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if usa invite all the talent into nt , can they win wc ?

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  • #31
    I think it's not about chemistry or talent. It's about playing styles, and for some reason NBA-succesful style and FIBA-succesful style are completely different (I guess the cause lies in some rules; like the NBA having a further 3P line, the illegal defense rule, the rebounding interference rule and NBA's "softer" refereeing). So, this is would I do if I were Colangelo:

    -Hire an American coach with long and recent or current FIBA experience, like Sam Vincent (Nigeria) or Paul Coughter (Lebanon). Not D'Antoni because his style has become too NBA-like.

    -Call several players with long and recent or current FIBA experience, priorizing those who don't absorb too much shooting on their teams and those who play for elite teams. My perfect example would be Anthony Parker, but there are many others. And have no doubt these guys would understand a lot better what it means to play for your NT.

    -Then add some NBA talent, priorizing those who could fit that FIBA style and team-oriented players. Battier was a good choice, and Brad Miller should have played much more.

    -And, at last, add one or two great scorers/shooters like Carmelo Anthony.

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    • #32
      They need Bruce Bowen, a lockdown defender. They need more defense. After watching US get smoked by Greece, it reminded me my in-house team. We couldnt play D, couldnt shoot and we lost 97-51. We cant rely on shooting or outplaying offense because the world is getting better on how to stop us and how to break us down defensively.
      My Blog: http://wwoib.blogspot.com/


      Statistics Wish List:
      1990 Asian Games -in Beijing, CHN
      1991 Pan Am Games -in Havana, CUB
      1991 South American Championships -in Valencia, VEN
      1991 Oceania Championship -in NZ
      1991 Asian Basketball Championship -in Kobe, JPN
      1992 African Basketball Championship -in Cairo, EGY
      1992 Euro Olympic Basketball Tournament -in Spain

      Comment


      • #33
        Why USA is losing
        -they carry to mani responsibility-winning, winning in class, entertaining(I mean every hall where USA is playing in PACKED-even against Senegal, Surinam or Albania)
        -They lost respect from RotW-heck when some 19 year old kid(Bellineli) is dunks and talks trash on USA team something is wrong.

        What to do:
        -Larry Bird-coach(international ref makes ticky-tacky call against USA, Bird shouts:hey ---- I'm Larry Bird and this isnt a friggn'foul. Next time-no call )
        -get some intimidators to put 19 year olds and euroleague 'stars' in place(elbows, hard fouls, undercuts on dunks and layups, etc)
        -Superstars must be hardned vets-Kobe, KG, TD, Shaq
        -more Detroit Pistons players
        -stop chucking 40 3 balls per game but get real shooters to break down zones in secs(Matt Carroll, Kaponovich, Ray Allen)

        Or select D-League All star team and let those guys to train whole year together and play them
        Last edited by Juan Carlos Nadal; 02-19-2007, 01:18 PM.
        47-70
        76-58

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        • #34
          I agree on D-League part. If NBA players dont want to represent, get players who really want to and show the true meaning of playing FOR YOUR COUNTRY, NOT YOUR OWN SELFISH SELF.
          My Blog: http://wwoib.blogspot.com/


          Statistics Wish List:
          1990 Asian Games -in Beijing, CHN
          1991 Pan Am Games -in Havana, CUB
          1991 South American Championships -in Valencia, VEN
          1991 Oceania Championship -in NZ
          1991 Asian Basketball Championship -in Kobe, JPN
          1992 African Basketball Championship -in Cairo, EGY
          1992 Euro Olympic Basketball Tournament -in Spain

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by usausa
            I agree on D-League part. If NBA players dont want to represent, get players who really want to and show the true meaning of playing FOR YOUR COUNTRY, NOT YOUR OWN SELFISH SELF.
            What do you mean? There are plenty of NBA players that want to rep the U.S.A. jersey and for the country. A hand few of stars doesn't make the whole leage.

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            • #36
              I don't think D-league teams or even all star would have any chance to be competitie against the top teams. the level is definately lower than the euroleague and you can't beat serious teams with that.

              the trouble is, US forgot how to play basketball to the extent their enormous talent advantage actually doesn't help.
              Originally posted by Jon_Koncak
              That's funny shit.I cant believe there are sports fans thinking like it.It's like Federer losing to random Japanese player in round 1 of French Open but tournament director stepping in and saying "hey it was a fluke win who wants to watch a random Japanese guy in next round,Federer qualifies"

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Matiz
                I don't think D-league teams or even all star would have any chance to be competitie against the top teams. the level is definately lower than the euroleague and you can't beat serious teams with that.
                True.

                Originally posted by Matiz
                the trouble is, US forgot how to play basketball to the extent their enormous talent advantage actually doesn't help.
                Bad coaching and developing of players.

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                • #38
                  The US have had almost every NBA superstar play in international competition in the last years. Besides Shaq and Kobe. Players like LeBron, Wade, Anthony, Howard, Bosh etc. dominate for their respective teams in the NBA.

                  I don't think bringing Kobe or Shaq in would change anything. I'd always say the leading NBA players are the best in the world making bad shots, but they're not capable enough creating good looks. I mean, if you can make a 24ft fadeaway with 3 hands in your face four out of ten times, like Kobe does, thats impressive. But it isn't as effective as finding the cutter for an open layup eight out of ten times.
                  The US' bad pick and roll defence was decisive in the semis, and it's no coincidence. I see only one player in the NBA running the pick and roll as good as Euroleague playmakers like Prigioni do, thats Steve Nash. And no one in the league is able to defend that high Nash-Stoudamire/Diaw screen and roll. That is usually even more dangerous in international play, because of the ability to knock down the three. That's another difference to NBA play.

                  I don't think there is a short term solution. Perhaps, yes, some European coaches in the NBA could show how international ball is played. And I don't want to sound cynically. International basketball has been learning from the US for decades. Perhaps it's time now to give some knowledge back.

                  That doesn't mean the US can't win in Beijing. They're in the mix, and they have always been. 6th in 2002, 3rd in 2004, 3rd in 2006 - if you try to see it objectively, these are good results. Only 3,4 teams are that stable. It's just that a gold medal is all that counts in the US.
                  Last edited by robbe; 02-20-2007, 01:32 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Some thoughts.
                    USA wasn't prepared this summer to win the WC, because Coach K didn't know the names of the players of the other teams. And the system was completely wrong.
                    1. USA played small-ball, with Howard as a C, Anthony as a PF, many times 3 guards on the floor. We've seen in the Europe Live, that placing a big man in the paint is lethal for the European teams (Dalembert has destroyed CSKA). I think that Kaman and Ben Wallace must be in the NT.
                    2. They can't defend pick&roll. And they can't make adjustments in the tournament. They risked to lose against Italy, and they made the same errors against Greece. Greece is better than Italy, so they lost.
                    3. Bring shooters. In NBA there are some spectacular shooters off the screens. I think that Kapono can make 10 3-pt goals in a game if he exits from a Wallace screen, and he shoots.
                    4. Watch the ASGs. Some players (LBJ, Arenas, Anthony) are born for these games. You can't bring them in the FIBA competitions. You must make the team with Billups, Hamilton, Big Ben, Bowen, Stoudemire...players who want to win every game, and they don't want to play just for fun.
                    5. A coaching staff with Euro experience. D'Antoni, Blatt, why not an European coach that worked in USA (Ataman, Bauermann...)?

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      a wise statement robbe.

                      yeah i can see how stable the results are from your point of view i guess its in the american bloodline that we want to win and be very competitive. as we have a saying here "go big or go home" and i guess this is why we are so concerned about gold in a sport we dominated for a long time, for us to fall down a few notches, i guess it makes us bloody a bit but more so to be back on top.

                      "Perhaps it's time now to give some knowledge back."
                      yes definitely its a give and take relationship as I see it, and the fundamentals of basketball the US does need to re learn and realize what theyve lost a loooong time ago. we do need to adapt to intl basketball. see u guys in beijing.

                      im in beijing by the way. this place is rockin!

                      Originally posted by robbe
                      The US have had almost every NBA superstar play in international competition in the last years. Besides Shaq and Kobe. Players like LeBron, Wade, Anthony, Howard, Bosh etc. dominate for their respective teams in the NBA.

                      I don't think bringing Kobe or Shaq in would change anything. I'd always say the leading NBA players are the best in the world making bad shots, but they're not capable enough creating good looks. I mean, if you can make a 24ft fadeaway with 3 hands in your face four out of ten times, like Kobe does, thats impressive. But it isn't as effective as finding the cutter for an open layup eight out of ten times.
                      The US' bad pick and roll defence was decisive in the semis, and it's no coincidence. I see only one player in the NBA running the pick and roll as good as Euroleague playmakers like Prigioni do, thats Steve Nash. And no one in the league is able to defend that high Nash-Stoudamire/Diaw screen and roll. That is usually even more dangerous in international play, because of the ability to knock down the three. That's another difference to NBA play.

                      I don't think there is a short term solution. Perhaps, yes, some European coaches in the NBA could show how international ball is played. And I don't want to sound cynically. International basketball has been learning from the US for decades. Perhaps it's time now to give some knowledge back.

                      That doesn't mean the US can't win in Beijing. They're in the mix, and they have always been. 6th in 2002, 3rd in 2004, 3rd in 2006 - if you try to see it objectively, these are good results. Only 3,4 teams are that stable. It's just that a gold medal is all that counts in the US.
                      "A nationality that easily feels wronged is an insecure one, and one that will be difficult to progress."-Anonymous

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by SK rulez
                        5. A coaching staff with Euro experience. D'Antoni, Blatt, why not an European coach that worked in USA (Ataman, Bauermann...)?
                        Or maybe hiring an Euro coach for the NT, and letting him pick the players and train them, would be enough.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by BadMann
                          i have watched some match dream team i played in barcelona , i found in 1992 eurteam also throw a lot of 3 point , and play zone defence , deferent betweet now and 1992 is that they throw 3 point much accurate . the style between dti and dt7 is very similar , only different is the individial ability between dt1 and dt7 , so i doult if usa have all the talent like cobe and others , can they win the wc ?
                          First of all, there's no more dream team now.

                          They don't deserve to be called one. I would agree that it's more a case of the rest of the world improving than us deproving though.
                          Is basketball your life? Submit your basketball story

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Mightytoo
                            They don't deserve to be called one. I would agree that it's more a case of the rest of the world improving than us deproving though.
                            I agree. I watched some '92 games recently. Even in '92, the US had tough stretches where they were forced into a slow paced half court game. And they sometimes didn't look good there. But the opposition couldn't keep them at bay for 40 minutes (which Greece was able to do in 2006), as the US was superior in terms of athletic ability. They would only need two five-minutes-stretches, in which Magic, MJ, Sir Charles, Pippen would run the fastbreak and put 20 points between themselves and the opposition.

                            Now that doesn't mean it is only the opposition that has changed. The '92-team had such smart, experienced players like Magic and Bird as team leaders. Can't compare that to '06.

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                            • #44
                              I gotta question: Are Amare, Marion and Arenas still able to be on the team, even though they didnt play in the WBC06?
                              "...I got the hand that will rock your craddle / cream you like cheese spread you on my bagel..." - Shaq

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                              • #45
                                Of course USA can win the WC anytime. They always have the best chances to win the tournaments. Anybody saying NO is a moron.

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