Originally posted by Kaireem
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Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V
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WE DON'T COUNT YEARS, WE COUNT CENTURIES
P. Noval, A.H. Lacson, Dapitan, Espanya
SANTO TOMAS APAT NA DAAN
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What's wrong with a Filipino coach? A Filipino coach will be coming from the same system that, for the meantime is problematic for us on the world stage. It's basically streetball. Iso-showboating, my-turn your turn, that's how our game has always been played. From the streets, to elementary and high school courts, all the way up to the PBA. How may teams/players innately pass rather than do a Kobe (Bryant) against 3-4 defenders? If you're a shooter, you're just some boring shooter. If you make the crazy spectacular plays, you're the man.
Filipino coaches, born, raised and bred in this system perpetuate it. We see that everyday on the courts & on TV. Until we are weaned from this streetball, my-turn, your-turn system, a Filo coach will always have difficulty beating teams with established systems. Unless we produce super players like JC, but 1 vs 5 is always disadvantaged in a team game. We can learn. And some of the younger coaches are already coming to this realization. The older Yeng Guiao, one time BCAP president and fiercely in opposition to foreign coaches already admitted this grudgingly, "napag-iwanan na tayo."
Why a foreign coach? Because they've had more success the past 50 years or so. Is it only because they're foreign? Of course not. Get the best man for the job that we can afford, if we're willing to spend. Countries with strong basketball programs, effective systems as evidenced by international success have useful knowledge. Why not leverage their knowledge when evidently, we're not getting the success we want on our own? Our educational system was Spanish, then American, but now we're training our own. Get the best person for the job, regardless of race.sigpic
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Lack of exposure of Filipino coaches in the FIBA game, plus our ISO centric style only works for one country, the United States, to a lesser extent, Latin American teams, but based on the recent World Cup, none of them made it to the KO stages,
for now local coaches should apprentice/train with a high caliber foreign coach simmilar to what Coach did for Ron Jacobs. Foregin coach should also focus on training the next gen of loacl coaches, and we have great young bright minds, all they need is training and exposure. Unfortunately BCAP is blined by their own sh*t
edit: there's a reason why PBA teams were trashed in the EASL and the recent Jones Cup
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Originally posted by ja.he View Post
Is the PBA really the measuring stick of success? Besides, Bill Bayno was able to coach in the PBA for just one conference as BCAP protested against him. Mark Dickel, Rajko Toroman and Todd Purves were just active consultants, not head coaches.
What I remember from Dickel was he was able to maximize Don Trollano. In his term, Don posting up smaller guards was a feature of their offense. He was forced to trade Trollano since the management wanted Parks. I don't remember much of his stint with Parks.
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Originally posted by greenarcher View Post
Pinoy coaches only go up against fellow Pinoy coaches. You will never learn what else is out there in the world when you only fight with people like you. You live in a country of keypad phones in a world of touchscreen phones. You will never know the new technologies/techniques if you are stuck with what you have.
Even for foreign-mentored ones like Charles Tiu, how long since he was last guided by a foreign coach? It's been ages.
If Japan, Indonesia, and a whole lot more countries (Canada has a Spanish coach) stuck to their own because of physical limitations, they would still be nowhere until now.
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Originally posted by shootingbwakaw View PostWhat's wrong with a Filipino coach? A Filipino coach will be coming from the same system that, for the meantime is problematic for us on the world stage. It's basically streetball. Iso-showboating, my-turn your turn, that's how our game has always been played. From the streets, to elementary and high school courts, all the way up to the PBA. How may teams/players innately pass rather than do a Kobe (Bryant) against 3-4 defenders? If you're a shooter, you're just some boring shooter. If you make the crazy spectacular plays, you're the man.
Filipino coaches, born, raised and bred in this system perpetuate it. We see that everyday on the courts & on TV. Until we are weaned from this streetball, my-turn, your-turn system, a Filo coach will always have difficulty beating teams with established systems. Unless we produce super players like JC, but 1 vs 5 is always disadvantaged in a team game. We can learn. And some of the younger coaches are already coming to this realization. The older Yeng Guiao, one time BCAP president and fiercely in opposition to foreign coaches already admitted this grudgingly, "napag-iwanan na tayo."
Why a foreign coach? Because they've had more success the past 50 years or so. Is it only because they're foreign? Of course not. Get the best man for the job that we can afford, if we're willing to spend. Countries with strong basketball programs, effective systems as evidenced by international success have useful knowledge. Why not leverage their knowledge when evidently, we're not getting the success we want on our own? Our educational system was Spanish, then American, but now we're training our own. Get the best person for the job, regardless of race.
last 5 champion coaches in the world cup were locals though - yugo for yugo in 2002, spanish for spain in 2006, american for usa in 2010 and 2014 and spanish again for spain in 2019
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Originally posted by C2Hamm View Post
Its not the foreign coach. Most fans are just saying that because they want gilas team to execute euro style set plays. Or at the very least, less iso plays, less dribble, and more made 3s. Im confident if sbp says they are giving coach ayo or coach charles the keys for till 2027 wc and PBA wont draft whoever player they pick that isnt in the pba, a lot would hold their opinion about foreign coaches unless either coach or sbp says something that ignite hatred again.
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Originally posted by Kaireem View Post
but our 2014 team didn't play euro ball? did they?
you get to speak your mind. Thats good. They are speaking theirs. Also good. If they are difference in preference, thats expected.
WE DON'T COUNT YEARS, WE COUNT CENTURIES
P. Noval, A.H. Lacson, Dapitan, Espanya
SANTO TOMAS APAT NA DAAN
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Originally posted by Kaireem View Post
so the coach is the solution? never mind if we don't have quality players? if it were a foreign coach at the helm of the 2023 wc team would you consider close games vs italy, angola and dr + the win vs china a success or at least a decent showing?
Originally posted by Kaireem View Post
which almost got us a win vs the dominican republic? i bet we would've won that game if clarkson didnt foul out.
last 5 champion coaches in the world cup were locals though - yugo for yugo in 2002, spanish for spain in 2006, american for usa in 2010 and 2014 and spanish again for spain in 2019
Our style and our coaches are only good enough for "almost". Decades of almost and still you want the same thing? We will forver be the team of "What Ifs" and "Almost". If that's good enough for you, nothing we can do about it.
Japan tried something new, and it did wonders for them. If Tab did not get booted out in the middle of preparations and still failed to beat Angola and DR, then be my guest, let's bring back Choke Reyes.
Originally posted by Kaireem View Post
but our 2014 team didn't play euro ball? did they?
There's a reason why our top players this year all play/played abroad. Does that not show you that their basketball is on a different level? PBA players being shamed should be enough proof that it is on a different level than the rest of the world. EASL and Jones Cup not proof enough?Last edited by greenarcher; 09-05-2023, 01:14 PM.
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Originally posted by ja.he View PostIs the PBA really the measuring stick of success? Besides, Bill Bayno was able to coach in the PBA for just one conference as BCAP protested against him. Mark Dickel, Rajko Toroman and Todd Purves were just active consultants, not head coaches.
Let's see if Ginebra and TNT succeed there after getting two imports. Let's see how they do in their groups.
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Originally posted by Kaireem View Post
which almost got us a win vs the dominican republic? i bet we would've won that game if clarkson didnt foul out.
last 5 champion coaches in the world cup were locals though - yugo for yugo in 2002, spanish for spain in 2006, american for usa in 2010 and 2014 and spanish again for spain in 2019
I don't really care if it's a local or foreign coach so long as he's bringing international experience. I'm done with the usual "learning experience" alibi or YG's "everyone is getting better we need to catch up" every time he loses a game. Every GILAS fan has identified the problems for more than a decade now like lack of shooting, predictable plays, too much iso, terrible roster building, lack of prep time etc. Sing me a new tune please
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Our import is a 33MPG 21PPG NBA Guy and all we got were ALMOSTS. Imagine if we did not have JC to keep the games close...
Japan's import has never even stepped foot on the NBA Summer League but they are on their way to the Olympics.
Imagine what a legit coach with FIBA experience could have done to JC and the team. Why settle for ALMOSTS?
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Originally posted by ja.he View Post
Is the PBA really the measuring stick of success? Besides, Bill Bayno was able to coach in the PBA for just one conference as BCAP protested against him. Mark Dickel, Rajko Toroman and Todd Purves were just active consultants, not head coaches.
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Originally posted by thatweirdguy View Post
That's the thing though. We were in the game because of Clarkson. We lived and die with JC. There's a possibility that we would have lost the China game too if Clarksoj didn't go off in the 3rd QTR.
I don't really care if it's a local or foreign coach so long as he's bringing international experience. I'm done with the usual "learning experience" alibi or YG's "everyone is getting better we need to catch up" every time he loses a game. Every GILAS fan has identified the problems for more than a decade now like lack of shooting, predictable plays, too much iso, terrible roster building, lack of prep time etc. Sing me a new tune please
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