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Thread: Euroleague Regular Season: Week 9

  1. #161
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    I mean the coach is one thing but if you take a look at the signings its full of mistakes. Benneth, Tompson, Lauvergne, who earns like 1.7 Million Euros what is insane. Williams seems to be a question mark. Then signing Bobby who would make sense if your team building was ok but he is too old to contribute. Ahmet signing for 3 years is just crazy but since he has a turkish passport he is crucial for the turkish league but he cant play euroleague if you have higher goals. Vesely who had a solid season last year is a big question mark right now too. We talked about sloukas many times. Great second option guard but he cant carry you unfortunately he thinks he can do it. On the other hand Datome and Kalinic solid pieces who are a contribution just when your team works well.

    All Fener player have somehow a serbian background. If it is Lauverne or Westerman who couldnt contribute as well btw. The time here you have that money and do as you like time will be over eventually.

  2. #162
    Senior Member markkanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janketa View Post
    Obra should get new contract and rebuild new team for the next season.
    Gerardini should be sacked. He is the biggest problem and except De Colo and Melli all transfers in past years were wrong. Every American player was mediocre but we pay them like stars. Renewal contracts with Dixon was a mistake too. We need top pg instead of him and Biberovic as naturalised player.

    This season is over in terms of title, like I said 3 rounds ago. But this season could be used for preparing for the next season.
    All transfers in past years were wrong? What about Kalinic, Udoh, Bogdanovic? But yes, there were many mistakes in past. Jason Thompson, Lauvergne, Westermann, Green.

    And the very reason why Fener played great in past season is core of european best players like Vesely, Sloukas, Datome, Kalinic, Melli, Bogdanovic. They are best european players which Fenerbahce could buy and that moment.

  3. #163
    Senior Member janketa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vivo View Post
    But despite these errors there are many good things Gherardini did.
    What good things? Except De Colo and Mell. With 30 milions budget we don't have decent pg, for two seasons we didn't have top10 shooting guard, we still don't have dominant center. Our pf can't make a single point or a single ft against Barca and he brought him for big money. I don't understand your point about many good things, sorry.

  4. #164
    Senior Member EverGreen's Avatar
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    Honestly. I don't think basketball teams need a GM. For football when you have 30 players yes. But basketball when you have 12-14 no.

    Obradovic never had a GM at Panathinaikos. He was the sole person responsible for players. He'd give his list to Manos Papadopoulos who is like a GM but not exactly a GM and he would do the negotiating together with the owners in regards to $$$. What I mean is that he never had a say or who he thinks is good or matches the club. Zoc would phone the player he was interested in tell him where he fitted in his plans. The player would say yes or no and then it was all about money. I feel Gheradini has more powers than Manos Papadopoulos.

    One of our biggest ever coup's was the signing of Jasikevicius. Oly had contacted him earlier. Gerson never spoke to him to come to Oly. Oly's owners contacted his manager and said we offer X for 3 years. What's your answer? Obradovic spoke to him on the phone telling him about plan. Manos Papadopopoulos flew to Barcelona where Lithuania were doing some preparation and spoke personally telling him exactly what PAO was looking to do in the next years. Panathinaikos made a financial offer to his agent. Zoc said take your time to make your decision. No pressure. Olympiakos finds out and in a panic calls Saras' manager and asks "how much money does he want to come to Olympiakos?". When this was conveyed to Saras he responded by saying "Am I a whore? Why are they talking about money? I don't care for the money.". Two days later he signed for PAO for less money that was offered by Olympiakos.

    The money being a non issue for Saras was proven again two years ago when Barca made him a big offer but he rejected it because he didn't want De La Fuente being his boss and deciding which players to sign. He stayed at Zalgiris with less than half Barca offered because he could be his own boss.
    Last edited by EverGreen; 11-21-2019 at 12:52 PM.
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  5. #165
    Senior Member janketa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markkanen View Post
    All transfers in past years were wrong? What about Kalinic, Udoh, Bogdanovic? But yes, there were many mistakes in past. Jason Thompson, Lauvergne, Westermann, Green.

    And the very reason why Fener played great in past season is core of european best players like Vesely, Sloukas, Datome, Kalinic, Melli, Bogdanovic. They are best european players which Fenerbahce could buy and that moment.
    Udoh and Bogdanovic was gamble transfers and cheap ones(comparing to others). But that was 5 years ago man. I thought on last couple seasons after they left.

  6. #166
    Senior Member janketa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    Honestly. I don't think basketball teams need a GM. For football when you have 30 players yes. But basketball when you have 12-14 no.

    Obradovic never had a GM at Panathinaikos. He was the sole person responsible for players. He'd give his list to Manos Papadopoulos who is like a GM but not exactly a GM and he would do the negotiating together with the owners in regards to $$$. What I mean is that he never had a say or who he thinks is good or matches the club. Zoc would phone the player he was interested in tell him where he fitted in his plans. The player would say yes or no and then it was all about money. I feel Gheradini has more powers than Manos Papadopoulos.

    One of our biggest ever coup's was the signing of Jasikevicius. Oly had contacted him earlier. Gerson never spoke to him to come to Oly. Oly's owners contacted his manager and said we offer X for 3 years. What's your answer? Manos Papadopopoulos flew to Barcelona where Lithuania were doing some preparation and spoke personally telling him exactly what PAO was looking to do in the next years. Obradovic spoke to him on the phone telling him more about the plans. Panathinaikos made a financial offer to his agent. Zoc said take your time to make your decision. No pressure. Olympiakos finds out and in a panic calls Saras' manager and asks "how much money does he want to come to Olympiakos?". When this was conveyed to Saras he responded by saying "Am I a whore? Why are they talking about money? I don't care for the money.". Two days later he signed for PAO for less money that was offered by Olympiakos.

    The money being a non issue for Saras was proven again two years ago when Barca made him a big offer but he rejected it because he didn't want De La Fuente being his boss and deciding which players to sign. He stayed at Zalgiris with less than half Barca offered because he could be his own boss.
    I am not sure about Gheradini role in transfers but someone made big mistakes. Maybe it's Obradovic fault, who knows. We don't need him in both cases.

  7. #167
    Senior Member Jon_Koncak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janketa View Post
    What good things? Except De Colo and Mell. With 30 milions budget we don't have decent pg, for two seasons we didn't have top10 shooting guard, we still don't have dominant center. Our pf can't make a single point or a single ft against Barca and he brought him for big money. I don't understand your point about many good things, sorry.
    When you signed Westerman most if not all Fener fans were celebrating.Same with jounalists."What a great pg,he'll thrive under Obradovic" and the usual bs.

  8. #168
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janketa View Post
    What good things? Except De Colo and Mell. With 30 milions budget we don't have decent pg, for two seasons we didn't have top10 shooting guard, we still don't have dominant center. Our pf can't make a single point or a single ft against Barca and he brought him for big money. I don't understand your point about many good things, sorry.
    So, Gherardini is solely responsible for all the bad signings with no input from Obradovic and had no hand in bringing Bogdanovic, Udoh etc. Got it.

    Come on man, no team can reach consecutive final fours and finals with a bad GM. I understand the frustration of us all but saying it's all Gherardini's fault is not factual. He had errors, Zoc had errors, some players are not giving it all, we had bad luck with multiple injuries... There is a combination of factors here.
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
    Şampiyonluk gelince

  9. #169
    Senior Member vivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    Honestly. I don't think basketball teams need a GM. For football when you have 30 players yes. But basketball when you have 12-14 no.

    Obradovic never had a GM at Panathinaikos. He was the sole person responsible for players. He'd give his list to Manos Papadopoulos who is like a GM but not exactly a GM and he would do the negotiating together with the owners in regards to $$$. What I mean is that he never had a say or who he thinks is good or matches the club. Zoc would phone the player he was interested in tell him where he fitted in his plans. The player would say yes or no and then it was all about money. I feel Gheradini has more powers than Manos Papadopoulos.

    One of our biggest ever coup's was the signing of Jasikevicius. Oly had contacted him earlier. Gerson never spoke to him to come to Oly. Oly's owners contacted his manager and said we offer X for 3 years. What's your answer? Obradovic spoke to him on the phone telling him about plan. Manos Papadopopoulos flew to Barcelona where Lithuania were doing some preparation and spoke personally telling him exactly what PAO was looking to do in the next years. Panathinaikos made a financial offer to his agent. Zoc said take your time to make your decision. No pressure. Olympiakos finds out and in a panic calls Saras' manager and asks "how much money does he want to come to Olympiakos?". When this was conveyed to Saras he responded by saying "Am I a whore? Why are they talking about money? I don't care for the money.". Two days later he signed for PAO for less money that was offered by Olympiakos.

    The money being a non issue for Saras was proven again two years ago when Barca made him a big offer but he rejected it because he didn't want De La Fuente being his boss and deciding which players to sign. He stayed at Zalgiris with less than half Barca offered because he could be his own boss.
    We needed a GM because Fener didn't have a good system, management until 2014. After 1 year Obradovic needed another basketball mind not only for transfers but also the system in the club's basketball branch. You probably already had that at Pao
    Dilimde şarkıların gündüz gece
    Deli gibi aşığız Fenerbahçe
    Bu dünyayı yakarız senin için
    Şampiyonluk gelince

  10. #170
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    I dont know what the benefit of having a gm is. The guy without knowing earns at least 2-3 Million Euros a year. Larking earned 1.7 Million and 2,6 Million this season and Larkin is 1000 times more effective than a gm.

  11. #171
    Senior Member janketa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Koncak View Post
    When you signed Westerman most if not all Fener fans were celebrating.Same with jounalists."What a great pg,he'll thrive under Obradovic" and the usual bs.
    I didn't notice that about Weterman, but for Williams there was some celebrating. And that is bs, guy is typical slum dunk American without brain, I knew that before he even came to Fener

    Westerman could be good backup pg at the end, but problem with us we don't have first pg either

  12. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    God that's an awful question to ask. It's like asking me with one of my 2 daughters do I love the most but ok. I'll bite. I want either who will commit to a 3 year contract at season's end. If you ask me who I want coaching PAO next week it's Pitino because Zoc seems to be worn out by the drama at Fener. It's like he needs a month to get away from the kitchen and clear his mind. Pitino's is cleared after a 6 month break. If I had the choice to sign either for 3 years I would sign Pitino because he never finished the job he started last season which was building nicely.
    Sorry about that, and thanks for biting .
    Yes, I see, and your answer shows the level trust in Pitino. that is actually quite impressive.
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  13. #173
    Senior Member Jazz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen View Post
    Even at Fener his mid-season signings have had little effect or have been trash like Jason Thompson, Anthony Bennett, Blagota Sekulic, Pierre Jackson and Eric Green.
    Yes, that really isn't a great list of signings although iirc he did sign Zisis mid season who was pretty solid.

  14. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levenspiel View Post
    Sorry about that, and thanks for biting .
    Yes, I see, and your answer shows the level trust in Pitino. that is actually quite impressive.
    It’s kind of like that girlfriend that dumped you and you couldn’t move on for a long time. Especially because you were very unlucky with the next ones.

    Time passed, Obra did his thing, we did ours, and suddenly last year out of nowhere we had the chance to date a really cool girl. We got a glimpse of an awesome life. That -I believe- helped a lot because we wanted to move on. We didn’t want to stay in the past. It’s just that the past was too great and had a massive effect on us.
    3rd, Euroleague IBN prediction game 2019

  15. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by markkanen View Post
    I agree with most that you said, but Jason Thompson wasn't mid-season addition. He played from the start of the season, very bad unfortunately.

    Team spirit is the most important thing in club success. De Colo and Williams are excellent players, TOP SG and TOP PF, but they came in team that slowly lose their shape and building chemistry between new players and the rest of team is not a easy task for any coach.



    Heurtel is long term out, so no Heurtel AND Delaney, only Heurtel OR Delaney. Delaney is replacement for Heurtel.
    Heurtel should be returning around January. Soo it will be Delaney, Heurtel, Pangos, when it matters. Meaning they can easily survive some additional injuries.
    Last edited by Killer Bob; 11-21-2019 at 05:53 PM.
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  16. #176
    Senior Member kzav's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killer Bob View Post
    Heurtel should be retiring around January. Soo it will be Delaney, Heurtel, Pangos, when it matters. Meaning they can easily survive some additional injuries.
    I knew Heurtel was one lazy &*^( but I didn't expect him to retire so early...
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  17. #177
    Senior Member Killer Bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kzav View Post
    i knew heurtel was one lazy &*^( but i didn't expect him to retire so early...
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  18. #178
    Senior Member Cuneyt's Avatar
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    Hindsight is 20/20 they say.

    When the "gamble" pays off as it did in Bogdanovic, Udoh, Datome, Melli, Bobby, and many others, it is pure luck!
    When the "gamble" fails as it did with Thompson, Bennett and many others, people look for somebody to blame!

    Pathetic really.

    In the summer when we signed De Colo, DW, and Westermann, I was very happy with the way the club was run. I will NOT blame and be a hypocrite just because the chemistry did not yet pan out.

    I believe this team will click, and am hoping it would not be too late to recover.

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