View Poll Results: Can Fenerbahçe make playoffs?

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  • What are you talking about? They WILL make playoffs.

    2 13.33%
  • They are a good team and it is likely.

    8 53.33%
  • They are off this season. It is a long shot.

    3 20.00%
  • They are done and gone. There is no way.

    2 13.33%
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Thread: Fenerbahçe, dead or alive?

  1. #61
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    Barca seem flakey at the moment. No one is performing consistently bar Mirotic and Delaney. The rest are warm and then cold. They definitely have an issue without Huertel and Pangos out who are proper pg's.
    PG issue hurts them but if everyone is performing bad in a team, coach is also to blame, especially when he has such a diverse roster
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
    Şampiyonluk gelince

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    Barca seem flakey at the moment. No one is performing consistently bar Mirotic and Delaney. The rest are warm and then cold. They definitely have an issue without Huertel and Pangos out who are proper pg's.
    The problem is not that they are hot or cold but the distribution of the minutes. Anthony Davis is hot as hell in the third quarter against Efes and gets 0 Minutes in the last quarter, same goes to Delaney who came as a legit nba player like Mirotic. I dont think that most of the guys are happy. Then pesic somehow plays with guys like Oriola or Roland Smits, nothing against the guy but if you have Tomic and Davis these guys shouldnt see any minute on the court.

    Another concerning point is playing together. Most of the actions are self creation. There is hardly ball sharing and chemistry. The roles are not fully clear, the rotation is weird simply said there are too many high qualitiy players without a personality who can guide them. From all the big teams Barca is this season the easiest.

  3. #63
    Senior Member EverGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    The problem is not that they are hot or cold but the distribution of the minutes. Anthony Davis is hot as hell in the third quarter against Efes and gets 0 Minutes in the last quarter, same goes to Delaney who came as a legit nba player like Mirotic. I dont think that most of the guys are happy. Then pesic somehow plays with guys like Oriola or Roland Smits, nothing against the guy but if you have Tomic and Davis these guys shouldnt see any minute on the court.

    Another concerning point is playing together. Most of the actions are self creation. There is hardly ball sharing and chemistry. The roles are not fully clear, the rotation is weird simply said there are too many high qualitiy players without a personality who can guide them. From all the big teams Barca is this season the easiest.
    You have a point. It's not easy when you try and play a 12 player rotation and think you need to split the mins to try and keep everyone happy. Barca lack a fluidity as a team. I think they are a step down from RM and Efes in that discipline.
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  4. #64
    Senior Member Cuneyt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levenspiel View Post
    it's Fener's thread, did not want to hijack it, but Efes is actually not overperforming except for Sertac & Pleiss, and even that is only my opinion. This is part of the illusion that also make it the least scary opponent. Remeber, Efes was seen as a fluke, a 3-shooting team only, by many but Efes dominated the games it had to, last year. We had to beat Barca by 15 to get the head to head, we beat by 22; we had to beat Baskonia to secure the 4th, no problem, we beat Barca in Barcelona by 34 in POs, you know what we did to Fener in F4, and also in TBL finals. So, it was not a fluke.

    This year, Efes is the second slowest team in the league but scoring the 2nd highest. Doesn't look like it, does it? without Dunston, and Moerman, and recently, Micic. Lucky shots again I guess.

    Obradovic is a fox. I will always remember him beating mighty Barca with a modest PAO, so anything is possible, but odds are not in your favor in an Efes match-up
    I never said Efes is or was a fluke. Efes is a solid team. However...
    Come on man...did you see Efes at 16-3 in the beginning of season? Me, I would have expected 11-12 W out of 19 in the beginning of the season. I am sure not one of us would have said Efes would win 85% of their games.
    I still believe Efes is overperforming. If they keep the RPM this high, it would be pretty tough to beat in a series for any team in the league including Real & Cska.
    But...that if is a big if.
    Personally I've not seen a team w/o a "performance drop" throughout the season.
    With Obra, the team starts solid and would drop in late jan early Feb, only to pick up the pace by April.
    Will the same happen to Efes? I dont know.
    Ataman is a good coach, but a self-righteous bastard who might think this to go on forever.
    The disaster would be to have the performance drop in April-May.
    We shall all see, but I am putting my money on that.
    Otherwise Efes is solid like I wrote above.

  5. #65
    Senior Member ab_mj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    The problem is not that they are hot or cold but the distribution of the minutes. Anthony Davis is hot as hell in the third quarter against Efes and gets 0 Minutes in the last quarter, same goes to Delaney who came as a legit nba player like Mirotic. I dont think that most of the guys are happy. Then pesic somehow plays with guys like Oriola or Roland Smits, nothing against the guy but if you have Tomic and Davis these guys shouldnt see any minute on the court.

    Another concerning point is playing together. Most of the actions are self creation. There is hardly ball sharing and chemistry. The roles are not fully clear, the rotation is weird simply said there are too many high qualitiy players without a personality who can guide them. From all the big teams Barca is this season the easiest.
    Anthony Davis ?

  6. #66
    Senior Member ab_mj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levenspiel View Post
    it's Fener's thread, did not want to hijack it, but Efes is actually not overperforming except for Sertac & Pleiss, and even that is only my opinion. This is part of the illusion that also make it the least scary opponent. Remeber, Efes was seen as a fluke, a 3-shooting team only, by many but Efes dominated the games it had to, last year. We had to beat Barca by 15 to get the head to head, we beat by 22; we had to beat Baskonia to secure the 4th, no problem, we beat Barca in Barcelona by 34 in POs, you know what we did to Fener in F4, and also in TBL finals. So, it was not a fluke.

    This year, Efes is the second slowest team in the league but scoring the 2nd highest. Doesn't look like it, does it? without Dunston, and Moerman, and recently, Micic. Lucky shots again I guess.

    Obradovic is a fox. I will always remember him beating mighty Barca with a modest PAO, so anything is possible, but odds are not in your favor in an Efes match-up
    This is not luck or over performance but many players are playing with their maximum. Larkin, he was also very good when he was playing for Baskonia 3 years ago not that level (Maybe Atamans's system allows him to shine that much...), Micic was his top until last several games.., Moerman has reached his top level and now Singleton is same. Simon is playing very good he was never be. No need to talk about Sanli, Pleiss.. If they keep playing like this, Efes is almost unstoppable unless any other team reaches their maximum (not any other team actually, only Real, Barca and Fener has that potential)

  7. #67
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ab_mj View Post
    Anthony Davis ?
    I think he meant Brandon Davies... Which is kind of Anthony Davis of Europe lol
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
    Şampiyonluk gelince

  8. #68
    Efes fan Levenspiel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuneyt View Post
    I never said Efes is or was a fluke. Efes is a solid team. However...
    Come on man...did you see Efes at 16-3 in the beginning of season? Me, I would have expected 11-12 W out of 19 in the beginning of the season. I am sure not one of us would have said Efes would win 85% of their games.
    I still believe Efes is overperforming. If they keep the RPM this high, it would be pretty tough to beat in a series for any team in the league including Real & Cska.
    But...that if is a big if.
    Personally I've not seen a team w/o a "performance drop" throughout the season.
    With Obra, the team starts solid and would drop in late jan early Feb, only to pick up the pace by April.
    Will the same happen to Efes? I dont know.
    Ataman is a good coach, but a self-righteous bastard who might think this to go on forever.
    The disaster would be to have the performance drop in April-May.
    We shall all see, but I am putting my money on that.
    Otherwise Efes is solid like I wrote above.
    Nah, maybe my mistake, I mentioned it because last year you had said Efes is winning beacuse they are making lots of shots, or something to that effect.

    Efes beat the expectations, because they kept the core and improved the chemistry further, not by overperforming (imho). I agree the history says it's not a good idea to keep the RPM so high all year long, no top seeded team won the title in this format. I was also saying we need to rest the major parts for a few weeks now.

    Ataman is a truly annoying guy, I give you that. Non-Turkish posters cannot fully grasp this.
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  9. #69
    Efes fan Levenspiel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ab_mj View Post
    This is not luck or over performance but many players are playing with their maximum. Larkin, he was also very good when he was playing for Baskonia 3 years ago not that level (Maybe Atamans's system allows him to shine that much...), Micic was his top until last several games.., Moerman has reached his top level and now Singleton is same. Simon is playing very good he was never be. No need to talk about Sanli, Pleiss.. If they keep playing like this, Efes is almost unstoppable unless any other team reaches their maximum (not any other team actually, only Real, Barca and Fener has that potential)
    first of all, I apologize for turning the conversation around to Efes.

    and I agree with you esp about Larkin, he was really good in Baskonia too, and he seems to have a chip on his shoulders this time, and he scares me to death every time he dives for the ball. He's the special one, sometimes it's just a single play, but he says, I'm the best player on the court. No other Efes player can say it. (Mike James, De Colo, and only a few others can say it in the EL).
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  10. #70
    Senior Member Cuneyt's Avatar
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    More or less agreed.
    I may have said Ataman is a shooting performance type of coach. In Gs he had all his chips in the shooting bag. Shoot the 3s and we'll be alright...
    Last years Efes was a bit like that, but the penetrations of the guards have added versatility to the offence.
    This year they seem to have increased defensive performance as well.
    so, I dont think Efes is a fluke, and I hope they keep revving

  11. #71
    Efes fan Levenspiel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    The problem is not that they are hot or cold but the distribution of the minutes. Anthony Davis is hot as hell in the third quarter against Efes and gets 0 Minutes in the last quarter, same goes to Delaney who came as a legit nba player like Mirotic. I dont think that most of the guys are happy. Then pesic somehow plays with guys like Oriola or Roland Smits, nothing against the guy but if you have Tomic and Davis these guys shouldnt see any minute on the court.

    Another concerning point is playing together. Most of the actions are self creation. There is hardly ball sharing and chemistry. The roles are not fully clear, the rotation is weird simply said there are too many high qualitiy players without a personality who can guide them. From all the big teams Barca is this season the easiest.
    Davies badly exposed our centers in the 3rd, scoring 16 I think. But the funny part is that Efes won that quarter by +5 points. And when he sat down, Barca made a 14-0 run. The game is strange, oen could argue Pesic was the genius seeing this.

    As most of us predicted at the start of the season, super-teams rarely work in the EL. Too many top-level players reduced to irregular 10mpg roles.

    I think Huertel & Pangos could change the picture. They have so much quality.
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  12. #72
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levenspiel View Post
    Davies badly exposed our centers in the 3rd, scoring 16 I think. But the funny part is that Efes won that quarter by +5 points. And when he sat down, Barca made a 14-0 run. The game is strange, oen could argue Pesic was the genius seeing this.

    As most of us predicted at the start of the season, super-teams rarely work in the EL. Too many top-level players reduced to irregular 10mpg roles.

    I think Huertel & Pangos could change the picture. They have so much quality.
    Yes, because what a team with big egos, little playing time, not enough shots and only one ball needs is definitely Heurtel I'm joking, but seriously, Heurtel could make this team better or make them implode. Pangos in another story, he could do well even when he keeps the ball in his hands for a bare minimum
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
    Şampiyonluk gelince

  13. #73
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    Delaney will be a problem after Heurtel comes. I dont think Pangos can get any minute, hell have to go.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levenspiel View Post
    Davies badly exposed our centers in the 3rd, scoring 16 I think. But the funny part is that Efes won that quarter by +5 points. And when he sat down, Barca made a 14-0 run. The game is strange, oen could argue Pesic was the genius seeing this.

    As most of us predicted at the start of the season, super-teams rarely work in the EL. Too many top-level players reduced to irregular 10mpg roles.

    I think Huertel & Pangos could change the picture. They have so much quality.
    Ball hog Heurtel? I really doubt it. He is just another Sloukas who has the ball in his hands for at least 14 seconds. You still have Higgins and Delaney. 2-3 guys must go I dont see another solution.

  15. #75
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toruko View Post
    Ball hog Heurtel? I really doubt it. He is just another Sloukas who has the ball in his hands for at least 14 seconds. You still have Higgins and Delaney. 2-3 guys must go I dont see another solution.
    At least Sloukas in the past showed he can play without having an issue when he isn't the top dog. I don't believe you can use Heurtel as a 15-20 minutes offensive spark from the bench
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
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