Group H: LTU-AUS-CAN-SEN

[usagre]

I think that now Canada is becoming a bit underestimated here. They are not that bad surely. They still can compose decent starting 5 with Cory Joseph, Pangos, Ejim, Olynyk, Birch, they has some fine players off the bench like Ph.Scrubb, Wiltjer, Boucher. Overall some decent shooting touch, which on a good day can blow away both Lithuania and Australia

Excellent point. The same thing is happening with the US as well. It's understandable to a degree if we focus on and get distracted by what those teams could have been.

[mojo13]

Final 12 for Australia announced:

Aron Baynes
Andrew Bogut
Jonah Bolden
Xavier Cooks
Matthew Dellavedova
Cameron Gliddon
Chris Goulding
Joe Ingles
Nicholas Kay
Jock Landale
Patty Mills
Nathan Sobey

Notable outs: Mitch Creek, Deng Adel, and Brock Motum.

Australia seemingly making some weird roster decisions in the back half of their team. Maybe searching for roster balance at the expense of cutting superior players? Most were not weren't expecting Xavier Cooks, Cameron Gliddon, and Nick Kay. Doesn't seem the Aussie fans are too pleased about this. But not sure it matters too much in the scheme of things.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/basketb...ee657f6229a427

[Shawshank]

So 5 main players returning from one of best Olympic Aussies team I have seen ever.

Bogut,Baynes,Ingles,Mills,Dellavedova

Surprisingly that remaining 7 role players are different compared to olympics. 4 of those 5 main players are in 30s.

For example Lithuania is bringing 8 same player's from Olympics

Maybe I overstatement Australia a bit looking to roster now, but still how they convingly beat and physically pushed us around in both 2014 and 2016 still is in my memory.

Lithuania 2019 is deeper than 2016 and our main 2 players from NBA in 2019 is not looking or playing like youngsters anymore like in Olympics 3 years ago they did.

With seeing both Canada and Australia rosters I like my team's chance's better to survive this group than one month's ago.

[Mindozas]

Final 12 for Australia announced:

Aron Baynes
Andrew Bogut
Jonah Bolden
Xavier Cooks
Matthew Dellavedova
Cameron Gliddon
Chris Goulding
Joe Ingles
Nicholas Kay
Jock Landale
Patty Mills
Nathan Sobey

Notable outs: Mitch Creek, Deng Adel, and Brock Motum.

Australia seemingly making some weird roster decisions in the back half of their team. Maybe searching for roster balance at the expense of cutting superior players? Most were not weren't expecting Xavier Cooks, Cameron Gliddon, and Nick Kay. Doesn't seem the Aussie fans are too pleased about this. But not sure it matters too much in the scheme of things.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/basketb...ee657f6229a427

Motum is not a notable out, IMO Landale is simply better nowadays to fill the frontcourt. While Kay was a guy I was expected to make a roster, he looked really solid in NBL, much tougher than Motum. Xavier Cooks had really good season in Germany, I didn't think that might be enough for him to break into roster, Mitch Creek looked like almost a lock there, also Adel seeking more or less the same position, but probably Cooks was simply better. Guy is really versatile, physically gifted all around player with nice shot. I think if he'll continue this way, in a year or couple he'll move to Euroleague.
Overall solid roster, there's balance in lines in defense/offense, there's experience, there's good coach. It'll be very hard nut to crack

[Roofman]

@Mindozas, I was very surprised to hear of Creek's omission- after the NBA six, I would have thought that he would be possibly the first cab off the rank from the rest, given he was mostly present during qualifying and minor tournaments, knew coach Lemanis' system and had a decent NBA experience and showed off an ok perimeter shot, previously the knock on him. Landale makes sense too, because no doubt you guys will be hungry for revenge, and will absolutely try to play through your bigs against us, so having a third centre makes complete sense for fouls and possible injuries.

The very little I have seen of Cooks I like, but he did look rail thin and only around a low 30s% shooter from range, will be a handful if he improves in these areas. Cooks and Bolden promise a running unit with shooters assisting off the bench. I should say that I follow Euro hoops and especially the Australians in it, but always interested in commentaries on players. Maybe you could shed some light on Motum who seems to not last more than two years at any particular club. He shot %s of 40+/50+/mid 80s from the line at Efes Pilsen, does he just like IQ and make basic errors? I mean he is 208cm, fairly athletic, obviously can shoot and seem like a solid person, would like to know some insight here...

[Mindozas]

@Mindozas, I was very surprised to hear of Creek's omission- after the NBA six, I would have thought that he would be possibly the first cab off the rank from the rest, given he was mostly present during qualifying and minor tournaments, knew coach Lemanis' system and had a decent NBA experience and showed off an ok perimeter shot, previously the knock on him. Landale makes sense too, because no doubt you guys will be hungry for revenge, and will absolutely try to play through your bigs against us, so having a third centre makes complete sense for fouls and possible injuries.

The very little I have seen of Cooks I like, but he did look rail thin and only around a low 30s% shooter from range, will be a handful if he improves in these areas. Cooks and Bolden promise a running unit with shooters assisting off the bench. I should say that I follow Euro hoops and especially the Australians in it, but always interested in commentaries on players. Maybe you could shed some light on Motum who seems to not last more than two years at any particular club. He shot %s of 40+/50+/mid 80s from the line at Efes Pilsen, does he just like IQ and make basic errors? I mean he is 208cm, fairly athletic, obviously can shoot and seem like a solid person, would like to know some insight here...

Motum is a nice guy indeed, or as you say solid person, a shy one, and what's bad about that - he brings that to the court too frequently, he tends simply to disappear. He might have some good stretches, like in 2016 bronze medal game vs Spain, but at times you simply doesn't notice that he is there, lacks leader qualities, a bit of that good sportive anger, is simply too passive in offense. Also no matter that he is athletic, he is soft player, especially in defense, there was a season in Zalgiris when he failed to block a single shot in whole Euroleague season, and he was playing some 20+ mins in 20+ games. Awful for a PF. Tbh in 2nd season he wasn't much better in it. Not the best rebounder either. Overall, had troubles in reading the game defensively and that was big problem of him.
He seems to be one of these cases where looks like guy has all the physical tools to be really good, but lacks character, mentality. I think the same Landale also isn't the strongest guy out there, also defensively average at best, but he has right mentality to go far, at least further than Motum did

[ZaliaBalta]

Tako Fall
Youssoupha Fall
Clevin Hannah
Gorgui Dieng

All out of Senegal's list.

[Mindozas]

Tako Fall
Youssoupha Fall
Clevin Hannah
Gorgui Dieng

All out of Senegal's list.

Only Hannah is fresh absence, others withdrew some week ago

[soulis79]

Senegal at the moment looks like the worst team of the tournament. It seems also ,that Faye is having some kind of injury. He appeared for 3 minutes in the last friendly at Verona and today versus Turkey he is not in the roster.

[paspalj]

Keep in mind Canada is not the most patriotic or nationalist country - it is a country that has multiculturalism and diversity as its main cultural drivers (this can be very good in many ways and also bad, with this as an example of what goes wrong). It is worth he trade off I suppose.

I get what you are trying to say and I have the utmost respect for Canada but patriotism has nothing to do with this. Look at the US for example, a country where patriotism is taken to the extreme, especially in the realm of sports. National Anthem before every game, special shoutouts to soldiers during games, ostracizing Kaepernick because of his decision to protest in this specific way that was considered disrespectful etc

In addition to that, there is the whole "greatest country on earth" thing going on. I don't want to get into details but you get the idea.

Despite all that, players casually reject their NT.
The NBA, like almost every american corporation, demands your full attention. If it doesn't bring money, it's not worth exploring.
(I distinguish american corporations because of the known cutthroat pace, dog-eat-dog mentality. Corporate greed is a worldwide thing.)

[Prancūzėlis_ZLD]

I get what you are trying to say and I have the utmost respect for Canada but patriotism has nothing to do with this. Look at the US for example, a country where patriotism is taken to the extreme, especially in the realm of sports. National Anthem before every game, special shoutouts to soldiers during games, ostracizing Kaepernick because of his decision to protest in this specific way that was considered disrespectful etc

In addition to that, there is the whole "greatest country on earth" thing going on. I don't want to get into details but you get the idea.

Despite all that, players casually reject their NT.

I also think patriotism has an important part in skipping the World Cup or not. Yet, there is a major difference between Canada and USA (which is, as you stated, a very patriotic country) : almost everyone would agree to say that Team USA is the best basketball team, so they have nothing to prove in this regards. Especially after remaining undefeated for so long... Most people still think they will get gold medal even with current team (if this is not the case, then redeem team 2 will come).
All that can't be said about Team Canada (but patriotism seems less important there)

[Levenspiel]

I get what you are trying to say and I have the utmost respect for Canada but patriotism has nothing to do with this. Look at the US for example, a country where patriotism is taken to the extreme, especially in the realm of sports. National Anthem before every game, special shoutouts to soldiers during games, ostracizing Kaepernick because of his decision to protest in this specific way that was considered disrespectful etc

In addition to that, there is the whole "greatest country on earth" thing going on. I don't want to get into details but you get the idea.

just wondering, is this patriotism for the "show", or is it real? Like many other things in the NBA, it looks fake, it feels fake (I personally have no respect for it, especially for this veteran honoring stuff everywhere).

It would explain these mass NBA withdrawals too, the patriotism is actually not there, or not that much, it's for the show.

[paspalj]

I also think patriotism has an important part in skipping the World Cup or not. Yet, there is a major difference between Canada and USA (which is, as you stated, a very patriotic country) : almost everyone would agree to say that Team USA is the best basketball team, so they have nothing to prove in this regards. Especially after remaining undefeated for so long... Most people still think they will get gold medal even with current team (if this is not the case, then redeem team 2 will come).
All that can't be said about Team Canada (but patriotism seems less important there)

Maybe you are correct. I don't really know and I don't have other counter-examples. Now that I think about it, when their pride gets hurt, then "patriotism" mode kicks in and we get the redeem teams

just wondering, is this patriotism for the "show", or is it real? Like many other things in the NBA, it looks fake, it feels fake (I personally have no respect for it, especially for this veteran honoring stuff everywhere).

It would explain these mass NBA withdrawals too, the patriotism is actually not there, or not that much, it's for the show.

It is definitely for the show. Big corporations don't care about any country or people. They just want to make money. The whole "freedom" things sells a lot here so that's what they need to do in order to sell their product. See what happened to Kaepernick.

This "forced" patriotism in every aspect creates this culture that sometimes people just blindly will fall into.
If you've watched "How to curb your enthusiasm" there is great scene where there is a party and in the presence of a soldier everybody greets him "Thank you for your service", "Thank you for your service" and when it's Larry's turn he just says "Hi" and everybody gets super upset that he didn't thank him for his service
I consider myself very lucky to live on the east coast where things are way better than the south or the middle of the country. People can be very individualistic and short sighted in terms of governance.

[usagre]

You guys are getting way too deep in analyzing a very simple concept.
It's all about this specific tournament. Nobody cares. They just dont. If you check the ratings for the gold medal games in 2010 and 2014 you will laugh your ass off. It's hard to ask players to be patriotic and care about a tournament when nobody else in your country does. There has never been a redeem team in this tournament. It's always B caliber teams and it will always be that or worse. It doesn't matter if they lose it for the next 20 years. It's not the Olympics. There pride is hurt and it leads to changes.

I understand that this might be difficult for foreigners to understand but you guys have to trust me.
It has nothing to do with patriotism or agents or anything. The tournament just does not have any value.

[Levenspiel]

If you've watched "How to curb your enthusiasm" there is great scene where there is a party and in the presence of a soldier everybody greets him "Thank you for your service", "Thank you for your service" and when it's Larry's turn he just says "Hi" and everybody gets super upset that he didn't thank him for his service

Haha, yes, I love that show, and Larry David in general. I was even expecting the vet to turn out in the end to be a cook or something like that in the army but at least we saw he was a proper soldier

thanks for the insight.