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Thread: Tournament Debriefing: GREECE

  1. #41
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    the result (3rd place) is obviously good, no queston about that.
    Starting the tournament we were the second favourite and I stil believe we could have gotten 2nd place had we not been matched with the first favourite in the semis.

    Other than that, speaking objectively, this tourney (only THIS because of the rosters) was very balanced if you take out Spain. I mean, I see Greece, Slovenia, Serbia, Turkey all within 5% difference in power from each other. France and Croatia, Russia within 10% from the aforementioned ones. So any combination of those teams could have filled the top4 after Spain. The fact that we ended up third, seems good, as even though we could have finished 2nd, we could just as easily lost the quarter final and finished...5-6th.

    I am only disatisfied by the fact that we didnt have all our weapons to finally see a great semi against Spain in neutral territory with better refereeing. If we had a full roster I believe they would stil have the advantage, but the game would be much closer and agonizing til the end....and with slight overperforming on our part we could have even won. Unfortunately this eurobasket didn't offer me such an experience in any game. Many close games, sure....we beat turkey in OT and slovenia by 1point, but that means nothing when you see both teams performing badly. There was no truely epic game like the semi in Spain...despite other factors there, so despite the bronze medal this eurobasket won't be much memorable to me...already looking forward to the world championship...

  2. #42
    Junior Member A-A's Avatar
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    well i respect your opinion, but sorry i did not like the coaching of the team.

    very bad rotation of the team to the all tournament.

    it took klaza 15min to see that vs spain we had problem with spanoulis as PG!!!
    he did not use kalampokis, and kaimakoglou to try to change and control the rhythm of the game. i am not a coach, i am a fan (surely klaza knows much much more than me) but i was not satisfied.

    also i believe that greek team has good opportunities for 2010 even for a medal, but they have to focus a little more for possible games against spaniards. it is embarrassing for players like papaloukas, and zisis, and diamadidis and many others good players to lose from spanish for 6 times! nobody likes to lose especially when you are a top player. so they must be prepared as much as possible for them.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by FIBA Europe Basket View Post

    As for Pelekanos-Zisis-Perperoglou. Absolutely Pelekanos is much better than them. I believe he was not invited to the team because Kazlauskas does not know him.

    Basically, I expect a huge year from Pelekanos at Maroussi if he stays healthy and Kazlauskas will see his value. And unlike Giannakis I believe he would play him on the team instead of just bench him. Pelekanos is a really great player he's just never gotten a good chance with the right team and coach.

    But I do believe he will finally get a good chance at Maroussi and also he will play in the Euroleague or Eurocup and he should certainly be the star of that team. He is the exact kind of player that a coach like Kazluaskas could use. Yes, I think he is way better than Zisis and Perperoglou to be honest about it.

    Greece needs a dynamic swingman badly and definitely Pelekanos could fill that role.
    All the above are very clear when i recall his 2 years' performance in Real an Olympiakos

    Come on, he is player for small clubs and can't step up when level of competition rises up

    As far Spanoulis i agree. He is not Dirk guys to win Spain by himself. He needs 3D and Papaloukas along with him so as to focus only in scoring and not carrying the ball so much time

  4. #44

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    Skatoulis: the stupid confirmed to be a retarded guy. Despite the great performance against Turkey, he has shown he can't be a leader, he can't be a point-guard (pg has to use the brain, Skatty is brainless) and he can't be a shooting-guard too: he needs the full court to play, and he needs the ball in his hands. It means he's not a SG, it means he's a streetballer. Rucker Park Tournament happens in summer, it should be his perfect dimension. Away from the NT, even if he could be useful for 5-10 minutes in some games, to break it. Playing 11 or more minutes, he simply breaks balls.

    Zisis: good defence, smart player, but he's far from the wonderful Zizzo who played in AEK or Benetton. Hoping that a day Varejao will end his career with a serious injury, let's also Hope that the perfect system of Siena could help him. The Chianti Mafia allows everything to Montepaschi, so he should not be scared anymore. At least in the Italian league.

    Calathes: first time he plays at senior level. Unfortunately he had to watch Skatoulis from the bench but when he has been able to play, he has shown good skills and - most of all - interesting brain. What a pity he'll be 15th man at Pana...

    Kalampokis: honest player, who was in Poland for the absences of Diamantidis, Papaloukas and probably Papamakarios. It would be unfair to destroy him. This is simply not his level but he made his best.

    Perperoglou: when you play with Diamantidis, Jasikevicius, Pekovic, Batiste, if you're a true crap no-one see it. You can have space, because opponents will guard your team mates. If you're considered one of the most important player of the team, the truth appears. The worst SF that Greece had in the last 10 years. Yes, including Papanikolaou (Dimitris).

    Printezis: pure European material. Excellent, he will become an important cornerman. Or better, he's already an important cornerman.

    Fotsis: he has become a mature player, the role of captain probably has been useful for him. He has grabbed rebounds and scored points, playing farer from the basket than the last years. Since he's only 28, he has at least two international competititons to play in the future. And he has to be in.

    Kaimakoglou: few minutes, after his best season. Let's see if he will improve and he will deserve again a spot with the NT.

    Koufos: the biggest mistake of Kazlauskas, because even if he is not a pittbul, he has fantastic skills and a pure talent, that's something missing in the other players. When you've a player who can score 15 points every evening, he has to play.

    Mpourousis: a day he was good, the day after he was a ghost. I don't see anything different from the Oly's Mpourousis. Let's accept him, or should we look for another player? Since Mpourousis is really dominating when he is "in", I would put him in the national team for ever.

    Shortsanitis: he can be as dominating as Shaquille O'Neal, but he's main problem is always the brain. We'll he remain in a good shape or will he collapse becoming again a Jabba the Hutt? Probably he should be adopted by Kazlauskas, since he's the first coach with whom he has a decent behaviour.
    Of course, this Shortanitis has to play with the NT till the World Cup 2018, when he'll be 33...

    Glyniadakis: 3rd center, a true pro. This is his perfect role, if the NT will need three centers in the future, everyone knows his telephone number.

    About the future, it's clear that Greece is missing a shooting guard, but probably no-one cares about it, because even when Diamantopoulos or Lliadellis scored 30 points in the Greek league, they weren't even called by Petropoulos or Ioannidis or Giannakis. But someone is needed in this role: Pappas? Let's watch his season with Kolossos. Mpramos? Let's see how he will understand the European basketball.

    I hope not to see anymore Spanoulis playing 35 minutes (I can accept him playing 5, maximum 10): if he doesn't accept it, there are Sloukas and Pappas waiting for their turn. I also hope Perperoglou to spend long long summers sitting on his armchair. Papanikolaou and Jankovic are the future.
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  5. #45
    Senior Member Mysh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FIBA Europe Basket View Post
    Spanoulis was the second best player in the tournament. Just ignore these "Greek fans" comments on him. They are clearly personally biased and have some sort of personal agenda against him.

    As for Pelekanos-Zisis-Perperoglou. Absolutely Pelekanos is much better than them. I believe he was not invited to the team because Kazlauskas does not know him. And as far as not playing in Olympiacos, well see Teodosic for exhibit A on the greatness of Giannakis to evaluate his players.

    Basically, I expect a huge year from Pelekanos at Maroussi if he stays healthy and Kazlauskas will see his value. And unlike Giannakis I believe he would play him on the team instead of just bench him. Pelekanos is a really great player he's just never gotten a good chance with the right team and coach. He was playing in small clubs like Peristeri or he was getting benched by coaches that have strange ideas about players in Real and in Olympiacos.

    But I do believe he will finally get a good chance at Maroussi and also he will play in the Euroleague or Eurocup and he should certainly be the star of that team. He is the exact kind of player that a coach like Kazluaskas could use. Yes, I think he is way better than Zisis and Perperoglou to be honest about it. Although to be fair Zisis is better than Greeks say. He is a very skilled and smart player and his fundamentals are excellent. It's just that he developed into a player that has no position. He is not a combo guard, not really a point guard, and although he plays as a pure shooting guard and his skills are of a true shooting guard - and although he has a pure shot, sweet stroke and unlimited range, he has the most inconsistent jump shot ever. I would guess that what happened to him was the Messina simply ruined him by destroying his confidence. That's what happens if you choose to play for Messina. You either become much better or your confidence is destroyed.

    Greece needs a dynamic swingman badly and definitely Pelekanos could fill that role.
    Pelekanos is better on defence, but doesn't have the shoot Greece needs. If you look at the stats I posted, you will understand we need some good shooters.

    Pelekanos though, is very good and I am not saying ignore him.

    As for Spanoulis, I think he was our best man. Without him, we wouldn't have been here. No other player had to do so many things in the court, as V-Span had, and from no other player had we so many expectations... His only weakness is his passing in my opinion.

    As for Sofo, he was our second best player. Well done on him for fixing his FTs! He is almost our best man now. I am not saying the best, because he lacks some stamina. He can't play long and that's his main weak point now.
    Last edited by Mysh; 09-21-2009 at 05:16 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by ozziem View Post
    You really know basket well...
    Thanks ozziem.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisfiss View Post
    man i hate the greek media, we won a medal and it seems like nothing happened. oh actually sth did happen, zagorakis threatens to resign and oly prepares for the game against aek. yes these news are more important...
    I totally agree on that. For the same reason it is impossible for me to understand why most people in one of the greatest basketball nations in the world considers after 22 years of great basketball success, still football as Nr.1 sport...
    Peja come home

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by A-A View Post
    well i respect your opinion, but sorry i did not like the coaching of the team.

    very bad rotation of the team to the all tournament.

    it took klaza 15min to see that vs spain we had problem with spanoulis as PG!!!
    he did not use kalampokis, and kaimakoglou to try to change and control the rhythm of the game. i am not a coach, i am a fan (surely klaza knows much much more than me) but i was not satisfied.

    also i believe that greek team has good opportunities for 2010 even for a medal, but they have to focus a little more for possible games against spaniards. it is embarrassing for players like papaloukas, and zisis, and diamadidis and many others good players to lose from spanish for 6 times! nobody likes to lose especially when you are a top player. so they must be prepared as much as possible for them.

    You are absolutely right, as most people who know the game's basic's cannot understand why the hell Spanoulis continued to play pg when from the first games he averaged 5-6 to's.
    We could compensate that with teams of lower talent and quality players but never with exceptional teams like Spain who punished for every stupid TO.

    One explanation was that he needed space at the top of the arc for his penetrations but even that did not count after the game with Russia and the endless blocks he got. After this game we lost the most effective offensive weapon, i.e. Spanoulis' penetrations...

    As far as loosing to Spain, one can only admire the passion and intensity of the Spanish defense, which for me is the true reason of their victory. No other team played with such intensity and this is why the destroyed everybody from the qf to the final by 20-point margins. Respect and shamefull for the Greek NT.
    Peja come home

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mysh View Post
    Pelekanos is better on defence, but doesn't have the shoot Greece needs. If you look at the stats I posted, you will understand we need some good shooters.

    Pelekanos though, is very good and I am not saying ignore him.

    As for Spanoulis, I think he was our best man. Without him, we wouldn't have been here. No other player had to do so many things in the court, as V-Span had, and from no other player had we so many expectations... His only weakness is his passing in my opinion.

    As for Sofo, he was our second best player. Well done on him for fixing his FTs! He is almost our best man now. I am not saying the best, because he lacks some stamina. He can't play long and that's his main weak point now.
    Greece lacks freak athletes, big time finishers, and big time play makers. That is what Pelekanos brings. Freakish athletic ability, incredible dunking, and he makes huge plays on the defensive end. He is a dynamic player and that's what Greece is sorely lacking. Spanoulis is dynamic, Sofo is dynamic but none of their other players are. Printezis is more like guy that does dirty work. Diamantidis and Papaloukas and Vasilopoulos are great players but none of them are even in the slightest dynamic. Zisis is run of the mill, Bourousis and Fotsis are good but not dynamic either, etc.

    Pelekanos is dynamic. He makes big plays and things happen on the court just like Spanoulis and Sofo. There is no reason why he should not be utilized.

  9. #49
    Senior Member g.g's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FIBA Europe Basket View Post
    Greece lacks freak athletes, big time finishers, and big time play makers. That is what Pelekanos brings. Freakish athletic ability, incredible dunking, and he makes huge plays on the defensive end. He is a dynamic player and that's what Greece is sorely lacking. Spanoulis is dynamic, Sofo is dynamic but none of their other players are. Printezis is more like guy that does dirty work. Diamantidis and Papaloukas and Vasilopoulos are great players but none of them are even in the slightest dynamic. Zisis is run of the mill, Bourousis and Fotsis are good but not dynamic either, etc.

    Pelekanos is dynamic. He makes big plays and things happen on the court just like Spanoulis and Sofo. There is no reason why he should not be utilized.
    Are you talking about the Greek Pelekano? I mean he is good player but nothing extraordinary to date...he is very athletic but nothing more.
    I hope you may seeing the future on him but that is another story. Today Pelekanos is not NT material.
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  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by g.g View Post
    Are you talking about the Greek Pelekano? I mean he is good player but nothing extraordinary to date...he is very athletic but nothing more.
    I hope you may seeing the future on him but that is another story. Today Pelekanos is not NT material.
    Pelekanos is an athletic freak, a lock down defensive player, a great finisher at the rim with powerful dunks and he has perfect technical skills and techniques in offense. If he was let's say Lithuanian, Serbian, Spanish, American where they develop players better he would have been a very good NBA player years ago.

    Actually, from a pure basketball scouting standpoint he is an elite level talent. I believe Kazlauskas will use him, unlike how previous coaches don't. Kazlauskas does not know him. I predict a huge year for him at Maroussi though. Just wait.

  11. #51
    Senior Member fasoulaki's Avatar
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    Pelekanos was playing for the national team in 2007 & 2008. He got his chance to prove himself.

    I remember him stealing the ball in defense and then failing to finish the dunk properly. I remember quite well that this happened a lot of times in the tournament.

  12. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by FIBA Europe Basket View Post
    Pelekanos is an athletic freak, a lock down defensive player, a great finisher at the rim with powerful dunks and he has perfect technical skills and techniques in offense.
    I've read something similar some years ago.
    Ah, ok, now I can remember: it was the profile of Michael Jordan when a was a college player.
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  13. #53
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    when/why is suddenly Pelekanos a world-class player?

    So far, in all top-level teams he's played, he hasn't really starred.... For 2nd level teams, perhaps he is perfect but certainly not at top level.

    If Greece is looking for some quality players...just take a look at our Under-21 team.

    Papanikolaou, Pappas, Kaselakis (my personal favorite) as well as Sloukas and Bogris will be the next generation of Greek basketball and I hope we can see 2-3 of them already performing in Turkey next year.

    I also hope that we'll finally issue a Greek passport to Mike Batiste!

  14. #54
    Senior Member Mysh's Avatar
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    They stas is the best way to lie... In this case I think it's an inderesting tool.

    Stats chart of the Greek NT.





    Green = Very Good, Yellow = Good, Orange = Average, Red = Poor

    OR = Offensive Rebounds, DR = Defensive Rebounds, TR = Total Rebounds, AS = Assists, PF = Personal Fouls, TO = Turnovers, ST = Steals, BS = Blocked Shoots, Pts = Points

    Now I understand pretty much everything Kazlauskas did, other than why Koufos didn't play. He is only prone to turnovers, which is expectable for his age.

    As for Perperoglou he is clearly one of our best shooters in all 1pt, 2pt and 3pt shoots! Why doesn't he trust himself? He needs to be more confident and shoot more.

    Hope that helps!
    Last edited by Mysh; 09-22-2009 at 10:24 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by ozziem View Post
    You really know basket well...
    Thanks ozziem.

  15. #55
    Senior Member softice's Avatar
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    De Colo and Sofo.
    We have to give credits at those 2 players for this medal
    Last edited by softice; 09-22-2009 at 10:38 AM.
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