Originally posted by zuma169
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Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V
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zuma169 there is a long explanation for that , can discuss when have more time
but essentially eligibility rules for a federation are independent of all the different nuances of each Nation's citizenship law, it can never be consistent with every law .
it is true for FIFA or FIBa or any international federation .
obviously it impacts each country differently, some have less and some have more advantages
There are also valid reasons why FIFAs rules cant apply well for FIBA, given the talent landscape in basketball is focused mainly in the US and Europe.
as.an example in FIFA anyone who establishes 5 yrs residency regardless of entncity, parent connection is eligible. So in essence any country that grants passport like Cambodia, can for a 12 man lineup after 5 yrs residency from a US selection.
Can discuss other implications later .
The other point need to note , is documentation is really the only verifiable basis for an eligibility criteria so even if you use parent connection, it's based on proving legitimate parent is a citizen or resident of the country, (its never if parent is of Filipino entncity)
And when we talk of documentation it is in reference to when it was issued, eligibility can never be based if a person has rights to citizenship, but it has to be if and when they actually acquired citizenship (possession). Why ? Cause in today's globalization almost anyone can claim rights connection to almost any country, like if an African nation said , anyone with lineage to Africa has rights to citizenship, therefore all the Blacks in US and everywhere can littierally claim citizenship,
One needs to either have possession of citizenship or not . (Its still issuance of documentation), whether thst be of the parent , or child or what age.
Obviously one can argue for improving eligibility criteria, like lowering age or using FIFA, but what CANNOT be the basis of an argument is that it has to be similar to every nations citizenship laws to be fair, that's impossible , no federation rules are ever similar to evey different citizenship laws.Last edited by DAdmiral; 10-05-2023, 03:43 AM.
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Originally posted by DAdmiral View Postzuma169 there is a long explanation for that , can discuss when have more time
but essentially eligibility rules for a federation are independent of all the different nuances of each Nation's citizenship law, it can never be consistent with every law .
it is true for FIFA or FIBa or any international federation .
obviously it impacts each country differently, some have less and some have more advantages
There are also valid reasons why FIFAs rules cant apply well for FIBA, given the talent landscape in basketball is focused mainly in the US and Europe.
as.an example in FIFA anyone who establishes 5 yrs residency regardless of entncity, parent connection is eligible. So in essence any country that grants passport like Cambodia, can for a 12 man lineup after 5 yrs residency from a US selection.
Can discuss other implications later .
The other point need to note , is documentation is really the only verifiable basis for an eligibility criteria so even if you use parent connection, it's based on proving legitimate parent is a citizen or resident of the country, (its never if parent is of Filipino entncity)
And when we talk of documentation it is in reference to when it was issued, eligibility can never be based if a person has rights to citizenship, but it has to be if and when they actually acquired citizenship (possession). Why ? Cause in today's globalization almost anyone can claim rights connection to almost any country, like if an African nation said , anyone with lineage to Africa has rights to citizenship, therefore all the Blacks in US and everywhere can littierally claim citizenship,
One needs to either have possession of citizenship or not . (Its still issuance of documentation), whether thst be of the parent , or child or what age.
Obviously one can argue for improving eligibility criteria, like lowering age or using FIFA, but what CANNOT be the basis of an argument is that it has to be similar to every nations citizenship laws to be fair, that's impossible , no federation rules are ever similar to evey different citizenship laws.
cguro if FIBA will retain and it has been said it will retain and no changes will happen with the eligibility rules.. cguro add something, like a heritage player eligibility rule.. aside from 1 naturalized player (bahala na countries how they will apply that) add 2 more players who got their passports beyond 16 years of age but has claimed heritage of that country (fil-ams natin).. I think that would be a good compromise and it will increase competition din within regions especially ours.. just a suggestion..
additional work for the eligibility committee to review and establish the heritage connection.. but it is what it is.. that is their job.. if mabagal then it is the responsibility of the country to apply for approval earlier than usual..
just my suggestion and I think this will benefit a lot of countries and will benefit the competition in the sport..
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Originally posted by deku_midoriya View Post
Hope he gets a call-up in February. He's still one of our best guard prospects.
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Can’t blame BGR for doing some effort about his eligibility status as far as sending an official email to FIBA, it’s a sign that the dude is really serious for representing the country in a sanctioned event.
Well I agreed on those possible factors why he is declined(?) for now that’s okay, hopefully after 4 to 5 years when he is already in a ripe age of 30 he can request for a re-classification. For now just continue his domestic involvement, put up a business, involve in any out-reach program/ basketball clinics and build a family on his own eventually. Those things are indeed a good merit moving forward. As we all know a good reference for this is the 3 Thai-Am that I’ve posted from the other thread.
Another Fil-Am player that I think is already ripe for exemption is 6’4 31 yr. old Jason Perkins, been in the country when he is still 19 yrs. old studied and played for DLSU for 4 yrs(?), married and had kids with his full blooded Filipina Wife, establishes his own businesse(s) and more that 5 yrs. of playing in the domestic leagues and non FIBA tourney like SEA 3x3 in 2019.
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Originally posted by zuma169 View Post
points well taken.. and i do agree magkakagulo gulo if FIBA would apply rules of each and every nation in terms of citizenship to determine their eligibility... but as an example BGR, his brother is full local.. both have same circumstances upon arriving here in the philippines.. dapat naman cguro exempt na.. kaya exemption eh.. but anyways it is what it is..
cguro if FIBA will retain and it has been said it will retain and no changes will happen with the eligibility rules.. cguro add something, like a heritage player eligibility rule.. aside from 1 naturalized player (bahala na countries how they will apply that) add 2 more players who got their passports beyond 16 years of age but has claimed heritage of that country (fil-ams natin).. I think that would be a good compromise and it will increase competition din within regions especially ours.. just a suggestion..
additional work for the eligibility committee to review and establish the heritage connection.. but it is what it is.. that is their job.. if mabagal then it is the responsibility of the country to apply for approval earlier than usual..
just my suggestion and I think this will benefit a lot of countries and will benefit the competition in the sport..
but just on the heritage rule, ultimately it is still supported by document verification, whether that be parent or grandparent has previous citizenship or whatever, there always has to be a document basis cut-off. It cannot be mere blood lineage , na kahit how far , like African slave migrants in 1900. .
now whatever that setting level is ( e.g. allow 2 players with parent are citizens, note JC woild Not qualify )you have to forecast the consequences for all. It is very possible that other counties with more lenient laws and big dispora population can take advantage much more than we can..
it's actually a myth that Philippines has a higher population of people who are overseas. Example 80% of Ireland population don't live in Ireland.Last edited by DAdmiral; 10-05-2023, 05:00 AM.
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Kai Sotto
AJ Edu
Geo Chiu
Carl Tamayo
Justin Baltazar
Mason Amos
Angelou Kouame (naturalized player)
Guys, do you think with such frontline, we have among the strongest frontcourt in Asian basketball in the next 6 to 8 years?"A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV
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what's your take on this guys? I am seeing a lot in social media that the win last night is the best ending/moment Gilas history... rightfully so...
but i beg to disagree.. no one can top SoKor vs Gilas 2013 FIBA Asia Championship... yes i do recognize last night we were down by 20 and cam from behind and won by a point.. but man back in 2013 that was really a close game as well.. went down the wire...
but i understand today's generation.. the most recent is the greatest..
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Originally posted by DAdmiral View PostAdd Sana
Philips
Balungay"A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV
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Originally posted by zuma169 View Postwhat's your take on this guys? I am seeing a lot in social media that the win last night is the best ending/moment Gilas history... rightfully so...
but i beg to disagree.. no one can top SoKor vs Gilas 2013 FIBA Asia Championship... yes i do recognize last night we were down by 20 and cam from behind and won by a point.. but man back in 2013 that was really a close game as well.. went down the wire...
but i understand today's generation.. the most recent is the greatest.."A king may move a man, a father may claim a son, but that man can also move himself, and only then does that man truly begin his own game. Remember that howsoever you are played or by whom, your soul is in your keeping alone, even though those who presume to play you be kings or men of power, when you stand before God, you cannot say, 'But I was told by others to do thus,' or that virtue was not convenient at the time. This will not suffice." - King Baldwin IV
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Originally posted by Sikatrix View Post
Sorry I think Ive read BGR tried but failed, anyone else?
SOCIAL MEDIABrandon Ganuelas-Rosser won’t fulfill his dream of suiting up for Gilas Pilipinas after the International Basketball Federation denied his request to play. Coming off a solid showing in the Southeast Asian Games in Phnom Penh last May, Ganuelas-Rosser wrote the FIBA to have himself cleared “but there’s no luck with that.” Brandon is the […]
Here is the BGR article.
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Originally posted by DAdmiral View Post
Hasn't Philips been in the country as long as BGR or even longer? Doesn't it speak volumes why they (SBP) applied for an exception for BGR (but failed ), but haven't applied for Philips , who has a much better chance .
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Originally posted by Sikatrix View Post
Not really. They came early 2020, left for a bit because of the pandemic. Maybe around 3 years total.
Super confident by 2025 if SBP applies and lobby's Mike case he would be exempted.
if Philips had opportunity to play for BG (pandemic years ?) 100 % he would be exempted
Reason for Matt is simply the criteria of the policy, this isn't a moral argument of what is just or not, or if policy is consistent with every nations citizenship law, which it will never be
Following logic thst if eligibility policy is contrary to One's citizenship law , then FIFA is in violation of Cambodia way.of granting citizenship, as FIFA requires lineage or 5 yrs residency. Which would disallow the rights of Cambodia imports who got citizenship instantly. As you can see , policy can never be consistent with every citizenship lawLast edited by DAdmiral; 10-05-2023, 09:24 AM.
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Originally posted by zuma169 View Postwhat's your take on this guys? I am seeing a lot in social media that the win last night is the best ending/moment Gilas history... rightfully so...
but i beg to disagree.. no one can top SoKor vs Gilas 2013 FIBA Asia Championship... yes i do recognize last night we were down by 20 and cam from behind and won by a point.. but man back in 2013 that was really a close game as well.. went down the wire...
but i understand today's generation.. the most recent is the greatest..
However, when it comes to official FIBA games, the defeat of South Korea in 2013, which marked the Philippines' return to the world stage, along with the moral victories in the 2014 World Cup, are still the most significant, imo.
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