on our Lithuanian team philosophy, though it was different in Sabas' and Marciulionis era.
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  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Test
    yes, maybe you are right, but what would you like more? That Lithuanians play in Rytas and then in NT or just rott on zalgiris bench while the funny guy DC and Marcus are shooting from 9 meters?
    This strategy might change even next year. Zalgiris will trust on young palyers more.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Test
    yes, maybe you are right, but what would you like more? That Lithuanians play in Rytas and then in NT or just rott on zalgiris bench while the funny guy DC and Marcus are shooting from 9 meters?
    Oh, they will play in Rytas and then in NT?.. ;D

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    Very debatable theme,because nobody knows what can happen with young players in two-three years... We dont know how will be develop skills growth such youngsters as Janavicius,Gecevicius or Matejunas. As for my opinion,in your country you have too much foreign players in two major clubs. Look,with this situation (5-6 import players)you can lose Mantas Kalnietis,who had lack time in Euroleague and even in final series he plays no more than 5-10 minutes... If Lithuania want to see strong NT in future,you should decrease quantity of foreign players,this,s for sure. And definitely,u should trust more own youngsters.I think it,s should be your way,the same as yougoslavians. And please,don,t compare Russia and Lithuania in this quastion.We,re in different financial weight category.

  11. #11
    Junior Member kaunaz's Avatar
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    Where are no problem of talents in Lithuania:
    1985:
    1.Kleiza is already a big star. And in few years he gonna be just like Karnisovas or even better.
    2.Maciulis also became a national team level player. And since 2009 Eurobasket when some older players will retire he would be one of the leaders.

    Also Seibutis and Jomantas got some potencial. But Jomantas now is No.1 most hated in Lithuania because of his dirty defensive tricks to injury someone.
    1986:
    1.Kalnietis should play SG mostly and the problem is that coaches and media wants to make him a playmaker. And of course is bad that he has to sit on the bench most of the games.
    2.Andriuskevicius. Maybe where are stil some hopes about him.
    1987:
    1.Dilys
    2.Butkevicius
    1988:
    Gecevicius
    1989:
    1.Vasiliauskas
    2.Janavicius
    3.Cepukaitis
    4.Lipkevicius
    5.Juskevicius
    1990:
    1.Motiejunas
    2.Sapiega
    3.Slezas
    1991:
    Peciukevicius
    1992:
    1.Cizauskas. Eurolegue NIKE IJT 2008 (U-18) stats: 18 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 5.7 spg! And he was 2 years younger than most of opponents!

  12. #12
    Senior Member Marius123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Test
    Vainauskas opinion is very nice and accurate.
    He's right in the sense: "Currently, in smaller LKL teams, there's a lack of free young leaders who would be ready for transfer to Lietuvos Rytas".

    That doesn't necessarily mean that Lithuania lacks young talents, though.

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    I bet, that if journalists would have asked the same questions Zalgiris management, they would got 180% opposite answers.

    1) Kairys has a lot of contacts in the US with NCAA and so on. And his interests and work is to send young kids there. But the only TOP European talent that is there for now is Koufos. But, as I understand, he is planning to return. No matter what Kairys says, NCAA doesn't look so attractive for europeans these days. Can't imagine some TOP european talents (from FMP for example) going there.
    Especially in Lithuania after such stories with Rimkevicius and so on.

    2) The good times for Vainauskas is over too (YEAH! ).

    Times are changing for some people and that is all.

    On other hand, Jasikevicius, Siskauskas are the best European players. And there is no quarantee that our talents that we have these days will be too. There is some possibility that we won't be one of dominating basketball nations in near future. For example, Spain with young M.Gasol, Rudy, Ricky looks much more attractive. But, I am pretty sure that we will always fight for the medals in European championship and so on.

  14. #14

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    In some way I agree with Vainauskas. There aren't sure things now. Lithuania for the moment don't have Rubio's, Fernandez's, Bargnani's (even though he is a bust), Pekovic's, Galinari's and so on. You see those players and you know that one day they will be superstars in Europe (Fernandez probably is already a superstar in Europe).
    What Lithuanian player will be drafted with high pick in NBA draft (you can hate NBA but still you have to acknowledge that the best talent is there)? The closest thing is Motiejunas but he also isn't a sure thing especially that we know that he is playing in Zalgiris (not the best place for young players) under one retard known as Grigas.
    Is there any young player with a lot of potential who is playing in NBA? There is Kleiza but he is a role player and if one day somehow he will manage to be the best player on Lithuania NT - this team will be screwed.
    Who is there that is young and managing to have some impact on Euroleague team? There is Maciulis, Jankunas, Jomantas, Seibutis but they won't be anything more than a role players on a good team.
    So no, for the moment I don't see new Siskauskas, new Macijauskas, new Jasikevicius. There are some decent young players but they have a lot work to do even if they want to establish themselves as useful players in best Lithuanian teams and I think probability that they will fail is bigger considering how best Lithuanian teams view into their young players.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Basketball GOD
    In some way I agree with Vainauskas. There aren't sure things now. Lithuania for the moment don't have Rubio's, Fernandez's, Bargnani's (even though he is a bust), Pekovic's, Galinari's and so on. You see those players and you know that one day they will be superstars in Europe (Fernandez probably is already a superstar in Europe).
    What Lithuanian player will be drafted with high pick in NBA draft (you can hate NBA but still you have to acknowledge that the best talent is there)? The closest thing is Motiejunas but he also isn't a sure thing especially that we know that he is playing in Zalgiris (not the best place for young players) under one retard known as Grigas.
    Is there any young player with a lot of potential who is playing in NBA? There is Kleiza but he is a role player and if one day somehow he will manage to be the best player on Lithuania NT - this team will be screwed.
    Who is there that is young and managing to have some impact on Euroleague team? There is Maciulis, Jankunas, Jomantas, Seibutis but they won't be anything more than a role players on a good team.
    So no, for the moment I don't see new Siskauskas, new Macijauskas, new Jasikevicius. There are some decent young players but they have a lot work to do even if they want to establish themselves as useful players in best Lithuanian teams and I think probability that they will fail is bigger considering how best Lithuanian teams view into their young players.
    Why i feel that L. Kleiza would kick ass in mediocre euroleague team getting 30 minutes on the court? As for me, i would freely add him besides such players like Gilinari or Rubio, though i believe Rubio is way more talanted player (but he still needs time to convince me). Kleiza with good PG on the court can be bloody player.
    As for new Saras, Macas, Siskauskas...i pretty sure Gecevicius will be something at least close. That's already obvious for me. Vasiliauskas, Janavicius are expected to become huge players. Why nobody talked about Siska or Jasikevicius as super talents when they were 22?
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    Senior Member auris1's Avatar
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    We have a bar set pretty high, don’t we?
    People like to compare young players to the stars - oh, he is young sabonis, marciulionis etc.
    Truth is , now there is no one like them .And never will be .But I am pretty damn confident that there is future stars .We just don’t know it yet .

    And there is one good point in the article – that youngsters leaving basketball schools have nowhere to play .And that there is no policy for them to develop through transitional period to men basketball. All because that old fuck garastas – the latest I heard that if there is no arena build in Kaunas for 2011 he has some alternative plan hiding in his sleeve -what the fuck is that suppose to mean – are they going to play preliminaries in his back garden? Or he is going to pull the 10000 seat arena out of his arse saying surprise and everyone clapping around.
    And sorry for the rant - hangover

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    Senior Member Gytaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaunaz
    1.Kleiza is already a big star. And in few years he gonna be just like Karnisovas or even better.
    Just like Karnišovas? He is nothing like Karnišovas, they are different types of players. Karnišovas was using his brain, while Kleiza relies solely on his physical abilities, while his decision-making is often questionable. And I hate Kleiza's "I'm the man" attitude. To be honest, he is my least favorite player on Lithuanian NT.

  18. #18
    Senior Member Test's Avatar
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    Depends on what talents are we talking about? Or it is NBA super individuals or above average team players. The first one group is not quite big. Only D-Motiejunas is NBA prospect these days. Bit if we talk about future LT NT, I don't see a problem. Lithuania raises quite good players all the time except PG's. Good PG position player only can be raisen in NCAA where they learn how to pass while running fast.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gytaz
    Just like Karnišovas? He is nothing like Karnišovas, they are different types of players. Karnišovas was using his brain, while Kleiza relies solely on his physical abilities, while his decision-making is often questionable. And I hate Kleiza's "I'm the man" attitude. To be honest, he is my least favorite player on Lithuanian NT.
    Kleiza, imho, isn't even close to Maciulis if we talk about "I'm the man" syndrome. Those things are realy annoying but sometimes it helps on the court. Jasikevicius is the same type of player though he and Kleiza are somehow more subtle. Maciulis behaviour and emotions resently are just irritating...he's shouting on his teams mates like bit...Even if he's doing realy fine on the court
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    Quote Originally Posted by Basketball GOD
    In some way I agree with Vainauskas. There aren't sure things now. Lithuania for the moment don't have Rubio's, Fernandez's, Bargnani's (even though he is a bust), Pekovic's, Galinari's and so on. You see those players and you know that one day they will be superstars in Europe (Fernandez probably is already a superstar in Europe).
    What Lithuanian player will be drafted with high pick in NBA draft (you can hate NBA but still you have to acknowledge that the best talent is there)? The closest thing is Motiejunas but he also isn't a sure thing especially that we know that he is playing in Zalgiris (not the best place for young players) under one retard known as Grigas.
    Is there any young player with a lot of potential who is playing in NBA? There is Kleiza but he is a role player and if one day somehow he will manage to be the best player on Lithuania NT - this team will be screwed.
    Who is there that is young and managing to have some impact on Euroleague team? There is Maciulis, Jankunas, Jomantas, Seibutis but they won't be anything more than a role players on a good team.
    So no, for the moment I don't see new Siskauskas, new Macijauskas, new Jasikevicius. There are some decent young players but they have a lot work to do even if they want to establish themselves as useful players in best Lithuanian teams and I think probability that they will fail is bigger considering how best Lithuanian teams view into their young players.
    Tell me please,how many MORE than decent young players have Greece,France,my country,Great basketball Yougoslavia?.. Who??? Koufos,who else from Greece(As for Oly youngsters,they,re the same role players as Maciulis,Jankunas or even their teammate Seibutis),France with young guys such Aliyanca or Batum?..I can imagine these guys as a role players in NBA, but i can,t imagine them such a LEADERS in CSKA or PAO. Who,s next?.. My country... With so ... RFB President(Chernov)as we have,even decent youngsters will too cool for us.We have Pankrashov and Fridzon(very useful player),but in Russian basketball reality, even them we can see only such a role players. Who,s next? Yougoslavia... Are you really certain that Pekovic will be KEY player for PAO?.. I don,t think so. He will be ROLE player for them as well as Teodosic for Oly,as Seibutis for Oly,as Teletovic in Tau,as Pledzic and Vidmar for Fener as other young guys... I just want to say,that in this ages you can,t be more than a ROLE player,only if you,re not Parker,Gazol,Kirilenko(remember,when he played for CSKA,he was one of the best players in europe),Ginobili or Stojakovic...

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