2019 PBA All Filipino Cup

[Jay P. Mercado]

How about list of statistic based ranking of players. Then a rule were top players can only be traded with another top 15 player based on statistical ranking. Aside from statistics, players age, experience can be added to formulate the player's ranking.

That should be workable. At this point, anything that can prevent rampant lopsided trades that tend to benefit the "richer" teams and efforts to improve parity would be acceptable.

It's critical, as you mentioned, to also include other tangible factors like age and experience, playing position (centers would obviously be more valuable), and a little portion on intangibles (leadership, impact to the game, etc.).

[zairex]

Win Share and advance analytics will be included. But also important in any rule it needs to be reviewed and change depending on its relevance and if a team finds a loophole on the rules. For example, if a rich team wants to trade their above average player for a farm team's top player, the farm team can just not play its player for several games or asked him to play bad to make his statistic to go down to the level of above average player from top player status.

[zairex]

That should be workable. At this point, anything that can prevent rampant lopsided trades that tend to benefit the "richer" teams and efforts to improve parity would be acceptable.

It's critical, as you mentioned, to also include other tangible factors like age and experience, playing position (centers would obviously be more valuable), and a little portion on intangibles (leadership, impact to the game, etc.).

I agree, also win share and other advance analytics will be included. But also important in any rule it needs to be reviewed and change depending on its relevance and if a team finds a loophole on the rules. For example, if a rich team wants to trade their above average player for a farm team's top player, the farm team can just not play its player for several games or asked him to play bad to make his statistic to go down to the level of above average player from top player status.

[reamily]

Real Value of Player = Salary he is getting... As long as pba isnt transparent this controversy will continue to haunt them... People will understand how Blackwater lose erram and how much a nard pinto overprice himself...

Transparency......I dont get why the fans are thinking so hard on the solution, the solution is already right in eyes... If someone like a alex cabagnot takes a paycut let the people judge if this is true or not... Sa NBA nga kita mo yun breakdown ng sweldo ng players sa pba kaya?

[Silent Killer]

Lanete to northport

https://www.facebook.com/221332367969808/posts/1565029460266752/

[k3ttch]

I find it funny that in pba, 6’5 even 6’4 players are still considered bigs and plays PF or C while in overseas taller players like antetokounmpo, Simmons, Durant et al can play guard positions if they wanted to. 6’4 players overseas are PG’s and SG’s they are undersized even for a SF. 6’5 players are generally PG’s and SG’s overseas. Some plays SF they are also considered short if playing in nba.

The reason why Junmar is now the goat with 5 straight MVP’s but still average in FIBA basketball.

The coddling nature of our basketball culture. We need to “give a chance to local bigs.” So you see the NCAA doing away with foreign players and the PBA imposing height restrictions on imports and the Midgets and Pygmies Basketball League restricting Filams to 6’4” and below.

It’s a good thing JMF has gotten to play FIBA ball so he’s no longer shocked and surprised when he gets blocked or outrebounded. Too bad his current coach keeps him nailed to the paint.

[Jay P. Mercado]

Real Value of Player = Salary he is getting... As long as pba isnt transparent this controversy will continue to haunt them... People will understand how Blackwater lose erram and how much a nard pinto overprice himself...

Transparency......I dont get why the fans are thinking so hard on the solution, the solution is already right in eyes... If someone like a alex cabagnot takes a paycut let the people judge if this is true or not... Sa NBA nga kita mo yun breakdown ng sweldo ng players sa pba kaya?

Ideal if it's in the NBA. Not ideal here. Salaries are grossly undervalued, especially among rich teams, to "fit" within the salary cap. But the other benefits they receive not included in the cap is what's significant, and yes, non-taxable.

You have a Terrence Romeo who SMB management claims to be receiving P200k a month despite the fact that he was the scoring champion on his last year of his rookie contract. Note that there was even a news report on Romeo's contract extension in 2015 where he got the max - https://news.abs-cbn.com/sports/09/2...ith-globalport.... or this -https://www.spin.ph/basketball/pba/terrence-romeo-signs-three-year-maximum-deal-with-globalport

Or Romeo might have been generous enough to take a pay cut, just like the SMB vets in accommodating him to their roster?

See what I mean? Salaries won't work!

[analyzed]

Before I thought you were just misunderstood but now I see that you are so blinded by so called ideal height and position. Thinking that because you are 6'6" you should be playing SF regardless whether the player likes or even can play SF. Telling people that they shouldn't be playing basketball because of their height rather than talent, skills and attitude is not what the sports promotes. I will never tell another human being what he can and can't do especially if they are good at it.

I really have no interest on putting people down, I don't t believe on that at all so that's not the intent, hoops is for everyone who enjoys the game and shoud be promoted but I do think there is a certain standard required to play to be a full time professional and 6 foot forwards isn't really of a minimum standard
College sports is different as they're there for the education

[reamily]

Ideal if it's in the NBA. Not ideal here. Salaries are grossly undervalued, especially among rich teams, to "fit" within the salary cap. But the other benefits they receive not included in the cap is what's significant, and yes, non-taxable.

You have a Terrence Romeo who SMB management claims to be receiving P200k a month despite the fact that he was the scoring champion on his last year of his rookie contract. Note that there was even a news report on Romeo's contract extension in 2015 where he got the max - https://news.abs-cbn.com/sports/09/2...ith-globalport.... or this -https://www.spin.ph/basketball/pba/terrence-romeo-signs-three-year-maximum-deal-with-globalport

Or Romeo might have been generous enough to take a pay cut, just like the SMB vets in accommodating him to their roster?

See what I mean? Salaries won't work!

But that is first step...as people will be conscious on this as everytime we see romeo in fb people will comment naniniwala ba kayo 200 k lang sweldo nito mas mataas pa yun kay nard pinto?.. Doing nothing here would be worse for the pba. Like for example people will not look at blackwater that bad if people knew that JP erram was a n expiring contarct and didnt want to sign with bwe. As last resort bwe will do a sign and trade deal with nlex for desiderio and tratter thats more transparent and uncontroversial compare to a simple erram to desiderio tratter trade without the details why the trade happen...

Like for example PBA rokie salary is ridiculous, so if Jordan Clarkson applied for pba draft he will mandated to receive 200 k php per month?

[Jay P. Mercado]

But that is first step...as people will be conscious on this as everytime we see romeo in fb people will comment naniniwala ba kayo 200 k lang sweldo nito mas mataas pa yun kay nard pinto?.. Doing nothing here would be worse for the pba..

No, doing nothing is best for them, at least in the eyes of the owners, the governors, the Kume, and the players, because it won't rock the boat. When everyone in the community is on the same page, why would anyone want to change things when it cannot totally revolutionize into something earth-shaking like a fan boycott or something?

Not that I'm not for it - I am - but I've learned to be realistic enough to accept that, despite the clamor to have the league be transparent with the players' salaries and UPC's, they just won't want these revealed. Not the owners and governors who cheat on the salary caps (SMC and MVP teams) and floors (Columbian and Blackwater). Not the Commissioner who has to factor the salary cap everytime as a concern when dealing with trade issues. Not the players who don't want their compensation revealed to the public for the security of their families.

Remember, this transparency issue on the salary cap has long been in existence since the century began - when Tanduay took stock of SMB's players receiving the max, and the counter move of the Rhum Masters to offer side contracts to their own players. That was year 2001. Seriously, do we really expect this to have been cleansed? Tanduay wasn't too cerebral enough because they had a side contract made - but would we ever believe a Danny Seigle earning in the P200k category that era when the max is P500k?

A player overall assessment can be made, definitely. But count out salaries, these aren't reliable...

[reamily]

We arent doing the step to immediately cleanse it but force them eventually after public clamor. imagine theres a salary floor in pba of 27 million a year so kia has to pay on the average of 150 k a month for a 15 man roster...and thats salary floor..People can counter that theres win game bonus import pay, thats why pba needs to transparent so that some rumors can be validated to facts.

For One JP erram is a pba mythical selection.. in nba a guy who become an all nba team has a luxury of putting a higher maximum pay... in pba they can easily rule that if erram is traded to another team he cannot take a pay cut just to make him fit to the "hard cap implemented " by pba you have to match his salary..As a restricted fa.. erram will receive max and if he is traded it will count on the hard cap of the team...

[Jay P. Mercado]

We arent doing the step to immediately cleanse it but force them eventually after public clamor. imagine theres a salary floor in pba of 27 million a year so kia has to pay on the average of 150 k a month for a 15 man roster...and thats salary floor..People can counter that theres win game bonus import pay, thats why pba needs to transparent so that some rumors can be validated to facts.

For One JP erram is a pba mythical selection.. in nba a guy who become an all nba team has a luxury of putting a higher maximum pay... in pba they can easily rule that if erram is traded to another team he cannot take a pay cut just to make him fit to the "hard cap implemented " by pba you have to match his salary..As a restricted fa.. erram will receive max and if he is traded it will count on the hard cap of the team...

You can put in all the rules that you like pertaining to salaries - make these even more stringent than the NBA's - but ultimately, the final decision rests with the very parties who violate these...

It's not like the salary cap / floor issue is only being discussed now. It's been around dating back the early 90's when Alvin Patrimonio received a multi-million peso contract worth P21M for 2.5 years at P500k a month. It was further reinforced when Tanduay gave Danny Ildefonso a P96M, 16-year contract in 2001. One can conclude that what Bong Tan did was to test the limits of the PBA rules, just like what you're proposing. In the end, Jun Bernardino revoked the offer sheet given...

[reamily]

You can put in all the rules that you like pertaining to salaries - make these even more stringent than the NBA's - but ultimately, the final decision rests with the very parties who violate these...

It's not like the salary cap / floor issue is only being discussed now. It's been around dating back the early 90's when Alvin Patrimonio received a multi-million peso contract worth P21M for 2.5 years at P500k a month. It was further reinforced when Tanduay gave Danny Ildefonso a P96M, 16-year contract in 2001. One can conclude that what Bong Tan did was to test the limits of the PBA rules, just like what you're proposing. In the end, Jun Bernardino revoked the offer sheet given...

But again all of these news were in pre internet era.. now information must be easily be accessible by the fans...

And that Danny Ildefonso contract if happened in the social media era.. Jun Bernandino woould be accused of protecting smc's interest on finding loopholes on the danny ildefonso contract..

[zairex]

I really have no interest on putting people down, I don't t believe on that at all so that's not the intent, hoops is for everyone who enjoys the game and shoud be promoted but I do think there is a certain standard required to play to be a full time professional and 6 foot forwards isn't really of a minimum standard
College sports is different as they're there for the education

Is there any league that has a standard on only allowing certain height to play a certain position or a league disallowing a player because of its height. Even in the NBA today, no such rule o standard exists.

[Jay P. Mercado]

But again all of these news were in pre internet era.. now information must be easily be accessible by the fans...

And that Danny Ildefonso contract if happened in the social media era.. Jun Bernandino woould be accused of protecting smc's interest on finding loopholes on the danny ildefonso contract..

You can clutch on thin straws and hope that this would work. But this is an entirely different problem - even worse or complicated than the trading of marquee players for crumbs or "protect the bigs" rule. If you use this as basis, then the other rule won't fly when it can easily be dispensed with by using the factors that were mentioned earlier, plus more.