Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

[Rds]

Tab is treated like royalty here and kinda deserves it but when people are quiet when Ateneo got destroyed in the WUBS what does that tell you? Personally I think a group of fans have blinders on and only hate on the PBA/Chot/SBP but they do not see the bigger more systemic issues we really need to fix in order for the country to truly compete at a global level. And again, once Tab said that Kai needed to go to Ateneo to make the NBA I automatically saw him as part of the problem and we cant move forward as a program if our leaders are endorsing nonsense for there own personal gain.

I have my problem with Tab but it is not basketball. His team is made up of around 8 rookies and 2nd years. He lost around 7 guys. 4 starters in kouame, padrigao, Ildefonso and Andrade. A key reliever in Matthew Daves. They just lost arguably the best FSA in UAAP history. After all of this they are expected to automatically win against a decent international college team?

Their new FSA is not as dominant or as tall as Kouame. They dont have a dominant player in their roster. If anything I think Tab is too loyal to his players. Thats on him but that doesnt say anything about his coaching and player development. He made slow Isaac Go to a decent basketball player. He is trying to do the same with soft Chiu. But the guy has no reliable offense. Chius lack of offense was partially the reason they lost.

Lets be real. Ateneo is not the favorite now. Even Tab needs time to develop his pieces. His pieces now are a bit inferior to last year. He needs time to develop them. But I dont think they will be the champ this season.

[DAdmiral]

While every one has their faults and fails , let's put context

As a program director or coach of a program (Ateneo) and employed as a stakeholders. One obviously is bias torwards the madate he is tasked to do. (Recruiting etc),

But some context, there is natural flow of things , Ballungay, Dwight all tried div 1 before moving to Ateneo, it's not the existence of Ateneo that took them away from Div1, rather Ateneo is a good plan B if failed to pan out .
2nd not all prep schools in the US are good , between an specialized environment that can be arranged with the Philippines for a phenomenon like Kai and just any US prep program. The local one is actually better for development.

Now if we're talking about NBA academy in Canberra, that's different, but in Kai's case he wasn't intending to go there or Europe, but a money driven US prep school, which for our best isn't recommended.

[greenarcher]

Which is why Tab cannot be both SBP and ADMU. If he is purely working for Batang Gilas / Gilas, there won't be bias and poaching problems.

The perennial problem with our youth teams is them being coached by either college coaches (Altamirano, Pumaren, Goldwyn) or by flat out trash - JOSH REYES.

[digitalsuperman]

I have my problem with Tab but it is not basketball. His team is made up of around 8 rookies and 2nd years. He lost around 7 guys. 4 starters in kouame, padrigao, Ildefonso and Andrade. A key reliever in Matthew Daves. They just lost arguably the best FSA in UAAP history. After all of this they are expected to automatically win against a decent international college team?

Their new FSA is not as dominant or as tall as Kouame. They dont have a dominant player in their roster. If anything I think Tab is too loyal to his players. Thats on him but that doesnt say anything about his coaching and player development. He made slow Isaac Go to a decent basketball player. He is trying to do the same with soft Chiu. But the guy has no reliable offense. Chius lack of offense was partially the reason they lost.

Lets be real. Ateneo is not the favorite now. Even Tab needs time to develop his pieces. His pieces now are a bit inferior to last year. He needs time to develop them. But I dont think they will be the champ this season.

ateneo is rebuilding now. i dont expect them to win all the time. also, ateneo is not a national team. i dont care that much less if they win or not. i dont understand why some other posters want us to react tab losing a game.

[IPC]

ateneo is rebuilding now. i dont expect them to win all the time. also, ateneo is not a national team. i dont care that much less if they win or not. i dont understand why some other posters want us to react tab losing a game.

As to the reaction to Tab, I think it's because the hate for Chot and SBP higher-ups is high, which is really warranted for the SBP heads. They want the hate to go to Tab as well for losing.

[digitalsuperman]

As to the reaction to Tab, I think it's because the hate for Chot and SBP higher-ups is high, which is really warranted for the SBP heads. They want the hate to go to Tab as well for losing.

good point. maybe because a lot of people here are high on tab and against chot.

[magic_chiongson]

why is tab being brought up here when he has nothing to do with the national team anymore, the ateneo discussions are at the uaap thread

[JAMSKIE]

As they say, "the proof of the pudding is in the eating".

Coach Tab has proven himself time & time again as an accomplished international basketball tactician. Of course he had/has his own shortcomings/flaws/failures. I think most Pinoy IBNers here would acknowledge that. But if you weigh Tab's upsides/positives versus his downsides/negatives, I think the former would out weight the latter by a significant degree.

[JAMSKIE]

why is tab being brought up here when he has nothing to do with the national team anymore, the ateneo discussions are at the uaap thread

I think what some posters here are implying is that coach Tab isn't criticized as much as a Chot Reyes or a Yeng Guiao is/was during instances of failures/loses.

[Sikatrix]

I think what some posters here are implying is that coach Tab isn't criticized as much as a Chot Reyes or a Yeng Guiao is/was during instances of failures/loses.

Personally thats not my point but rather one that putting too much blame on Chot or Yeng distracts from more systemic problems our program has. Its fun to blame those two but take them out and replace them with Tab or Goorjian and our program will still have a poor ceiling because of how decision are being made at all levels.

Now my main criticism of Tab is when he was in a position to try to change things did he do it or did he try to funnel Kai to Ateneo?

[kukikups]

Personally thats not my point but rather one that putting too much blame on Chot or Yeng distracts from more systemic problems our program has. Its fun to blame those two but take them out and replace them with Tab or Goorjian and our program will still have a poor ceiling because of how decision are being made at all levels.

Now my main criticism of Tab is when he was in a position to try to change things did he do it or did he try to funnel Kai to Ateneo?

I think any coach/program director who would have a chance to personally get to influence where kai goes at that time would do it. Who wouldn't (at least dito sa pinas)? Unfair advantage he has yes. Unethical, i don't think so given how UAAP and NCAA has been practically a "pro league" sa dami ng perang tinatapon sa mga bata ngayon. With Chot Reyes, he somehow has this talent of putting himself in the limelight, mostly for the wrong reasons, so that's on him. Yeng, on the other hand has been too rigid on his stand regarding foreign coaches to a fault while at the same time cannot use his influence to the stakeholders to prioritize the national team's schedule over. The whole ecosystem of SBP and stakeholders has a big problem and fixing it is easier said than done. We can blame MVP and his minions and even RSA and long hair for that, pero those 2 entities are probably the biggest sources of funds for Philippine basketball.

[Rds]

Personally thats not my point but rather one that putting too much blame on Chot or Yeng distracts from more systemic problems our program has. Its fun to blame those two but take them out and replace them with Tab or Goorjian and our program will still have a poor ceiling because of how decision are being made at all levels.

Now my main criticism of Tab is when he was in a position to try to change things did he do it or did he try to funnel Kai to Ateneo?

On hindsight I wouldn't say Kai going to Ateneo would be that bad. It wouldn't be the best. Kai was a player in their HS. Tab is basically the school program director and the college coach. What do you expect him to say? For a guy who prides himself in developing players and of coaching to win every game regardless of the players at hand, I don't blame him much for being biased.

What exactly is the systemic problem that you are pointing at? That good players go to college here and not abroad? I think that is not systemic. It's more of people with money willing to sponsor kids to go outside instead of their local alma mater. How is Tab related to that? Do you mean he should've told Ateneo's then booster, Lao, to sponsor Kai's expenses in the NCAA?

Altruism has its limits. It would be helpful if he weren't Ateneo's coach. But again why would any private entity shoulder Tab's salary just for him to coach Gilas? We know previous youth coaches poached players to their college. That is a risk. We are only avoiding that now because Chot Jr is not a college coach. It is what it is. Tab vocally recruiting Kai to Ateneo I think is not the problem. Kai was going where the money is. I don't think Ateneo has the same money as UP or La Salle. Its main come on probably is Tab himself. We know Kai was better off going abroad. Not anything Tab said was going to change that. But Kai going for the short term money of Ignite and the hype was Kai and his handlers fault not on Tab.

[Sikatrix]

On hindsight I wouldn't say Kai going to Ateneo would be that bad. It wouldn't be the best. Kai was a player in their HS. Tab is basically the school program director and the college coach. What do you expect him to say? For a guy who prides himself in developing players and of coaching to win every game regardless of the players at hand, I don't blame him much for being biased.

What exactly is the systemic problem that you are pointing at? That good players go to college here and not abroad? I think that is not systemic. It's more of people with money willing to sponsor kids to go outside instead of their local alma mater. How is Tab related to that? Do you mean he should've told Ateneo's then booster, Lao, to sponsor Kai's expenses in the NCAA?

Altruism has its limits. It would be helpful if he weren't Ateneo's coach. But again why would any private entity shoulder Tab's salary just for him to coach Gilas? We know previous youth coaches poached players to their college. That is a risk. We are only avoiding that now because Chot Jr is not a college coach. It is what it is. Tab vocally recruiting Kai to Ateneo I think is not the problem. Kai was going where the money is. I don't think Ateneo has the same money as UP or La Salle. Its main come on probably is Tab himself. We know Kai was better off going abroad. Not anything Tab said was going to change that. But Kai going for the short term money of Ignite and the hype was Kai and his handlers fault not on Tab.

Tab was selling BS that Kai can go straight from Ateneo to the NBA. Like lol.

[Sikatrix]

I think any coach/program director who would have a chance to personally get to influence where kai goes at that time would do it. Who wouldn't (at least dito sa pinas)? Unfair advantage he has yes. Unethical, i don't think so given how UAAP and NCAA has been practically a "pro league" sa dami ng perang tinatapon sa mga bata ngayon. With Chot Reyes, he somehow has this talent of putting himself in the limelight, mostly for the wrong reasons, so that's on him. Yeng, on the other hand has been too rigid on his stand regarding foreign coaches to a fault while at the same time cannot use his influence to the stakeholders to prioritize the national team's schedule over. The whole ecosystem of SBP and stakeholders has a big problem and fixing it is easier said than done. We can blame MVP and his minions and even RSA and long hair for that, pero those 2 entities are probably the biggest sources of funds for Philippine basketball.

Ive also being arguing for a long time that the true peril of PH basketball is that the parties involved prioritize self interest over PH basketball and where I differ with most fans is I consider Tab one of those parties.

[magic_chiongson]

Tab was selling BS that Kai can go straight from Ateneo to the NBA. Like lol.

i remember tab saying something along the lines that going to ateneo would be better for his development compared to playing overseas (i disagree with this) but don't remember him saying he could go straight to the nba afterwards. but yes, he should be criticized for that.

as for his tenure with the national team, he has show that he can accomplish equal or more than chot with far less support from the pba/sbp. starting from the silver medal in 2015 fiba asia with the team B or team C of PBA players, to 2021 teams with not a single pba player and high-level NP. i think that's what the issue is with most fans.