Page 3 of 58 FirstFirst 123451353 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 1141

Thread: 2019 World Cup Qualifying Odyssey!

  1. #41
    Senior Member LuDux's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    2,812

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Svajunas View Post
    Correct me if Im wrong but isnt Valinskas a 1-2 and Butkevicius a clear 3?

    Butkevicius played SG in Euroleague season

  2. #42

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    I was simply comparing two newcomers to the national team discussion that none of us anticipated on the scene three months ago.

    No problem, it's just that it's irrelevant comparison. Soon we'll have 5-6 small forwards who all will be better than any of our SG likely, but at the end of the day you have to field your SG line-up.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

  3. #43

    Default

    Convincing win against Poland which played really bad, shot the ball extremely bad and made so many TOs.

    As for Lithuania it's hard to say something other than that we played against weak opposition. The thing is that I somehow thought we have a better B team. Maybe the fact that we couldn't grab one of Gudaitis, Kavaliauskas here played a big role because those 2 skinny and soft centers looked like a high school players against Karnowski who only blew himself away with personal fouls from a great game. Any decent and tough frontcourt would go ham against such frontcourt.
    I admit Butkevicius is looking good at the moment. He's limited offensively, but he is playing D and is surely better than Gailius and Giedraitis at 3. Orelikas aside improved passing doesn't seem much better than he was in Rytas. Not an A team material, it's not even close.
    I guess Adomaitis really felt his own for the first time he's with NT cause that's his level roster. That's the players he's working with. Maybe that's the reason he was so hesitant to keep Seibutis on the court for any longer stretch and the fact that he find Juskevicius a better player is really worrysome to me. It was strange that he threw Girdziunas, Gailius, Butkevicius at the same time in the first half while Lith couldn't cope with Poland defensively. I still don't have trust in Adomaitis to lead NT in the knock out stage of official tournaments. He is just unfamiliar with that kind of level and his rotation and a taste for players haven't convinced me that he knows what he's doing and he is worth higher level team than the B NT and Neptunas, Lietkabelis level club. This team aside Seibutis and Butkevicius is horrific defensive team. I have the same bitterness in my tongue as after the game against Greeks when Adomaitis tried to stop Calathes and Sloukas backourt with Juskevicius and Gecevicius...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

  4. #44
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Vilnius
    Posts
    1,959
    Country: Lithuania

    Default

    I have to say this team has played so far really good having in mind the roster and limited time to prepare. Poland's squad with Karnowski, Ponitka, Kulig, Kosharek doesn't seem really worse than Lithuanian one, but as a team was nowhere close.

  5. #45
    Senior Member LuDux's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    2,812

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    Convincing win against Poland which played really bad, shot the ball extremely bad and made so many TOs.

    As for Lithuania it's hard to say something other than that we played against weak opposition. The thing is that I somehow thought we have a better B team. Maybe the fact that we couldn't grab one of Gudaitis, Kavaliauskas here played a big role because those 2 skinny and soft centers looked like a high school players against Karnowski who only blew himself away with personal fouls from a great game. Any decent and tough frontcourt would go ham against such frontcourt.
    I admit Butkevicius is looking good at the moment. He's limited offensively, but he is playing D and is surely better than Gailius and Giedraitis at 3. Orelikas aside improved passing doesn't seem much better than he was in Rytas. Not an A team material, it's not even close.
    I guess Adomaitis really felt his own for the first time he's with NT cause that's his level roster. That's the players he's working with. Maybe that's the reason he was so hesitant to keep Seibutis on the court for any longer stretch and the fact that he find Juskevicius a better player is really worrysome to me. It was strange that he threw Girdziunas, Gailius, Butkevicius at the same time in the first half while Lith couldn't cope with Poland defensively. I still don't have trust in Adomaitis to lead NT in the knock out stage of official tournaments. He is just unfamiliar with that kind of level and his rotation and a taste for players haven't convinced me that he knows what he's doing and he is worth higher level team than the B NT and Neptunas, Lietkabelis level club. This team aside Seibutis and Butkevicius is horrific defensive team. I have the same bitterness in my tongue as after the game against Greeks when Adomaitis tried to stop Calathes and Sloukas backourt with Juskevicius and Gecevicius...

  6. #46
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Klaipeda
    Posts
    2,003
    Country: Lithuania

    Default

    Good start on our way to world cup 2019.Our B team looked really good.Most of them were very motivated and yuo could see they played really hard.Respect.

    I see 4 players from this B team that could make A team or atleast be seriuos candidates and make final 14-15 player list.

    Its Seibutis his experience would be very valuable, but limited minutes he is getting old.
    Juskevicius is already matured player and knows what what he is doing even with all of his minuses .
    Orelikas our frontcourt would definetely use such style player .All our big are grinders and insiders, we lack alot very important in modern era strech four style player .
    Butkevicius heck thats what athlete should look like, strong,fast, tough, very athletic.I love such all around players and he improved offensively alot , he can play seriuos defence againts Sg-Sf players .

  7. #47
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    3,134
    Country: Canada

    Exclamation

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Good start on our way to world cup 2019.Our B team looked really good. Most of them were very motivated and yuo could see they played really hard. Respect.
    I agree. The players all seemed to be delighted to be part of the team and as a result came together as a "team" very quickly. Moreover they showed real effort and played with spirit.


  8. #48

    Default

    FOA, I also give credit to the guys playing with hear and hustling like you should playing for the NT! Nice effort!

    SOA, Ludux I'm sorry, I know Neptunas' guys rocked and it's a great day to you, but it's NT and not Klaipeda's picnic, it's a little bit bigger matter, so despite you being very sensitive when I touch some of Neptunas' guys I have to say some things

    This is huge blow of FIBA. With all respect to watch these games was 10000000 times more boring than watching the clashes of A teams. It's like 2 different universes. When in late 90's and early 10's there were "windows" all the stars played and rocked. Such superstars in European BB as Karnisovas was there and played against second rate opponents, whatever opponents. It's a sad day and huge blow by FIBA because instead of real deal players, fans watched Neptunas or Lietkabelis going against Kosovo and Poland. This is disgrace.

    Now aside Seibutis who is well established player and there's no need to discuss him I don't see a single player who should be in the NT, except maybe Butkevicius who was the only player worth mentioning. As an energy guy he could be interesting. Specially if he can guard some SGs (on other hand the problem is Adomaitis isn't smart enough even to try such players as Ulanovas, Butkevicius at 2 even when he's being openly butchered by Sloukas f.e so I'm wasting my time here). He looks like a guy who deserves to be in the camp.
    Juskevicius is absolutely streaky, non-team player, bad defender. If we are serious about winning in the knock out stages, such players shouldn't be even close. He would get shut 8 times out 10 against real deal competition which NT faces in the knock out stage. History confirms that - he delivered in 2014, failed in 2016, 2017.
    Orelikas is not even close. Why to consider streaky Orelikas when you have why better option in Kuzminskas? I mean way better in all possible ways, even shooting. Orelikas is naturally 3, it's just that he is too slow and fat to play there. At 4 he's too small and would cause NT to much troubles defensively. Even Kuz causes NT a lot of troubles defensively and he's way better defender than Orelikas at 4. IMO, it's out of question, he's not NT material.

    So I would invite only Seibutis and Butkevicius from this team.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

  9. #49
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Vilnius
    Posts
    1,959
    Country: Lithuania

    Default

    If Juskevicius failed at 2017 then all other players failed as well except JV and Kuzia. He's a solid player and in fact is showing it on the court. It's the fact as well that you underrate him cause you put him in the one line with Vasiliauskas one time.

    I also don't like those talks that all these players (or almost all) don't deserve playing in A team. It's somehow disrespectful - if not them, A team won't play anywhere.

  10. #50
    Senior Member LuDux's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    2,812

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    Adomaitis isn't smart enough even to try such players as .. Butkevicius at 2 even when he's being openly butchered by Sloukas
    Or Maskoliunas who is tall enough to defend Sloukas

  11. #51

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamcatcher View Post
    If Juskevicius failed at 2017 then all other players failed as well except JV and Kuzia. He's a solid player and in fact is showing it on the court. It's the fact as well that you underrate him cause you put him in the one line with Vasiliauskas one time.

    I also don't like those talks that all these players (or almost all) don't deserve playing in A team. It's somehow disrespectful - if not them, A team won't play anywhere.
    I was talking about the knock out stage. Who cares about the group stage? Our B team would advance to next round, but only than you face top 8 European teams. Juskevicius scored 0 against Greece in 20min, 0 ef, -19 +/- worst in the team. My point is that such players as Juskevicius would be useless in the knock out stage 8 times of 10. I don't know if I can express my self more clearly.

    Quote Originally Posted by LuDux View Post
    Or Maskoliunas who is tall enough to defend Sloukas
    So you fix my quote and make malicious joke...nice effort bro
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

  12. #52
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Klaipeda
    Posts
    2,003
    Country: Lithuania

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post

    So I would invite only Seibutis and Butkevicius from this team.
    Good thing that you are not deciding it ) juskevicius failed in 2017? Really players who shouldnt even be there played obviuosly better than we expexted before tournament is called failing really? Adas was one of few players that overperform what was expected from him
    He played obviuosly better tournament than Milaknis, Gecevicius and Grigonis so how then describe their performances? Failing is when you are expected to produce and couldnt do it like motiejunas for example, not player that was taken only as backup for 5minutes and in some games even was best our guard in the game.Juskevicius overall was top6-7 our player in eurobasket when we was protected to be 10-12.Again get your facts straight straighforward...hard to read this biased fans nonsenses always againts same players and kissing ass to same players even when they obviuosly fail.Grigonis failed too in the group play badly, the only thing that he played ok versus Greece and even then fouled out in 15minutes...

    Yes i would take Orelikas, the game is changing pf just must make 3pointers these days on daily basis not sometimes.The ball is moving way faster and defences have hard to time to catch 4 shooters at same time.Even polish american coach mentioned exactly Orelikas because he is matchup problem for any team that entire frontcourt is big but slow .But hell straightforward knows better he would take scared rookies kulboka, sedekerskis or valinskas
    over matured players like Orelikas, Juskevicius, Butkevicius and hope to win in playoffs in 2019 ..If i want my team to do good in playoofs in surely go with mature ones of 26-30 years old age atleast they give us better chance that they wont shit to bed because of pressure.
    Last edited by Shawshank; 11-27-2017 at 09:22 PM.

  13. #53

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    get your facts straight straighforward...hard to read this biased fans nonsenses always againts same players and kissing ass to same players even when they obviuosly fail.Grigonis failed too in the group play badly, the only thing that he played ok versus Greece and even then fouled out in 15minutes...
    You suggesting me to get the fact straight, but failing to even check that both each played exactly 20 minutes and both guarded Sloukas and the result is that Grigonis had -2 +/- and Juskevicius -19. Grigonis was able to bring defensive presence, Juskevicius could not. Yes, Juskevicius played well in the group stage, and yes he overperformed there, but do we want to play well in the group stage or to win something in the tournament? Just read my post above.


    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Yes i would take Orelikas, the game is changing pf just must make 3pointers these days on daily badus not sometimes.The ball is moving way faster and defences have hard to time to catch 4 shooters at same time.Even polish american coach mentioned exactly Orelikas because he is matchup problem for any team that entire frontcourt is big but slow .But hell straightforward knows better he would take scared rookies kulboka, sedekerskis or valinskas
    over matured players like Orelikas, Juskevicius, Butkevicius and hope to win in playoffs in 2019
    Now that's a bunch of BS You again trying to put your own words into my mouth when you angry. But what the hell. Better say, how exactly Orelikas as stretch 4 is better than Kuzminskas? How and why NT would use Orelikas at 4 instead of Kuzminskas? Why we need Orelikas when we can throw in a better player Kuz?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Iff i want my team do good in playoofs in surely go with mature ones of 26-30 years old age.
    I wonder where Lithuania would be now if our head coaches would watch at players IDs instead of actual game Sure leave aside Sabonis, Lekavicius, Grigonis, Gudaitis, hell even Valanciunas would fall out if he would want to play in February You're rocking dude.
    Last edited by Straight forward; 11-27-2017 at 09:57 PM.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

  14. #54
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Klaipeda
    Posts
    2,003
    Country: Lithuania

    Default

    Juskevicius as 9-12 player is good option he proved that in 2 tournaments already.Juskevicius isnt taken or expected to bring us wins in playoofs,that way we have Valanciunas,Kuzminskas,Kalnietis and couple other is their responsability,not 9-12 player he is just helper.

    stats of eurobasket 2017 averages

    Juskevicius 7,2pts
    Grigonis 4,2pts
    Gecevicius 4,2pts
    Milaknis 1,8pts

    Juskevicius did really good compared with other our guards except of Kalnietis.He played better, but that was expected from him.



    Grigonis didnt show nothing special in 2016 and 2017 and i dont understand why you are praising him like that? he shit to bed missing lots of shot in those 2 tournamens...Saying that i believe Marius will be important in the future i dont argue that. He show me that in Greece game.But in last 2 champs he was more dissapointing than anything else...

    Kuzminskas is SF why we should compare him with PF Orelikas? Kuzminskas is our leader ofcourse he is alot better.Kuzminskas played in PF because Motiejunas sucked and there werent no other options to put in pf in that roster.We can easily play Kuzminskas in his natural position Sf and Orelikas PF.No problem here.Orelikas for 10-12min for style of play change can be valuable player.Not only pound pound that ball inside as we did in last couple champs.

    Nobody says you have to leave super young tallent that belongs to national team.Ofcourse they should be taken and are taken.But even those super tallents struglles first 1 or 2 years in nt team.Im talking about average young players that is of 9-12 level players and average matured one players of that level.Those matured one can give us better chance in winning in playoofs in today because of simply TOUGHER MENTALITY ! IF Lithuania wants to win today its should go that way and put those youngster when they are ready,if we want to win in 2023 then you can put all those velickas sedekerkis,valinskas type players in 2019.But in that case best scenerio first playoff round exist.

    All coaches is doing that,maturity and experience in basketball mean something especially when real pressure begins is not just ID on passport.You were trolling kemzura because he took older player in 2011-2012,you were trolling Kazlauskas because he was trusting more experiences ones,now you trolling Adomaitis because he takes Juskevicius,Orelikas and do not let play scared Kulboka . So maybe its your problem DUDE not all coaches,that they are trusting more experience players?
    Last edited by Shawshank; 11-28-2017 at 12:33 PM.

  15. #55

    Default

    IMO, with current basketball you need 10-11 men rotation even in the knock out stage (and it's playoffs not playoofs, besides in FIBA there' no playoffs, it's the knock out stage, just noticed you always make this mistake). It was more than obvious that our backourt rotation was too thin in both 2016 and 2017. How Juskevicius is not meant to help us in the knock our stage if he played 20 minutes and had the most serious role to stop Sloukas? If you take Juskevicius, you will have to play Juskevicius. Unless he's 3rd SG who would only play few minutes. The thing is that once real deal game started - knock our stage- Adimaitis was in a deep shit with his backourt options: Gecevicius was absolutely horrific and got absolutely destroyed in 2 minutes, Milaknis for some reasons was lost all tournament long and Juskevicius couldn't bring things on the table. Like it wouldn't be enough, Kalnietis is not capable of controlling the backourt any more since 2015. Yes, at offence he still can play, but he's defence now really sucks. Sometimes it's just beyond criticism, just watch that Greece game. The same happened against Australia, he didn't have legs for the defence. So good luck winning against Greece with such "defensive" backourt Good luck winning against any top8 Euro team. When we succeeded in 2013-2015, Seibutis played a huge role a the best defensive player in NT. Kalnietis wasn't so absolutely horrific at D and still had that young players' stamina. In 2017 only Grigonis could play D, that's it...You're writing like some teenager, "Juskevicius averaged 7pts, that's +3 compared to Grigonis". While watching first games in the group I said it clearly - if Grigonis won't be ready for the knock our stage, we are going no-where because DEFENCE is the key in the knock out stage. Hell, even Warriors with all their offensive talent, needs an absolutely lock down defender Klay Thompson to win games. And you still can't figure out how Grigonis is better than Juskevicius...

    FOA, Orelikas is as much PF as Kuzminskas. Second, there's no guarantee that he would shoot threes even a bit better than Kuz did (36% is decent for PF) and that's the only area where he would be better. Again, Orelikas would have to naile 4-6 threes every game to compensate non-existant defence at 4. Players would climb all over him.

    Your ID theory is false because Grigonis was the best guard in the game against Greece, And that was the game that matter. One of the best players that night also was Ulanovas and he had to play more..Valanciunas also was 25...so 3 of 4 best players in the most intense and important game of the tournament were younger than 26...so much for your theory...

    Stop misquoting me. I never said Kulboka should be IN. I said he will be in the future, not like nearest future. He's not ready. Sedekerskis is much more read and hope he would be in the camp 2019.

    As for Kemzura, I admit some of my remarks where incorrect and false. Regarding Kazlauskas, I always loved how he picked players other than few obvious mistakes like Kariniauskas. He has an eye and understands what it takes to win. Kazlauskas is a coach who has balls to trust young players and he did many times. Adomaitis on other hand fucked up real hard with the backourt options and usage. Particularly, "mutual agreement" with Seibutis was devastating mistake and he failed to use Ulanovas at 2 for defensive reasons as he didn't have a single guard who can play D other than crippled Grigonis...So far Adomaitis didn't prove he knows how to build a winning team and I'm far from being sure that he will do better in the future.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

  16. #56
    Senior Member Svajunas's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    778
    Country: Lithuania

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LuDux View Post
    Or Maskoliunas who is tall enough to defend Sloukas
    When you take your sarcasm to pathetic level...

  17. #57

    Default

    Best players per position in Lithuania today:

    PG Lekavicius
    SG Grigonis
    SF Kuzminskas
    PF Unknown
    C Sabonis

    I really see that Grigonis stepping up to another level. Lekavicius is hands down better than Kalnietis, not even because he's 2 ways player differently than Mantas, but I think he's already better offensively as well. With those 2 emerging we can be at the different level than we were in 2016 and 2017 (Kalnietis and Seibutis covering a backup roles in the backourt).
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

  18. #58
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Klaipeda
    Posts
    2,003
    Country: Lithuania

    Default

    Kalnietis, Sg unknown,Kuzminskas,Jankunas,Valanciunas if we have to play playoffs game today.This is the best players for each positions we have right now in those type of tournaments.

    But In 2019 Jankunas and Kalnietis most likely will be too old to be main players in their positions ( 35 and 33)
    Last edited by Shawshank; 12-20-2017 at 06:40 PM.

  19. #59
    Senior Member madmax's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,328

    Default

    Kalnietis will have no shot of being the main playmaker in 2019 anymore, as Lekavicius is already heads and shoulders above him right now lol...as for Jankunas, dude will be 35 years of young by then and we have plenty of established and upcoming players in this position too, so no chance for the old fox too to make the roster I'm afraid

  20. #60

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    Kalnietis, Sg unknown,Kuzminskas,Jankunas,Valanciunas if we have to play playoffs game today.This is the best players for each positions we have right now in those type of tournaments.
    I seriously doubt we can win anything with Kalnietis playing a lot in the knock out stage. His defence is terrible. Maybe if he wouldn't play more than 15 minutes, he would be able to provide some defensive presence, but I even doubt about that. Sure we would still play him 15-20min as we don't have any better platers and probably even more because most likely Adomaitis won't have balls to make Lukas the main PG, but the way I see things we can't beat Top8 Euro teams with Kalnietis. I would mainly use Lukas, Mantas, Seibutis, Grigonis rotation in various ways. Would try to cover Kalneitis' defensive flaws moving him to 2 defensively or somehow, but when you play against Teo/Bogdanovic, Lull/Rodriguez, Calathes/Sloukas, De Colo/Fournier, Dragic/Doncic you are doomed with Kalnietis in the court. Dude can't play D. Australia with Mills and Dellavedova tear us apart, than Calathes and Sloukas.

    SG is known and it's Grigonis. Seibutis is close, but he has declined offensively while Grigonis can also play O, to facilitate a little bit, he reads the game well. IMO, no doubt he's the best SG at the moment. I wrote PF unknown because I treated Sabonis as 5, but if we treat him as 4, hands down he's the best and it's not even close. Aside Sabonis is between Jankunas and D-Mo. We don't know how much D-Mo improved.

    And again, JV is not better than Sabonis. He's much more limited.

    Today I would go with such NT:

    Lekavicius, Kalnietis
    Grigonis, Seibutis, Ulanovas
    Kuzminskas, Maciulis
    Sabonis, Jankunas, D-Mo,
    Valanciunas, Gudaitis
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The flick from the future...

Page 3 of 58 FirstFirst 123451353 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •