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Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

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  • Originally posted by Joe Yabuki View Post

    Really nice to see Gilas top the asia cup qualifiers on assists, a nice change of pace from the 1 on 1 dribble drive of past Gilas
    It's an identity of a Tim Cone team, which is nice to see translate in the international stage.

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    • Frontcourt is already loaded. It doesnt need to natiralize a player like boatwright. They should get harper jr. Or ellis instead
      Philippine Malditas to FIFA Womens World Cup 2023

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      • Originally posted by Joe Yabuki View Post

        Really nice to see Gilas top the asia cup qualifiers on assists, a nice change of pace from the 1 on 1 dribble drive of past Gilas
        Dribble Drive doesn’t have to be 1-on-1.

        The issue with Chot’s DDO is it didn’t have the right players to run it effectively.

        The short prep time also meant chemistry cannot be established so players don’t know how and where to move on the court off the ball.

        DDO under Chot was more like ISO ball with dribble penetration as the first offensive option.

        A well executed DDO is like that of NZ, Italy, and DR.

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        • Originally posted by sroth3839 View Post

          Dribble Drive doesn’t have to be 1-on-1.

          The issue with Chot’s DDO is it didn’t have the right players to run it effectively.

          The short prep time also meant chemistry cannot be established so players don’t know how and where to move on the court off the ball.

          DDO under Chot was more like ISO ball with dribble penetration as the first offensive option.

          A well executed DDO is like that of NZ, Italy, and DR.
          Thats fair, it really is a talent reliant play style

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          • Originally posted by Silent Killer View Post
            Frontcourt is already loaded. It doesnt need to natiralize a player like boatwright. They should get harper jr. Or ellis instead
            I agree that Gilas has a deep pool of big men with Sotto, Edu, QMB, Amos, Baltazar and Phillips. But of course availability (injuries) and eligibility (Phillips and QMB) are major concerns. But I do agree that the next naturalized players should be more like in the mold of Brownlee who can create multiple scoring opportunities and be versatile enough to play multiple positions.
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            • Originally posted by r1ck View Post

              I agree that Gilas has a deep pool of big men with Sotto, Edu, QMB, Amos, Baltazar and Phillips. But of course availability (injuries) and eligibility (Phillips and QMB) are major concerns. But I do agree that the next naturalized players should be more like in the mold of Brownlee who can create multiple scoring opportunities and be versatile enough to play multiple positions.
              "mold of Brownlee"
              Cone says 'versatile' Boatwright much like Brownlee - only 3, 4 inches taller

              "can create multiple scoring opportunities"
              Bennie Boatwright was a 6-foot-10, 235-pound forward who could score from anywhere on the court

              "play multiple positions"
              Good size to play multiple positions

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              • Originally posted by r1ck View Post
                I agree that Gilas has a deep pool of big men with Sotto, Edu, QMB, Amos, Baltazar and Phillips. But of course availability (injuries) and eligibility (Phillips and QMB) are major concerns. But I do agree that the next naturalized players should be more like in the mold of Brownlee who can create multiple scoring opportunities and be versatile enough to play multiple positions.
                I think once AJ hits 30, I reckon we'll need to naturalize a big who can protect the paint, ideally born in the range of 2004-2010. The interior defender is a bigman profile where I think we don't have much depth. I dunno if we will have another eligible big who can protect the paint like Kai, AJ, or even Japeth.

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                • Originally posted by Silent Killer View Post
                  Frontcourt is already loaded. It doesnt need to natiralize a player like boatwright. They should get harper jr. Or ellis instead
                  They just need a humble and skilled player like Brownlee which converted into a strong leader in the court.
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                  • Originally posted by Joe Yabuki View Post

                    Thats fair, it really is a talent reliant play style
                    Chot needed multiple penetration and treats like Castro, Jimmy, Blatche etc. With 2023 edition, he relied to much on JC and not spread the offense like the 2014 edition.
                    ​​​​​

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                    • Originally posted by JAMSKIE View Post
                      One thing more notable on our current Gilas team is that it is very versatile. It can go big (but slower) with a starting 5 of Fajardo, Kai, JB, Dwight Ramos & Newsome. This is really a big line up especially in the Asia-Oceania level. It can also go small (but quick & flexible) with AJ Edu, JB, Dwight, Newsome & Iskati.

                      This is quite a significant improvement from the past iterations of the national team. 10 years ago we have only 2 options as far as the size of our 5 players on the floor. We can go with a small line up, or we can go with even a smaller line-up.

                      If we compare our 2013-2015 Gilas under coach Chot Reyes with the current Gilas team under coach Tim Cone, we can see the significant diffeerence in terms of size.
                      Under Chot Reyes, Fajardo has just a supporting role while the guards take all the limelight. Kai during last year's World Cup was used insignificantly. Cone believes in size and knows how to use the bigs as a leverage while Chot is focus more on the guards.

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                      • Originally posted by alfrancis View Post

                        Under Chot Reyes, Fajardo has just a supporting role while the guards take all the limelight. Kai during last year's World Cup was used insignificantly. Cone believes in size and knows how to use the bigs as a leverage while Chot is focus more on the guards.
                        Having Kai & Junmar Fajardo playing at the same time would be unimaginable in modern day basketball, yet this frontline combination has been common with the current Gilas under coach Tim. Fact is, coach Tim has even used this combo in the 2024 Olympic Qualifying Tournament, especially in that historic win over the mighty Latvia team. No less than the Latvian coach admitted that he really had problems handling the Gilas team's size. Imagine, wala pa nga si AJ Edu in that tournament.

                        I think we will never see this combo if Gilas is still handled by coach Chot Reyes.

                        I think coach Tim is able to utilize Junman better than coach Chot did with Gilas. I remember about a decade ago, coach Chot saying that the low post game was already a passe. I think coach Tim has proven him wrong.
                        "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

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                        • Originally posted by alfrancis View Post
                          Under Chot Reyes, Fajardo has just a supporting role while the guards take all the limelight. Kai during last year's World Cup was used insignificantly. Cone believes in size and knows how to use the bigs as a leverage while Chot is focus more on the guards.
                          Originally posted by JAMSKIE View Post
                          Having Kai & Junmar Fajardo playing at the same time would be unimaginable in modern day basketball, yet this frontline combination has been common with the current Gilas under coach Tim. Fact is, coach Tim has even used this combo in the 2024 Olympic Qualifying Tournament, especially in that historic win over the mighty Latvia team. No less than the Latvian coach admitted that he really had problems handling the Gilas team's size. Imagine, wala pa nga si AJ Edu in that tournament.
                          I think we will never see this combo if Gilas is still handled by coach Chot Reyes.

                          I think coach Tim is able to utilize Junman better than coach Chot did with Gilas. I remember about a decade ago, coach Chot saying that the low post game was already a passe. I think coach Tim has proven him wrong.
                          I never thought that the Kai and June Mar pairing would be even feasible in extended stretches, given that Kai wasn't as good a defender before this year's OQT, and that June Mar is a defensive liability in FIBA. There were speed issues as well on defense. Now that Kai showed improved defense since the Latvia game, he can cover for his teammates, including June Mar.

                          A low-post game is still important in FIBA. Gives another angle of attack, whether scoring straight from the post or using gravity. However, I think bigs should be big enough, say around at least 206cm (6'9") to be dedicated post player at center. If a big is smaller, say around 204cm (around 6'8") or smaller, I think he should do it mainly from the power forward spot, unless he has a combination of strength, athleticism, and skill to do it at center.

                          I think Chot would play a four like Carl or Troy, or a wing like Malonzo or Oftana at the 4 spot, heck even someone like Dwight. He'd put a shooter or shot creator at the 3 if it's not Gabe or Abueva. Big or small, but hardly two centers at the same time. And he doesn't really emphasize the post, like sir alfrancis said. A small ball lineup would be OK if we had a small ball four like JB or RHJ, plus a good defensive wing like Gabe or even Dwight at 3 and a good defender at the 5. However, right now, a small ball lineup wouldn't maximize our bigs.

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                          • Basketball is a tall man's game. Defense wins you championships not offense. You won't win without the rebounds and the ability to defend. Only a nitwit coach wouldn't use bigs properly. Small ball only works if your players are special and aren't terribly disadvantaged across all positions in terms of height. Golden State with Curry, Thompson, and Durant didn't use "true traditional bigs" but that trio is an unstoppable offensive juggernaut that can only be defended single coverage because a double team will open up one of them and that is guaranteed 2 or 3 points. Heck, Curry gets double teamed near the halfcourt and still scores. A good tall team will always beat a good small team.
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                            • Makes me think, if the Junmar-Kai frontline combo is effective then what more a Kai-AJ Edu frontline combo. Unlike Junmar who is slow footed (always have trouble defending the Pick n' Roll), AJ Edu has the speed & the laterals plus he's athletic (more athletic than either Kai or Junmar). AJ Edu is the type of big man who is most suited to the FIBA game which requires bigs to be agile & mobile enough to defend the pick & roll, as well as to challenge the outside shooting big men of the opposing team.
                              "A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV

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                              • Originally posted by JAMSKIE View Post
                                Makes me think, if the Junmar-Kai frontline combo is effective then what more a Kai-AJ Edu frontline combo. Unlike Junmar who is slow footed (always have trouble defending the Pick n' Roll), AJ Edu has the speed & the laterals plus he's athletic (more athletic than either Kai or Junmar). AJ Edu is the type of big man who is most suited to the FIBA game which requires bigs to be agile & mobile enough to defend the pick & roll, as well as to challenge the outside shooting big men of the opposing team.
                                Philippines are so blessed with Kai/AJ Frontcourt Duo. It will be the Main Frontline Duo for next 15 years.

                                I wonder how Boatwright will Complement the two.

                                Brownlee kinda able to play great with the two of them. I am not sure if Bennie will. Hopefully, he does.

                                He is a 6'9-6'10 SF Shooter We neeed. And sometimes he can play 4 too.

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