2008 US National Team

[mvblair]

Since our loss on home soil in the 2002 World Basketball Championships and subsequent defeat in Athens 2004, Team USA has struggled to find an identity, even with a myriad of young superstars, NBA MVPs, NBA Finals MVPs, and NBA All-Stars. The Athens 2004 team did manage to win the Bronze against Lithuania, an accomplishment that is often overlooked.

The 2007 Americas Gold Medal team played well against other “B” teams in the Americas, but still has not proved that it can fight with the best national teams in the world. Jerry Colangelo was elected in 2006 to manage Team USA, and he immediately recruited players who promised a three year commitment. That commitment has been shaky at best, with players defecting do to injury and want of rest.

In the 2007 Americas, we fielded:

Chauncey Billups G
Jason Kidd G
Deron Williams G
Michael Redd G
LeBron James G/F
Tayshaun Prince F
Carmelo Anthony F
Dwight Howard F/C
Amare Stoudemire F/C
Tyson Chandler C

The following players were on “injury leave:”

Chris Paul G
Dwayne Wade G
Gilbert Arenas G
Joe Johnson G/F
Kobe Bryant G/F
Paul Pierce G/F
Lamar Odom F
Chris Bosh F/C
Brad Miller C
Greg Oden C

The above lists seem to be the pool of players that Colangelo is willing to send to Beijing. Obviously, he may send a few different players since his “3 year commitment” has already been disrupted.

Along with those players, we’ve got some good coaches with plenty of experience.

Mike Krzyzewski will get players to play together, design offense/defense – Second tenure with USA basketball, plenty of international experience, plenty of experience putting teams together quickly, plenty of big victories in NCAA
Jim Boeheim will design offense/defense– Spent the past 46 years playing and coaching at the Syracuse University, plenty of big victories in NCAA
Mike D’Antoni will get offense to work against zone defenses – big player in NBA and overseas, plenty of international experience, plenty of big victories in Italy
Nate McMillan will keep big egos in check – some success coaching in NBA, plenty of success playing
Rudy Tomjanovich will scout other national teams – brings big-time NBA experience, able to change teams very quickly

In the end, Team USA’s success at the beautiful new Wukesong Basketball Arena in Beijing will depend on good on-the-court decision making. Good decision making wasn’t necessary with the super-athletic teams in the late ‘90s and early ‘00s, because Team USA’s athletic superiority made up for everything that we lacked in terms of leadership and craft. Now, in a world game that features equal athletics and craftier team play, Team USA must improve their on-the-court decisions; no more isolations, no more dribbling without penetration, no more pull-up threes.

[HIGHLANDER]

Interesting thread mate.
Sounds as though the States are taking this very seriously with the coaching side especially.
You did not say if you thought this group of coaches and players will win.
For to long the US has taken the rest of the world for granted and they just expected to just turn up and win.
If they don't win this time they may run out of ideas!

I will stick my head out and say they won't win the gold, sorry...

[hotjam_2]

What no Kevin Garnett on the US squad? I would think it's too early to tell which team's going to win the Olympics. For the US to win these days they got to have every position covered. Right now they're lacking a big strong center that can give picks. Maybe bring back Shak, just for insurence?
I'm still going with Spain, but you never know how the condition of the players are going to be right at Olympic time. Gabajosa, Gasol, and Navarro did'nt seem 100% fit at last year's Euro's, and it cost them the championship. and of course bringing in the great combination of Rudy F and Rick Rubio as the sub guards would give Spain another fighting chance to take it all

[mvblair]

Interesting thread mate.
Sounds as though the States are taking this very seriously with the coaching side especially.
You did not say if you thought this group of coaches and players will win.

I have no idea if they will win or not...I really don't know. I'll explain in a sec'...

For to long the US has taken the rest of the world for granted and they just expected to just turn up and win.
If they don't win this time they may run out of ideas!

Yes, and then it will just be a matter of working as hard as all the other good national programs in the world.

What no Kevin Garnett on the US squad?

He barely got the Gold in Sydney, and frankly, I think he's scared that we'll lose and he'll look bad. Allen Iverson lost in 2002 and 2004, but he wanted so badly to play, we should have put him on the team. If guys like KG and Duncan don't want to play because they're scared, disinterested or think it's unfair, we should forget about them.

I would think it's too early to tell which team's going to win the Olympics. For the US to win these days they got to have every position covered. Right now they're lacking a big strong center that can give picks. Maybe bring back Shak, just for insurence?

Yes! You're right; we don't have a really reliable big man. I mean, Stoudemire, Howard, and Bosh are all great players, but I don't really think any of them can hit outside shots that well (Bosh maybe) and they can all get out-pushed for rebounds by the big boys on some of those NTs. Brad Miller could be that person, but something tells me that after his injuries last year and this year, he's not going to Beijing.

As for my prediction....I'm always lousy at this....

Team USA has the best chance to win, but I don't think they'll actually win. Like Highlander, I'll bet on the field and say that the USA will not win Gold. Of the qualified teams, I think the chance of getting Gold is as follows:

• 25% - USA
• 20% - Spain
• 20% - Argentina
• 20% - Lithuania
• 10% - Russia
• 5% - Other

Now, I think that there are a number of teams that need to go to the qualifying tournament who could also win medals (Greece, Puerto Rico and I wouldn't be shocked if Slovenia, Croatia, Brazil, or even Germany medalled). So, once that Qualifying Tournament in Athens is over (July 20th?), I'll revise my list.

[L8DBACK]

The way I look at this, it would be early to judge the USA Team at this point. Anything could happen between now and the Olympics. That goes with the other teams competing in the Olympics. You got to be mentally and physically tough when you get to Beijing. I think preparation will be the key. Got to play as a team and get the rythm going.

[mvblair]

The way I look at this, it would be early to judge the USA Team at this point. Anything could happen between now and the Olympics. That goes with the other teams competing in the Olympics.

Yes, you're absolutely right. I mean, what will happen to China if Yao doesn't recover? Or Russia if Kirilenko goes down?

I think preparation will be the key.

And that is our big change. Now we're trying our best to practice and get prepared, although we did it for Athens too.

[Test]

• 35% - USA
• 15% - Spain
• 20% - Argentina
• 20% - Lithuania
• 5% - Russia
• 5% - Other

I liked mvblairs list, I think this is more accurete IMO

[Phantim3dx]

anymore thoughts by anyone on this thread bceause it would be great to see the other thoughts on this yes indeed. i am spamming so i can continue this topic

[damelo]

Yes! You're right; we don't have a really reliable big man. I mean, Stoudemire, Howard, and Bosh are all great players, but I don't really think any of them can hit outside shots that well (Bosh maybe) and they can all get out-pushed for rebounds by the big boys on some of those NTs. Brad Miller could be that person, but something tells me that after his injuries last year and this year, he's not going to Beijing.

Well, Bosh now seems to be really dangerous from 5-6 meters, maybe alittle more, so he is close to the 3pts range internationally. If the other center don't like to go too far from the basket, it may be enough. I remember Nancy losing regularly against Le Mans when they had centers like Huseyin Besok or Sandro Nicevic, becaus they had no one fast enough and tall enough to follow them outside the paint.
Then I remember a few years ago an article on STAT in which Mike d'Antoni told that Stoudamire already was one of the top three point shooting player during th exercise. And even before he got operated and all stuff. Now, at 5-6 meters, he barely misses.
All you lack may be size, but, Chandler can bring it, and rebounding. Howard is unstopable when he wants due to his physical ablities.
So, I definitely don't think team USA problems are inside, but that they are more in giving the ball inside.

[mvblair]

Well, Bosh now seems to be really dangerous from 5-6 meters, maybe alittle more, so he is close to the 3pts range internationally.

Yes, Bosh has good range for a center. Unfortunately, he's really slow on the perimeter.

Then I remember a few years ago an article on STAT in which Mike d'Antoni told that Stoudamire already was one of the top three point shooting player during th exercise. And even before he got operated and all stuff. Now, at 5-6 meters, he barely misses.

Stoudamire can make shots, but I from 5-6 meters? I'm not sure about that. Especially when these European centers and forwards are accustomed to guarding guys out on the perimeter.

All you lack may be size, but, Chandler can bring it, and rebounding. Howard is unstopable when he wants due to his physical ablities.
So, I definitely don't think team USA problems are inside, but that they are more in giving the ball inside.

I disagree respectfully, Damelo. Our centers will have more trouble on a FIBA court than an NBA court. Why? Well, the great defenses that international teams can play. Dwight Howard can kill anybody under the basket because he can move so well around the basket area...when he's isolated. What will he do when he's surrounded by two or three guys on a collapsed zone? Probably the same thing our centers did for the past 4 years: make a turnover. And also, the trapezoid lane keeps these really big dudes like Nesterovic, Ilgauskas, Howard, Shaq and so forth further away from the basket. That's bad for our centers, who need a couple of seconds to position themselves by the basket.

Revamped U.S. basketball squad to focus on the team -- Apr 15, 2008, by Andrew Stern, Reuters

The U.S. Olympic basketball team will go to Beijing with familiar faces but a new attitude in the hope of ending a series of humbling international defeats, coaches said on Tuesday.

“I think in some respects over the years we’ve been a little bit arrogant about the game, in that we’ve said it’s our game,” said head coach Mike Krzyzewski, who also coaches at college power Duke University.

“It’s not our game, it’s the world’s game, and we’re playing a different game when you play international basketball.”

...The one-on-one moves and poor shooting of the often youthful American squads have been exposed by quick-passing, excellent-shooting sides from Argentina—the gold medal winners in Athens—Greece, Lithuania and Puerto Rico.

The new era of global competition is a contrast to the domination of past U.S. “dream teams” at the Olympics.

The U.S. organizers adopted a new approach in 2005, giving NBA Phoenix Suns’ general manager Jerry Colangelo unprecedented control of who would coach and play for the team.

Colangelo, speaking at the U.S. Olympic Team’s “media summit” in Chicago, said the gap between the United States and the rest of the world had closed with roughly 75 players from 30 countries playing in the NBA.

“I’ve always been a firm believer that basketball is the ultimate team game,” he said.

“The more you play with one another, the better you can become. That a good team can beat a team of all-stars, that was shown in the Olympics in ‘O4...In many of those countries they have a national team structure, and many of those players have been together since the time they were introduced to the game, so they grew up together,” added Colangelo.

TEAM SPIRIT

Suns’ coach Mike D’Antoni, who spent years coaching internationally, is one of Krzyzewski’s “co-head coaches” brought in to give U.S. players a sense of what is different and to instill his brand of fast-paced basketball.

Colangelo interviewed players and selected 33 to form the core of the team, many holdovers from past squads, who were asked to make a three-year commitment.

“The last two years we’ve seen our program develop to where, whether it be Lebron James, Kobe Bryant, Jason Kidd, whoever the guys are on the team, they feel they’re part of a team,” Krzyzewski said.

“We’ve asked them to be committed to play for their country, and not just play.”

Already, the team has practiced or played exhibitions together for 10 weeks over the past two summers, compared to the hastily assembled 2004 squad that practiced only a few weeks together.

Depending on injuries and the need for certain roles to be filled—such as outside shooters to break down zone defenses the Americans are likely to face—the 12-man roster with three alternates will be chosen for the team’s first Olympic contest on August 10.

So, Colangelo, D'Antoni and Coach K are basically saying the same thing L8DBACK just said: practice will make for a better team. That's key for every team.

But, listen, it's a myth that other national teams have played together since they were 8 years old and that's why they win. Heck, Lithuania was competing for Olympic Gold less than two years after independence. Heck, the Soviet Union lost nearly all of their Lithuanian core, but reformed as the Russian NT and got the Silver in 1994...their national sports program was in ruin, so that was only two years after Yeltsin was eleceted.

Playing together for a few years is nice, but the example of Russia proves that it is not necessary. Better examples are the countries of former Yugoslavia. It's too easy a solution to say "well, all those other countries play all the time, so that's why we lost."

[L8DBACK]

Yes, you're absolutely right. I mean, what will happen to China if Yao doesn't recover? Or Russia if Kirilenko goes down? And that is our big change. Now we're trying our best to practice and get prepared, although we did it for Athens too.

Australia’s men have been struck by a couple of thunderbolts with the news that veterans Sam Mackinnon and Jason Smith will be unable to play at the Olympics.

Mackinnon, 32, has blood clots on his lungs while Smith, the 33-year-old captain of the Boomers, needs surgery on a shoulder injury that he suffered in last year’s NBL play-offs.

He must now take blood-thinning medication for three months, though, and doctors have said he cannot play any contact sport during this time.

Smith needs an operation on his rotator cuff and that will prevent him from playing for eight months.

[JGX]

Why? Well, the great defenses that international teams can play. Dwight Howard can kill anybody under the basket because he can move so well around the basket area...when he's isolated. What will he do when he's surrounded by two or three guys on a collapsed zone? Probably the same thing our centers did for the past 4 years: make a turnover.

Or maybe he'll shoot 81% from the field, like he did last summer. He hasn't had many turnovers the last two years either.

Howard is our third or fourth option depending who is on the court at the time...if teams swarm him then the other guys will be shooting wide-open threes all day.

Just as in previous years, we'll score more than enough points to win, the question is whether the defense will be there, and if the breaks go our way.

Here's my team for now:

Kidd
Paul
Williams
Redd
James
Anthony
Bryant
Battier
Prince
Stoudemire
Howard
Chandler

Backcourt--I've gone with Kidd even though he's clearly on the downside of his career, because he played well last summer, and will understand his role of being the playmaker and getting the team started in transition. Plus he can provide some veteran leadership. If he's struggling, you have two phenomenal youngsters in Paul and Williams, who both have a decent amount of international experience, and can also create while remaining scoring threats. I left Billups off because he's more of a halfcourt player and also I think it's better to go with the younger players in a condensed tournament schedule. The other guards are pretty obvious picks.

Frontcourt--Battier played well in Japan, a good defender who can hit open shots, IMO there's definitely a place for him on the squad. Prince is there because you need a big guy that can defend the perimeter. The big pick is between Bosh and Chandler--Bosh is a much better scorer, but Chandler is a great rebounder and solid defender, coming off his best NBA season. With all the scoring on this team we can sacrifice some scoring in this spot for a better rebounder/defender. However, given last summer's experience where Chandler just sat on the bench, we might be better off bringing a guy that K is actually going to use.

[mvblair]

Or maybe he'll shoot 81% from the field, like he did last summer. He hasn't had many turnovers the last two years either.

Howard is our third or fourth option depending who is on the court at the time...if teams swarm him then the other guys will be shooting wide-open threes all day.

You're right, but do you still trust him on the international court? I don't, even though he is miles better than he was previously. The guys he played against last summer are not as good as what he'll see in Beijing (obviously), but that 80% FGs does indicate that he knows how to score quickly, which is important for a guy without a jump-shot.

Just as in previous years, we'll score more than enough points to win, the question is whether the defense will be there, and if the breaks go our way.

We've had some trouble scoring in the past against Greece and several games where we've killed ourselves with bad shooting, but I agree that poor defense is where we've lost games.

Backcourt--I've gone with Kidd even though he's clearly on the downside of his career, because he played well last summer, and will understand his role of being the playmaker and getting the team started in transition. Plus he can provide some veteran leadership. If he's struggling, you have two phenomenal youngsters in Paul and Williams, who both have a decent amount of international experience, and can also create while remaining scoring threats. I left Billups off because he's more of a halfcourt player and also I think it's better to go with the younger players in a condensed tournament schedule. The other guards are pretty obvious picks.

I'm on the anti-Kidd bandwagon, so I disagree with you about putting him on the court (we all agree that he looked pathetic in the Play-Offs, right?). I think Williams is our best choice mainly because he plays tough defense (or at least I assume he does 'cause he's in Utah). He's not the scorer that Paul is, but he's got the defense that could control some of the big guards we're going to play against.

Clearly though, that swingman SG/SF is our strongest position: Kobe, LeBron, Anthony (great internationally)...that's tough to beat.

Frontcourt--Battier played well in Japan, a good defender who can hit open shots, IMO there's definitely a place for him on the squad. Prince is there because you need a big guy that can defend the perimeter. The big pick is between Bosh and Chandler--Bosh is a much better scorer, but Chandler is a great rebounder and solid defender, coming off his best NBA season. With all the scoring on this team we can sacrifice some scoring in this spot for a better rebounder/defender. However, given last summer's experience where Chandler just sat on the bench, we might be better off bringing a guy that K is actually going to use.

I agree about Battier and Prince. They can out-hustle anybody in the game. They'll also be able to play defense against some of those big guards, like what Bruce Bowen does in the NBA. Chandler...I don't know...I'm not convinced. He is coming off his best season, but I think that's largely because of Paul and Peja. Of course, if Chandler is on the Olympic team, he'll play with better players than that, so his game could stay high. Yeah, maybe I like him. Bosh is one of the USA's best PFs, but don't you think his skinny-man defense will get him torn apart?

[Phantim3dx]

jgx pretty much nailed it, i tend to agree with what he says and i'd like kidd ther ebecause he is a proven commodity internationally. and youve got other backup pg's if they are looking for a scoring threat id say go with paul and chandler on the floor because they know each other pretty well on the court and that makes them more comfortable with each other. id personally pick chandler over bosh. its really really a tough decision but ive got chandler down low over bosh jsut because bosh and as matt said "skinny-man defense" just wouldnt be able to hack iso plays when the pf he guards are bigger.

[bobo81]

Sounds mean but I am glad to see Billups cut...he just cant cut it in the international game...

Chandler vs Bosh is interesting. Both of them lack coordination in the defensive game so I dont know which side to go with. Both have a different style of scoring, but if Id have to choose it'd be Bosh because he is a better scorer imo.