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Thread: Lithuanian Point Guards

  1. #21
    Moderator Mindozas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    I take it that Žygimantas Janavičius is injured right now?

    He is, for some month already, but should be back soon enough, but that's more important topic to struggling Neptunas, not NT anymore


  2. #22

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    Few cents on Velicka's debut in NT. One thing that really excited me was his attitude. Velicka used to have a reputation of emotionless and sort of laid back, maybe even slightly cocky youngster, but I though his carriage was great. He was excited, nervous, it was obvious he WANTED IT. He cared and really wished to do it right. I think now he's sort of an underdog keeping in mind Jokubaitis and Marciulionis. He knows society and even coaches now invite those 2 in the first place and expect the most from them, so I think Arnas had some additional motivation to prove he's on the map. Kept strictly with coache's requests, if going p'n'r then p'n'r, if sending the ball to the left (Girdziunas p'n'r) then it is. No bullshit messing around, crazy threes, unpredictable decisions. He looked like a really coachable player. A bit eager, urgent and too excited here and there, yes, but overall really poised. And knowing his age and excitement I thought he stuck strictly with the game plan nicely, maybe even too much. Only 1 turnover per 2 games in 31min, 12 points, 7 assists. That's a solid numbers. We should also have in mind he had one game in more than a month in France due to Corona, and came late to the camp having really little time to prepare. So he's not into his 100% playing shape as well. I loved how his slashing prevails instantly, even against athletic Belgians, I thought he could be even more aggressive here and there, he nailed 6/6 FT and that's good because his legs were shaking a little bit, it was seen.
    Now on the negative side, I thought he blew couple of really good lay ups that he could really make, he was hesitant shooting three while open (later took the contested one), he didn't really felt comfortable controlling the team in the broad sense, but then again it could be coaches asking to stick to his strong sides particularly. Compared to even more vital debut of Jokubaitis, Velicka couldn't express him self as all around facilitator, was a little bit disturbed with those stretches when the tension begun to grow, didn't felt comfortable taking over the control of the game entirely, something what Jokubaitis didn't cease to do against Czeck Rep.
    Overall, I think very promising performance, somewhat more matured than probably one could expect from Velicka. He shows clear signs of development, improving both as player and the person. I thought his body language and communication was really spot on, I didn't track anything fishy about his carriage while he was linked with some attitude issues by some people. IMO, we are witnessing a flat out long term NT guard member. I predict him making 2022EC roster (oh, snap, now I can't even predict such thing...).

    Last edited by Straight forward; 12-01-2020 at 02:08 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  3. #23
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    Few cents on Velicka's debut in NT.... I think now he's sort of an underdog keeping in mind Jokubaitis and Marciulionis. He knows society and even coaches now invite those 2 in the first place and expect the most from them....

    Compared to even more vital debut of Jokubaitis, Velicka couldn't express him self as all around facilitator, was a little bit disturbed with those stretches when the tension begun to grow, didn't felt comfortable taking over the control of the game entirely, something what Jokubaitis didn't cease to do against Czeck Rep.
    Right this moment I think Arnas Velička is far more ready for the big time than is Rokas Jokubaitis.

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    Right this moment I think Arnas Velička is far more ready for the big time than is Rokas Jokubaitis.
    Why do you think so?
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  5. #25
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Rokas Jokubaitis was born on 19 November 2000 while Arnas Velička was born on 10 December 1999. Velička is therefore almost a year older which makes a big difference at that age.

    Last February Rokas Jokubaitis had a PER of 8 in 22:35 minutes of play against the Czech Republic, a relatively weak opponent. In the July friendly tournament against Estonia and Latvia Jokubaitis' PER over 16:35 minutes of play was 5. In comparison during the two just completed games against Denmark and Belgium, Arnas Velička had an average PER of 8.5 in 15.7 minutes of play.

    Jokubaitis had a PER of 8.9 over an average of 16:50 minutes of play in 19 LKL games in 2019-20. Jokubaitis has a PER of 6.5 over an average of 17:22 minutes of play in 8 LKL games this year. In 2019-20 Velička had a PER of 13.9 over an average of 26:25 minutes of play in 24 LKL games.

    That's all the objective data I have but it favours Velička.

    Last edited by Hepcat; 12-01-2020 at 11:00 PM.

  6. #26

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    Hepcat, bruh, we already discussed that, stats do not show all the picture Either you following a player, or you don't. If you don't, you don't know anything about him. That's is a fact. Velicka is underrated, but Jokubaitis has been magnificent in Euroleague this season (I assume you haven't snatched a single game of Zalgiris this season) and really stood up compared to last season. At the moment he's surely better than Velicka, but it's a bit more close than most people think in Lithuania, or at least they did prior these windows.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  7. #27
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
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    2022-2024 guard lineup we have like 4 locks

    lekavicius,jokubaitis
    grigonis,giedraitis

    sf will be loaded if your prediction with sirvydis and brazdeikis will come true with ulanovas there as main one.

    so you saying that Velicka will overcome Dimsa or your even beloved D.Giedraitis ?

    im not so sure at all we need 3pg in every tournament,usually we had only 2 pg.

    I would rather have more sg-sf in todays type game. My guess would be velicka will be like juskevicius if everybody healthy he will be 13th player.By time Lukas will get old marciulionis gonna be close to be ready by your future prediction no ?

    you know that team cant have like 7 guards right ?

  8. #28

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    I agree with these 4 locks, maybe questioning R.Giedraitis just a little bit, not because doubting his current level, but he may just be not a spot on fit for the NT. I think next tournament will show where he is now and can he bring his things for the NT as well. If not, he may be at question because most likely we will have interesting options going further now.

    As for 2022, now I would see something like this:

    Jokubaitis, Velicka,
    Grigonis, Lekavicius, R.Giedraitis

    I would use Lekavicius as 2 more, as both Jokubaitis and Velicka are better facilitators. At some point I would even consider to have six guards, be it D. Giedraitis, or a bit later A. Marciulionis, because we can't leave aside stud guards. It's a guard orientated game and I would sacrifice one center or forward, but would take a guard who can change the game with a good stretch. To me, Velicka is too good to be some borderliner. If my projection is spot on, I see him developing into a really strong long term player, providing very solid stretches from the bench. I don't really see T. Dimsa as some long term piece. I don't really even think he will make NT if all the pieces will be there.

    If we will have a lot quality guards, it will be a great problem to have. IMO, both Marciulionis and Jokubaitis are very versatile scorers as well. They will be able to play 2 rather comfortable, the same Jokubaitis now is playing off his position basically. Velicka not so much, I think his primarily force lays on p'n'r, passing and dominant slashing, but he doesn't have mid range game and overall not so versatile scorer, so I have him at 1 primarily. At some point I think we'll have six guards tournaments. And, yeah, despite the fact I'm a huge fan of Lekavicius, I don't foresee him having a very long career for the NT. This summer he'll be 27yo, I project him to play since some 31. Most likely he will have to step aside for stronger guards, but it's just a speculation now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  9. #29

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    It's not some big prospect, and he's nowhere near three youngsters we discussing here, but I think Jokubas Rubinas deserved just to be mentioned. However you watch at it, it's a rare occasion that 18yo PG would dominate NKL the way he does this season. 15.6pts, 6.1ast. Off course, that comes in 33:15min and Perlas this season is not so strong as in previous years, but Rubinas numbers are worth considering. F.e. 19yo Lekavicius had 12.1pts, 5.6ast in 32min (stronger team and bigger competition likely). Rubinas is 186cm crafty PG who lacks a bit more explosiveness and toughness, but surely can shoot threes. We don't seem to be lacking PGs this decade, but he might be an interesting borderliner:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Dv2-SDQOHA
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  10. #30
    Senior Member Svajunas's Avatar
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    Another lefty... wtf

  11. #31

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    Velicka on NT debut, Maciulis' motivational speech before the game, his current shape, and continuation of LNB PRO A:

    https://www.basketnews.lt/news-14731...es-ilgesi.html
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  12. #32

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    Man, tough debut for A. Marciulionis against EL club. For the first time he played serious minutes (thirty minutes almost) against such team and he really struggled. I thought he completely slept over the first half while he could utilize his agility and energy, but remained passive. Later he found it hard to bang with stronger players with his currently thin frame and stamina issues also took place. I thought he had to be much more aggressive, precise and cheeky under such conditions, but it's a hell of a school for him. Should look at he mirror after such game and to work even harder. If we compare 18yo Marciulionis and Jokubaitis in LKL, it's really really close, maybe even Jokubaitis having a slight edge, but I'm sticking to my projection that Marciulionis has a higher upside. Rokas is marching forward, his main weakness now is shooting threes. It's not like he can't shoot, last season 45,7% (16/35), his numbers are decent in EL this season as well, but his 4/18 (22,2%) in LKL this season doesn't look good...
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  13. #33

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    Hell of a week for Marciulionis. Unleashed against Zalgiris and VEF. Tonight 15pts, 7as, 17eff in 24min. He needed that kind of experience, to go through his mistakes, to feel the game, to brake on through on such level. It was an amazing stretch in third quarter when was doing it all: dominant slashes, facilitating, nailing a three, playing D, making some creative tricks. Rare 18yo gets such opportunity and utilizes it. RAW potential. He's getting there. If he will be lucky and will get more solid minutes with some credit, he will be ready to compete with any Rytas' guard after couple of months.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  15. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    Jokubas Rubinas deserved just to be mentioned
    He may not be Jokubaitis, just a mere Jokubas, but his stock is rising. Dropped 31pts against Zalgiris2 and now he has 17ppg, 6apg, 17.3eff. If we would look at sheer numbers, then he's on Kalnietis soil, 18yo Kalnietis was dropping 17,7/4,3. And likely current NKL is more PRO and competitive than 2004 LKAL. The numbers are huge. What I like about him is that he has super quick and reliable trigger. He can shoot spot up and off the dribble. Has midrange game. Crafty with the ball, nice crossovers, hesitation dribble. Despite the fact that he doesn't have roaring athleticism and dominant first step, seems to be maneuvering very flexibly while driving, using crafty euro step to get a lay up. 43.4% threes is impressive. If Marciulionis will go to NCAA next season, Rytas has a good piece to fill his shoes. Here's his fresh career high:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIuL13LGYec
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  16. #36
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    The way Augustas dishes off assists is just as impressive as his drives to the basket.


  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    The way Augustas dishes off assists is just as impressive as his drives to the basket.

    It is indeed. 4 assists in 8 minutes in his last LKL take. IMO, he will have a good chances to make 2022, 2023 NT already (more like latter probably), at the age of 20, 21. Just as Jokubaitis does. IMO, at 2023 we should have big PG trio packed in the NT already.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  18. #38

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    Rooney not directly criticise Kairys and whole Rytas situation (who doesn't?), but does that very correctly. I understand him. While I can say openly, Kairys has been a complete trash. It's a fact. All these excuses and absences won't dig the fact that he's a trashy coach and Rytas has been a complete mess. He would be long gone if not ridiculous conditions of his contract, yeez...When you think about, what kind of crazy project is this season's Rytas is...A nightmare.

    Now as for Augustas case, I thought he surely could get more chances here and there (like in last LKL game he grabs 11per in some 7min, but than he plays 9min overall...He's leached even when he's playing well. But I wouldn't dramatise, he got his stint in CL, he's playing 12min in LKL. That's the same minutes Jokubaitis was getting in Zalgiris as 18yo. Yes, just as Rooney I want more and there's a sense he can play more, but situation is not tragic for the young gem, he's developing. Interesting that he was very close leaving to Lietkabelis, but decided to be loyal to Rytas. IMO, next season he's gone to NCAA because Rytas is too messy to trust them. He supposed to be a back up PG, but Rytas couldn't sell Bickauskis. I doubt Rooney will trust Rytas for another time, even if they will say, we are giving at least 20min next season.

    https://www.15min.lt/24sek/naujiena/...se-875-1437804
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  19. #39

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    I love Jokubaitis, he is poised to be elite EL PG, but I stick to my projection that A.Marciulionis is the best guard prospect since his dad. Career high in LKL, 17pts in 16min. against Lietkabelis. Bar injuries he will be relentless and tameless guard at both ends of the flour.

    If only 10s could get one of these three PG studs... I don't think 21yo Kalnietis could have 12/5 in tough and athletic league as France LNB as Velicka is having now. 31yo Kalnietis has been struggling in this league in 2018/2019 season with 7.7/5.6. Basically we are about to have 2 star point guards and plus Velicka who is likely better than Kalnietis. If these three will have great careers it should be some sort of compensation for all these decades of PG section deficiency in Lithuania.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Marciulionis son will be bust like first Sabonis son

  20. #40
    Senior Member CoachZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    I love Jokubaitis, he is poised to be elite EL PG, but I stick to my projection that A.Marciulionis is the best guard prospect since his dad. Career high in LKL, 17pts in 16min. against Lietkabelis. Bar injuries he will be relentless and tameless guard at both ends of the flour.

    If only 10s could get one of these three PG studs... I don't think 21yo Kalnietis could have 12/5 in tough and athletic league as France LNB as Velicka is having now. 31yo Kalnietis has been struggling in this league in 2018/2019 season with 7.7/5.6. Basically we are about to have 2 star point guards and plus Velicka who is likely better than Kalnietis. If these three will have great careers it should be some sort of compensation for all these decades of PG section deficiency in Lithuania.
    I think that your guard situation long term looks quite well. A bit concerning that none of them are great shooters though, but you can overcome that.

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