FIBA ASIA Cup Qualifiers

[DAdmiral]

There is a misconception of international citizenship laws that are based on documents 1. Clarkson by definition is not connected legally per verified documents to a Filipino citizen or a natural born Filipino as per definition..
2. The 2 main basis of getting a FIBA exception are 1. # of years residency & 2. Years playing in domestic league on both cases Qatar Harris has both , while Clarkson doesn't meet both.

[ja.he]

It isn't an exaggeration that the SBP stakeholders have spent more on Blatche and Clarkson alone , than the rest of the budget for Gilas. Not kidding.
now is this prudent use of money ?
What if we spent a fraction of the cost allocated to Blatche and Clarkson on simply providing financial assistance to Fil foreigners to process their passport before 16, ( note they eventually processed their passport anyway but however late)

if Qatar is wise enough to invest in 16 year old foreign recruitment, shouldn't we have enough smarts to process and recruit our Fil foreigners before 16 years old? It isn't rocket science

That's why, in some way, having Brownlee as our naturalized player helps to the funds of SBP since he seems to be way cheaper than both Blatche and Clarkson.

Those funds could have been used for the processing of teenage Fil-Fors as well as those Fil-Fors or any players (like Kouame or Akowe) that can be candidates for the exemption.

[zairex]

There is a misconception of international citizenship laws that are based on documents 1. Clarkson by definition is not connected legally per verified documents to a Filipino citizen or a natural born Filipino as per definition..
2. The 2 main basis of getting a FIBA exception are 1. # of years residency & 2. Years playing in domestic league on both cases Qatar Harris has both , while Clarkson doesn't meet both.

So again I just want to understand.

Harris Only have 2 years before being a local. And didn't stay in Qatar as on those 2 years, as he played in Uruguay. So total of two years non consecutive or half of the time he is not in Qatar is enough to be a local.

What is the specifics of those residence stay according to FIBA? And years of playing in domestic league

[Metta]

If the trend of developed nations depopulating continues, I'm expecting citizenship rules in several countries to also change (and things such as Hagop along with it). Many countries will copy Qatar to bolster their countries (not just for sports reasons).

Fortunately, we won't have that problem for the foreseeable future, in fact we're one of a few countries with ideal demographics.

With our growing young population combined with our projected economic growth, I can see our continued growth in sports.

I don't think we need any drastic changes in eligibility rules. We just have to do a better job of informing promising filfor prospects in time. Local conditions in terms of development is also improving and we're getting taller. I'm old enough to notice how much training, development, competition, etc has drastically changed (at least at the high levels...it's yet to trickle down to the barangay level that's why there is still a lot of room for growth).

[zairex]

If the trend of developed nations depopulating continues, I'm expecting citizenship rules in several countries to also change (and things such as Hagop along with it). Many countries will copy Qatar to bolster their countries (not just for sports reasons).

Fortunately, we won't have that problem for the foreseeable future, in fact we're one of a few countries with ideal demographics.

With our growing young population combined with our projected economic growth, I can see our continued growth in sports.

I don't think we need any drastic changes in eligibility rules. We just have to do a better job of informing promising filfor prospects in time. Local conditions in terms of development is also improving and we're getting taller. I'm old enough to notice how much training, development, competition, etc has drastically changed (at least at the high levels...it's yet to trickle down to the barangay level that's why there is still a lot of room for growth).

I agree with what you said.

The fear is that these rich but low-populated countries will pay their way to be competitive. Like what Qatar is doing, which I dont think is fair for the good of the sports. Would you not complain if we see teams in Qatar, Bahrain, and UAE rather than develop their grassroots programs like we hope SBP does, they just get half of their roster from Free Agents worldwide. And it will only take them 2 years to be converted into local players.

[DAdmiral]

So again I just want to understand.

Harris Only have 2 years before being a local. And didn't stay in Qatar as on those 2 years, as he played in Uruguay. So total of two years non consecutive or half of the time he is not in Qatar is enough to be a local.

What is the specifics of those residence stay according to FIBA? And years of playing in domestic league

Understand the difference between guidelines principles ans qualifications standards that are measurable.
FIBA for exceptions only has cited guidelines not qualification standards ( such as must have 5 years continuous stay ).

now because FIBA only has guidelines and NOT measurable qualifications (must be 5 continuous years ), Harris only having 2 years residency and not continuous does NOT disqualify him from exception approval.

Let's be all honest , it is correct to assume that Harris exception was mainly granted on the basis a consesion given to Qatar as World cup host.
And it's for tbis reason that we cannot use Harris case as basis to justify our case for approval for exception players we file a case for

[DAdmiral]

We have to remember residency years and domestic play are just used for exception to the main rule ( U16 passport)

The U16 passport rule is a specific quantifiable standard .

[Metta]

I agree with what you said.

The fear is that this rich but low populated countries will just pay their way to be competitive. Like what Qatar is doing, which I dont think is fair for the good of the sports. Would you not complain if we see teams in Qatar, Bahrain, UAE rather than develop their grassroot programs like we hope SBP does, they just get half of their roster the from Free Agents all over the world.

Those with the money always bend the rules in their favor, that's just how the world works.

For sure it's a weak-ass move what Qatar is doing. But then again, it's still within the rules. I'm pretty sure there are plenty of Chinese, Korean, Iranian, etc who look down on us for being too accepting of our hafu players. I'm not saying they're correct in being critical, it just shows how there are degrees to this.

Having said that, I think China, Japan and other countries with money/influence and at the same time racial-purity advocates will not let it get to a point where mercenary gulf-state teams will be dominating asian basketball.

[zairex]

Understand the difference between guidelines principles ans qualifications standards that are measurable.
FIBA for exceptions only has cited guidelines not qualification standards ( such as must have 5 years continuous stay ).

now because FIBA only has guidelines and NOT measurable qualifications (must be 5 continuous years ), Harris only having 2 years residency and not continuous does NOT disqualify him from exception approval.

Let's be all honest , it is correct to assume that Harris exception was mainly granted on the basis a consesion given to Qatar as World cup host.
And it's for tbis reason that we cannot use Harris case as basis to justify our case for approval for exception players we file a case for

Why did it matter for Qatar that the rule can be bent while for others doesn't. What made Qatar situation special. Because they were hosting and any documents stating this fact.

[zairex]

Those with the money always bend the rules in their favor, that's just how the world works.

For sure it's a weak-ass move what Qatar is doing. But then again, it's still within the rules. I'm pretty sure there are plenty of Chinese, Korean, Iranian, etc who look down on us for being too accepting of our hafu players. I'm not saying they're correct in being critical, it just shows how there are degrees to this.

Having said that, I think China, Japan and other countries with money/influence and at the same time racial-purity advocates will not let it get to a point where mercenary gulf-state teams will be dominating asian basketball.

I am not naive that some countries will do that. But we have rules for a reason. I would agree the like of Somalia that they can get players with out the primary eligibility accomplished because of their situation. But Qatar doesn't have that. If FIBA going to do this make it sensible not just outright disregard it for accomodation. Also, Why didn't they extend that accommodation to us

[DAdmiral]

Why did it matter for Qatar that the rule can be bent while for others doesn't. What made Qatar situation special. Because they were hosting and any documents stating this fact.

To be clear there are NO measurable standards bent or violated, just principles that were lenient in favor of Qatar . The same gesture was given to Indonesia as host with Jawato, where the principles applied were lenient.

To further stress point if Clarkson was exempted as we were host in 2023. That would go against the principles of exception, as clear Clarkson has no residency and domestic play tenure which are thw main guildline principles for exception

[zairex]

To be clear there are NO measurable standards bent or violated, just principles that were lenient in favor of Qatar . The same gesture was given to Indonesia as host with Jawato, where the principles applied were lenient.

There is measurable standard like length of stay and professional experience. Even his contributions to their basketball growth can also be listed to be gauged

We don't know how do they even measure that with Tyler case.

I guess no one can say now why someone can be local or not. Which means everyone can be a local player for a country, those Hagop rule are just for us to read. Following them is not necessary as long as FIBA approves it. Why would FIBA approves it no one know but them.

[Metta]

If I'm not mistaken, it's been at least 10 years that Qatar has been throwing money and using sketchy tactics to improve their program. Them not making any significant stride given that long time bodes well to prove that success going the inorganic route is not that simple.

Hopefully, before they figure it out, EVs will already be the norm so they run out of oil money.

Also, if we continue our development, I think we shouldn't fear even a souped-up Qatari team. It's about time we see ourselves as a higher-tier level team. A team that can compete against mid to lower Euros and Americas teams (sprinkled with occasional upset of top 10 teams).

[DAdmiral]

The guidelines for exception are principles without a minimum quantifiable standard , e.g. minimum of 5 years continuous residency l

The Hagop U16 passport rule on the other hand has a minimum standard that is measurable- must have a passport before 16 years old.

This is quite clear. I guess then there is merit for FIBA to have a measurable standard for exceptionx , thats a sound recommendation

Having said that , esch country including the Philippines should think strategically how to meet the clear minimum standard requirement. HOW DO YOU GET PASSPORT BEFORE 16 YEARS OLD FOR YOUR TOP PROSPECTS

[zairex]

The guidelines for exception are principles without a minimum quantifiable standard , e.g. minimum of 5 years continuous residency l

The Hagop U16 passport rule on the other hand has a minimum standard that is measurable- must have a passport before 16 years old.

This is quite clear. I guess then there is merit for FIBA to have a measurable standard for exceptionx , thats a sound recommendation

Having said that , esch country including the Philippines should think strategically how to meet the clear minimum standard requirement. HOW DO YOU GET PASSPORT BEFORE 16 YEARS OLD FOR YOUR TOP PROSPECTS

How about this strategy, make Boatwright play in MBPL for one year or 10 months. And make him do basketball clinics. After a year we can convert him to Local. Do this to 5 more imports then we definitely can compete for FIBA World cup championship.