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Slovenia Redeem team upset biggest in bball history?

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  • #16
    I mean..No.Germany in 1993 was by far the biggest upset.We're talking about a team that lost 3 times in that same tournament.

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    • #17
      I don know how big surprise Slovenia was, but I know that in this forum popular vote put Slovenia in 3rd place in the group. and we won all 5 games, destroying France in the most important match, but was still underdog against Latvia and big underdog against Spain, who was consequently demolished in semis. Slovenian going 9:0 was imho very big surprise.
      previously known as Beno

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      • #18
        Amazing, yes, not a surprise

        Alyosha,

        well, we all agree, what a tournament.. now, as one tends to claim himself sane, I will do so for myself, I actually did believe that Slovenia stood a chance for going all the way ahead of the tournament and put some money on it winning it all, with a pretty good return of 30X... now, in all fairness was I 100% certain that we could win, no - but I thought that Slovenia def was a top 4 team with a chance of going all the way. I thought that both betting agencies, and to a lesser extend this forum underestimated it... Now, we all know that there were some good reasons for it to people believe this way, but here are few reasons why I thought Slovenia could make it this time around...

        1. While this was far from Slovenia's best squad ever, the team had a clear leader in Dragic, two top European players in Randolph and Doncic. While it lacked the stars of the past, it had another 6 solid European level players that were young and eager and knew how to play and fight. In the past we had better squads, but with noone who would be as good as Dragic and standing out as much - therefore the leader
        2. the luck has to turn around sometime.. Slovenian national team was due in for the first medal in 2005, when it lost due to poor coaching and underestimation against Germany in quarterfinals, it was due for the medal in 2007 when it dropped in last minute and a half against Greece in quarterfinals, it was due to play the final in 2009 (and actually stood chance against Spain) when Teodosic hit the three for the OT, it was due for the medal in 2013 home Eurobasket, when it lost to later champions, it was due for the medal in 2014 WC, when Australian team speculated and we lost to Lithuania in a tied game and ended up facing States in quarters... I watched some of these games live on the stadiums and was immensely frustrated, believe me
        3. winning mentality - while Slovenia in the past faced collapses in the last minutes of the already won games, it grew confidence in the past years. I think this has been helped by the successes of other sports, namely handball and volleyball that won medals and put off the pressure from the basketball team. I also knew that if they managed to win in quarters (what other team had a ratio of 1/7 before this tournament?!), they will be coming in as the underdog and surprise, when they werent really. Winning mentality and confidence and makes all the difference.
        4. great coaching - while I still believe that Jure Zdovc is a great coach, we cant say that for some of the others we had in the past that were not up to the level of the players at the time.. Kokoskov has proven to be amazing
        5. older spanish team, absences from French, Serbian as well as Greek teams.

        Now all the hard times are forgotten and I still cant quite believe it, well done to the team.
        I also want to congratulate to Serbians who were very close and Spaniards and Russians, as well as Latvians, who I think could be in the finals had they been in the other draw.

        As goes for the complaints about absences, our best generation that could but never played together: Nesterovic, Milic, Lakovic, Nachbar, Udrih, Vujacic, Dragic, Lorbek, Smodis, Gorenc, Dragic, Tusek, Becirovic, Brezec, etc.... well, it happens - so we need to face it. And based on what we have seen, one team one dream mentality with solid players can take you all the way.

        Is it amazing? Yes! Was it unimaginable? NO. As long as I have been watching, the biggest upsets for title would def be Germany 1993 as some of you pointed out and then I would say Germany coming 2nd in 2005 as well...

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        • #19
          The Eurobasket is a tournament which takes a few weeks. It is less about talent and more about chemistry. There have been plenty of teams which overachieved due to good chemistry. Think of the FYR of Macedonia who made the semi finals a few years back. Other teams like Lithuania have had some good chemistry for several tournaments and were also able to reach finals. Slovenia went a step further because of some of aforementioned reasons. This squad had some good leaders and lesser expectations, which resulted to less pressure. This allowed them to build up good chemistry game by game. Take into account that a powerhouse like Spain is losing ground due to age, and that teams like Serbia, France, Greece had key absences (imagine Slovenia without Dragic) and there you have it.

          This is good, we are all happy for Slovenia. But that said, Slovenia is a traditional basketball nation. Can't say it's the biggest upset. Think of Greece 1987 or Germany 1993. Neither were true basketball nations at that point.

          That said, I think that the new FIBA qualification model will allow elite teams to build good chemistry during the two year qualification phase. Even if there are some absentees. So teams which traditionally have good chemistry will suffer more in actual tournaments.
          PAO EUROPEAN CHAMPION 1996 - 2000 - 2002 - 2007 - 2009 - 2011

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Victorious View Post
            The Eurobasket is a tournament which takes a few weeks. It is less about talent and more about chemistry. There have been plenty of teams which overachieved due to good chemistry. Think of the FYR of Macedonia who made the semi finals a few years back. Other teams like Lithuania have had some good chemistry for several tournaments and were also able to reach finals. Slovenia went a step further because of some of aforementioned reasons. This squad had some good leaders and lesser expectations, which resulted to less pressure. This allowed them to build up good chemistry game by game. Take into account that a powerhouse like Spain is losing ground due to age, and that teams like Serbia, France, Greece had key absences (imagine Slovenia without Dragic) and there you have it.

            This is good, we are all happy for Slovenia. But that said, Slovenia is a traditional basketball nation. Can't say it's the biggest upset. Think of Greece 1987 or Germany 1993. Neither were true basketball nations at that point.

            That said, I think that the new FIBA qualification model will allow elite teams to build good chemistry during the two year qualification phase. Even if there are some absentees. So teams which traditionally have good chemistry will suffer more in actual tournaments.
            The teams might build good chemistry during the 2 years qualification. But who will play in the end? All the best players are playing in Nba or Euroleague. It looks to me 1 team will qualify and the other will play. Not fair to guys who will qualify and for sure no new chemistry. I don't believe Greece will play in WC 2019 with Fiba champions league players and Bourousis.
            previously known as Beno

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            • #21
              In all honestly, I wouldn't be worried about Greece qualifying. They traditionaly have a lot of depth, even if this tournament didn't show that.

              As for Slovenia, big upset? definately. Probably the biggest upset in the last 20 years considering the odds bookies gave or winning it all. Of all times? I can't judge that.
              For upsets not including winning it all, Macedonia few years back or Germany in 2005 imo were still a bit more surprising.

              I feel bad for Latvia. Once again, I made a list I believe 4 years ago, which consisted from some mere 1,2 point loses or really tough groups or lack of luck with drawings. They could have played in the finals for the upset as well.
              Originally posted by Jon_Koncak
              That's funny shit.I cant believe there are sports fans thinking like it.It's like Federer losing to random Japanese player in round 1 of French Open but tournament director stepping in and saying "hey it was a fluke win who wants to watch a random Japanese guy in next round,Federer qualifies"

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Killer Bob View Post
                The teams might build good chemistry during the 2 years qualification. But who will play in the end? All the best players are playing in Nba or Euroleague. It looks to me 1 team will qualify and the other will play. Not fair to guys who will qualify and for sure no new chemistry. I don't believe Greece will play in WC 2019 with Fiba champions league players and Bourousis.
                For top teams which have top EL and NBA players you might be right. But if these federations can make a preliminary roster of 22 players, and allow some of the Euroleague players to participate during some games of the qualification phase, it will help the team build good chemistry. There are after all some games in June and July. Not to mention that these teams would be functioning under the same coach for some years, which is a big plus. It certainly would be for Greece.
                PAO EUROPEAN CHAMPION 1996 - 2000 - 2002 - 2007 - 2009 - 2011

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Joško Poljak Fan View Post
                  In all honestly, I wouldn't be worried about Greece qualifying. They traditionaly have a lot of depth, even if this tournament didn't show that.
                  It's not about qualifying. It's about using the opportunity to build good chemistry which they lack.
                  PAO EUROPEAN CHAMPION 1996 - 2000 - 2002 - 2007 - 2009 - 2011

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by fasoulaki View Post
                    Hopefully 2017 EC will have stronger impact on Slovenia than 1993 EC on Germany.
                    Slovenia unlike 93. Germany has long basketball tradition and it's audiance. Sure they need boost since they are actually hit by players production crisis and they will get it from this EC, but it's not like they are basketball "newcomers"
                    Jordi Bertomeu sucks!

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                    • #25
                      Well... that impact ussualy starts showing with kids at the range of 13-15, since more of them take up basketball more seriously.

                      Olimpija's F4 in 1997 and their perfomances untill 2001 grew our 84-87 generations...
                      than there was some pause and mixed performances
                      2009 EC gave us 95' generation (Rebec, Nikolič, partialy 97' Šiško, Mesiček, Čančar)
                      2013 gave us 98' and 99' generations... apart from Dončič, there is Macura, Samar, Duščak, Radovič
                      With the 17 EC, I espect 02', 03', 04' generations to profit...
                      Originally posted by Jon_Koncak
                      That's funny shit.I cant believe there are sports fans thinking like it.It's like Federer losing to random Japanese player in round 1 of French Open but tournament director stepping in and saying "hey it was a fluke win who wants to watch a random Japanese guy in next round,Federer qualifies"

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Joško Poljak Fan View Post
                        Well... that impact ussualy starts showing with kids at the range of 13-15, since more of them take up basketball more seriously.

                        Olimpija's F4 in 1997 and their perfomances untill 2001 grew our 84-87 generations...
                        than there was some pause and mixed performances
                        2009 EC gave us 95' generation (Rebec, Nikolič, partialy 97' Šiško, Mesiček, Čančar)
                        2013 gave us 98' and 99' generations... apart from Dončič, there is Macura, Samar, Duščak, Radovič
                        With the 17 EC, I espect 02', 03', 04' generations to profit...
                        maybe in Europe. but I`d take Cavs coming back from 3-1 last year as the biggest upset

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                        • #27
                          I've started watching basketball back in early 90s. And if we are talking about international competitions, then it is the second biggest upset only after Germany-93. Realistically, if the maximum of the roster's "objective worth" is concerned, Slovenia is somewhere near 8th position plus/minus a couple of places. But Slovenia terrifically overperformed while most of its potential eliminators underperformed. Still Slovenia - Spain semifinal is an upset of the century for me, I can't quite get how it happened and why to this very day.

                          But at the same time this means that this Slovenian team is the weakest Eurobasket champion since quite a some time... most probably, Germany-93. I don't think that, despite the fact that people love Cinderella stories, it is a good thing for European basketball.

                          I was mostly considering about Europe though, as in the world basketball there happened some stuff comparable and maybe even outshining than this Slovenia's win - Venezuela-2015 was possibly more of an upset, especially with back-to-back wins against heavily favoured Canada and Argentina in the play-offs.
                          Last edited by Terrorizer; 09-21-2017, 01:39 PM.
                          2013/2014 IBN Euroleague Prediction Game Winner

                          Thrash 'till Death!

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Terrorizer View Post
                            I've started watching basketball back in early 90s. And if we are talking about international competitions, then it is the second biggest upset only after Germany-93. Realistically, if the maximum of the roster's "objective worth" is concerned, Slovenia is somewhere near 8th position plus/minus a couple of places. But Slovenia terrifically overperformed while most of its potential eliminators underperformed. Still Slovenia - Spain semifinal is an upset of the century for me, I can't quite get how it happened and why to this very day.

                            But at the same time this means that this Slovenian team is the weakest Eurobasket champion since quite a some time... most probably, Germany-93. I don't think that, despite the fact that people love Cinderella stories, it is a good thing for European basketball.

                            I was mostly considering about Europe though, as in the world basketball there happened some stuff comparable and maybe even outshining than this Slovenia's win - Venezuela-2015 was possibly more of an upset, especially with back-to-back wins against heavily favoured Canada and Argentina in the play-offs.
                            Against Spain is simple explanation, Kokoskov outplayed Scariolo and Doncic Rubio.
                            previously known as Beno

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                            • #29
                              Lol at the biggest upset in the history of Eurobasket . Slovenia came with their best squad that they could gather also they naturalized american player just before the start of the tournament while Serbia,Spain,France and some other countries have missed lots of great players, I would call this Slovenian team the weakest champion in modern history of the European basketball. The biggest upset is Russia beating Spain on their own turf, that was the great Spain team loosing a real underdog team . You were lucky that this was the weakest Eurobasket ever, congratulation on your title but don't start BS topic like this one. It is so stupid.
                              Last edited by Srle; 09-24-2017, 09:23 PM.
                              UZEO SI TROFEJ MACVANE MACVANE MACVANE!!!

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Srle View Post
                                Lol at the biggest upset in the history of Eurobasket . Slovenia came with their best squad that they could gather also they naturalized american player just before the start of the tournament while Serbia,Spain,France and some other countries have missed lost of great players. You were lucky that this was the weakest Eurobasket ever, congratulation on your title but don't start BS topic like this one. it so stupid.
                                First gz to Slovenia, second Srle stole my thoughts, Slovenia is not a surprise atleast not for me, Slovenia beating Spain was a surprise but Slovenia beating Serbia was not even close to surprise, when you look by the names even then Slovenia had better team than Serbia and probably 90% of the teams on this tournament
                                Republic of CRVENA ZVEZDA

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