Star PGs don't bring the rings

[Johnny Garcia]

Year – Champion (Starting Point Guard - Franchise Player/s)
1991 – Chicago (John Paxson – Michael Jordan)
1992 - Chicago (John Paxson – Michael Jordan)
1993 - Chicago (John Paxson – Michael Jordan)
1994 – Houston (Sam Cassel – Hakeem Olajuwon)
1995 – Houston (Sam Cassel – Hakeem Olajuwon)
1996 – Chicago (John Paxson – Michael Jordan)
1997 – Chicago (John Paxson – Michael Jordan)
1998 – Chicago (Ron Harper– Michael Jordan)
1999 – San Antonio (Avery Johnson– David Robinson/Tim Duncan)
2000 – Los Angeles Lakers (Ron Harper – Shaquille Oneal)
2001 – Los Angeles Lakers (Derek Fisher – Shaquille Oneal/Kobe Bryant)
2002 – Los Angeles Lakers (Derek Fisher – Shaquille Oneal/Kobe Bryant)
2003 – San Antonio (Tony Parker – Tim Duncan)
2004 – Detroit Pistons (Chauncey Billups – Pistons!)
2005 – San Antonio (Tony Parker – Tim Duncan)
2006 – Miami (Jason Williams – Dwyane Wade)
2007 – San Antonio (Tony Parker – Tim Duncan)
2008 – Boston (Rajon Rondo – Big 3)
2009- Los Angeles Lakers (Derek Fisher – Kobe Bryant)
2010 – Los Angeles Lakers (Derek Fisher – Kobe Bryant)
2011 – Dallas (Jason Kidd – Dirk Nowitzki)
2012 – Miami (Mario Chalmers – LeBron James) or Oklahoma City (Russell Westbrook – Kevin Durant)

The last 22 NBA champions featured either “role players” as point guards and a franchise player NOT playing that position. Sure there are the likes of (borderline stars then) Tony Parker and Rajon Rondo but inarguably Tim Duncan and the Boston’s Big 3 was more important in those champion teams (thus the “franchise” tag)

My questions are these:

Is it safe (assuming of course you have a choice; because there are instances when a “franchise” PG falls into your lap in the draft) to say that a team is better off building a team NOT from a franchise/star point guard?

I provided not-so-in depth stats just what we see initially from that list but is there a stat that can tell us that having franchise/star point guards are due to fail because of the final make-up of your rotation? Say 50M salary cap; 20 percent to your “franchise player” and the rest for the support. Following that formula, it means that you spend less in other positions thus getting less-talented players from the SG-SF-PF-C spots?

Finally, should I be worried that I am a Los Angles Clippers fan? Well, we have the “franchise” tag on Chris Paul and the last 22 years pattern does not bode well for me.

(also posted at the Clips board and my blog: http://www.johnnybets.com/star-pgs-d...e-worried.html if this is OT here.)

[CKR13]

See Magic Johnson and the drought of a dynasty that was built around a point guard.

1980
1982
1985
1987
1988

While the case of Isiah Thomas and his Detroit Pistons is also viable.

Yes there has been a considerable drought of championship teams lead by a point guard that is defined as the franchise player. Closest thing to the Magic Johnson model was the failure of Jason Kidd and his New Jersey Nets in 2002 and 2003 where the West was just too strong for any eastern team. While there is Steve Nash and his high octaned offense with the Phoenix Suns. Sadly, the Suns did not had much like in the competitive western conference.

Chris Paul and his New Orleans Hornets in 2008 fizzled in the playoffs while the case of Deron Williams and his Utah Jazz can also be cited. The west was just too strong for the Hornets and the Jazz to hurdle over.

I still believe that you can build around a talented point guard for the championship, but there are a lot of contributing factors like team depth, opposition's arsenal and a lot more. Those things should be favorable in the right time and in the right place. In a lot of franchises dating back to the days of Lenny Wilkins, the team did not had the players to compete in the 60's with Boston and Minneapolis / Los Angeles around.

With Chris Paul, so long as his health and specifically his knees holding up, the Los Angeles Clippers should be fine. All they need now is to still continue adding players to compete as well as it will hinge pretty much on the development of Blake Griffin and DeAndre Jordan.

The West is changing as the Oklahoma City Thunder have emerged. In that scenario, the Clippers have a chance to compete. Chris Paul is a huge difference maker. His mastery of the tempo and playmaking is the catalysts of the team.

[NorCal]

Good topic. I think the culture and the rules of the NBA has always favored big men with the exception of one or perhaps 2 periods in the league's history. The 80s, it could be argued, favored a faster pace of basketball and thus you saw a dominant PG like Magic take 5 titles. Before and after that time until the last few years the NBA was largely dominated by big men and the NBA finals teams and especially the key player(s) on those teams for the most part proved that (with Michael Jordan being the one consistent outlier in this long stretch).

Since 2004 when the league changed the hand check rules as well as other rules that have worked to make driving the ball so important, the dominant figures in the league for the first time are almost all Point Guards or Wing Players. Think of the top 7-8 players in the league- Lebron James, Kobe Bryant, Dwight Howard, Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, Dwyane Wade- except for Howard they all fit the mold. I think it took the teams some time after 2004 to really understand how heavily the new rules favored strong wing players and PGs who could take it to the hole and now teams are drafting more and more with that in mind (even the average height of all players in the NBA has been dropping for the last few years, proving that teams are moving away from focusing their teams on inside out/center dominated play).

My point with all of that is, I think the topic of the thread is largely true when looking at the league historically but going forward, if the rules don't change, I think we will see more star PGs win championships.

[CKR13]

Some said that this era is the "Golden Age of Point Guards". In reference to the likes of Jason Kidd, Steve Nash, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Rajon Rondo, Derrick Rose, Jeremy Lin, Ricky Rubio alongside others like Russell Westbrook, Kyrie Irving and John Wall.

That brings us back to the topic where the said golden age is debatable wherein the premiere point guards like Paul or Williams have yet to win an NBA championship. Rondo won a championship in 2008, but he was not the Rondo that is playing today. Last year, Kidd won a championship but he was not the focal point.

The so called golden age as we discussed on other boards could just be in reference with the collective talent of point guards in the league. This era still has Kidd and Nash. Williams and Paul are on their prime. Rajon Rondo will get better while there is a lot of upside / potential with Irving, Rubio, Lin and Wall. Derrick Rose was the youngest MVP.

[Johnny Garcia]

Yes I conveniently did not include the 80s because i just don't know much of that era so I am sticking with the recent decades anyway if you have stats for those 1990 and below please post and I think we will see similar stats

[rikhardur]

Compare with this thread: http://forums.interbasket.net/showth...get-you-a-ring