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Thread: Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

  1. #6601

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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    I don't think Junemar is that untouchable. I see him as too slow & unathletic to make any impact in the world stage. I see Japeth as even more serviceable than Junemar.
    Let's see how the PBA season and FIBA windows turn out. I've seen Japeth cost us games in crunch time (missed 3 point shot vs Lebanon and botched layup vs. Angola), his decision making is still questionable after all these years, but yes he's still serviceable but let's try a kid named Carl Tamayo who has already proven his worth. While Junemar is and will always be an option on offense and he's trimmed down recently and has been working on his 3s. Junemar used to be solely a low post threat but now he can stretch the floor. We need players that are composed and makes intelligent plays during close games. We're gonna have a handful of contests in the WC where we need players who can execute late in the game. I am pretty sure our PBA players are using the incoming World Cup as motivation to improve their play for a possible call-up, hopefully Japeth can show us he deserves one more stint.
    Manifesting: Philippines top 5 in the FIBA World Rankings

  2. #6602

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    Quote Originally Posted by carmelo7 View Post
    you beat me to it hahaha pero the experience kase of Tuffin as a Role Player (unlike Parks who needs to adjust from being the Man to a backup) on a tough league speaks volume to his potential and he can play the 1-2-3 positions if necessary much like a Dwight Ramos. And he's younger too than Parks, un iba kase nainis lng sa superstar aura ni BRP Jr
    Ray is mature enough to adjust from superstar to backup. that's the difference of BRP and Kief. Kiefer always need the spotlight and he doesn't recognize his physical limitations in the international game. In short wala siyang impact. BRP has already shown he can hold his own (vs France OQT 2016). No question about Kiefer's skill and feel for the game but maybe just stick with the Bleague or the PBA and stay out of Gilas for the mean time. Kiefer was there during FIBA WC 2019, SEA games and Fiba Asia Cup, no impact at all. He's a phenom in the Philippines, but yeah, he just got to accept his limitations.

    Bobby Ray Parks after all was an NBA prospect and a NCAA D1 quality player, hence the superstar aura. Dwight is also a solid NCAA D1 player. Kiefer is none of those.
    Manifesting: Philippines top 5 in the FIBA World Rankings

  3. #6603
    Senior Member DAdmiral's Avatar
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    Tuffin has reps in that 3 and D role ( avg around 25 min) within the context of having All NBL level teamates ( Cooks ) and Div 1 , G- league star imports. .
    We're talking about reps where his play determines winning or losing in the playoffs. additionally they really put Tuffin to defend the opposing teams point guard (disruptor ) . so from a exposure to role perspective he has it , the # of 3 point attempts of catch and shoot nature ( supporting a player like Clarkson who draws gravity) , Tuffin also has that significant exposure in that role .. ( and he's been succesful and that very specfic 3 and D role at a very high level in meaningful games (High preasure win or lose or go home -if you don't do your role

    Very few players i think have that same recent expereince in that specfic role at that level and circumstances (championships , playoffs)

  4. #6604
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    Quote Originally Posted by KoolAid View Post
    Wright is a lot better as a shot creator than a shooter, so maybe that is the reason why he is not effective with Gilas since he is being used as a shooter than a creator.
    You have a point there bro.
    Maybe that is the reason why it seems Jordan Heading is more effective than Wright playing for Gilas. Heading suits the role of a spot up shooter for Gilas better than Wright.

    Kumbaga eh, if Heading gets a pass while he is in the 3-pt area, wala na syang iniisip but to take the shot, hence his shots have more conviction. On the other hand, when Wright gets a pass while he's in the 3-pt. zone, he may still think, should I shoot this or maybe I should drive, or maybe I should get a bit closer & take a pull up jumper, or maybe I should just pass it to an open teammate? I noticed how many times Wright pass up open 3-pt. shots. Masyado syang hesitant tumira. If it was Jeff Chan, Dondon Hontiveros, or Jordan Heading being on that situation, they will take the shot without any hesitation.
    "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

  5. #6605
    Senior Member IPC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    Matthew Wright's 3-pt shooting is nowhere to be found in the FIBA game. He is actually one of among the disappointments in Gilas. I just couldn't understand that pag nasa FIBA game environment na sya, nawawala na yung shooting nya.

    I think & I'm hopeful that Heading will be part of the 2023 Worl Cup pool. I have much more confident in Heading's shooting in the FIBA game than Wright.
    Quote Originally Posted by zairex View Post
    Maybe just like Pogoy he needs more time to be accustomed with FIBA after a long absents. He was ok with 2018 Qualifiers. Like Pogoy that for me the last Qualifiers was the first time for a long time he was going to the game without injuries or coming from a grueling playoff run. Thats why he was decent.
    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    The thing is, Wright has already played a good No. of FIBA & international competitions/games for the last 6 years or so. He already has enough reps for the FIBA game atmosphere. Dapat naka adjust na sya.
    Actually, Wright was 23-50 (46%) from 3 in his first 11 FIBA games, including 7-16 in his first five FIBA qualifiers games. Aussie brawl and beyond, he suddenly regressed to 1-9 (11%) from 3 for God knows what.

  6. #6606
    Senior Member IPC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paliganibossalfrancis View Post
    Let's see how the PBA season and FIBA windows turn out. I've seen Japeth cost us games in crunch time (missed 3 point shot vs Lebanon and botched layup vs. Angola), his decision making is still questionable after all these years, but yes he's still serviceable but let's try a kid named Carl Tamayo who has already proven his worth. While Junemar is and will always be an option on offense and he's trimmed down recently and has been working on his 3s. Junemar used to be solely a low post threat but now he can stretch the floor. We need players that are composed and makes intelligent plays during close games. We're gonna have a handful of contests in the WC where we need players who can execute late in the game. I am pretty sure our PBA players are using the incoming World Cup as motivation to improve their play for a possible call-up, hopefully Japeth can show us he deserves one more stint.
    I have Japeth slightly ahead of June Mar for defense, to be honest. June Mar has been serviceable in FIBA tournaments for rebounding and extra scoring, but now, he might have difficulty defending PnR and rotating.

    Carl's a good option for the 4 spot. Shows fight on offense, has become a closer for UP, and has improved his switching to be able to competently defend even guards, and knows how to defend interior passes with good hands. 7.7 RPG in 24-26 minutes too.

    And his FIBA performance has been good as a senior. Our best PF after maybe Japeth, right now.

  7. #6607
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    Quote Originally Posted by IPC View Post
    Actually, Wright was 23-50 (46%) from 3 in his first 11 FIBA games, including 7-16 in his first five FIBA qualifiers games. Aussie brawl and beyond, he suddenly regressed to 1-9 (11%) from 3 for God knows what.
    Really? But he looks fine in the PBA. Maybe it's a mental thing.

  8. #6608
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    Quote Originally Posted by IPC View Post
    I have Japeth slightly ahead of June Mar for defense, to be honest. June Mar has been serviceable in FIBA tournaments for rebounding and extra scoring, but now, he might have difficulty defending PnR and rotating.

    Carl's a good option for the 4 spot. Shows fight on offense, has become a closer for UP, and has improved his switching to be able to competently defend even guards, and knows how to defend interior passes with good hands. 7.7 RPG in 24-26 minutes too.

    And his FIBA performance has been good as a senior. Our best PF after maybe Japeth, right now.
    Junemar was very valuable for Gilas from 2014 to 2019 period mainly becoz we didn't have much option at the center spot. Let's face it, Junemar was Phi basketball's best center during that era. He was our premier big man in that era.

    But now that we have a Kai Sotto, I think Junemar's value with the national team has diminished. I honestly believe that as a backup for Kai Sotto, Japeth Aguilar is a better option. Besides, Japeth can also play at the 4 spot - something than Junemar can't do.
    "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

  9. #6609
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    Quote Originally Posted by thatweirdguy View Post
    Really? But he looks fine in the PBA. Maybe it's a mental thing.
    Maybe Wright gets intimidated being defended by taller & more physical wingmen in the FIBA game.

    In the PBA, he's matched up with 6-foot-1/6-foot-2 wings, but in the FIBA game, he's defended by 6-foot-4 or 6-foot-5 wings.
    "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

  10. #6610
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    Quote Originally Posted by paliganibossalfrancis View Post
    Ray is mature enough to adjust from superstar to backup. that's the difference of BRP and Kief. Kiefer always need the spotlight and he doesn't recognize his physical limitations in the international game. In short wala siyang impact. BRP has already shown he can hold his own (vs France OQT 2016). No question about Kiefer's skill and feel for the game but maybe just stick with the Bleague or the PBA and stay out of Gilas for the mean time. Kiefer was there during FIBA WC 2019, SEA games and Fiba Asia Cup, no impact at all. He's a phenom in the Philippines, but yeah, he just got to accept his limitations.

    Bobby Ray Parks after all was an NBA prospect and a NCAA D1 quality player, hence the superstar aura. Dwight is also a solid NCAA D1 player. Kiefer is none of those.
    Kiefer hasnt been the same player after the 18-month suspension Thirdy on the other hand is simply too undersized and lacks the guard skills to be effective with Gilas. A guard and wing rotation of Iskati,Perez,Parks,Tuffin,Ramos,JC and Malonzo would be our strongest and a big rotation of Kai,Carl,Jap,Edu & JF should be enough. Tuffin over Heading as they seem to be very similar in playing style with Tuffin being taller at 6'4sh (Heading at 6'1sh)

  11. #6611
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    Quote Originally Posted by IPC View Post
    Actually, Wright was 23-50 (46%) from 3 in his first 11 FIBA games, including 7-16 in his first five FIBA qualifiers games. Aussie brawl and beyond, he suddenly regressed to 1-9 (11%) from 3 for God knows what.
    Actually its not the shooting % which was the issue of Wright playing for Gilas, its more like, "Where were U when we needed your 3-pt shooting the most?" I think the Gilas coaching staff were telling Wright: "The main reason why we picked U on this team becoz of your 3-pt shooting. Yet you are passing up too many open 3-pt shots".
    "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

  12. #6612

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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    Junemar was very valuable for Gilas from 2014 to 2019 period mainly becoz we didn't have much option at the center spot. Let's face it, Junemar was Phi basketball's best center during that era. He was our premier big man in that era.

    But now that we have a Kai Sotto, I think Junemar's value with the national team has diminished. I honestly believe that as a backup for Kai Sotto, Japeth Aguilar is a better option. Besides, Japeth can also play at the 4 spot - something than Junemar can't do.
    so with that our realistic World Cup lineup will be (meaning we play by the rules -- field in JC as NP; the rest are local players from BLeague, PBA and UAAP)

    Starters:
    PG - Scottie Thompson
    SG - Jordan Clarkson
    SF - Jamie Malonzo
    PF - Japeth Aguilar
    C - Kai Sotto

    Bench:
    SF Dwight Ramos
    SG Jordan Heading
    SF/PF William Navarro
    PG CJ Perez
    SG Bobby Ray Parks Jr.
    SF/PF Carl Tamayo
    C AJ Edu

    projection: 9-16 Classification


    if stars align (meaning Ange can play as our NP, NBA Stars Jalen & JC considered as local, MikeyWill given clearance by FIBA):

    Starters:
    PG Jalen Green
    SG Jordan Clarkson
    SF Jamie Malonzo
    PF Japeth Aguilar
    C Kai Sotto

    bench:
    PG Scottie Thompson or CJ Perez
    SG Mikey Williams
    C/PF Ange Kouame
    SG Bobby Ray Parks Jr.
    SF/PF Carl Tamayo
    SF Dwight Ramos
    C/PF AJ Edu

    projection: Quarterfinals stint
    Manifesting: Philippines top 5 in the FIBA World Rankings

  13. #6613

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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    Maybe Wright gets intimidated being defended by taller & more physical wingmen in the FIBA game.

    In the PBA, he's matched up with 6-foot-1/6-foot-2 wings, but in the FIBA game, he's defended by 6-foot-4 or 6-foot-5 wings.
    This is true. Heading > Wright. We need a shooter who's actually always ready to shoot without thinking twice. Wright is more of a triple threat, we have a lot of triple threats in the team already (JC, BRP, Dwight, Jamie). Someone who will fill in Jeff Chan's role in 2014 and DHont's role in 2015. THAT role is crucial in keeping us afloat in tight games.. and evidently, Heading hits those long-range bombs even in transition (72% 3pt shooter in the 2021 FIBA OQT in 2 games), Wright is just a 32% shooter in 9 Asian Qualifiers games prior to 2019 WC.
    Manifesting: Philippines top 5 in the FIBA World Rankings

  14. #6614

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    Quick question:

    how different is Tab Baldwin's system and Chot Reyes/Tim Cone's system?

    We've already seen Tab Baldwin coaching pros. He seems to rely heavily on isolation plays if he has players like Romeo, Castro & Blatche. 2 OQTs under him (all losses), 1 FIBA Asia silver medal (almost an outright Olympic qualification). Coach Tab coaching a Gilas team full of amateurs is a different story though... but although we get moral victories, we know an all-amateur team has no chance vs. powerhouse teams.

    Meanwhile I like what I'm seeing with Chot/Tim Cone now. It seems like they're already figuring out how to get pros to play cohesively.
    Manifesting: Philippines top 5 in the FIBA World Rankings

  15. #6615
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    Quote Originally Posted by paliganibossalfrancis View Post
    Quick question:

    how different is Tab Baldwin's system and Chot Reyes/Tim Cone's system?

    We've already seen Tab Baldwin coaching pros. He seems to rely heavily on isolation plays if he has players like Romeo, Castro & Blatche. 2 OQTs under him (all losses), 1 FIBA Asia silver medal (almost an outright Olympic qualification). Coach Tab coaching a Gilas team full of amateurs is a different story though... but although we get moral victories, we know an all-amateur team has no chance vs. powerhouse teams.

    Meanwhile I like what I'm seeing with Chot/Tim Cone now. It seems like they're already figuring out how to get pros to play cohesively.
    The most impact would be the addition of Coach Tim Cone, defensively they're much better. Chot is very creative offensively but struggles on the defensive end, so CTC really compliments Chot, and you have an "assistant coach" he can respect experience-wise, and they're buddies so CTC can outright tell him what's wrong and he'll listen agad. Plus having Malonzo,Jap and Iskati makes it easier for CTC to integrate his system

  16. #6616
    Senior Member IPC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    Actually its not the shooting % which was the issue of Wright playing for Gilas, its more like, "Where were U when we needed your 3-pt shooting the most?" I think the Gilas coaching staff were telling Wright: "The main reason why we picked U on this team becoz of your 3-pt shooting. Yet you are passing up too many open 3-pt shots".
    Even in the PBA, I already see Wright as a choker in big moments. So what more in FIBA? And then the dip in form happened after the Aussie brawl.

  17. #6617

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    Quote Originally Posted by carmelo7 View Post
    The most impact would be the addition of Coach Tim Cone, defensively they're much better. Chot is very creative offensively but struggles on the defensive end, so CTC really compliments Chot, and you have an "assistant coach" he can respect experience-wise, and they're buddies so CTC can outright tell him what's wrong and he'll listen agad. Plus having Malonzo,Jap and Iskati makes it easier for CTC to integrate his system
    Great analysis. This current version of Gilas seems to play well against Asian counterparts. Let's see how they go against Japan's full lineup, Coach Goorijan's Boomers and European powerhouses. From those (hopefully we'll see some) tuneup games, we'll figure out what adjustments in the lineup they need to make. The respect our players have for Coach Tim Cone is evident that's why they play more disciplined and in sync. CTC holds them accountable.
    Manifesting: Philippines top 5 in the FIBA World Rankings

  18. #6618

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    Quote Originally Posted by IPC View Post
    Even in the PBA, I already see Wright as a choker in big moments. So what more in FIBA? And then the dip in form happened after the Aussie brawl.
    He's old. Already served the country multiple times. Time to let younger players take his spot. Time for him to focus on his BLeague career and save as much as he can before heading back to the PBA.
    Manifesting: Philippines top 5 in the FIBA World Rankings

  19. #6619
    Senior Member IPC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paliganibossalfrancis View Post
    Quick question:

    how different is Tab Baldwin's system and Chot Reyes/Tim Cone's system?

    We've already seen Tab Baldwin coaching pros. He seems to rely heavily on isolation plays if he has players like Romeo, Castro & Blatche. 2 OQTs under him (all losses), 1 FIBA Asia silver medal (almost an outright Olympic qualification). Coach Tab coaching a Gilas team full of amateurs is a different story though... but although we get moral victories, we know an all-amateur team has no chance vs. powerhouse teams.

    Meanwhile I like what I'm seeing with Chot/Tim Cone now. It seems like they're already figuring out how to get pros to play cohesively.
    Actually, Tab also tends to use go-to guys in Ateneo. He's really a defensive specialists. Just happens to have simple counters to defensive schemes.

    Defensively, Tab puts a little more emphasis on defending the perimeter on rotations. Cone's more of a protect the paint guy, but can get his guys to rotate to the perimeter, like Ginebra against the Dragons, and Gilas against Jordan.

  20. #6620
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    Quote Originally Posted by paliganibossalfrancis View Post
    Great analysis. This current version of Gilas seems to play well against Asian counterparts. Let's see how they go against Japan's full lineup, Coach Goorijan's Boomers and European powerhouses. From those (hopefully we'll see some) tuneup games, we'll figure out what adjustments in the lineup they need to make. The respect our players have for Coach Tim Cone is evident that's why they play more disciplined and in sync. CTC holds them accountable.
    Yeah that's the thing with Coach Tim he demands nothing less than the highest of efforts, during interviews he would say the nicest things about his players but if you observe him live in action (courtside) he would give leeway for players to do their thing but if it doesnt work you'll hear it from him without the cursing all constructive. I hope all the players he needs he gets in 2023 because this Cone-Chot team up looks promising and has the backing of SMC as well hehe

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