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Thread: Fiba World Cup 2023 Philippines

  1. #1401
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    and some japanese people got invited to nba summer leagues and g league and some got offers to play HS ball in US and university..

    lots of things need to be done..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silent Killer View Post
    and some japanese people got invited to nba summer leagues and g league and some got offers to play HS ball in US and university..

    lots of things need to be done..
    Yes they have a good number of Players with US or international experience.
    Chikara Tanaka IMG, Kai Toews UNC, Yudai Baba Mavericks, Yuta Watanabe Grizzlies, Rui Hachimura Wizards, Yuuki Okubo Crossroads, Avi Schafer Georgia Tech, Seiya Ando PBA/NBLC, Yuki Togashi Texas Legends and probably more.

    We’ve only been world class probably during Caloy Loyzagas time up to Jaworski and Mon’s amateur days. After that it seems to be downhill from then. We actually had a headstart. Torculas, Lopez, Demisana are really our future US prospects. We already had Japeth, Ray Parks and Kiefer. Even rumours with Johnny, Renren and Castro. We could have sent other players to G League too. Blonde Romeo, Fajardo(Dallas) are the only players of recent memory to come to mind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by analyzed View Post
    No I heard that, but rather than go with his opinion assuming that's exactly what we think he meant for argument sake.

    Just go with the actual record of Kiwi players (not opinion)playing in NBA and top Euro teams (most have NBA pre season invites), there are 10 current. So wel and good if u can find more than 10 home grown players of that level.. Isn't that a better verification if their are indeed more players from that the Philippines homegrown of that level. Not opinion of what we think someone meant.
    The players records are there anyway for verification

    This isn't a case of my opinion vs Mark, but Mark's accuracy of what we interpret he means vs actual verified records

    BTW if I heard it correctly he said the 3 NZl players are better and national team but there more in the Philippines for the level below

    I simply do not see more than 10 homegrown Filipinos at Adams, Webster bros, Abercombrie , Fotu, Delaney, Salt etc etc level.. If there were then all these players would have NBA training camp invites (cause the guys above all have)
    I think it may be possible to find 10 players of Filipino heritage of that level though.. Mark of course doesn't differentiate, like he mentioned Pringle, and of course Standhardinger can be of that level.. So I get it.. Tapos sama mo Green, Hepa, Clarkson,, Remy.. Yeah that makes sense. But homegrown.. Nah.. Malabo
    I think he was referring to those playing in the local leagues regardless of their fiba eligibility. And I don't think he counted lol it was an estimate and I don't think he meant by saying 50 players, form like 4 national teams that can compete rather he's saying there's this many who are national team level talents. Heck if you ask him to name 40 to 50, a large chunk of those will be twos and ones.
    We have this chance to fit JC in the gilas team, why are you putting in effort on finding ways to exclude him?

    - lurklurk

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyz View Post
    Yes they have a good number of Players with US or international experience.
    Chikara Tanaka IMG, Kai Toews UNC, Yudai Baba Mavericks, Yuta Watanabe Grizzlies, Rui Hachimura Wizards, Yuuki Okubo Crossroads, Avi Schafer Georgia Tech, Seiya Ando PBA/NBLC, Yuki Togashi Texas Legends and probably more.

    We’ve only been world class probably during Caloy Loyzagas time up to Jaworski and Mon’s amateur days. After that it seems to be downhill from then. We actually had a headstart. Torculas, Lopez, Demisana are really our future US prospects.
    2014 team was world class.
    We have this chance to fit JC in the gilas team, why are you putting in effort on finding ways to exclude him?

    - lurklurk

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    Quote Originally Posted by astigram04 View Post
    2014 team was world class.
    Yes you’re not wrong. We were competitive against world class teams but we were still exposed in aspects of the game that our players and coaches wouldn’t have known by just playing locally.

    Also David’s spot could’ve gone to Parks Jr. or Wright at that time tho. If we were thinking like other countries in terms of development.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyz View Post
    Yes you’re not wrong. We were competitive against world class teams but we were still exposed in aspects of the game that our players and coaches wouldn’t have known by just playing locally.

    Also David’s spot could’ve gone to Parks Jr. or Wright at that time tho. If we were thinking like other countries in terms of development.
    Or, perhaps tenorio's spot. Chot already had alapag and Castro. Lee could've been his 3rd PG (as a combo guard) but he was just used at the 2 spot. Heck there even was a norwood who can play point when needed. Utilizing junmar a little more could've helped too, like it did for us vs Senegal. Yes, on hindsight, there definitely were some details that should've been different.. that could've spelled for us a couple more wins in the prelims and a berth to the next rd but still, I think it's safe to say that we impressed out there.
    We have this chance to fit JC in the gilas team, why are you putting in effort on finding ways to exclude him?

    - lurklurk

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    Quote Originally Posted by astigram04 View Post
    Or, perhaps tenorio's spot. Chot already had alapag and Castro. Lee could've been his 3rd PG (as a combo guard) but he was just used at the 2 spot. Heck there even was a norwood who can play point when needed. Utilizing junmar a little more could've helped too, like it did for us vs Senegal. Yes, on hindsight, there definitely were some details that should've been different.. that could've spelled for us a couple more wins in the prelims and a berth to the next rd but still, I think it's safe to say that we impressed out there.
    Yes but remember Castro was playing with an injured achilles. So Tenorio’s spot was fine. But yeah if Castro wasn’t injured David and Tenorio should have went to Parks and Barroca at that time was the popular choice lol. Defensive team, mythical team and finals mvp.

    Yes that comeback from Croatia was a big surprise for many. But I have to admit most of our success was because of Blatche. Bigs were having problem guarding him. Cant deny Gabe’s impact tho and Junemar’s surprise game. Oh well at least in the next coming world cups we could focus on development along with being competitive. Sotto for 2023 and Demisana for 2027.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyz View Post
    Yes but remember Castro was playing with an injured achilles. So Tenorio’s spot was fine. But yeah if Castro wasn’t injured David and Tenorio should have went to Parks and Barroca at that time was the popular choice lol. Defensive team, mythical team and finals mvp.

    Yes that comeback from Croatia was a big surprise for many. But I have to admit most of our success was because of Blatche. Bigs were having problem guarding him. Cant deny Gabe’s impact tho and Junemar’s surprise game. Oh well at least in the next coming world cups we could focus on development along with being competitive. Sotto for 2023 and Demisana for 2027.
    you seem high on that demisana kid, what do you see in him

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    Quote Originally Posted by lurklurk View Post
    you seem high on that demisana kid, what do you see in him
    Well he’s only 15. In the next u16 batch of Kim Tamayo, Thomas Batties, Matthew Rubico, Sebastian Reyes, JV Papa, Christian Saenz and Lebron Nieto he seems to be the only homegrown standout. 6’7 training to be a wing. Working out with UP boys alongside betterbballph already under virtual playground. So he’s in the right track in terms of development. But skills wise needs to toughen up and improve all aspects of his game. I personally just want him to be out of the Philippines soon and try his luck in the states. More international prospects the better for our national team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by analyzed View Post
    Obviously the sheer depth volume of the PBA and Philippine college teams outnumbers the 8 team semi pro NZ NBL. (then top players in NZ don't play in the only real league not involving high school kids), so from that perspective, yeah Marks right.
    In terms however of developing homegrown elite FIBA level players, it isn't remotely close. The records of players who've made it all around the world is proof of this
    Below article from today of NZ developed player Marks (13 year NBA vet)


    https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/basketba...st-achievement

    My NBTC appointed COACH Brendan is a 12 year Italian Euro league veteran (he's Mark's best friend), the sheer number and size of players who make it overseas is too obvious a difference.
    New Zealand has far superior program than us not just in basketball but in sports in general. We produced more basketball players but their development are already flawed to begin with. A 5'9-6'3 playing center at a young age is not good way to develop a player. And a lot of local coaches and trainers don't know how teach young guys to play multiple positions. It's messed up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyz View Post
    Well he’s only 15. In the next u16 batch of Kim Tamayo, Thomas Batties, Matthew Rubico, Sebastian Reyes, JV Papa, Christian Saenz and Lebron Nieto he seems to be the only homegrown standout. 6’7 training to be a wing. Working out with UP boys alongside betterbballph already under virtual playground. So he’s in the right track in terms of development. But skills wise needs to toughen up and improve all aspects of his game. I personally just want him to be out of the Philippines soon and try his luck in the states. More international prospects the better for our national team.
    From what I have seen of him play, he’s not athletic, struggles to run up and down the floor at only 6’7. Not to mention very thin. He’s good skill wise though lefty that can shoot from midrange to three and he’s a capable passer in high low. Extremely raw but unless he grows like Kai, or his training with betterballph makes him more athletic he’s not really a standout to me.

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    ^ same assesment. kid is still raw compared to his peers/age-group. i dont think he is an international prospect at this point. of course, a lot can still change. hopefully he'll put in the work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by B L A C K S U N View Post
    New Zealand has far superior program than us not just in basketball but in sports in general. We produced more basketball players but their development are already flawed to begin with. A 5'9-6'3 playing center at a young age is not good way to develop a player. And a lot of local coaches and trainers don't know how teach young guys to play multiple positions. It's messed up.

    Not to mention it messes with their athletic development as well, I was looking at the 2017 slam combine numbers, and for the guys who play 1-3 on average their numbers are good athletically, you move to the bigs, Aaron Fermin has a 27inch standing jump and a 29 inch approach, there are other factors that go into this but a mere 2 inch boost from approach to standing means your technique is bad for jumping, it should be at min 5inches higher, another guy tested 27.1 inches and an approach of 27.0inches??? How is your approach worse than your standing. Well at a young age if your used to standing around in the paint you don’t train that approach technique. A guy like Troy Rosario who played volleyball probably learned to jump high off 2 because in volleyball most of the time you’re jumping either off vert or off 1 -2 step explode off two feet, rarely do they use 1 foot for jumping so it makes sense why he’s effective at the 4 under the basket because BWB has that ability. But some of these guys need work athletically with their mechanics and athleticism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silent Killer View Post
    and some japanese people got invited to nba summer leagues and g league and some got offers to play HS ball in US and university..

    lots of things need to be done..
    Japan is known to be a country good at any sport. Half the world probably dont know what the Philippines is. We can expect shorterm obscurity due to the FIBA world suckage. That's why this next window is important. The more PH can breakthrough the world stage, the more the world will recognize PH players.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRodster21 View Post
    Not to mention it messes with their athletic development as well, I was looking at the 2017 slam combine numbers, and for the guys who play 1-3 on average their numbers are good athletically, you move to the bigs, Aaron Fermin has a 27inch standing jump and a 29 inch approach, there are other factors that go into this but a mere 2 inch boost from approach to standing means your technique is bad for jumping, it should be at min 5inches higher, another guy tested 27.1 inches and an approach of 27.0inches??? How is your approach worse than your standing. Well at a young age if your used to standing around in the paint you don’t train that approach technique. A guy like Troy Rosario who played volleyball probably learned to jump high off 2 because in volleyball most of the time you’re jumping either off vert or off 1 -2 step explode off two feet, rarely do they use 1 foot for jumping so it makes sense why he’s effective at the 4 under the basket because BWB has that ability. But some of these guys need work athletically with their mechanics and athleticism.
    To add, these numbers would be acceptable if they were maybe 6’10 -7’0 but at 6’5 or 6’4 they are very bad

  16. #1416
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyz View Post
    Yes but remember Castro was playing with an injured achilles. So Tenorio’s spot was fine. But yeah if Castro wasn’t injured David and Tenorio should have went to Parks and Barroca at that time was the popular choice lol. Defensive team, mythical team and finals mvp.

    Yes that comeback from Croatia was a big surprise for many. But I have to admit most of our success was because of Blatche. Bigs were having problem guarding him. Cant deny Gabe’s impact tho and Junemar’s surprise game. Oh well at least in the next coming world cups we could focus on development along with being competitive. Sotto for 2023 and Demisana for 2027.
    Parks certainly but, Barroca, no. Definitely not thinking of another 5'8 point guard. Anyway, speaking of 2023 and 2027 world cup, would you rather the SBP form the best team possible for 2023 or save a couple of spots for younger players who would be utilized sparingly but are investments for 2027?

    I had several posts before the 2019 World Cup suggesting that since there is no chance we will advance to the next round (considering the bracket we were in), we should instead send a very young team and use that stint to prepare for 2023. But we're in a different situation now, aside from the fact that we are hosting, we have a legitimate chance to be very competitive BUT.. Kai and AJs prime will probably be in 2027, bka there's even a greater chance to be competitive by then
    We have this chance to fit JC in the gilas team, why are you putting in effort on finding ways to exclude him?

    - lurklurk

  17. #1417
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    Quote Originally Posted by astigram04 View Post
    Parks certainly but, Barroca, no. Definitely not thinking of another 5'8 point guard. Anyway, speaking of 2023 and 2027 world cup, would you rather the SBP form the best team possible for 2023 or save a couple of spots for younger players who would be utilized sparingly but are investments for 2027?

    I had several posts before the 2019 World Cup suggesting that since there is no chance we will advance to the next round (considering the bracket we were in), we should instead send a very young team and use that stint to prepare for 2023. But we're in a different situation now, aside from the fact that we are hosting, we have a legitimate chance to be very competitive BUT.. Kai and AJs prime will probably be in 2027, bka there's even a greater chance to be competitive by then
    i thought this was already a foregone conclusion--the way we are hearing it, Kai, AJ, possibly dwight ramos and 1gdl all have high chance of being on that 2023 team. All 4 are young enough to be the "investments" for 2027.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lurklurk View Post
    i thought this was already a foregone conclusion--the way we are hearing it, Kai, AJ, possibly dwight ramos and 1gdl all have high chance of being on that 2023 team. All 4 are young enough to be the "investments" for 2027.
    As my previous posts should suggest, I don't see having Kai and AJ in 2023 as mere investments, rather theyll already be our best players outside of the naturalized player. Juan and Dwight won't be too young even in 2023, they'll probably be around 24-26. What I meant with investments will be players like Francis lopes, sage tolentino, Michael Phillips and the likes
    We have this chance to fit JC in the gilas team, why are you putting in effort on finding ways to exclude him?

    - lurklurk

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    ^ didn't see your previous posts. but the ages are google-able. 1gdl and dwight are 20 right now, they'll be 23 in 2023. same as AJ edu. kai is 2 years younger and will be 21. they will be the investments for 2027, when they will be 25 to 27 years old and will be on their athletic prime.

    lebron lopez and sage are currently what, 16? they will be 23 on 2027. they can be the investments by then.

  20. #1420
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    Quote Originally Posted by lurklurk View Post
    ^ didn't see your previous posts. but the ages are google-able. 1gdl and dwight are 20 right now, they'll be 23 in 2023. same as AJ edu. kai is 2 years younger and will be 21. they will be the investments for 2027, when they will be 25 to 27 years old and will be on their athletic prime.

    lebron lopez and sage are currently what, 16? they will be 23 on 2027. they can be the investments by then.
    Kai and AJ won't be there because you are preparing for the future, they'll be there because they're already 2 of your best players. Age is immaterial in that regard. Isn't it a consensus that Kai will be nba ready by 3 years? Some are even saying 2. If rightfully so then he should be your best player (being of nba level) outside of your naturalized and, perhaps, remy Martin. Dwight, regardless of being 23 or 24 will probably be part of the rotation because we need some size at the wings. In other words, he's needed, not merely added in consideration of 2027. Juan who I think will be 24 by the time the world cup starts, or a month away from turning 24, maybe considered as one. Or maybe he'll be good enough to be a rotation player by then.a long shot but not impossible
    We have this chance to fit JC in the gilas team, why are you putting in effort on finding ways to exclude him?

    - lurklurk

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