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Thread: Euroleague regular season: Week 18

  1. #181
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    Vesely is playing against ITÜ right now and he is playing very well tbh. Come on Fener seed 6 is still possible.

  2. #182
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    Vesely is playing against ITÜ right now and he is playing very well tbh. Come on Fener seed 6 is still possible.
    I have no data to support that, but I feel like injured players usually play the first game back very well but then hit a slump for a couple of games. We will see how it goes for Vesely, and if he is indeed free from injury (he wasn't last time)
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
    Şampiyonluk gelince

  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by vivo View Post
    I have no data to support that, but I feel like injured players usually play the first game back very well but then hit a slump for a couple of games. We will see how it goes for Vesely, and if he is indeed free from injury (he wasn't last time)
    Well I read an article that cites him with "i will play the first time without pain". I dont think that Feners medical stuff is so stupid to give an ok without vesely being ok. He looks better way better than i expected.

  4. #184
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    Well I read an article that cites him with "i will play the first time without pain". I dont think that Feners medical stuff is so stupid to give an ok without vesely being ok. He looks better way better than i expected.
    The medical staff of Fener was changed iirc, deservedly so. So I have no reason to distrust newer staff (yet). And I agree Vesely looks fluid
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
    Şampiyonluk gelince

  5. #185
    Senior Member Tevfik1907's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vivo View Post
    The medical staff of Fener was changed iirc, deservedly so. So I have no reason to distrust newer staff (yet). And I agree Vesely looks fluid
    https://www.eurohoops.net/tr/eurolea...r-degisikligi/

    We've changed the medical staff in 10/2019.

    They said that the same former doctor who worked with us also worked in BJK football club in 2012-13 season and they said they also had too many injuries like we suffered in the previous season. (18 football players injured).

    I have no idea who chose and why they chose that previous doctor in the first place.
    Last edited by Tevfik1907; 01-11-2020 at 08:00 PM.
    FENERBAHÇE BASKETBALL
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    --- 1991, 2007-08(2), 2010-11(2), 2014, 2016-18(3) Turkish BSL Champion ---
    --- 2015-19(5) EuroLeague Final Four ---
    --- 2017 EuroLeague Champion ---

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    With all my respect: i think not more than 5-10%. The game in OAKA was an off day nothing else.
    The only thing PAO has over Efes is tradition which translates into a 16-8 head- to head record since the EL's inception.

    We have a heavy negative head to head vs RM and Barca and when you take into consideration the weight of the jersey, you can understand why PAO would prefer a PO series vs Efes.

    Against RM especially we have lost 9!!!! consecutive games. I hear the name RM and I start crying. Our last win in Madrid was 6 years ago.
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  7. #187
    Senior Member Victorious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    The only thing PAO has over Efes is tradition which translates into a 16-8 head- to head record since the EL's inception.

    We have a heavy negative head to head vs RM and Barca and when you take into consideration the weight of the jersey, you can understand why PAO would prefer a PO series vs Efes.

    Against RM especially we have lost 9!!!! consecutive games. I hear the name RM and I start crying. Our last win in Madrid was 6 years ago.
    Exactly, almost certainly Pao will loose against Real Madrid or even CSKA/Barca. But they have a slight chance against Efes. First and foremost, Efes is a team without pressure as they don't have a large fanbase. However, during the play offs they will be the grand favorites against Pao. This will be a factor which can give their opponents some chance.
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  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    The only thing PAO has over Efes is tradition which translates into a 16-8 head- to head record since the EL's inception.

    We have a heavy negative head to head vs RM and Barca and when you take into consideration the weight of the jersey, you can understand why PAO would prefer a PO series vs Efes.

    Against RM especially we have lost 9!!!! consecutive games. I hear the name RM and I start crying. Our last win in Madrid was 6 years ago.
    I didnt say anything against it. I am sure that you would choose Efes over RM but it doesnt mean that you will be the favorite against Efes. I acknowledge your tradition and the power of OAKA but the impact of this tradition is not bigger than the abilities of your players. Without mentioning some names Efes is a much better team. Does it mean that pao has 0 chance? Never, there is always a chance but you must also face the reality that pao is not a big team anymore. I dont think that this is a problem of the greeks in this forum.

    I wouldnt prefere PAO as the playoff opponent not because of fear but there are weaker opponents.

  9. #189
    Senior Member janketa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    I didnt say anything against it. I am sure that you would choose Efes over RM but it doesnt mean that you will be the favorite against Efes. I acknowledge your tradition and the power of OAKA but the impact of this tradition is not bigger than the abilities of your players. Without mentioning some names Efes is a much better team. Does it mean that pao has 0 chance? Never, there is always a chance but you must also face the reality that pao is not a big team anymore. I dont think that this is a problem of the greeks in this forum.

    I wouldnt prefere PAO as the playoff opponent not because of fear but there are weaker opponents.
    I would not neglect fact that Efes lost just one away game and that was in OAKA. Maybe it was off night but maybe Pao is troublesome opponent for Efes. I think CSKA is also team that doesn't match Efes system.

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by janketa View Post
    I would not neglect fact that Efes lost just one away game and that was in OAKA. Maybe it was off night but maybe Pao is troublesome opponent for Efes. I think CSKA is also team that doesn't match Efes system.
    Maybe, maybe not. PAO was also the team that lost against Alba in OAKA and then the loss with a very bad game in Milan. The team doesnt show a certain stability.

  11. #191
    Efes fan Levenspiel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janketa View Post
    I would not neglect fact that Efes lost just one away game and that was in OAKA. Maybe it was off night but maybe Pao is troublesome opponent for Efes. I think CSKA is also team that doesn't match Efes system.
    if the RS standings end in a way that Efes/CSKA/Real/Barca takes the first 4 spots and Fener-PAO-Maccabi-X team between 5-8, we'd prefer PAO the least, then Fener, then Maccabi... the comfort level of the X team is also related to their tradition & success history. Works the other way, too; I can totally see why any of the 5-8 teams would pick Efes over the other 3.

    having said that, Efes should be able to pass all of them.
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  12. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adon View Post
    Ataman is great or what?
    he certainly knows a few things

    EN9Ap__WkAEItBG.jpg
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  13. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by janketa View Post
    This post is like written for Fener-Barca game next thursday, just instead of Pleiss/Sertac put Thomas/Lauvergne
    in Barcelona game, Davies was killing us in the 3rd quarter; there was no stopping him. Sertac & Pleiss messed up in offense and got into foul trouble in defense. but somehow we won that quarter. Then Pesic sat Davies down in the 4th, and Barca made a 14-0 run. Strange isn't it? Singleton & Peters did an excellent job at 4 & 5. I don't know, maybe the role of bigs in the EL is also changing.

    What I truly like in Efes is that all the players we have bashed based on previous impressions are now doing extraordinary work. I cannot believe how good/decent defenders Sanli, Pleiss, and Peters are suddenly. People who know bball more can explain I'm sure, but this cannot be a coincidence. Anderson & Singleton have become very good at doing the dirty jobs, doing whatever it takes to win regardless of the numbers in stat-sheet. Simon is taking advantage of defenses who focus on Micic & Larkin. Seemingly no egos in the team. I truly enjoy watching it this team.
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  14. #194
    Senior Member markkanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levenspiel View Post
    if the RS standings end in a way that Efes/CSKA/Real/Barca takes the first 4 spots and Fener-PAO-Maccabi-X team between 5-8, we'd prefer PAO the least, then Fener, then Maccabi... the comfort level of the X team is also related to their tradition & success history. Works the other way, too; I can totally see why any of the 5-8 teams would pick Efes over the other 3.

    having said that, Efes should be able to pass all of them.
    What you guys think about your short guard rotation? I mean, you have only Larkin, Micic and Beabois. I respect your team because of your constancy, you almost always play the same, no ups and downs like the rest of league. Your 15-3 record is great if we consider that you lose one game in double week, one game without two main players and one game in last seconds. But you need to buy another guard to rest Larkin and Micic if you want to win the title.

  15. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by markkanen View Post
    What you guys think about your short guard rotation? I mean, you have only Larkin, Micic and Beabois. I respect your team because of your constancy, you almost always play the same, no ups and downs like the rest of league. Your 15-3 record is great if we consider that you lose one game in double week, one game without two main players and one game in last seconds. But you need to buy another guard to rest Larkin and Micic if you want to win the title.
    There still is Simon and Tuncer. There is no need for another guy.

  16. #196
    Senior Member janketa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markkanen View Post
    What you guys think about your short guard rotation? I mean, you have only Larkin, Micic and Beabois. I respect your team because of your constancy, you almost always play the same, no ups and downs like the rest of league. Your 15-3 record is great if we consider that you lose one game in double week, one game without two main players and one game in last seconds. But you need to buy another guard to rest Larkin and Micic if you want to win the title.
    Absolutely, Efes needs one more guard asap, because there is no backup for Micic and Larkin. Ataman tried with Beabois but guy was such choker that Efes almost lost the game, mostly because of him

  17. #197
    Senior Member janketa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levenspiel View Post
    in Barcelona game, Davies was killing us in the 3rd quarter; there was no stopping him. Sertac & Pleiss messed up in offense and got into foul trouble in defense. but somehow we won that quarter. Then Pesic sat Davies down in the 4th, and Barca made a 14-0 run. Strange isn't it? Singleton & Peters did an excellent job at 4 & 5. I don't know, maybe the role of bigs in the EL is also changing.

    What I truly like in Efes is that all the players we have bashed based on previous impressions are now doing extraordinary work. I cannot believe how good/decent defenders Sanli, Pleiss, and Peters are suddenly. People who know bball more can explain I'm sure, but this cannot be a coincidence. Anderson & Singleton have become very good at doing the dirty jobs, doing whatever it takes to win regardless of the numbers in stat-sheet. Simon is taking advantage of defenses who focus on Micic & Larkin. Seemingly no egos in the team. I truly enjoy watching it this team.
    Larkin, Micic, Simon, Anderson, Pleiss, Dinston, Singleton, Sanli and Peters are hard as stone players, capable to win the title against any opponent. But it's up to Ataman how he will share roles in the team. He has some mediocres in the roster too, you know who

    I agree with Toruko that Tuncer could be used much more, maybe as backup for Micic or Larkin in case of injury.

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    Tuncer plays 1min adding less than 1 point. I don't think he should be even considered as a rotation player. Shooting 33% for 2 an 13% for 3 this season (played just 10 games).

    Simon can run the pick and roll but is no pure guard. He is a swingman, he is maybe the personification of a swingman. Efes plays the lineup Micic - Larkin - Simon quite often, wouldn't consider it as a guard/combo guard lineup. Simon obviously plays the 3 in this situations. A pure guard would help a lot for Efes, I also thought about this. Beaubois is some kind of a grab bag, sometimes he scores in series, sometimes he looks like completely lost but efficiently he is a pure scorer and nothing else. He can create out of isolation, but just for himself. Just check his stats, wow, he has 2.3 assists per game?! I will try to focus on this to see what kind of assists that are, extra passes, outlet passes or something which really can be called a pure assist. Would have guessed max 1.1as per game or something like that. A combo guard would help Efes, if it's a quality one I think that would boost them in being a real strong contender this year. I still doubt they are stronger than Real in a championship game. But they proved me wrong a lot of times and from all this high budget teams I like them the most so even Real is my favourite in winning it this year and a squad I would personally call stronger than Efes I hope for Ataman's boys to win it all this year. They play attractive offensive basketball, most people love this, it's the future whether we like it or not. Barca doesn't look so well-rounded to me, I think Efes can play with them even in a series as they have proven last year. Favourites look good this year, F4 will be fantastic.

  19. #199
    Efes fan Levenspiel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markkanen View Post
    What you guys think about your short guard rotation? I mean, you have only Larkin, Micic and Beabois. I respect your team because of your constancy, you almost always play the same, no ups and downs like the rest of league. Your 15-3 record is great if we consider that you lose one game in double week, one game without two main players and one game in last seconds. But you need to buy another guard to rest Larkin and Micic if you want to win the title.
    I am just a casual fan, I do not know the inner workings or the strategies of the club, but I feel like we'll stick to the existing roster/budget. You, and previously Janketa, have a good point on guards; it's thin, but I'm not as worried. I see Barca's roster and inadequate minutes for so many top level players, even with Huertel out, then I look at our roster and see every one is happy with their roles & minutes. Ataman would not have given the minutes to a potential extra guard any way, so if one player is somehow out, we'll have to figure it out between the members of existing roster.

    We could (and should) do some kind of load management on guards' minutes, yes. As Toruko said, we can give Tuncer the keys for TBL. He's too brave (ie. careless with the ball) for his skills, but who cares if we lose several games?
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  20. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katastroika View Post
    Tuncer plays 1min adding less than 1 point. I don't think he should be even considered as a rotation player. Shooting 33% for 2 an 13% for 3 this season (played just 10 games).

    Simon can run the pick and roll but is no pure guard. He is a swingman, he is maybe the personification of a swingman. Efes plays the lineup Micic - Larkin - Simon quite often, wouldn't consider it as a guard/combo guard lineup. Simon obviously plays the 3 in this situations. A pure guard would help a lot for Efes, I also thought about this. Beaubois is some kind of a grab bag, sometimes he scores in series, sometimes he looks like completely lost but efficiently he is a pure scorer and nothing else. He can create out of isolation, but just for himself. Just check his stats, wow, he has 2.3 assists per game?! I will try to focus on this to see what kind of assists that are, extra passes, outlet passes or something which really can be called a pure assist. Would have guessed max 1.1as per game or something like that. A combo guard would help Efes, if it's a quality one I think that would boost them in being a real strong contender this year. I still doubt they are stronger than Real in a championship game. But they proved me wrong a lot of times and from all this high budget teams I like them the most so even Real is my favourite in winning it this year and a squad I would personally call stronger than Efes I hope for Ataman's boys to win it all this year. They play attractive offensive basketball, most people love this, it's the future whether we like it or not. Barca doesn't look so well-rounded to me, I think Efes can play with them even in a series as they have proven last year. Favourites look good this year, F4 will be fantastic.
    Tuncer may mot take many minutes right now in Euroleague but he can give you for sure 10 good minutes against middle class teams and he is more than enough for BSL. He can run great pick and roll games, he is a great passer (even if some of the passes are reckless which causes turnovers), he can shoot the three. I dont see any problems with him offensively. Defensively he is a huge problem though. Nevertheless he will get his chance. Someone who makes a good USA game can handle any game.

    Kruno is right now in his prime. As you mentioned he is a great p&r player and can take over the second play maker role easily.

    I dont see any problems with the guard rotation as long as there is no injury of micic or larkin.

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