i met Tsakalidis in the gym when he came in AEK ,i asked Jurovic (where is this soul?)is he good ? and he told me that he knows bb,but...
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Bourousis vs. Tanjevic
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Originally posted by Linktothepast View PostKalashnikov, i think these kinds of talks are pointless. Noone is entirely "clean" in my opinion. And many of those who talk about ethics now are a bit hypocrites themselves (they simply wanted to see us fail all along and they got pissed with us trying to sneak past it, while they would do the same without second thought).
Just throwing some food for thought to people who just discovered the unspoiled paradise of professional sports...
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Originally posted by mantra View PostFirst of all there needs to be a clear distinction made between your average naturalized player and the ones Turkey possess (at the moment there is only Ersan playing for the NT). There is only a few of these players and all of them came to Turkey at a very young age having cultural and even possibly ethnic ties to the country. They are immigrants (much like I am myself in the United States) not professionals. The fact that they happened to become successful professional basketball players doesn't change this essential fact. If I had become a successful player here in the US would it have been wrong for me to choose to play for the American NT? Than I guess the US shouldn't have any sort of NT in any sort of sport.
Countries like France, England, Holland import people from former colonies in several sports when they can all the time. Have you ever heard of a place called Suriname in South America? Some of Holland's best players in their history have originated from that barely known country in fact most people probably never would've heard of that country if it weren't for the likes of Davids and Seederf, etc. Interestingly enough some of these players were born in Suriname while it was still a part of the Netherlands.
There are a lot of people in Turkey who have family that originates from the Balkans (I know this for a fact as I am one of them) as well as other parts of the regions surrounding Turkey including other parts of Southern Europe (even Italian immigrants living as an extreme minority in parts of Turkey), the rest of the Middle East, Central Asian Turks, Caucasus mountains and even Russia and Crimea. I know from my own family that I may not even have a drop of Turkish blood in me and that I am a mutt mainly of people from the Balkans and who knows what else. Even in Turkey I am a 3rd generation immigrant. I hope some of you start realizing what a complex country Turkey happens to be and that this issue of naturalization in Turkey is not as simple as meets the eye.
As someone else before me has stated Ersan is Uzbek which probably means he has more Turki blood in him than most players in the Turkish NT or even most people in the country of Turkey for that matter. Also Russia has many federal states (which are basically countries within countries) where the majority of people are not Russian like Tatarstan (the Tatars themselves are Turki), so does it really matter if Uzbekistan is an independent country and Ersan chose to play for Turkey the country he moved to as an immigrant with his parents instead (also a country he has ethnic ties with)? How can you compare that to some American who ends up gaining a passport from a country he's never even visited to count as a non-foreigner in his current league and then plays for that countries NT as some sort of payback?
Very intelligent, EXCELLENT postTHE NBA IS FAKE
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Originally posted by pata View Postomg..
how about nick galis,kosta koufos(they are american of greek descent)
how about igor milosevic,sakota.tsakalidis
never isn't it?
+ Milosevic and Sakota never played and never will play for our men NT.
Tsakalidis... well he aint Ilyasova ... That means he was just a banger and nothing more. Not a game deciding player. Well i can barely even call him a player but whatever thats not the point
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Originally posted by reignman View PostThey are Greeks of Serbian/Russian descent if that suits you?
+ Milosevic and Sakota never played and never will play for our men NT.
Tsakalidis... well he aint Ilyasova ... That means he was just a banger and nothing more. Not a game deciding player. Well i can barely even call him a player but whatever thats not the point
and ok tsakalidis is exception..he is out of never..
the fact is greece,turkey and many more countries always naturalise atlethes..doesnt matter if they played or didnt play in national teams...
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Originally posted by Levenspiel View PostJankovic, Sakota, Tsakalidis, Milosevic?
Stojakovic wanted to play for Greece and you didn't accept it?
No need to go on with this discussion. Very few countries, if any, are intact regarding the naturalizations. Some do it more, some less. Ersan is a naturalized player no matter how close he's ethnically close to us.
bullshit..they want him,but he refuse..like Tarlac and Jaric..
During the 90' a lot of our player went out of Serbia cuz of war and sport ban(fiba,fifa,etc)
Sakota would never have a place in our team..it s simple,he is not good enought.
But you from Turkey steal couple our players-Jahovic(Turkdzan),and I can t remember what s the name of young serb,U chanched his name..nikola...
and of course brother Hedo----KO VAS JEBO GODINAMA JEBACE VAS OPET----
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Wouuw this thing went way off topic.
Well i would make the same comments if that was my own NT doing what Greek NT did 2 years in a row.
And yes justice served, Greece will still face what they try to escape, i hope i won't have to watch games like that in the coming tournaments.
And i would like to believe that my Greek fellows wouldn't like to watch their NT loosing games like that either.
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Originally posted by ataman5 View PostWouuw this thing went way off topic.
Well i would make the same comments if that was my own NT doing what Greek NT did 2 years in a row.
And yes justice served, Greece will still face what they try to escape, i hope i won't have to watch games like that in the coming tournaments.
And i would like to believe that my Greek fellows wouldn't like to watch their NT loosing games like that either.
You can enjoy TODAY the premature derby Spain-Greece.
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Some of the peoples main goal is just to attack Turkey, some of the Greeks or i must say, i dont see where is it going, you're criticizing the naturalization thing or is it just because you can't bear Ersan's performance as a Turkish NT?
If you're against naturalizing thing why hasn't anyone mentioned Preldzic till now? Cause we're not against of that kind of an action, we're just very recently tried to naturalized him, and have failed unfortunately, and last time I've checked he had nothing about being Turkish
but the Ersan case is nowhere near of your thesises, like "mantra" mentioned before, we're considering that people even more Turkish than we're now, I've had a friend when I was in High School from Eastern Turkestan, which is a state of China, and I, for myself have practiced it too, because of that globalization or closing to western civilization things causing some losts to our culture,
and about the Stojakovic-Ersan comparisons, check out the link below, try to get what Turkic means and covers, if you have that kind of bonds with Serbians too, please enlighten me..
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Originally posted by Levenspiel View PostI wouldn't take this too seriously. To me it looked like just a little heated conversation between naturally competitive bball people. Nothing to make a big fuss.
Tanjevic-Bourousis' thing luckily finished before escalating to something much worse (...much worse would have been, the way I see it -no matter that I'm Greek myself, I'd feel the same for any team, yet I guess such would only happen with the Greek one- if even just the audience would start being especially unfriendly towards the Greek team for its oncoming games).
Coach Tanjevic's action could be compared to waving a gun in public, even if it never went off. And what's sad about it, is from what I read someplace, he hasn't yet understood (at least Blatt said he was sorry for what he initially said) his responsibility towards it, since he said at some interview that "Bourousis must have seen too many films", trying to make what he himself said (and nearly started a "war" with it), sound so trivial. If it WAS trivial, he should have known better to avoid saying it in the court, in the 1st place. Unfortunately I suspect (not know) that his INTENTION, WAS to create havoc in the 1st place.....Anyway, let's hope it all IS water under the...Bosphorus bridge
Originally posted by UMUT_FB_LAL View PostVery intelligent, EXCELLENT post
mantra expressed him self in both very an eloquent manner - a very sensible one too. I wish I'd see some posts like that very one, from my "proud" Greek compatriots as well, instead of the usual (I do not mean either the thread or the forum in specific, but generally rather) "we Greeks are the best of the best - when orthodox God created us he was thinking of the model of Man - we are perfect, we're impeccable, we're unbeatable we are good, we are nice, we are ethical, we're the crème de la crème - and we also humper anyone's mamma that thinks otehrwise". We generally ARE nice, but come on. For example, I read some posts HERE claiming that "the greek federation wouldn't accept those players" ("ethics" implied...). What a load of crock. It possibly had to do with either lobbying decisions - or even the players themselves didn't fancy that. U kidding me? "The Greek Bball Federation", for example performed "MIRACLES" once, so to have Nick Gallis play for the National Team. What was then the Federation? Comprised of what? Non-Greeks? Corrupt sons of bitches, that later on got their butt kicked out by some crusading SAINTS that overtook it and brought stability considering its ethical profile??? Dunno what to advise you people - either wake up or grow up, are my options. An even maybe "stop hiding behind your finger". 'Cause it shows, and it's an ugly sight.
Finally, what should for example the "outspoken" (he's what we Greeks say "like a fly into milk", 'cause of his natural looks) Schortsanitis have done? Gone back to Cameroon and try register/"hide" within the country's National Team, 'cause his skin indicates his African DNA roots from his mother's side and he wouldn't be heard THAT much around the world so that people would not make much fuss about it? The guy was brought up here, he IS half-Greek considering the gene pool he came from, he learned his bball ABCs here. So why should it be different than any other Turkish, Serbian, Uzbec or whatever player. Not that eg Calathes (as very well mantra, pictured him), the way I see it, should be deprived of the "right"/chance to make a lifetime choice about which NT to play for. Dedication is what should count, the way I see it - not even the DNA "prison"Last edited by washcloud; 09-04-2010, 02:29 PM.
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Originally posted by Levenspiel View PostI
Well, the language is a little bit different in every region within Turkey too. It's just natural. But if she says she cannot understand Azeri, sorry to say this, but she's quite ignorant.
But we are not the same people anymore of course. We've been living in different geographies under different conditions for a long time, and people get differentiate in time. But I can easily communicate with a Baskurt (an autonomous state in Siberia within Russia) for example. You just have to know old words and he/she should know his/her native language. They are under heavy Russian assimilation and the current Turkish in Turkey is kind of fabricated.
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