Carl Tamayo thread

[lurklurk]

Your first group is called "Combo Forwards"(Can play Sf/Pf)

Your second group is called " Swingman" (Can play Sg/Sf)

There are also called "Combo Guard" (Can Play Pg/Sg)

Then " Big Man"(Can play Pf/C)

Also " Point Forward" ( Can Play Pg/F)

KD initially played as a swingman, now he is a full on combo forward.
Draymond Green was drafted as a combo forward, now he rarely plays as a 3 and is purely a big man.

Same scenario, i wish tamayo at least trains as a swingman before transitioning to a combo forward that we wish him to be.

[ja.he]

@ja.he

which group would you put a Scottie Pippen?

I have to say he can play 2 and 3 (swing) in OFFENSE. He is primarily a 3 but he can be a 2 because of his vast array of offense (almost identical to jordan), he can shoot from anywhere and can attack from the perimeter.

Take note that we are talking about offense here.

[JAMSKIE]

@ja. he

This reminds of the notion by some posters here who believe that the role of "fours" & small forwards are similar. With what you've implied in your post, I say it depends on what group of small forwards. If we're talking of the 1st group - Kahwi, Durant, Bird, Lebron, Melo Anthony, then yes, there are a lot of similarities of roles (between "fours" & small forward). But if we're talking of the 2nd group - Jordan, Kobe B., Butler, Paul George, I say medyo malayo.

Kobe B. is a different animal from a Draymond Green.
M. Jordan is a different animal from a Kevin Garnett.
Kevin Love is a different animal from a Jimmy Butler.

[JAMSKIE]

I have to say he can play 2 and 3 (swing) in OFFENSE. He is primarily a 3 but he can be a 2 because of his vast array of offense (almost identical to jordan), he can shoot from anywhere and can attack from the perimeter.

Take note that we are talking about offense here.

You're not convinced Pippen can guard a natural 2?

Sorry for the OT

[ja.he]

You're not convinced Pippen can guard a natural 2?

Sorry for the OT

I think he can be a fully-pledged swingman in another team by looking his potent offense (he is like a jimmy butler without being a nutcase or pre-injury paul george). Besides, he was in an era wherein players have still defined roles in the team.

[lurklurk]

Pippen back in the day can guard opposing 1 to 4. harper-jordan-pippen switched a lot on defense.

[ja.he]

@ja. he

This reminds of the notion by some posters here who believe that the role of "fours" & small forwards are similar. With what you've implied in your post, I say it depends on what group of small forwards. If we're talking of the 1st group - Kahwi, Durant, Bird, Lebron, Melo Anthony, then yes, there are a lot of similarities of roles (between "fours" & small forward). But if we're talking of the 2nd group - Jordan, Kobe B., Butler, Paul George, I say medyo malayo.

Kobe B. is a different animal from a Draymond Green.
M. Jordan is a different animal from a Kevin Garnett.
Kevin Love is a different animal from a Jimmy Butler.

Definitely not, 4 or power forwards are closer to centers in many instances while 3 or small forwards are closer to a shooting guard or in some occasions, point guard. Ofcourse, there are also small forwards that can power forwards in some instances and vice versa.

It depends on the skillset and physical attributes of the player.

This is the reason why i don't subscribe with the idea that kobe, troy and even carl can be converted into swingmen because if you converted them into swingmen, that means you are forcing them to play the 2. We are at disadvantage if it is insisted.

[JAMSKIE]

Definitely not, 4 or power forwards are closer to centers in many instances while 3 or small forwards are closer to a shooting guard or in some occasions, point guard. Ofcourse, there are also small forwards that can power forwards in some instances and vice versa.

It depends on the skillset and physical attributes of the player.

This is the reason why i don't subscribe with the idea that kobe, troy and even carl can be converted into swingmen because if you converted them into swingmen, that means you are forcing them to play the 2. We are at disadvantage if it is insisted.

Well, they are obviously referring to modern day "fours" naman. The ones who can shoot the trey, dribble & with good mobility. Something in the mold of RDO, Kelly Williams, Dray Blatche, or Iran's Arsalan Kazemi or Lebanon's Ali Haidar or Japan's Yuta Watanabe.

They aren't referring to the back-to-the-basket type of "fours".

[JAMSKIE]

Pippen back in the day can guard opposing 1 to 4. harper-jordan-pippen switched a lot on defense.

Yup, Pippen can barnacle power forwards w/ the same effectiveness as keeping in step with a combo guard on defense.

Pippen was more known for his versatility on defense than in offense.

[ccharmed]

Ive watched magic and pippen a long time. Even live. There are just players who have size, athleticism and iq to screw up anyone short of jabbar and shaq. Of course, no one fuc*s around with prime jabbars and shaqs ever over the last 12 games of a season. Draymond was very good in his prime -- a different kind of pippen as he is best against 2-5 while pippen is fantastic against 1-4. Magic can grind down 1-5 as he has quickness, control and bulk to ride down anyone -- except the monster jordan of course who hates losing. Jordan is the real baller nazi -- he treats others as üntermenschen.

[JAMSKIE]

Bacto to the topic guys.

How do we compare Troy Rosario & Carl Tamayo?

I say Tamayo has better handles but Rosario has better shooting, more athletic & the quicker player. I see Tamayo's tendency to become passive in defense could be his biggest downside. Worse than his lack of athleticism & quickness. Tamayo should have a change in attitude in defense. He has to play with much more aggressiveness in defense.

[NOiNU]

First group: Yeah, Kawhi, KD, Larry Bird, LeBron James and Melo are great small forwards but they don't play the shooting guard spot. They would play more power forward than to be shooting guards and that's evident in their playing styles in the offensive end.

2nd group: Demar DeRozan, Utah Hayward, Jaylen Brown, Pre-injury Paul George, Jimmy Butler, Kobe Bryant, Andre Iguodala and Michael Jordan are perfect examples of players that are bonafide small forwards. Some of these are natural 2 but can play the 3 while others are natural 3 but can play the 2. But 2 and 3 spots are always in the perimeter and these two can switch on the other side of the perimeter area to another. Hence, the term "swingman".

Compare the first group to the second group in terms of offensive styles and body physique as well and you will see the difference.

Kawhi is a wing. He has always played the 2/3 slots even in his early years.

[ja.he]

Well, they are obviously referring to modern day "fours" naman. The ones who can shoot the trey, dribble & with good mobility. Something in the mold of RDO, Kelly Williams, Dray Blatche, or Iran's Arsalan Kazemi or Lebanon's Ali Haidar or Japan's Yuta Watanabe.

They aren't referring to the back-to-the-basket type of "fours".

But they still have the attributes of a big - they are still a fixture in paint. Post moves are still the bread and butter of these guys despite playing the modern role. While RDO, Blatche, Haidar and Watanabe are modern bigs, their moves still resemble those of bigmen role.

There are things that still separate who are the 3 (or swing for that matter) and 4 and it is still visible to the naked eye.

[ja.he]

Kawhi is a wing. He has always played the 2/3 slots even in his early years.

Kawhi is a wing. He has always played the 2/3 slots even in his early years.

He is not a wing. I barely see him play the guard in his entire career and he plays the small ball 4 (lebron vs. kawhi in 2014). He is primarily a 3 because bigs are available for him.

You should have known the reason why kawhi was snubbed by the suns and slipped in the late first round in the draft - because he was a power forward when he was in san diego. Bakas ang pagiging ang pagiging power forward sa galaw niya (trans: being a power forward is evident in his game).

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1222644-san-antonio-spurs-what-kawhi-leonards-breakout-postseason-means-for-his-future

Some considered him a high lottery prospect and some thought the San Diego State product was a mid-to-late first rounder. There were questions about his size, as he spent most of his college career playing power forward, but is just 6'7".

[NOiNU]

Yeah, the differences in roles have narrowed down but ate still visible. I think that’s just the nature of team sports. You can be very versatile but you have this one role/position that you are really comfortable with.

That said, the defining factor has always been on the defensive side. With modern teams opting to go 4 out and 5 out setups, the difference on the offensive side among players are negligible. But it is not the case for defense. A player playing the position should be able to defend it or else he’d always be put in an island without even running a screen play. This is where Tamayo as a 3 is in question. Can he withstand the rigors of chasing perimeter players. Is he agile enough to go around screens? Is he quick enough laterally to stay in front of a bonafide wing, say a Gabe Norwood, Yudai Baba or a SN Bahrami? If he can show in the future he can do these things, then by all means let’s peg him as a legit 3/4.

Of course he can still be played as a 3. But not unlike Rosario, he’d be playing depending on the match ups and only at short stints. Speaking of Rosario though, do you see improvements in his wing skills. Parang meron naman kahit pakonti-konti.