View Poll Results: The finalist is gonna be?

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  • Lithuania

    27 71.05%
  • Croatia

    11 28.95%
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Thread: [Semifinals] Game 86/A: Lithuania - Croatia

  1. #121
    Senior Member auris1's Avatar
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    I wish i had something better to do with my life instead of reading /answering in this forum.But I don't.I am like a cat on the heat,in need to rub my crotch on everything regarding basketball,just because it is "this time "of the year.
    yet..I do not care enough to bother myself with some people and them stupid comments.
    To make things clear i will have the list people i ignore as my signature

  2. #122
    Senior Member Dr. Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Martin View Post
    Hahaha I agree

    50/50 chances, if Bogdanovic is on fire shooting from the ''parking lot'' like Taletovic did then CRO will be in the finals.. if not ...
    Bogdanovic was 0/5 for 3pts and CRO Team was 3/20... so thats the only reason why they lost the game.

    Valanciunas 20min -7
    Javtokas 12min +16

  3. #123
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baelor View Post
    that was really gooood ! Without a second thought. Yeah, some soviets came to them and told them - do you want to play for the currently non-existent country we occupied and be sent to Siberia, or..... Ussr? And of course the answer was without a second thought jesus....
    Corrected for accuracy.

    Last edited by Hepcat; 09-21-2013 at 04:33 AM.

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    Corrected for accuracy.
    Why oh why Lithuanians do like so much to bring all the kinds of their troubled history and close-minded Russophobia over any board no matter what the topic? Even Greeks and Turks when insulting one another over those internets don't recall the massacres their forefathers commited against each other at every suitable and non-suitable occasion. I don't know how many Lithuanian Interbasket users have their direct ancestors perished 'in Siberia' but my great-grandfather (who was Russian) died in one of prison camps after 14 years of detention, serving his sentence for 'counter-revolutionary acitivity' despite being communist through and through. But that's all irrelevant to basketball matters and you're constantly bringing it up. It seems that you were hurt by the fact that till USSR's disintegration your small country had formal independence only for some 20 years in more than a 500 years span (and for a bigger part of those 20 years Lithuania was a quasi-fascist state ruled by a dictator whose surname translates like 'sour cream' from Russian to add a flair of mysteriousness). It's not a very unique case as almost any small European country (likes of Portugal or Denmark are exceptions but they aren't too numerous) wasn't independent - especially if we consider much of the XVIIIth, XIXth and even XXth century. In an 'imperial age' it was a pretty logical hystorical reality.

    Ok, it's irrelevant. Believe what you want. Just try to back up your basketball opinions with some purely sportive arguments

  5. #125
    Senior Member Darknemo2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrorizer View Post
    Why oh why Lithuanians do like so much to bring all the kinds of their troubled history and close-minded Russophobia over any board no matter what the topic? Even Greeks and Turks when insulting one another over those internets don't recall the massacres their forefathers commited against each other at every suitable and non-suitable occasion. I don't know how many Lithuanian Interbasket users have their direct ancestors perished 'in Siberia' but my great-grandfather (who was Russian) died in one of prison camps after 14 years of detention, serving his sentence for 'counter-revolutionary acitivity' despite being communist through and through. But that's all irrelevant to basketball matters and you're constantly bringing it up. It seems that you were hurt by the fact that till USSR's disintegration your small country had formal independence only for some 20 years in more than a 500 years span (and for a bigger part of those 20 years Lithuania was a quasi-fascist state ruled by a dictator whose surname translates like 'sour cream' from Russian to add a flair of mysteriousness). It's not a very unique case as almost any small European country (likes of Portugal or Denmark are exceptions but they aren't too numerous) wasn't independent - especially if we consider much of the XVIIIth, XIXth and even XXth century. In an 'imperial age' it was a pretty logical hystorical reality.

    Ok, it's irrelevant. Believe what you want. Just try to back up your basketball opinions with some purely sportive arguments
    Well you your family do not have to perish to really hate russians. For example my Grandfather spend 12 years in prison and my grandmother - 10. Neither perished, but it's enough for me to not have any warmer feelings towards Russia at all.

  6. #126
    Senior Member Darknemo2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Martin View Post
    Bogdanovic was 0/5 for 3pts and CRO Team was 3/20... so thats the only reason why they lost the game.

    Valanciunas 20min -7
    Javtokas 12min +16
    +/- Is deceptive stat. It would seem like Valanciunas did not have a good day again, but he was more imposing than Javtokas on defence, just that when Javtokas was on court Maciulis had his little shooting exhibition which increased everyones +/- rating quite a bit.

  7. #127
    Senior Member madmax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
    Well you your family do not have to perish to really hate russians. For example my Grandfather spend 12 years in prison and my grandmother - 10. Neither perished, but it's enough for me to not have any warmer feelings towards Russia at all.
    you do know that the guy most responsible for all those atrocities was not even russian, correct? So why are you blaming russian people again? Just because one mad schisophrenic georgian decided to "unite" half of Europe in the last century?

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by madmax View Post
    look, I'm all for patriotic feelings and the sense of entitlement, but...this Lithuania team isn't even playing up it's best potential and yet they are trashing another european powerhouse in Croatia without much fuss to begin with. Like Terrorizer said, it's like witnessing Prokom team playing in Euroleague F4. In other words - LAME
    You are overdoing it guys,wtf,the level of basketball played is very nice,well at the beginning of the tournament some teams and players were way out of shape and played scaryingly bad,but as the tournament progressed,the quality continiously became better and better,in this game it's true that Croatian team fell apart soon after the beginning of the second half,they completely lost the clear mind and given up,but this was because of the great performance in defence and fast tempo of the Lithuanian team.And the 1st half of the game was fantastic by both team with many beautiful plays!

  9. #129
    Senior Member Dr. Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
    +/- Is deceptive stat. It would seem like Valanciunas did not have a good day again, but he was more imposing than Javtokas on defence, just that when Javtokas was on court Maciulis had his little shooting exhibition which increased everyones +/- rating quite a bit.

    Stats can lie, but not this time. Only Valanciunas (-7) and Motiejunas (-9) have negative -/+ . It wasnt only Maciulis that had shooting exibition Kleiza score 22pts (+24) and Kalnietis 18pts (+15).

  10. #130

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    Terrorizer, you do make an interesting point about individual players' abilities of our current NT and you may as well be right, but:

    1) I kinda enjoyed this Eurobasket, even if it happens to be the weakest shit ever. Too bad you didn't.
    2) Can you REALLY judge the "strength" of a tournament based on what players play in it? I mean, on one level, sure you can. But your same arguments could be applied to Lithuanian NT in the 2010 World champ, so I'd guess it was a weak-ass championship also? Actually, come to think of it, Eurobasket 2001 was just not of this world, because Lithuanian NT, composed of what we could call "superstars" who almost beat Team USA in the Olympics, was crushed. Or maybe, juuuuust maybe, it's the team that plays in any championship and not the players.

    I mean, sure you can judge the strength and the lameness of a championship and, as I've said, you make some interesting points, but in the end - why do that? It just does not look like you are enjoying yourself and that kind of beats the purpose of watching basketball (same applies to madmax, who is, more likely, crazymax!)

    Anyway, I want to thank all of you guys who commented on these boards and especially in the Lithuanian NT threads (since I mostly follow em, not because other NT fans are not as much deserving). Every year I come back here and every year I am not disappointed. Hepcat, that story was BEAUTIFUL, thanks man! I kind even love madmax, even if it's love based on hateful familiarity on what he will say on any given day. Let's get gold! (Or maybe silver, but only if it's a good fight.)

  11. #131
    Senior Member macleopard13's Avatar
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    I was reading the argument extending from the last page, and I'll just say my opinions.

    madmax, if another player does better than your favorite player, just acknowledge it. Everyone has good and bad days, and anyways, the most important thing is the win, not how an individual player performs. I wasn't a fan of Darjus Lavrinovic because he was doing poorly in EB 2009, and in his clubs. He was slow on defense, inconsistent on offense, and a bad decision maker, I thought. He proved me wrong in this tournament - he is a threat inside (and even outside), he is somewhat mobile and plays moderate defense. He played well against stronger teams like Serbia, Italy and Macedonia. He stepped up when Valanciunas couldn't. So I guess he's still a decent player. Valanciunas really hasn't used all of his potential in this tournament. I hope he will in some other tournament.

    Vitas Gerulaitis topic: wow, how patriotic is it to give your child a middle name of "Kevin"? Thumbs down for that.

    In his interview, Kazlauskas hinted that he may not come back to coach Lithuania for the 2014 WC in Spain. If Kazlauskas leaves, then we'll have to choose from Pacesas and Kurtinaitis. I don't know which one is better suited for the team, though.

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by madmax View Post
    you do know that the guy most responsible for all those atrocities was not even russian, correct? So why are you blaming russian people again? Just because one mad schisophrenic georgian decided to "unite" half of Europe in the last century?
    I didn't know that one mad georgian personally came and arrested more than 20 million people?
    Oh wait, the rest were "just following orders"? I think I've heard that one before... didn't know it's a valid excuse...

  13. #133
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrorizer View Post
    Why oh why Lithuanians do like so much to bring all the kinds of their troubled history and close-minded Russophobia over any board no matter what the topic?
    I didn't bring up the subject, nor were most of us even eager to bring up the subject. You and Madmax brought up the subject by raising the question of the flags under which hyphenated-Lithuanians and unhyphenated Lithuanians have competed:

    Quote Originally Posted by madmax View Post
    for all the lithuanian roots that late Vitas had, he still felt american in heart and played for the USA colors.... So he was about as lithuanian as Pete Sampras was greek I guess
    Quote Originally Posted by Terrorizer View Post
    And, yessuz, Sabonis, Paulauskas, Marciulonis and many others played for USSR NT without much of the second thought. Are they subhuman traitors after that?
    And the reason most Lithuanians are happy to embrace Gerulaitis and whatever other hyphenated-Lithuanian as their own is because the population of Lithuania is only 3MM, and there are only a few hundred thousand more hyphenated-Lithuanians in places such as North America and Australia. Lithuanians just don't have a population of tens of millions from which to harvest heroes, so that they have to grasp at whoever is convenient.

    Last edited by Hepcat; 09-21-2013 at 04:45 PM.

  14. #134
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
    +/- Is deceptive stat. It would seem like Valanciunas did not have a good day again, but he was more imposing than Javtokas on defence....
    I agree. I don't think the five blocks that Jonas Valančiūnas had yesterday were adequately reflected in the +/- or efficiency stats. They were big time demoralizing plays for the Croats.

    If I were Kazlauskas, I'd start either Valančiūnas or Robertas Javtokas tomorrow with whoever doesn't start being my first alternate at the five position. And if either of these fellows falters out there on the floor, I wouldn't hesitate to bring in Darjuš in his place.

    Last edited by Hepcat; 09-21-2013 at 04:43 PM.

  15. #135
    Senior Member Ashtrusis_dantis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrorizer View Post
    Why oh why Lithuanians do like so much to bring all the kinds of their troubled history and close-minded Russophobia over any board no matter what the topic? Even Greeks and Turks when insulting one another over those internets don't recall the massacres their forefathers commited against each other at every suitable and non-suitable occasion. I don't know how many Lithuanian Interbasket users have their direct ancestors perished 'in Siberia' but my great-grandfather (who was Russian) died in one of prison camps after 14 years of detention, serving his sentence for 'counter-revolutionary acitivity' despite being communist through and through. But that's all irrelevant to basketball matters and you're constantly bringing it up. It seems that you were hurt by the fact that till USSR's disintegration your small country had formal independence only for some 20 years in more than a 500 years span (and for a bigger part of those 20 years Lithuania was a quasi-fascist state ruled by a dictator whose surname translates like 'sour cream' from Russian to add a flair of mysteriousness). It's not a very unique case as almost any small European country (likes of Portugal or Denmark are exceptions but they aren't too numerous) wasn't independent - especially if we consider much of the XVIIIth, XIXth and even XXth century. In an 'imperial age' it was a pretty logical hystorical reality.

    Ok, it's irrelevant. Believe what you want. Just try to back up your basketball opinions with some purely sportive arguments
    You are most funny demagogue (in couple with madmax) on this forum. You provoke such an answers yourself and after that start to screem "look how bad they are"... Imbisil, for the begining learn history - more when 10 percent of Lithuanians were killed, or imprisoned, or sent to Siberia, there is no lithuanians who's one of reletives was not send to Siberia, sister of my grandfather was sent to Siberia and lost her health in there, she wasn't able to walk for last 30 years of her life... I remember it very well, so go fuck yourself you rightenous ashole. But no matter what i you need a very strong glases to see some russofobia here. Maybye you would be so nice and would show us some examples of it?
    And yes, "quasi-fascist state ruled by a dictator whose surname translates like 'sour cream' from Russian", don't show yourself full idiot, ups you already did. "Quasi-fascist" in compare with what? Soviet Union? Yes Smetona was a dictator like almost in all european counties of that time, "Quasi-fascistic" - in your dreams uneducated imbisil.

  16. #136
    Senior Member Ashtrusis_dantis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrorizer View Post
    Look at Lithuanian roster - yes, it's close to the best you can get by now, but I think that it's just an indication of the painful process of generations change when your very talented mid- to late- 70s born generation is leaving shoes too big to fill for your current NT players. So this roster has 2 players from NBA (and D-Mo ain't exactly successful over the pond) and among other ten players only Jonas Maciulis plays a valuable role for the top European team with Pocius being non-factor for Madrid and he's on the move from Spanish capital to much less posh Kaunas simply because he ain't good enough for a European powerhouse (just like Seibutis and Gecevicius weren't good enough for Oly). And let's compare it with something like EB-2007. Back then Lithuania had 9 European-based players and let's look where did they came from: fresh from EL triumph with Pao of which he was an important part of Siskauskas represented CSKA, K. Lavrinovic and Kaukenas represented Siena (EL FF caliber team at the time) and Jasaitis was moving from MTA to TAU (D. Lavrinovic's UNICS was also a power to reckon with). First three were among the leading players for European super-clubs. Lithuania of 2007 was lucky to get bronze and, by the way, they eliminated the same Croatia in QFs with +2 difference (which was also better back in the day despite being coached by hysterical idiot Repesa) while now much weakened Lithuania of 2013 will play in finals. If this is not a sign of crap tournament, then I don't know what else would be. It was my intention to choose examples from your own teams of the recent past to show you the fact that current Lith and Cro are very average teams.

    Lithuania will play in EB's finals for the first time since 2003 (and maybe with the same opponent). But who's a heir to Saras in this team? Kanietis, right? Who's a heir to Macas in this team? Seibutis, right? Even Maciulis (a player of the type I like very nuch) fails to fill Saulius' shoes.
    Wow, what a strikes of stupid troll, tell me, what Lithuanian roster is stornger - this one or the one wich become 3'rd in WC2010?

    Or some addition to bullshit about roster - who plays where, who is a roll player and other bla bla. her are 2 rosters OG2000 and EC2013 and teams where players played at that time:

    Lithuania OG2000:
    Saulius Stombergas – Kinder Bologna
    Mindaugas Timinskas – Zalgiris
    Eurelijus Zukauskas – Zalgiris
    Darius Maskoliunas – Prokom Trefl
    Ramunas Siskauskas – Lietuvos Rytas
    Darius Songaila – Wake Forest university
    Sarunas Jasikevicius – Union Olimpia
    Kestutis Marciulionis – University of Delavare
    Tomas Masiulis – Zalgiris
    Dainius Adomaitis – Anwil Wloclawek
    Gintaras Einikis – CSKA
    Andrius Giedraitis – Lietuvos Rytas

    No NBA players, 2 students, 2 players from polish league (!!!), 5 from Lithuanian clubs and only 2 from top european teams... 3 in the world, almost beat americans...

    Lithuania EC2013:
    Mantas KALNIETIS Krasnodaro „Lokomotiv-Kuban“ (Rusija)
    Tomas DELININKAITIS Čerkasų „Mavpy“ (Ukraina)
    Renaldas SEIBUTIS Vilniaus „Lietuvos rytas“
    Martynas POCIUS Madrido „Real“ (Ispanija)
    Jonas MAČIULIS Atėnų „Panathinaikos“ (Graikija)
    Mindaugas KUZMINSKAS Kauno „Žalgiris“
    Linas KLEIZA Toronto „Raptors“ (Kanada)
    Kšištofas LAVRINOVIČIUS Kauno „Žalgiris“
    Darjušas LAVRINOVIČIUS Kauno „Žalgiris“
    Donatas MOTIEJŪNAS Hjustono „Rockets“ (JAV)
    Jonas VALANČIŪNAS Toronto „Raptors“ (Kanada)
    Robertas JAVTOKAS Kauno „Žalgiris“

    Maybye you want to compare this roster with Lithuanian roster in EC2009, wich was a disaster for us?
    You know nothing about basketball and lost a good time to keep silece.
    Last edited by Ashtrusis_dantis; 09-21-2013 at 05:02 PM.

  17. #137
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrorizer View Post
    Look at Lithuanian roster - yes, it's close to the best you can get by now, but I think that it's just an indication of the painful process of generations change when your very talented mid- to late- 70s born generation is leaving shoes too big to fill for your current NT players. So this roster has 2 players from NBA (and D-Mo ain't exactly successful over the pond) and among other ten players only Jonas Maciulis plays a valuable role for the top European team with Pocius being non-factor for Madrid and he's on the move from Spanish capital to much less posh Kaunas simply because he ain't good enough for a European powerhouse (just like Seibutis and Gecevicius weren't good enough for Oly). And let's compare it with something like EB-2007. Back then Lithuania had 9 European-based players and let's look where did they came from: fresh from EL triumph with Pao of which he was an important part of Siskauskas represented CSKA, K. Lavrinovic and Kaukenas represented Siena (EL FF caliber team at the time) and Jasaitis was moving from MTA to TAU (D. Lavrinovic's UNICS was also a power to reckon with). First three were among the leading players for European super-clubs. Lithuania of 2007 was lucky to get bronze....
    You're overlooking the fact, yes fact, that teams are not just a sum of their parts. A team should be a whole that is greater than the sum of its parts. And Lithuanian national team coaches over the years have been remarkably good at building such teams from whatever building blocks happen to be available each year.

    For example, I very clearly remember the byline for Team Lithuania in a preview article that either Time or Sports Illustrated ran in 2000 previewing the Sydney Olympics basketball competition. It was "How the mighty have fallen!" Well it turned out that the mighty had not fallen at all, and now several of the players on that team, e.g. Jasikevičius, Songaila, Štombergas, Šiškauskas, have joined the pantheon of Lithuanian basketball legends. And I have no doubt that this current generation of players will harvest at least its share of medals over the next ten years and that some of them will be part of Lithuania's pantheon of basketball legends in twenty.

    The proof of the pudding is not on paper; it's on the court. And so far this team has delivered.


  18. #138
    Senior Member Darknemo2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Martin View Post
    Stats can lie, but not this time. Only Valanciunas (-7) and Motiejunas (-9) have negative -/+ . It wasnt only Maciulis that had shooting exibition Kleiza score 22pts (+24) and Kalnietis 18pts (+15).
    Valanciunas had great impact on our defense. His blocks hit Croats very hard, so hard that even when Valanciunas went to the bench they kept on shooting those high-arched twos in the post. If not of that big block party that Val had at the end of the second quarter I don't think we would have had that third quarter run because ever since Croats stopped feeling comfortable with their inside shots.

  19. #139
    Senior Member macleopard13's Avatar
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    Lithuania will play in EB's finals for the first time since 2003 (and maybe with the same opponent). But who's a heir to Saras in this team? Kanietis, right? Who's a heir to Macas in this team? Seibutis, right? Even Maciulis (a player of the type I like very nuch) fails to fill Saulius' shoes.
    Let's be honest: our team isn't very talented. We don't know how to play intelligent basketball anymore, we can't hit miracle shots, and we don't have a stellar passing culture. But we are an athletic, hard-working team that plays excellent defense, and this has been working for us so far.

  20. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by septynix View Post
    Terrorizer, you do make an interesting point about individual players' abilities of our current NT and you may as well be right, but:

    1) I kinda enjoyed this Eurobasket, even if it happens to be the weakest shit ever. Too bad you didn't.
    I also enjoyed some parts of it. But I think that potentially it could be much better. Just look at the play-offs. Even if, for example, EB-2011 in Lithuania also lacked games with outcome decided on the last minute (aside from LTU-MKD QF), yet except Spain no team won against their opponent with the points difference more than +10. And here we have only Spain-France semis and, to a lesser extent, Lithuania-Italy quarterfinals game being able to revive true magic of Eurobasket's play-offs. Some teams were suffering from heavy burden of absences but some others just didn't look like their normal selves in Slovenia. I think it's just a chain of unlucky coincidences and bad chemistry+coaching in many powerhouses camps. 'Small' teams like Finland or Belgium actually deserved respect, it were giants who underperformed on a massive scale.

    Quote Originally Posted by septynix View Post
    2) Can you REALLY judge the "strength" of a tournament based on what players play in it? I mean, on one level, sure you can. But your same arguments could be applied to Lithuanian NT in the 2010 World champ, so I'd guess it was a weak-ass championship also? Actually, come to think of it, Eurobasket 2001 was just not of this world, because Lithuanian NT, composed of what we could call "superstars" who almost beat Team USA in the Olympics, was crushed. Or maybe, juuuuust maybe, it's the team that plays in any championship and not the players.
    I completely agree with you on almost anything you've said here, especially the part which I bolded. Yet I do see 2010 WC as a semi-'weak-ass championship' also. Most of heavyweights (Greece, France, Spain, Russia, Argentina) were underperforming, the level of competition was very uneven and seeing a team as limited as Turkey in finals was no fun either. After one of my favourite all-world international basketball tournaments which was WC-2006 (Russia didn't even participated in it, mind it) it was a huge letdown for me. Considering Lithuanian NT, I've noticed that it always fares better when it is some kind of underdog. Nobody really saw Lithuanian NT, undergoing major generations change, as a power to reckon with before Sydney Olympics, yet it proved to be the most bright positive surprise of the tournament. Just a year after, these guys were going to Turkey as some kind of favourites and the same players who ere seen as almost useless were viewed as major stars, which was helped by the fact that many of them changed Lithuanian (or even Polish) championship for some Spanish/Italian powerhouses - and they failed massively. In the next Eurobasket expectations were mixed, yes, for sure Lithuania had a good quality in its ranks but most didn't view Lithuania as one of the top favourites to win it all (or even a favourite to finish on podium) - and you did just that. Traditionally successful for Lithuania Olympics aside, the next time your NT were achieveing something really great was in 2010 when many (myself included) weren't predicting even a spot in QFs for Lithuania.

    Quote Originally Posted by septynix View Post
    I mean, sure you can judge the strength and the lameness of a championship and, as I've said, you make some interesting points, but in the end - why do that? It just does not look like you are enjoying yourself and that kind of beats the purpose of watching basketball (same applies to madmax, who is, more likely, crazymax!)
    Ok, maybe, you have a point. If championship goes not the way I like it (both quality-wise and considering how good are the teams, which I've considered favourites, playing) I kinda start to view it all too rationally, not being able to just dive in that exciting world of this game, thinking something like 'Oh, it could be so much better' instead. Before this championship I was sure that Spain and Greece are the teams with best chances for medals, France can be shaky but its potential is also very high, Italy and Russia are huge guesses but could offer some very positive surprises in spite of all their absences, Germany very well could go into play-offs, Turkey will disintegrate and I also hoped for Macedonia once again shocking the world with collecting some favourites scalps. I was only right about Turkey's disintegration as, sans France (and before the play-offs they were a team really unpleasant to watch, to say the truth), any other team mentioned here disappointed on a major scale. So final results were really illogical and puzzling for me

    But even with all this taken into account, I still think that the real level of playing in far too many games of this Eurobasket wasn't that good as it was in some earlier ones. Very often it was too sloppy, especially in offense, and so many favourites struggled with game's organization and team chemistry.

    Still, septynix, I want to thank you so much for your polite tone and the fact that you offered very deep and reasonable arguments, some of which I just wasn't even willing to refute because I think exactly the same You know, it's a pleasure for me to have such a kind of basketball discussion. And the fact that you're Lithuanian guy makes it even a more enjoyable option, as numerous Lithuanian users show extreme close-mindedness and bigotry on these boards and I would really hate to think that basketball fans from a country with such a rich basketball history and culture as Lietuva are aggressive boors with herd mentality and tendency to throw personal insults at will. You're just proving with your post that no matter what kind of linguistical or historical barriers separate us, we can find a common ground and unite in love for the beautiful game of basketball (and not only in it).

    hepcat, your last post in this thread is exactly what I mentioned earlier. Most of Lithuania's successes of 2000s and 2010s were achieved not due to the fact it was the most talented or spectacular or even super-intellectual with over-sophisticated offense (it wasn't either of these as even in 2003 there were multiple teams better than Lithuania 'on paper', yet Lietuva showed great passing game and had some 'lights-out' snipers in its ranks) but due to the thing that I can't say better than macleopard13:

    Quote Originally Posted by macleopard13 View Post
    Let's be honest: our team isn't very talented. We don't know how to play intelligent basketball anymore, we can't hit miracle shots, and we don't have a stellar passing culture. But we are an athletic, hard-working team that plays excellent defense, and this has been working for us so far.
    I only will add one aspect which I think is crucial. Recent versions of Lithuanian NT maybe aren't exactly examples of the most coachable teams in existence but they are much more coachable, unified and gutsy than most other European top NTs where battle of egoes rages on and stupidity mixed with 'primadonna mentality' often reigns supreme.

    P.S. I want even start to argue with ashtrusis-dansis as 'bazar bitching' isn't my cup of tea but I think that he's overstepping the line of decency here.
    'Imbisil', 'so go fuck yourself you rightenous ashole', 'don't show yourself full idiot, ups you already did', 'uneducated imbisil', 'Wow, what a strikes of stupid troll' - no matter, how sensitive are you and how my words were bitter for you, but I never lowered my discussion to this type of ugly personal insults and, hence, such a mean reaction can't be justified. I don't want to call on mods as this is for pussies and I don't want to behave like a 'stukach' but you're abasing not me but yourself with such posts. So, frankly, it's better to stop behaving like that on this international forum as you're really doing a massive disservice for the Lithuanian basketball fans (sub)culture. And your English is beyond terrible

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