Player naturalisations

[boz74]

Let me point you to Kleiza and Kaukėnas cases who took advantage of USA youth system but played for Lithuania. Kleiza moved to USA at 16 years old, never lived in Lithuania, never played in Lithuania just was born in there.

Never lived in Lithuania, really? Where did he live until age 16, then?

Are those players not elegible because they did not grow up at Lithuania and did not play in Lithuania system

I'm pretty sure they did grow up in Lithuania and did play in the Lithuanian basketball system (not to mention that they do not hold any other citizenship).

It appears you're trying to advance your argument by making stuff up.

Besides, Sabonis took advantage of Spanish and Lithuania youth system, and he chooses Lithuania because of identity. I do not see what problem you have with that. I can see that he takes advantage of Lithuania system and leave to play for Spain. Same problem, is it not?

How did he take advantage of the Lithuanian youth system if he never played there? If you mean youth teams, he shouldn't have been allowed there either.

SO all players that are playing ball in other countries and other clubs shouldnt be allowed to play for their national team,because they take advantage of those countries basketball system right ?

If they have not played two seasons in the country they wish to represent, then no, they shouldn't be allowed. Contrary to what you are implying, that is obviously only a tiny minority of all the players that are currently playing abroad.

[Shawshank]

Never lived in Lithuania, really? Where did he live until age 16, then?


I'm pretty sure they did grow up in Lithuania and did play in the Lithuanian basketball system (not to mention that they do not hold any other citizenship).

It appears you're trying to advance your argument by making stuff up.


How did he take advantage of the Lithuanian youth system if he never played there? If you mean youth teams, he shouldn't have been allowed there either.



If they have not played two seasons in the country they wish to represent, then no, they shouldn't be allowed. Contrary to what you are implying, that is obviously only a tiny minority of all the players that are currently playing abroad.

why 2 seasons ? not 7 or 9 seasons? its boz74 rule or what? There are so manny example that player not become what he is until he went play abroad.Biggest part of nba long time european players become stars in europe after playing in american system.Im againts european nba players playing in eurobasket,they become way better after returning from american system .Their national team and their system have nothing to do with progress their player made in usa. He should be allowed to play only for usa.Right thats your logic?

IF lithuanian parents kid born not in Lithuania,it doesnt mean HE IS NOT LITHUANIAN,even our democratical laws is saying that ! You are coming here and saying that kid that want to represent and feel himself Lithuanian like Domantas has no right to play for Lithuania, all of his relatives country, because he was born in spain/usa? Dont worry we dont pay him money,he is doing that because HE IS LITHUANIAN !

Your logic and rules you want to make up is messed up.Sabonis is Lithuanian basketball federation president and our best player of all time and his son will play for Spain ) btw spaniards tried and offered Domantas to play fro Spain.He said im lithuanian ,i cant play for you If Domantas played for spain THAT WOULD BE Naturalisation PROBLEM,not when lithuanian want to play for Lithuania.Get your fact right men.

[boz74]

why 2 seasons ? not 7 or 9 seasons? its boz74 rule or what?

Feel free to make it 7 or 9 if you wish. It's a rule that is used by the IIHF, a reputable sports governing body.

Im againts european nba players playing in eurobasket,they become way better after returning from american system .Their national team and their system have nothing to do with progress their player made in usa. He should be allowed to play only for usa.Right thats your logic?

You are entitled to your opinion that NBA players should not be playing in Eurobasket, but that is not my logic at all.

I suggest you stop putting words in my mouth and read my posts with a little more attention.

IF lithuanian parents kid born not in Lithuania,it doesnt mean HE IS NOT LITHUANIAN,even our democratical laws is saying that !

I have said nothing of the sort. Please stop putting word in my mouth and making stuff up.

In addition, you might want to realise that Macedonia's democratic laws made McCalebb a Macedonian, yet a lot of people (maybe including you?) have a problem with him playing for that country's national team. So it seems largely accepted that merely being a citizen of a country shouldn't be enough to make someone eligible for the NT.

You are coming here and saying that kid that want to represent and feel himself Lithuanian like Domantas has no right to play for Lithuania, all of his relatives country, because he was born in spain/usa?

Not at all, I'm saying he shouldn't be allowed to play for Lithuania because he has not played two seasons in Lithuania while he did play two seasons in another country of which he is also a citizen.

Your logic and rules you want to make up is messed up. Sabonis is Lithuanian basketball federation president and our best player of all time and his son will play for Spain )

The sons of Slovakia's best hockey player of all times, former national team head coach and member of parliament, play for the USA, and are not allowed to play for Slovakia. There's nothing messed up about it.

If Domantas played for spain THAT WOULD BE Naturalisation PROBLEM

I'd like you to explain how it would be a "problem" that a Spanish guy who played in Spain for years would also play for the Spanish NT. That seems "messed up" to see something as natural as that as a "problem". Is it also a naturalisation "problem" to you that Tony Parker plays for France or Adetokoumbo for Greece?

[usagre]

I don't understand what the correlation is between a national league and a national team. A player can and should play in any league in the world that offers him the most money. In essence it is just an occupation. I don't see how that impacts his nationality and his roots. One has nothing to do with the other.

[Baloo]

I can't even comprehend idea that you guys are talking/questioning Sabonis Jr. playing for Lithuanian national team. Just because he is born outside of Lithuania doesn't make him less Lithuanian. Same with American born Greek roots players. Orf course they should have a right to play for the country of their ancestors.

[Dirtyh]

I don't understand what the correlation is between a national league and a national team. A player can and should play in any league in the world that offers him the most money. In essence it is just an occupation. I don't see how that impacts his nationality and his roots. One has nothing to do with the other.

BTW, are you American-Greek? I have wondered how those people really feels what is their home land? I agree that it is hard task for me if someone was saying that he's a Finn even if he's never live in here and can't speak our language. Problem would be minor if countries would have better laws. No we need better rules for basketball.

[boz74]

I can't even comprehend idea that you guys are talking/questioning Sabonis Jr. playing for Lithuanian national team. Just because he is born outside of Lithuania doesn't make him less Lithuanian. Same with American born Greek roots players. Orf course they should have a right to play for the country of their ancestors.

Being born outside of Macedonia does not make McCalebb any less Macedonian either. Yet very much the same people who find it natural for Sabonis to play for Lithuania object to the presence of one player like McCalebb, let alone several, in Macedonia's national team.

So there is obviously something else that makes players' eligibility "legit", besides a mere citizenship, whether it be Lithuanian or Macedonian. That is reflected in FIBA rules, which already discriminate between citizens of the same country.

The debate here is, do the current rules discriminate too much, or not enough, or not in a correct way, etc. It's unfortunate that you fail to see that the current status quo is merely one option amongst plenty of others, none of them any less legitimate in and of itself than the others.

[boz74]

I agree that it is hard task for me if someone was saying that he's a Finn even if he's never live in here and can't speak our language.

Even if he speaks the language I find it very difficult to consider him a fellow countryman. If he wanted to play in my country's national team I would tell him to sod off.

[Baloo]

Being born outside of Macedonia does not make McCalebb any less Macedonian either. Yet very much the same people who find it natural for Sabonis to play for Lithuania object to the presence of one player like McCalebb, let alone several, in Macedonia's national team.

So there is obviously something else that makes players' eligibility "legit", besides a mere citizenship, whether it be Lithuanian or Macedonian. That is reflected in FIBA rules, which already discriminate between citizens of the same country.

The debate here is, do the current rules discriminate too much, or not enough, or not in a correct way, etc. It's unfortunate that you fail to see that the current status quo is merely one option amongst plenty of others, none of them any less legitimate in and of itself than the others.

Of course it does. McCalleb is basically bought and paid to play for a country that he doesn't give a fu..k about. Sabonis is Lithuanian from head to to the toe.

[boz74]

That is merely your opinion that McCalebb is any less Macedonian than his teammates. Saying Koufos is less Greek than his teammates is an equally valid opinion. Your opinion is probably more popular here, but that obviously does not make it more correct, and neither does saying "of course" all the time.

[Jon_Koncak]

I can't even comprehend idea that you guys are talking/questioning Sabonis Jr. playing for Lithuanian national team. Just because he is born outside of Lithuania doesn't make him less Lithuanian. Same with American born Greek roots players. Orf course they should have a right to play for the country of their ancestors.

So every American proffesional basketball player except the Indian ones should have a right to play for another country,right?What about Ginobili,should he play for Italy too?What about Australians?Should most of them play for Great Britain?

[Baloo]

So every American proffesional basketball player except the Indian ones should have a right to play for another country,right?What about Ginobili,should he play for Italy too?What about Australians?Should most of them play for Great Britain?

Of course same as most of us will have a chance to play for Neanderthal National Team if we want to. Ridiculing this idea make only you laughable, as u can't compare 5th or 6th generations Australians with Koufos whose parents moved to the USA.

[Jon_Koncak]

So where do we draw the line?3rd generation,4th?14th?Calathes parents werent born in Greece,neither Dorsey's or Bramo's.

[Baloo]

Line is where you decide to draw the line. If your parents, grandparents are Greeks so can you be.
McCalleb have nothing to do with Macedonia, neither he ever play there. have no ancestors from there etc.

[vaslover]

To stubborn BOZ 74
GREAT Johan Cruyff( the same as GREAT Arvydas Sabonis) played one day in Barcelona 1973-1978..... In 9 february 1974 was born his son Jordi Cruyff.... Yes, in Amsterdam, so the law is on your side. But...but....but still..... Almost all his childhood he spent in Catalonia. When he was 14 he played for Barca Under14 team and he played for them until 1996. But the most curious thing was for whom he should play for Netherlands or Spain? He was 100% LA MASIA Academy boy but eventually he chose Netherlands NT! Are you suprised once again? But for normal people it,s ok. Because when your father Johan Cruyff/Arvydas Sabonis definitely( at least for me) that eventually you,ll choose Netherland/Lithuania..... This,s 100% METAPHYSICS, IIHF rules( who cares ice-hockey rules in our site?!) doesn,t work in this case..... It,s so amazing to represent Netherland in football and Lithuania in basketball respectively, especially when your father Cruyff and Sabonis......