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Thread: All time NT

  1. #21
    Senior Member Darknemo2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilkas View Post
    G: Jasikevičius, Kalnietis
    G: Marčiulionis, Macijauskas, Kurtinaitis
    F: Štombergas, Šiškauskas
    F: Karnišovas, Kleiza
    C: Sabonis, Ilgauskas, Valančiūnas

    I do not understood people who put Einikis. He drink and abuses his wife, drinking before practicing and doing cocaine. I think he do bettr if not drugs and alcohol.

    Chomičius sadly did not play good, he ,33 year old in Barcelona olympics, was episodal player. This is why I put not him. Songaila played averagely. Paulauskas ,Lubinas did not count, they played before year 1992..
    Einikis was really good. His drinking and other problems became clear only when he ended his career. If he didnt have to play under Sabonis shadow most of the time he could have been even bigger. His hooks were pretty much unstoppable.

  2. #22
    Senior Member auris1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    I understand he has seriuos injury history and playing in summer would be a big risk and so on.
    You don't.

    Shame on those fans who put ilgauskas on our all time national team roster,that men do not belong to be there period.
    Walking proudly on a high ground here ,aren't you? Imagine living with this burden ,it must be hard.
    What a prick .

    And lets say,had he played in one tournament,that would not had been enough for you and people alike ,would it ?
    Or you would just whine about him being slow and out of pace , and really bad at rebounding ,or maybe not scoring enough points.And in the end ,people like you would come to conclusion that we never needed a player like him in a first place...

  3. #23
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by auris1 View Post
    You don't.


    Walking proudly on a high ground here ,aren't you? Imagine living with this burden ,it must be hard.
    What a prick .

    And lets say,had he played in one tournament,that would not had been enough for you and people alike ,would it ?
    Or you would just whine about him being slow and out of pace , and really bad at rebounding ,or maybe not scoring enough points.And in the end ,people like you would come to conclusion that we never needed a player like him in a first place...

    whats your problem? I said fact men didnt play for his national team 8 games atleast once for 14 years because it was a risk..and played 10 season 80games and there is no risk cha cha Men Ilgauskas isnt the only basketball player in the world that got seriuos injury or something.Sabonis too got 2 achilies brakes in 1986-1987 so he should said i cant play for my country,its a risk i can get injury...If you are involved in sport THERE IS ALWAYS RISK YOU GONNA GET INJURED.Im reapeting NOBODY IN LITHUANIA RESPECT ILGAUSKAS and thats kind words how to say it , it was his desicions and he will have to live with the fact that his own country people doesnt respect him ... HE never was and will be loved by fans like those true Lithuania basketball legends.I wasnt suprised like 2 years ago he said he will go for Usa citizenship,He always acted he was more american than lithuanian when he left Lithuania in 1996.

    In conversations about our national team all time best,player that havent played a game shouldnt be even mentioned,he is lithuanian by blood,but by heart always was american.Do to respect such money slaves thats all.
    Last edited by Shawshank; 10-30-2014 at 08:54 AM.

  4. #24
    Moderator Mindozas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawshank View Post
    whats your problem? I said fact men didnt play for his national team 8 games atleast once for 14 years because it was a risk..and played 10 season 80games and there is no risk cha cha Men Ilgauskas isnt the only basketball player in the world that got seriuos injury or something.Sabonis too got 2 achilies brakes in 1986-1987 so he should said i cant play for my country,its a risk i can get injury...If you are involved in sport THERE IS ALWAYS RISK YOU GONNA GET INJURED.Im reapeting NOBODY IN LITHUANIA RESPECT ILGAUSKAS and thats kind words how to say it , it was his desicions and he will have to live with the fact that his own country people doesnt respect him ... HE never was and will be loved by fans like those true Lithuania basketball legends.I wasnt suprised like 2 years ago he said he will go for Usa citizenship,He always acted he was more american than lithuanian when he left Lithuania in 1996.

    In conversations about our national team all time best,player that havent played a game shouldnt be even mentioned,he is lithuanian by blood,but by heart always was american.Do to respect such money slaves thats all.
    How much you must hate a person to write so much nonsenses and imaginary stuff in just 2 posts, is just beyond me


  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mindozas View Post
    It's NT matter. Ilgauskas never represented NT in any official tournament, just played few qualifying games before he got injured and moved to USA where underwent series of feet surgeries and started to play for Cavs. Before moving he was accused by his coach (later federation president) for faking injury, but actually as time showed, it was much more serious than anyone could've thought. Well as it turned out, Ilgauskas never played for NT again. In 2008 Ilgauskas wanted to play, but back injury occured and last hope was gone. So some people called him traitor through-out all his career, who doesn't give a f*ck about his country, some said that he is mad on federation president cause of that accusations and etc, so that's the reason he doesn't want to represent NT anymore. I was this the latter at first. But I wasn't aware how complicated situation actually was until I get to know about it all from some sources close to situation. Ilgauskas wasn't mad, he did give a f*ck about his country and wanted to represent it badly, but he had very serious health issues, which didn't allow him. Basically every summer it was dilemma for him: either rest his body (feets) during NBA off-season as every doc, club insisted him to do so; either play for NT, but there's very high risk that his body woudn't take it and next injury would most probably be career ending (similar case happened to Yao, he kept playin' for NT summer or few and it was all over for him). So the situation was unenviable, stakes/risk were very high, so he decided to rest during off season and only in 2008 finally wanted to take a risk, but I guess smth is never meant to be. After I get to know it all, I stopped blaming him for anything. Even I'm patriot of my country and love NT, if I'd be in Ilgauskas shoes, I don't know if I would take such risk at young age and put my bball career in jeopardy, so who am I to blame other person for taking such decision. For me was enough to know that Ilgauskas wasn't faking anything and it was big loss for him not to play for NT, just like for NT not to have him in it. Sad circumstances, sad story
    Thank you for this helpful information. I have big gaps in my knowledge of Lithuanian basketball history and your post helps fill one. I have to apologize a little for bringing this topic up though, seeing now the conflict it brought to the page - I was just hoping to learn a bit more but maybe I stumbled onto a sore point for people.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Darknemo2000's Avatar
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    Well Lithuanian government took away Lithuanian citizenship from Ilgauskas (as double citizenship is not allowed by the current laws) so Ilgauskas isnt even a Lithuanian anymore. Does that mean we should stop including him to all time lithuanian 12?

  7. #27
    Moderator Mindozas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
    Well Lithuanian government took away Lithuanian citizenship from Ilgauskas (as double citizenship is not allowed by the current laws) so Ilgauskas isnt even a Lithuanian anymore. Does that mean we should stop including him to all time lithuanian 12?
    Yes. He also shouldn't be allowed to visit Lithuania anymore, strictly prohibited to speak Lith language and eat cepelinai (or how it's called in English) On a serious note, he was and he is Lithuanian by birth, he was raised here, he learned to play bball here and while playin' he was "Lithuanian", so laws are laws, no matter how ridiculous it is sometimes, but it didn't change anything in this case, atleast for me


  8. #28

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    Yeah, there's like million people in the USA that has some sort of Lithuanian roots. Our government trying to cut all this
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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    Yeah, there's like million people in the USA that has some sort of Lithuanian roots. Our government trying to cut all this
    Well, can you blame them? If the people feel more American or Canadian than Lithuanian then what's the point of them having Lithuanian citizenship? Only those who speak and feel Lithuanian I consider as citizens.

    In my view, Ilgauskas is a citizen (he speaks Lithuanian and, judging from the tears he shed when he lost his citizenship and his adoption of the two Lithuanian kids, he feels Lithuanian) and should be allowed to retain his Lithuanian passport. But laws are laws...
    Last edited by macleopard13; 11-04-2014 at 05:23 PM.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    This is an unfortunate, messy, touchy situation. There were reasons behind the passage of the law. Should it be repealed? I don't know. I haven't studied the rationale behind the law.

    Being that such a law exists though, is it right for exceptions to be made for sports celebrities? Maybe the Lithuanian state can confer "honorary citizenship" on those who have done a lot for the country? I believe Ilgauskas has been contributing financially and otherwise to the development of Lithuanian basketball, has he not? He's also been involved with Lithuanian charities of some sort as well, has he not? But then again, should "foreigners" be allowed to just buy Lithuanian citizenship?

    This is not an easy question.


  11. #31
    Senior Member Darknemo2000's Avatar
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    Have seen tons of kids wanting to be next Sabonis, Siskauskas, Jasikevicius, Marciulionis or Valanciunas. Havent seen anyone who wants to be next ilgauskas. In terms of popularity in lithuania he isnt that popular really.

  12. #32
    Moderator Mindozas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    This is an unfortunate, messy, touchy situation. There were reasons behind the passage of the law. Should it be repealed? I don't know. I haven't studied the rationale behind the law.

    Being that such a law exists though, is it right for exceptions to be made for sports celebrities? Maybe the Lithuanian state can confer "honorary citizenship" on those who have done a lot for the country? I believe Ilgauskas has been contributing financially and otherwise to the development of Lithuanian basketball, has he not? He's also been involved with Lithuanian charities of some sort as well, has he not? But then again, should "foreigners" be allowed to just buy Lithuanian citizenship?
    He did charity, donated money, bball stuff and so on. Also his two kids are adopted Lithuanians. Anyway, even I was defending him and his decisions in this topic, I wouldn't say he is the one "who have done a lot for the country". However, I surely wouldn't take away citizenship from the person who have born and raised in LT, lived here for 20 years, be it Ilgauskas or some ordinary person, unless he doesn't care about it himself, but it's not me who's creating the law


  13. #33
    Senior Member Modis's Avatar
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    PG: Šarūnas Jasikevičius The Golden Boy
    SG: Šarūnas Marčiulionis Was hard to choose between Arvydas Macijauskas and him
    SF: Saulius Štombergas Amazing 3-point shooting abilities.
    PF: Linas Kleiza was hard to choose between Kšyštofas Lavrinovičius and him
    C: Arvydas Sabonis Probably the best Center to ever play the game.

    Bench
    PG: Mantas Kalnietis
    SG: Arvydas Macijauskas Ramūnas Šiškauskas
    SF : Simas Jasaitis
    PF : Darius Songaila Kšyštofas Lavrinovičius
    C : Darjušas Lavrinovičius
    Lithuania

    Olympic Games: Bronze 1992-1996-2000.
    FIBA World Championship : Bronze 2010.
    FIBA EuroBasket : Gold 1937-1939-2003. Silver 1995-2013-2015. Bronze 2007.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Modis View Post
    PG: Šarūnas Jasikevičius The Golden Boy
    SG: Šarūnas Marčiulionis Was hard to choose between Arvydas Macijauskas and him
    SF: Saulius Štombergas Amazing 3-point shooting abilities.
    PF: Linas Kleiza was hard to choose between Kšyštofas Lavrinovičius and him
    C: Arvydas Sabonis Probably the best Center to ever play the game.

    Bench
    PG: Mantas Kalnietis
    SG: Arvydas Macijauskas Ramūnas Šiškauskas
    SF : Simas Jasaitis
    PF : Darius Songaila Kšyštofas Lavrinovičius
    C : Darjušas Lavrinovičius
    Simas Jasaitis, but no Arturas Karnisovas? I'm so confused... I would actually remove Jasaitis entirely, move Stombergas to the bench and make Karnisovas a starter. That dude was a beast.

  15. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by omgsomuchpotential View Post
    Simas Jasaitis, but no Arturas Karnisovas? I'm so confused... I would actually remove Jasaitis entirely, move Stombergas to the bench and make Karnisovas a starter. That dude was a beast.
    Surely wondering between Marčiulionis and Macijauskas just conforms the guy must be very young and most likely hasn't even seen any game of Marčiulionis live Štombergas never were at Šiškauskas' level - Šiškauskas was No.1 option at Euroleague's champs CSKA with his MVP season. Štombergas never was even close to that, though I surely agree he's third best Lithuanian SF in NT history. To include Jasaitis to the team and to cut Karnišovas - probably that were the bottom line where I basically had to ignore the poster, but I just came here with an idea that Mačiulis already passed Jasaitis when we talk about honourable players to mention. His contribution in 2010 bronze, 2012 Olympic qualification, 2013 silver (magnificent), 2014 4th place (very important) make me think Mačiulis stands as the 4th best small forward in Lithuanian basketball history now.
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  16. #36
    Senior Member sashikas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    Štombergas never were at Šiškauskas' level - Šiškauskas was No.1 option at Euroleague's champs CSKA with his MVP season. Štombergas never was even close to that, though I surely agree he's third best Lithuanian SF in NT history.
    Cannot completely agree with that. Štombergas was at similar level during Žalgiris' golden years 1997/98 and 1998/99. Also he was at the same level in Tau Ceramica 2000/01.

  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by sashikas View Post
    Cannot completely agree with that. Štombergas was at similar level during Žalgiris' golden years 1997/98 and 1998/99. Also he was at the same level in Tau Ceramica 2000/01.
    I see what you mean. I was thinking about it. The season when Zalgiris won Euroleague was amazing for Stombergas and I think it's his strongest season, maybe competing with Tau Ceramica 2000/1 season (1997/98 was Saporta cup or whatever it was called back than, similar to Eurocup, second tier league in Europe so it doesn't qualify in my view). But the thing is that Stombergas was only one of the leaders (along Bowie and Edney) and arguably T. Edney was the real leader (final 4 MVP) and motor of that team.

    While Siskauskas was de facto MVP of final 4 2007 (Champs team) and MVP of Euroleague 2008 (Champs team) while really rocking in the knock-out stage for CSKA and being No1 option in the clutch. That's the difference, IMO.
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  18. #38
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by omgsomuchpotential View Post
    Simas Jasaitis, but no Arturas Karnisovas? I'm so confused... I would actually remove Jasaitis entirely, move Stombergas to the bench and make Karnisovas a starter. That dude was a beast.
    I agree. There's no way Simas Jasaitis should be on the team instead of Artūras Karnišovas. the all-time leader in points scored for the Lithuanian team:

    Lithuanian Basketball Team - Wikipedia

    It's also a pity that there's no place on the team for Rimas Kurtinaitis.


  19. #39
    Moderator Mindozas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    Surely wondering between Marčiulionis and Macijauskas just conforms the guy must be very young and most likely hasn't even seen any game of Marčiulionis live Štombergas never were at Šiškauskas' level - Šiškauskas was No.1 option at Euroleague's champs CSKA with his MVP season. Štombergas never was even close to that, though I surely agree he's third best Lithuanian SF in NT history. To include Jasaitis to the team and to cut Karnišovas - probably that were the bottom line where I basically had to ignore the poster, but I just came here with an idea that Mačiulis already passed Jasaitis when we talk about honourable players to mention. His contribution in 2010 bronze, 2012 Olympic qualification, 2013 silver (magnificent), 2014 4th place (very important) make me think Mačiulis stands as the 4th best small forward in Lithuanian basketball history now.
    If we are still talking about 1992 and onwards (like in the beginning of the thread), then maybe yes, it might be Maciulis...or M.Zukauskas, only then Jasaitis

    Regarding Siska vs Stomba, IMO Siska was better in his prime, but I wouldn't say that Stomba was "not even close" to him


  20. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mindozas View Post
    Regarding Siska vs Stomba, IMO Siska was better in his prime, but I wouldn't say that Stomba was "not even close" to him
    Yeah, that was too harsh words surely! Just got exited while trying to put my argument out of the pocket.
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