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Thread: 2019 - 2020 ASEAN Basketball League

  1. #381
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    Ceasefire muna. Haha.

    Merry Christmas guys. And happy festivus for the rest of us.

  2. #382
    Senior Member digitalsuperman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bballcrazy View Post
    Tien Lei is done. If you watch his prime highlights dude look like Tracy Mcgrady on the dunks..Now he can barely move.
    is he that guy deemed as the lebron james of asia?
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  3. #383
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gusty View Post
    Exactly . That’s always been my beef. Jus soli and jus sanguinis are both legitimate ways of acquiring citizenship. Why the utter disregard of the jus sanguinis principle on Hagop’s part??? Why did FIBA-Asia choose to be complicit?

    Just plain and simple selective respect for municipal law.. SMH
    FIBA implemented this rule precisely because of individual countries' citizenship laws, which vary in strictness in granting citizenship. Germany grants citizenship to anyone with at least one German parent or grandparent (ex. Chris Kaman). Israel grants citizenship to anyone practicing the Jewish faith, or who has at least one Jewish grandparent under their Law of Return. FIBA's eligibility rules are a way to implement a universal eligibility system that applies to all countries regardless of their laws. So yes, it was designed to deliberately "piss on" nations' local citizenship laws.

    Is it a perfect system? Not by a long shot, because it's still possible to "cheat" the system, as seen in Qatar's naturalizing most of Bosnia and Herzogovina's U-16 team B to play for them. But I can see the reason for its implementation.

    The only complaint I have against it is the 16 year age limit. 18 is the age of majority of most countries and I'd like to see the age limit raised to 18, so that the decision to play for which country lies with the PLAYER, rather than with the player's parents.

  4. #384
    Senior Member reamily's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by digitalsuperman View Post
    is he that guy deemed as the lebron james of asia?
    naka ten points pa yan with his rheumatic legs nowadays haha
    To becomes Asia's Best, we need to compete against the World's Best..

  5. #385
    Senior Member mangangalakal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by k3ttch View Post
    FIBA implemented this rule precisely because of individual countries' citizenship laws, which vary in strictness in granting citizenship. Germany grants citizenship to anyone with at least one German parent or grandparent (ex. Chris Kaman). Israel grants citizenship to anyone practicing the Jewish faith, or who has at least one Jewish grandparent under their Law of Return. FIBA's eligibility rules are a way to implement a universal eligibility system that applies to all countries regardless of their laws. So yes, it was designed to deliberately "piss on" nations' local citizenship laws.

    Is it a perfect system? Not by a long shot, because it's still possible to "cheat" the system, as seen in Qatar's naturalizing most of Bosnia and Herzogovina's U-16 team B to play for them. But I can see the reason for its implementation.

    The only complaint I have against it is the 16 year age limit. 18 is the age of majority of most countries and I'd like to see the age limit raised to 18, so that the decision to play for which country lies with the PLAYER, rather than with the player's parents.
    Good point. And the raising of the age limit is actually more doable than abolishing the rule altogether, in terms of getting other countries' support.
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  6. #386
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    Part of the reason for the 16 year old cuttof instead of higher age, is FIBA wants the decision of citizenhip based more on non basketball reasons but mainly on choice of country one wants to adopt. It also puts greater emphasis and rewards the nation who developed the player in his pre 16 year old years

    Do note the process of exception allows for 18 year olds who've shown they have adopted the country as their own. So it is actually addressed
    Again not perfect but you can see the rationale behind it
    Last edited by analyzed; 12-24-2019 at 03:05 AM.
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  7. #387
    Senior Member mangangalakal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by analyzed View Post
    Part of the reason for the 16 year old cuttof instead of higher age, is FIBA wants the decision of citizenhip based more on non basketball reasons but mainly on choice of country one wants to adopt. It also puts greater emphasis and rewards the nation who developed the player in his pre 16 year old years

    Again not perfect but you can see the rationale behind it
    but in majority of the world 16 year-olds have limited legal capacity, in other words most 16 year-olds cannot choose their citizenship yet. If FIBA really wants players to represent the country of their choice, let them wait til they're old enough to decide which country they really want to play for. Citizenship is not only a legal concept but a personal decision as well. In football there have been prominent cases of senior NT players switching nationalities, for example Diego Costa of Atletico Madrid (switched from Brazil to Spain) and Eder (switched from Brazil to Italy)
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  8. #388
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    Quote Originally Posted by k3ttch View Post
    FIBA implemented this rule precisely because of individual countries' citizenship laws, which vary in strictness in granting citizenship. Germany grants citizenship to anyone with at least one German parent or grandparent (ex. Chris Kaman). Israel grants citizenship to anyone practicing the Jewish faith, or who has at least one Jewish grandparent under their Law of Return. FIBA's eligibility rules are a way to implement a universal eligibility system that applies to all countries regardless of their laws. So yes, it was designed to deliberately "piss on" nations' local citizenship laws.

    Is it a perfect system? Not by a long shot, because it's still possible to "cheat" the system, as seen in Qatar's naturalizing most of Bosnia and Herzogovina's U-16 team B to play for them. But I can see the reason for its implementation.

    The only complaint I have against it is the 16 year age limit. 18 is the age of majority of most countries and I'd like to see the age limit raised to 18, so that the decision to play for which country lies with the PLAYER, rather than with the player's parents.
    Fair point. But again, this presupposes a universal acceptance of 18 as the age of majority. What if it’s 16 in others, or 21 in some? In this case, those countries which recognize 21 as the age of majority will be at a disadvantage again. If “fairness “ is the object, I would posit that respecting each state’s municipal law, so long as it does not trample upon municipal law of another, would be the best means of attaining that end. (You correctly pointed out that “pissing on” municipal law is what the Hagop rule achieved.)

  9. #389
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    Quote Originally Posted by mangangalakal View Post
    but in majority of the world 16 year-olds have limited legal capacity, in other words most 16 year-olds cannot choose their citizenship yet. If FIBA really wants players to represent the country of their choice, let them wait til they're old enough to decide which country they really want to play for. Citizenship is not only a legal concept but a personal decision as well. In football there have been prominent cases of senior NT players switching nationalities, for example Diego Costa of Atletico Madrid (switched from Brazil to Spain) and Eder (switched from Brazil to Italy)
    This. The decision should be with the PLAYER, rather than the PARENTS.

    Also, you'd think that with FIBA trying so hard to ape FIFA (to the extent of even proposing to make Olympic basketball an U23 event), they'd also adopt FIFA's rules on player eligibility.

  10. #390
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    Quote Originally Posted by mangangalakal View Post
    but in majority of the world 16 year-olds have limited legal capacity, in other words most 16 year-olds cannot choose their citizenship yet. If FIBA really wants players to represent the country of their choice, let them wait til they're old enough to decide which country they really want to play for. Citizenship is not only a legal concept but a personal decision as well. In football there have been prominent cases of senior NT players switching nationalities, for example Diego Costa of Atletico Madrid (switched from Brazil to Spain) and Eder (switched from Brazil to Italy)

    Do note the process of exception allows for 18 year olds who've shown they have adopted the country as their own. So it is actually addressed

    What is hard to justify and rightfully so, is twenty year old adults whose actions have shown no indication that they've truly adopted the country.
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  11. #391
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    Quote Originally Posted by bballcrazy View Post
    Tien Lei is done. If you watch his prime highlights dude look like Tracy Mcgrady on the dunks..Now he can barely move.
    Tien Lei is what, already 36? Cagers of that age are usually way past their prime so its understandable that Tien is hardly a shadow of what he was 10 years ago. He has also gained significant weight. From what I remember, he was a bit skinny/lanky when he was in his early 20's.

    He was really a match-up problem in Asian basketball during his prime as he was a perfect "stretch four" for the international game. Tien Lei is the type of player I want Carl Tamayo to become minus the athleticism.
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  12. #392
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    Its unfortunate that these Taiwanese teams in the ABL - Formosa Dreamers & Fubon Braves, have become tambakan ng mga laos at may edad na mga former National players of Chinese Taipei.

    This wouldn't help the ABL as far as elevating the level of competition of the league. I understand that the top players of the current Chinese Taipei National team are in China's CBA pro league where the money is good. But I think it would be better for the ABL if Formosa Dreamers & Fubon Braves recruit those lower tier Chinese Taipei National players & some other star players from Taiwan's top pro league - the SBL.
    "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

  13. #393
    Senior Member Silent Killer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    Its unfortunate that these Taiwanese teams in the ABL - Formosa Dreamers & Fubon Braves, have become tambakan ng mga laos at may edad na mga former National players of Chinese Taipei.

    This wouldn't help the ABL as far as elevating the level of competition of the league. I understand that the top players of the current Chinese Taipei National team are in China's CBA pro league where the money is good. But I think it would be better for the ABL if Formosa Dreamers & Fubon Braves recruit those lower tier Chinese Taipei National players & some other star players from Taiwan's top pro league - the SBL.
    i think SBL disbanded kaya fubon braves move to ABL

  14. #394
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    Imo jet chang, joseph lin are still the elites of taiwan basketball.. maliba kay liu cheng, chou yin shiang atsaka kay chen this is the best of taiwan has to offer..bangko din yan si hu long mao pag nag abl siya..
    To becomes Asia's Best, we need to compete against the World's Best..

  15. #395
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silent Killer View Post
    i think SBL disbanded kaya fubon braves move to ABL
    Then this only means more players, who are very much in their prime, available for both Fubon & Formosa for their ABL rosters. Of course the elite National team players like Chou Yi-Hsiang, Liu Cheng, Hu Lung-Mao, Chen Ying-Chun, are expected to be playing in the CBA, but I think the other lesser caliber players in the SBL (now disbanded) could have been lured to play for Fubon or Formosa in the ABL.
    "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

  16. #396
    Senior Member digitalsuperman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by reamily View Post
    naka ten points pa yan with his rheumatic legs nowadays haha
    lol grabe naman rheuma talaga.haha
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  17. #397
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    Maybe Alab should hire the fast and furiuos when the other one decides to retire. They can be good for 10 points too.

    All kidding aside, putting the Taiwanese stars in ABL is a good move. Taiwanese bball market is ripe for SEA and their stars, ageing as they are, are still more skillful than majority of the local stars in the ABL. This is a wake up call also for the locals as they can clearly see the gap as an ageing Lin Chi Chieh and Tien Lei are EABA stars that can still compete in SEA.

  18. #398
    Senior Member mangangalakal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMSKIE View Post
    Then this only means more players, who are very much in their prime, available for both Fubon & Formosa for their ABL rosters. Of course the elite National team players like Chou Yi-Hsiang, Liu Cheng, Hu Lung-Mao, Chen Ying-Chun, are expected to be playing in the CBA, but I think the other lesser caliber players in the SBL (now disbanded) could have been lured to play for Fubon or Formosa in the ABL.
    The SBL did not disband, but with Fubon and KKL gone, there are now only 5 teams in the league. Link
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  19. #399
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    Quote Originally Posted by mangangalakal View Post
    The SBL did not disband, but with Fubon and KKL gone, there are now only 5 teams in the league. Link
    Ah ok, noted. Thanks for the correction.

    Just wonder how could one make do of a 5-team pro league? It looked more like a pocket tournament rather than a legit professional basketball league.
    "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

  20. #400
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    OT

    ^ Based on the video in the SBL page, looks like a PBA game. Empty seats and all.

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