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2024 Collegiate Pre-Season (EcoOil-FilOil & PinoyLiga)

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  • Originally posted by TheRodster21 View Post

    Yeah though the athleticism, skill and build of D1 players at least those that are offered scholarships and actually play are different. Even Dalph’s team isn’t that high D1 but they would be pretty strong in the uaap, guards are pinoy height but the athleticism and body types are completely on a different level
    Correct. The physical traits (athleticism, speed, strength) is the main difference in levels. Euro/Aussie leagues have as much size and skill as the nba, the special sauce is the physical traits.

    And the thing with a league that has higher athleticism is, you have to match the baseline requirement to be effective on defense. That's why all homegrown pinoys that are given a chance in D1 are athletic (aside from having height).
    Last edited by Metta; 06-18-2024, 01:58 AM.

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    • So UP over-recruiting over the years only resulted in one ring, but if they don't over-recruit they'd have multiple championships? Got it.

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      • Originally posted by OverratedTabBaldwin View Post
        So UP over-recruiting over the years only resulted in one ring, but if they don't over-recruit they'd have multiple championships? Got it.
        Happens all the time in US D1, the NBA, and whenever Team USA gets bounced by other countries.

        Sometimes less is more.

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        • Originally posted by Metta View Post

          Happens all the time in US D1, the NBA, and whenever Team USA gets bounced by other countries.

          Sometimes less is more.
          USA environment=Philippine environment
          Got it.

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          • Originally posted by Metta View Post

            Correct. The physical traits (athleticism, speed, strength) is the main difference in levels. Euro/Aussie leagues have as much size and skill as the nba, the special sauce is the physical traits.

            And the thing with a league that has higher athleticism is, you have to match the baseline requirement to be effective on defense. That's why all homegrown pinoys that are given a chance in D1 are athletic (aside from having height).
            Not all the time. There is a difference in skill too. In the international game there is more passing than dribbling, more outside shooting (although the US has caught up). That’s why some unathletic Euro guys make it, they compensate for lack of athleticism by being very, very good in certain aspects of international play that are not very much cultivated in the US.

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            • Originally posted by Tuck View Post


              I think he’s much better than given credit for maybe it’s because i watched him live twice when he was with UE . The game when they beat dlsu in araneta he was amazing at boxing out and screening while contesting without fouling. He matched up well with Dlsu’s bigs then given i don’t think philips played .

              He had a good pick and roll partner and with Villegas spacing the floor he had good enough hands to finish.

              The second best player in the uaap is probably Philips and it’s not fair to compare the other local bigs to him. Stevens and Alter can hold their own against anyone else .

              Thick bigs are bad matchups for DLSU’s frontline. That’s why fat Gani Stevens had a good game against DLSU in S85.

              Phillips is able to push Malick, with his thin frame and high center of gravity, on the post. When Udodo matched up with Mike, Mike wasn’t able to do his think. He even had this possession where he ran out of time trying to push his way against and around Udodo, to no avail. While Udodo is no Malick Diouf, he’s a better matchup against the La Salle bigs.

              Alter is physically there. It’s his skills and mental game that needs work. The guy easily bites on fakes and can be too aggressive defending the post, leading to fouls. At least now, he’s gotten faster laterally so he’ll be able to defend face-up attacks better. But he’d still be caught dead in a traditional, back to the basket attack. Luckily, Mike doesn’t have a lot of back to the basket moves, he gets away with size and athleticism. But Agunnane has moves and should be a good test for Alter.

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              • Originally posted by OverratedTabBaldwin View Post

                USA environment=Philippine environment
                Got it.
                Your favorite coach led a team of Pinoy college kids and did well against national teams of pros. Also led no-name New Zealanders and reached the semifinals of Fiba World Cup.

                The right less is better than the wrong more.

                You're a troll. Got it.

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                • Originally posted by athleticmind2005 View Post

                  Not all the time. There is a difference in skill too. In the international game there is more passing than dribbling, more outside shooting (although the US has caught up). That’s why some unathletic Euro guys make it, they compensate for lack of athleticism by being very, very good in certain aspects of international play that are not very much cultivated in the US.
                  That's my point, skill in europe and elsewhere is sometimes higher. If skill was the overriding criteria, there would be much more Europeans in the nba.

                  Unathletic euros are rarely given chances in the nba no matter how good they are in Europe. Just recently, Micic who is arguably the best player in Euroleague in recent years is an nba benchwarmer. People will mention Luka and Jokic as unathletic (and is the reason why they got drafted low, it rarely works out for guys like them). Those guys maybe slow but they are huge, strong, and are generational offensive players.

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                  • Originally posted by Metta View Post

                    That's my point, skill in europe and elsewhere is sometimes higher. If skill was the overriding criteria, there would be much more Europeans in the nba.

                    Unathletic euros are rarely given chances in the nba no matter how good they are in Europe. Just recently, Micic who is arguably the best player in Euroleague in recent years is an nba benchwarmer. People will mention Luka and Jokic as unathletic (and is the reason why they got drafted low, it rarely works out for guys like them). Those guys maybe slow but they are huge, strong, and are generational offensive players.
                    This. Athleticism isn't just jumping high and running fast. Jokic is freakishly strong and very coordinated for someone his size. Luka too. He may look chubby but his deceptively strong and agile. I remember watching his first few games and thinking how it was so hard for him to break down his defender and was using almost all the moves on his arsenal with minimal effectiveness. Then dude adapted by using less ball handling skills and more on changing his pace/ bumping opponents off.

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                    • Originally posted by thatweirdguy View Post

                      This. Athleticism isn't just jumping high and running fast. Jokic is freakishly strong and very coordinated for someone his size. Luka too. He may look chubby but his deceptively strong and agile. I remember watching his first few games and thinking how it was so hard for him to break down his defender and was using almost all the moves on his arsenal with minimal effectiveness. Then dude adapted by using less ball handling skills and more on changing his pace/ bumping opponents off.
                      I have a bit of different opinion. Yes Jokic and Luka are sublime offensive players but it helps that they play in the NBA where defenders cannot bump them back.

                      Luka has been good in Fiba but I dont think his drives while putting the defender on his hip wouldve been as easy in Fina. Jokic I dont even remember having a dominant game in Fiba. I think Fiba is harder for Jokic. More allowed physicality on defense. Stronger centers.

                      Reminds mr of the Olympics where Draymond Green was benched but guys like McGee and DeAndre Jordan were effective. In the NBA the McGees and DeAndres are being dropped for the Chet Holmgrens. Its not hard to see why Jokic is dominating in the NBA. Even LA kept on pushing AD against Jokic when it was clear it was the McGees and Howards that were the better matchup.

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                      • Originally posted by thatweirdguy View Post

                        This. Athleticism isn't just jumping high and running fast. Jokic is freakishly strong and very coordinated for someone his size. Luka too. He may look chubby but his deceptively strong and agile. I remember watching his first few games and thinking how it was so hard for him to break down his defender and was using almost all the moves on his arsenal with minimal effectiveness. Then dude adapted by using less ball handling skills and more on changing his pace/ bumping opponents off.
                        There was a research done about grip strength (a good indicator of natural strength) and the ones that scored the highest are Europeans (also explains why World's Strongest Man Competition is a Scandinavian affair). We all know from the Olympics that when it comes to running and jumping, those with African descent dominates. So yes, there is some truth that white dudes are strong and blacks can run fast and jump high (collectively of course, because as always there are exceptions).

                        It's also interesting that quite a few half-and-halfs like Blake Griffin, Gordon, LaVine are uber-athletic.

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                        • Originally posted by Metta View Post

                          Your favorite coach led a team of Pinoy college kids and did well against national teams of pros. Also led no-name New Zealanders and reached the semifinals of Fiba World Cup.

                          The right less is better than the wrong more.

                          You're a troll. Got it.
                          I see. A Tab Baldwin fan. Got it.

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                          • Originally posted by OverratedTabBaldwin View Post

                            I see. A Tab Baldwin fan. Got it.
                            I love how he lives in your head rent free, he's the reason for your being.

                            I'm a fan of good basketball. The ones that enable lesser teams to beat loaded teams.

                            You're not only a troll, but an unimaginative one at that. Got it.

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                            • Originally posted by Metta View Post

                              I love how he lives in your head rent free, he's the reason for your being.

                              I'm a fan of good basketball. The ones that enable lesser teams to beat loaded teams.

                              You're not only a troll, but an unimaginative one at that. Got it.
                              Looks like we have a hurting Tab Baldwin fan right here. lol

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                              • Originally posted by OverratedTabBaldwin View Post

                                Looks like we have a hurting Tab Baldwin fan right here. lol
                                Are you going to continue being a troll (and an unimaginative and lousy one at that) or are you going to expound more on your ideas so we can have a worthwhile discussion?

                                Baldwin is not the issue here...refute the examples I gave you of lesser teams beating loaded teams...c'mon let's hear your ideas. Stop hiding your ineptitude by using nonsense and lame one-liners and changing subjects.

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