Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. IV

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by analyzed View Post
    Yes I think 6 2 for guards similar to the 15 Japanese guards in NCAA US is more realistic.
    The thing is we have to start with the right material, we already failed if our top 24 in the NBTC NCAA as an example has zero players of the right height for their position. (tapos na pag ganoon)
    Originally posted by analyzed View Post
    Not necessarily PG, just listed as guards the list is the link above, and they're not all current college players.
    While obviously it's not absolute thing that they're all bigger, the rate of perimeter oriented players for a certain height (6'2 and above) is higher. This is forseeing what a player's s height has to be to be reasonably competitive internationally
    (edit I saw the list)

    Firstly, you say "in NCAA US" unless there is another US NCAA, this pertains to college not high school. Unless you have a link of Japanese with formal US NCAA invites.

    Secondly, we are talking of PG with 6'2" not SG or other guard position.

    Thirdly, in your list how many of them went to Japan High School like Rui to be called homegrown?

    Comment


    • Originally posted by c_d View Post
      ^There's 6'2 Chikara Tanaka who's now playing in IMG who was born in 2002. He's part of their Team B pool for the Jones cup but didn't make the cut. In comparison, we have 2002 born Forthsky Padrigao who will most likely be playing in the UAAP juniors until he's 19.

      Their u16 team this year will have 6'5 wing Ibu Yamazaki who I believe plays for Meisei High School, same school as Hachimura. Ang iniisip ng schools ay magchampion sila sa liga nila and not player development or future employment ng mga bata...


      That's not a reason for the sbp not to establish a youth program with the goal of producing world class talent at the world youth level and eventually for the men's team. As for reusing the Gilas 1 formula, I'd rather see a program where we train youth players to be recruited to play for eiher the NBA Global Academy, a good NCAA college program or club ball in Europe. That gives them a bigger chance of landing a pro contract overseas where they'll be regularly competing at a level that is comparable to what you'll see in FIBA Tournaments. That playing experience will carry over when they suit up for the NT.
      Of course SChools wont release their playere to Batang Gilas, pano na ang dream nilang NCAA at UAAP championships if the players will be recruited by US Academies or US NCAA schools...

      Comment


      • Originally posted by c_d View Post
        ^There's 6'2 Chikara Tanaka who's now playing in IMG who was born in 2002. He's part of their Team B pool for the Jones cup but didn't make the cut. In comparison, we have 2002 born Forthsky Padrigao who will most likely be playing in the UAAP juniors until he's 19.

        Their u16 team this year will have 6'5 wing Ibu Yamazaki who I believe plays for Meisei High School, same school as Hachimura.


        That's not a reason for the sbp not to establish a youth program with the goal of producing world class talent at the world youth level and eventually for the men's team. As for reusing the Gilas 1 formula, I'd rather see a program where we train youth players to be recruited to play for eiher the NBA Global Academy, a good NCAA college program or club ball in Europe.
        I do not claim to know the players in Japan, but the 2 names you mentioned is just an example of the rate of them producing players of height in the perimeter.
        I know anytime I mention NZ people wil find it offensive, but so you get the context of why I see a significant disparity in youth players, the competition my son plays in is in the city of Wellington (population 500k), we have the following in our competition 15 year old 6 8 small Forward Tafaro, 6 7 SF Ben, 6'6 SF Malacai, 6 4 wing Zeke., that number multiplies by 5 if you account for the rest of the country. it is really a disadvantage if other players of that height of that many who play the wing position exclusively or mainly in other countries, while the Philippines tall players 6 4 ish don't get the same exposure
        NBTC- Team New Zealand - Camp David: vision "To provide a basketball Pathway for Filipino Kids in NZ while building men of character and leadership. I can do all things ...
        https://www.facebook.com/teamNZBasketball/

        Comment


        • Originally posted by analyzed View Post
          Fadski, what you have to realize is that many countries Japan and New Zealand included do not have competitive serious basketball in college. Especially not like the semi pro nature of the UAAP. Therefore the normal pathway of many in NZ and Japan if they want a paid scholarship as well as living expenses covered while playing basketball is US NCAA. While in the Philippines college teams have already planned their pathway to their school even in early high school. Now here is how that impacts development. The Japanese high school kid who stands 6 2ish already knows for him to even have a chance of playing in the US he has to play exclusively guard or PG. While a 6 2 Pinoy kid may be asked to even be their high school big man to win more games.. to bring glory to their school. See the significant difference
          So the problem with our basketball is not entirely the PBA's fault, I think if SBP can do a similar rule to the US NCAA regarding the recruitment of high school players many of our best young talents would have a crack on that US NCAA D1 basketball.

          A talented young Pinoy baller mentality would be why would I go to the US, try my luck and risk everything, when I can stay in the country and play for a very popular school in the Philippine who would give me everything I want. That is why I commend what Kai, AJ Japeth and even Kobe did for their basketball career. Imagine if BRP stayed in the US I think he could have been our very 1st Philippine born player in the NBA. Too bad, but It was understandable what he did was for his father.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by zairex View Post
            (edit I saw the list)

            Firstly, you say "in NCAA US" unless there is another US NCAA, this pertains to college not high school. Unless you have a link of Japanese with formal US NCAA invites.

            Secondly, we are talking of PG with 6'2" not SG or other guard position.
            Sorry goes back another page the list is the 42 Japanese born players who have played is US NCAA, yes of course college
            Most from Japan based high schools

            Oh you may talk about PG, I'm just referring to list listed as guard.. regardless it is quite glaring the number of tall players playing perimeter roles G or GF

            And obviously the number, 42
            While obviously there are reasons why we don't go to US NCAA, the desparity is significant and the length per position
            NBTC- Team New Zealand - Camp David: vision "To provide a basketball Pathway for Filipino Kids in NZ while building men of character and leadership. I can do all things ...
            https://www.facebook.com/teamNZBasketball/

            Comment


            • Originally posted by analyzed View Post
              Sorry goes back another page the list is the 42 Japanese born players who have played is US NCAA, yes of course college
              Most from Japan based high schools

              Oh you may talk about PG, I'm just referring to list listed as guard.. regardless it is quite glaring the number of tall players playing perimeter roles G or GF

              And obviously the number, 42
              While obviously there are reasons why we don't go to US NCAA, the desparity is significant and the length per position
              Firstly who are 15 japanese players in current US NCAA?

              Secondly the post you are replying to clearly said PG for 6'1" to 6'2" not any other guards position. And if you look at the list all PG are below 6'0"

              Thirdly how many of them learn to play basketball in Japan or went to Japan High School to be consider home grown. If they went to US high school then I believe there are more than 50 Fil-Fors NCAA players which neglect your narrative. For example, Guards Matsui and Taishi were teammates at Montrose Christian High School in Rockville, Maryland

              Fourth, most of them are mix race just a note. Okinawa is where a US Base located.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by analyzed View Post
                Yes I think 6 2 for guards similar to the 15 Japanese guards in NCAA US is more realistic.
                The thing is we have to start with the right material, we already failed if our top 24 in the NBTC NCAA as an example has zero players of the right height for their position. (tapos na pag ganoon)
                The thing is, as far Asian basketball is concerned, its really rare for any Asian country having 6-foot-4/6-foot-5 point guards. Only China's Gou Ailun who is around 6-foot-3 & Lebanon's Wael Arakji who is listed as 6-foot-4 could be considered "tall" point guards. The point guards of South Korea, Iran, Jordan, Kazakhstan are in the 6 feet flat to 6-foot-2 height range. Japan's star point guard Yuki Togashi is only around 5-foot-8/5-foot-9. Former Iran National team point guard Mahdi Kamrani is barely 6 feet.

                The point here is that by having 6-foot-0 to 6-foot-2 point guards, hindi na tayo dihado against our opponents' point guard height-wise, at least in Asian basketball.
                "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

                Comment


                • Originally posted by JAMSKIE View Post
                  The thing is, as far Asian basketball is concerned, its really rare for any Asian country having 6-foot-4/6-foot-5 point guards. Only China's Gou Ailun who is around 6-foot-3 & Lebanon's Wael Arakji who is listed as 6-foot-4 could be considered "tall" point guards. The point guards of South Korea, Iran, Jordan, Kazakhstan are in the 6 feet flat to 6-foot-2 height range. Japan's star point guard Yuki Togashi is only around 5-foot-8/5-foot-9. Former Iran National team point guard Mahdi Kamrani is barely 6 feet.

                  The point here is that by having 6-foot-0 to 6-foot-2 point guards, hindi na tayo dihado against our opponents' point guard height-wise, at least in Asian basketball.
                  Problem is 6-0 are SG, and 6-2 arw SF in the UAAP and NCAA... Si Akin Ito nga 5-10SF....

                  Comment


                  • Oh yes problem isn't just the PBA, my focus is more high school and college age development (homegrown programs) that's where problem is mainly
                    NBTC- Team New Zealand - Camp David: vision "To provide a basketball Pathway for Filipino Kids in NZ while building men of character and leadership. I can do all things ...
                    https://www.facebook.com/teamNZBasketball/

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by zairex View Post
                      Firstly who are 15 japanese players in current US NCAA?

                      Secondly the post you are replying to clearly said PG for 6'1" to 6'2" not any other guards position. And if you look at the list all PG are below 6'0"

                      Thirdly how many of them learn to play basketball in Japan or went to Japan High School to be consider home grown. If they went to US high school then I believe there are more than 50 Fil-Fors NCAA players which neglect your narrative. For example, Guards Matsui and Taishi were teammates at Montrose Christian High School in Rockville, Maryland

                      Fourth, most of them are mix race just a note. Okinawa is where a US Base located.
                      It's immaterial really what the exact number is of players per hight per position or how many played high school in the US, (they're listed as Japanese Nationals born in Japan therefor FiBA eligible).

                      If you still can't see disparity in homegrown developed players compared to our Asian rivals, that's up to you to be in denial, just don't be suprise at the rate of Div 1, NBA summer league and NBA regular players coming from these countries in the next couple of years compared to the Philippines. People don't need to know the exact number to see the obvious.
                      NBTC- Team New Zealand - Camp David: vision "To provide a basketball Pathway for Filipino Kids in NZ while building men of character and leadership. I can do all things ...
                      https://www.facebook.com/teamNZBasketball/

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by analyzed View Post
                        Oh yes problem isn't just the PBA, my focus is more high school and college age development (homegrown programs) that's where problem is mainly
                        So is Japan way better in producing NCAA D1 players than Philippines? How many Japanese went to Japan High School and directly when to NCAA D1.

                        Comment


                        • I don't know I'm not from Japan, but their development output regardless of where these eligible players were trained is obviously churning out more

                          We do know their 3 NBA players (regular season) spent time in Japanese high schools
                          NBTC- Team New Zealand - Camp David: vision "To provide a basketball Pathway for Filipino Kids in NZ while building men of character and leadership. I can do all things ...
                          https://www.facebook.com/teamNZBasketball/

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by analyzed View Post
                            It's immaterial really what the exact number is of players per hight per position or how many played high school in the US, (they're listed as Japanese Nationals born in Japan therefor FiBA eligible).

                            If you still can't see disparity in homegrown developed players compared to our Asian rivals, that's up to you to be in denial, just don't be suprise at the rate of Div 1, NBA summer league and NBA regular players coming from these countries in the next couple of years compared to the Philippines. People don't need to know the exact number to see the obvious.
                            You always say result are result then you even come up with logical information (which I dont know exactly what you mean) as your basis but when asked about facts on your statement saddenly you brushes them away. How convenient?

                            To those in the forum this was his post

                            Originally posted by analyzed View Post
                            Now look at this list of 42 Japan born players who played in US colleges , 42 !



                            See the difference ! Not far behind in output, are you serious. so how many homegrown players have we in Div 1 , 2 ? so 42 compared to 2, how's that not far behind? and note a number of the Japanese div 1 players are significant contributors to their teams not bench warmers like Japs or Kobe..
                            What he didn't say o most probably he didn't even click on the players profile, for players that played PG, G or GF only 3 out or 28 players played in Japan High School. Being born doesn't mean they were trained in Japan about basketball or Japan basketball program produces D1 NCAA, they were just born there. They might have live most of there lives in US and trained there. See how the statement is falsehood and even a noobs knows that a player train in US majority of his life is not homegrown talent. Unless he goes back to play college where he is born, like Bobby Ray Parks.

                            And if we accept his narrative, we have more than 50 Fil fors and pure Pinoys who played in US NCAA. Far Behind?

                            Remember this quote of yours

                            Originally posted by analyzed View Post
                            Sorry goes back another page the list is the 42 Japanese born players who have played is US NCAA, yes of course college
                            Most from Japan based high schools
                            Didnt you even try to look at players profile before you even say these words.

                            You are so vigorous on some of the ibners that development is far behind in Philippines by making falsehood statements and branding us sensitive. We are not sensitive, i for one know we have to develop better grassroots program but making falsehood will not help and we are just correcting your narratives. Some of your narrative are baseless. That's not sensitive, its just logical information. Result are results.
                            Last edited by zairex; 08-06-2019, 08:14 AM.

                            Comment


                            • Gusto nyo dumami NCAA players natin? Higpitan natin college ranks sa pagbabayad sa student athletes esp basketball. Sureball yan, yung mga middle class at elite talents natin makakaisip mangarap ng mas mataas. Kung wala ka rin naman compensation paglalaro in Pinas, might as well aim for higher ceiling. I've never seen a nation paying players like pros even in the grassroots ( ligang labas). Lol onli in da pilipins...!
                              Never look too far ahead. You might stumble on a block right in front of you.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by analyzed View Post
                                I don't know I'm not from Japan, but their development output regardless of where these eligible players were trained is obviously churning out more

                                We do know their 3 NBA players (regular season) spent time in Japanese high schools
                                You don't know, then don't make assumption that you have no info about. If where they develop doesn't matter then why say this in your post

                                Originally posted by analyzed View Post
                                People may be wondering with the lopsided in homegrown development output between Japan and the Philippines , why the FIBA results don't suggest the same lopsided outcomes... the reason is simple ( and I've been saying it like a broken record) , Cause we are getting our results from players who are not developed in house by the program, specifcially.

                                1. Naturalize player ( bTW our NP is an NBA regular level player not Brown or even Fazekas type

                                2. Fil foreign ( developed outside) - Norwood, Asi, Alapag, Kelly to name a few
                                Looks like contradiction from you statement that Japan has better development that ours right.

                                Again we are talking about development not eligibilities here. Once again going away from your own topic. Sensitive?? I think not. Correction is what it is called.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X

                                Debug Information