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Thread: Mark Cuban on WC-"the NBA is making a huge mistake"

  1. #21
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    The rule difference really didnt seem to be teh problem in this tournament, did it? It didnt seem to be a problem at all...And dont give me this, "well the ref's changed the rules for team USA", i watched many teams pick up a pivit foot with no call, and didn't notice any blantant no calls for team USA.

  2. #22
    Senior Member mktackabery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kestas


    what federations: Olympic? ....maybe basketball (that would be plain absurd)?
    I seriously doubt Lithuania has ever recieved 10 mln USD from International Olympic Comitee just because we participate in the Games.

    am I hopelessly uneducated, or is Cuban writing complete bulls*it?
    well he certainly has been known to throw that around on many occasions.
    Michelle Tackabery
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  3. #23
    Senior Member kestas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bball1234
    If the NBA is not superior than let me ask you a question. Why do all of the internaitional superstars go to teh NBA?
    for various reasons. and not all of the best non-Americans play in NBA, not by a long mile. and plenty never will, actually.
    NBA is superior in some ways and worse in others, so this can not be generalised. if we look at the attendance, money involved, public interest and individual tallent then NBA is superior, but if we look at deffense, teamwork, coaching and passion, then major European leagues are superior, and so on..

  4. #24
    Senior Member EverGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kestas
    for various reasons. and not all of the best non-Americans play in NBA, not by a long mile. and plenty never will, actually.
    NBA is superior in some ways and worse in others, so this can not be generalised. if we look at the attendance, money involved, public interest and individual tallent then NBA is superior, but if we look at deffense, teamwork, coaching and passion, then major European leagues are superior, and so on..
    I completely agree with your post.

    When they started playing competive basketball in Europe, the only thing you could buy as a fan except for the match ticket (if there was one) was sunflower seeds. If you were lucky, someone might have been selling roasted chestnuts outside the stadium.
    Last edited by EverGreen; 09-06-2006 at 09:43 PM.
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  5. #25
    Senior Member mktackabery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen
    When they started playing competive basketball in Europe, the only thing you could buy as a fan except for the match ticket (if there was one) was sunflower seeds. If you were lucking someone might have been selling roasted chestnuts outside the stadium.
    hmmm, sunflower seeds and chestnuts. yuck. no barbecue and sweet tea?
    Michelle Tackabery
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  6. #26
    Senior Member Nikoo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mktackabery
    hmmm, sunflower seeds and chestnuts. yuck. no barbecue and sweet tea?
    sunflower seeds rules

    EverGreen was talking about the 80s or early 90s right now there are FastFood restaurants in the most Euroleague arenas.
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  7. #27
    Senior Member EverGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikoo
    sunflower seeds rules
    tsik, tsik, tsik, tsik

    Damn, must be a Balkan thing



    Quote Originally Posted by Nikoo
    EverGreen was talking about the 80s or early 90s right now there are FastFood restaurants in the most Euroleague arenas.
    Man, I tell you, I reme the time coca cola started being sold by vendors and it caused a stir! I want one and I want two shouted the fans
    Mi imamo svoga boga, on se zove Bodiroga.
    Demetrious "Primo Gavrorum Malleus" Diamantidis

    Thank you for all you have given me. 6*
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23Bxh4eYMxw

    Panathinaikos is not just a club. It's a religion.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtWbTZbfkI8

    When the OAKA foundations moved a couple metres
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KbFl2mO8E0

  8. #28
    Senior Member EverGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mktackabery
    hmmm, sunflower seeds and chestnuts. yuck. no barbecue and sweet tea?
    Buddy, it was all about the game. No one thought of eating there. That was the last thing on fans mind. The 1st was to shout as much as they could to help their team to victory and hey..if there was an opportunity to terrorise the visiting team..why not take it up?

    It was all about what Dejan is kissing in my avatar. The club above all.
    Mi imamo svoga boga, on se zove Bodiroga.
    Demetrious "Primo Gavrorum Malleus" Diamantidis

    Thank you for all you have given me. 6*
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23Bxh4eYMxw

    Panathinaikos is not just a club. It's a religion.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtWbTZbfkI8

    When the OAKA foundations moved a couple metres
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KbFl2mO8E0

  9. #29
    Senior Member mktackabery's Avatar
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    yes well in the NBA it is all about the beer, the dance team, the beer, the fireworks, the giveaways at time-outs, the beer, and oh look! did somebody just dunk?
    Michelle Tackabery
    Tackabery Chronicle
    Durham, NC, USA

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by EverGreen
    Buddy, it was all about the game. No one thought of eating there. That was the last thing on fans mind. The 1st was to shout as much as they could to help their team to victory and hey..if there was an opportunity to terrorise the visiting team..why not take it up?

    It was all about what Dejan is kissing in my avatar. The club above all.
    Bodiroga simply amazing player

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trener
    Bodiroga simply amazing player

  12. #32
    Senior Member EverGreen's Avatar
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    Mi imamo svoga boga, on se zove Bodiroga.
    Demetrious "Primo Gavrorum Malleus" Diamantidis

    Thank you for all you have given me. 6*
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23Bxh4eYMxw

    Panathinaikos is not just a club. It's a religion.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtWbTZbfkI8

    When the OAKA foundations moved a couple metres
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KbFl2mO8E0

  13. #33
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    Straight up, the best european players don't even play in the nba. A bunch sort of leak over every few years or so but 80% don't even play in the nba.

    zisis
    kakouzis
    papaloukis
    scola
    kambala
    diamantidis(this greek dude would shut kobe down, hell half of italy would shut kobe down, it's their roman attitude. they're dominant people that come from a great and powerful civilization. kobe only wishes he was italian)
    navarro
    galanda(torched team usa a few years ago. old now)
    k. lavriinovic(torched team usa for 20+)
    fernanadez
    chatzivretas
    reyes
    jimenez
    soragna(this guy would freakin own kobe as well)
    marconato(owned duncan a few years ago)
    sabonis came to the nba when he was aging and had ruined knees.

    i could go on and list 50 more players from my stat sheet that have effing housed u.s. players

    the u.s. is overrated. if all of the european teams put there best players together on one team, the u.s. would be losing by 30 ppg.

    dirk was an experiment. he hadn't proved anything in europe before he came to the nba. there are many average euro players that could come to the nba now and take it over like dirk. it just depends on the team they land on and the situation.

    euros come to nba for one thing these days and that is money. when that drys up, say goodbye to excitement and skill in u.s. bball.

  14. #34
    Senior Member Nemesis 11 (aka Sabas 11)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pecker
    Straight up, the best european players don't even play in the nba. A bunch sort of leak over every few years or so but 80% don't even play in the nba.

    zisis
    kakouzis
    papaloukis
    scola
    kambala
    diamantidis(this greek dude would shut kobe down, hell half of italy would shut kobe down, it's their roman attitude. they're dominant people that come from a great and powerful civilization. kobe only wishes he was italian)
    navarro
    galanda(torched team usa a few years ago. old now)
    k. lavriinovic(torched team usa for 20+)
    fernanadez
    chatzivretas
    reyes
    jimenez
    soragna(this guy would freakin own kobe as well)
    marconato(owned duncan a few years ago)
    sabonis came to the nba when he was aging and had ruined knees.

    i could go on and list 50 more players from my stat sheet that have effing housed u.s. players

    the u.s. is overrated. if all of the european teams put there best players together on one team, the u.s. would be losing by 30 ppg.

    dirk was an experiment. he hadn't proved anything in europe before he came to the nba. there are many average euro players that could come to the nba now and take it over like dirk. it just depends on the team they land on and the situation.

    euros come to nba for one thing these days and that is money. when that drys up, say goodbye to excitement and skill in u.s. bball.
    This post is not very realistic. Kobe is the best player in the game at the moment. The closest thing we got to Michael Jordan. No, he'll never be Jordan, he's not that smart/popular but you got to realise he's is the BEST offensive talent in the game PERIOD! Of course international game is different and he wouldn't dominate like that because of zone defenses and different style, but a player that can put the ball in the basket from any situation is always helpful to a team. The NBA remains the dream of most players in Europe too, some are realistic and know they are not NBA type players so they make their careers in Europe and that's fine. Some others like Dirk HAD to go because they were too talented not to go. They had to do it for themselves and for the game itself!

  15. #35
    Administrator stuart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pecker
    zisis
    kakouzis
    papaloukis
    scola
    kambala
    diamantidis(this greek dude would shut kobe down, hell half of italy would shut kobe down, it's their roman attitude. they're dominant people that come from a great and powerful civilization. kobe only wishes he was italian)
    navarro
    galanda(torched team usa a few years ago. old now)
    k. lavriinovic(torched team usa for 20+)
    fernanadez
    chatzivretas
    reyes
    jimenez
    soragna(this guy would freakin own kobe as well)
    marconato(owned duncan a few years ago)
    80%, really?

    I think anyone can come up with a list that counters this one not only in talent and ability, but in sheer numbers of Euro players that have attempted the NBA. I am almost certain I could match your list solely with players from the former-Yugoslavia -- Divac, Rakocevic, Milicic, Stojakovic, Krstic, Ilic, Drobjnak, Radmanovic, Planinic, Carbarkapa, Danilovic, Sakovic, Jaric, Pavlovic, Rebraca and I am sure I missing another 3-5. Again, these are just former-Yugoslav players...

    If I am not mistaken, Kambala tried out for a couple US teams and failed to make the grade, while Scola, Navarro, Zisis, and Fernandez are destined to try the NBA sometime. Whether they are successful is another question.

    Stuart

  16. #36
    Senior Member Nikoo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pecker
    zisis
    kakouzis
    papaloukis
    scola
    kambala
    diamantidis(this greek dude would shut kobe down, hell half of italy would shut kobe down, it's their roman attitude. they're dominant people that come from a great and powerful civilization. kobe only wishes he was italian)
    navarro
    galanda(torched team usa a few years ago. old now)
    k. lavriinovic(torched team usa for 20+)
    fernanadez
    chatzivretas
    reyes
    jimenez
    soragna(this guy would freakin own kobe as well)
    marconato(owned duncan a few years ago)
    sabonis came to the nba when he was aging and had ruined knees.
    Go and see your doctor. You need HELP
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  17. #37
    Senior Member Waneko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bball1234
    I truly do believe that if international rules were followed in the states, that the US would fair much better int hese tournaments. ,

    Another thing about this is that teh WC mean little to americans, most dont even really know that it went on unfortunantely. The olymipics are a bigger deal, but that shoudltn affect our winning.
    Interesting point. Let me ask you, if the NBA adopted international rules, would Lebron James and Dwayne Wade still be the superstars they are? Or would they become just "good" or average players? You have to consider that first before you make your assumption.

    You must believe:

    a)the same players will still be the superstars under a new system, or

    b) that a different group (or type) of players would end up representing the U.S. in the international tournaments. If you believe the latter, do you think the U.S. should still be the overwhelming favorite?

    If you believe the former, tell us how the current U.S. players will adapt to the new system. You will have to convince us that Lebron will plant himself and hit open three pointers all day.

  18. #38
    Senior Member Zalgirinis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waneko
    Interesting point. Let me ask you, if the NBA adopted international rules, would Lebron James and Dwayne Wade still be the superstars they are? Or would they become just "good" or average players? You have to consider that first before you make your assumption.
    Superstars and etc labels are created by NBA media. What I could say that LeBron or Wade would be 70-80% of what they are if "star-treatment" wasnt so favored by NBA refs there. What would change adoption of international rules if NBA refs would still call those unexesting fouls on every move of superstar or dont call travelling?

  19. #39
    Senior Member Waneko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zalgirinis
    Superstars and etc labels are created by NBA media. What I could say that LeBron or Wade would be 70-80% of what they are if "star-treatment" wasnt so favored by NBA refs there. What would change adoption of international rules if NBA refs would still call those unexesting fouls on every move of superstar or dont call travelling?
    Yes, when I was thinking about the NBA adopting the international game, I included changing how fouls are called (which is very different), but I left out the superstar preferential element of it. Americans need individual heros, as it goes along with the cultural norm of the importance of individual achievement being above all else. So obviously David Stern and Co. figured out that marketing the game with individuals instead of teams makes the people more interested.

    It works too. My wife, who knows little about the game, can recognize Lebron's face on television, but doesn't know the name of the any of the teams.

    Anyway, you're right, any change towards making the NBA more like the international game will have to include cracking down on the preferential treatment stars get from the refs, which has been going on for decades. I venture to say that they would lose a lot of fans that way. Not the real fans like the people who post here, but the fair weather fans who bring in a great chunk of the revenue for the league.

  20. #40
    Senior Member mktackabery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waneko
    Anyway, you're right, any change towards making the NBA more like the international game will have to include cracking down on the preferential treatment stars get from the refs, which has been going on for decades. I venture to say that they would lose a lot of fans that way. Not the real fans like the people who post here, but the fair weather fans who bring in a great chunk of the revenue for the league.
    I disagree strongly with this. NBA revenue mainly comes from national advertisers - sponsorships - television contracts; and most exposure for teams comes through television. Fair weather fans watch it on tv and don't have to even go to the arenas; even if they wanted to they couldn't afford it.

    The flattening of media in the U.S. means anyone with a basic cable subscription can see two to five NBA games during the regular season without trying hard at all. If you have an extended cable or satellite connection like I do, you can catch almost any team, even on the opposite coast, and if you want to spend even just a little more money, you can see all the teams on a subscription. For the cost of one night of NBA basketball, I could subscribe and see every single game, every single team, on my television. An NBA all access pass, or whatever it's called, goes for about $160, which is the cost of a first-tier ticket at the Charlotte Bobcats. I can drive two hours to see the Bobcats, but I have only done so when I had free tickets provided to me by the television stations on which our law firm advertises. And I like the Bobcats, more or less. I prefer watching college ball, but I'm ready to get on the bandwagon if Morrison pans out.

    Arena revenue comes from local businesses primarily which buy sky boxes and blocks of seats; ticket prices have to be extremely high to justify the cost of investment in the arenas the NBA wants; contracts are ridiculously large for players. Blaming all of this on individual play versus team play is short-sighted in my opinion. It's like the chicken and the egg argument. And I don't believe the refs show deferential treatment, either. It's simplistic to the extreme.
    Michelle Tackabery
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