Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

[carmelo7]

If you have billions to spend being logical would be the least of your concerns, you would want results NOW. Reason why industry leaders (top guys) are not doctors, lawyers and field experts because these types would only go for what's logical and reasonable. Great leaders have the balls to go against what is perceived to be the logical choice, they're bold and have an outside the box solutions that wouldnt resonate to experts. If they lobby for the exemption of Brownlee and fail/succeed, who can say that it would be the last? or a waste of effort? If they throw enough money (everyone has a prize) they sure will do it again for something beyond reason. I'm pretty sure ideas to file for exemption for Philipps etc have been mentioned but for NOW its not enough they will only lose these players to BLeague anyways Lol If Im RSA or MVP, im old and filthy rich I say give me the results NOW not in 5-10 years. That fellas are the mentality we're seeing.
And its not BOBO when their thinking is just beyond your comprehension simply because they have the resources that you have no experience to speak of.

[zuma169]

Again, from my post, I am ALL IN for localizing Ange Kouame.. and in fact i am for the sacking of Al Panlilio and Chot Reyes because I think Panlilio is not a good fit and incompetent and Chot Reyes, while I have admired and respected what he did during the 2013-2014 FIBA season his time is up, but that is another issue.. what i am saying is now it is ok for brownlee to be localized.. he deserves it to be honest.. he has been in the country, played in the country and loved the country (well he is lucky that he is with a crowd favorite ginebra san miguel).. do you think if we loby for 2-3 players to be exempted, would that be ok or baka sobra na.. one at a time lang..

cge I ask you this, if the plan works, that only for this World cup 2023, brownlee becomes local and he and clarkson can play at the same time, will you complain? aayaw ba kayo? because me I am fine with it.. then the following years, work on the other ineligibles exemption cases, besides pasok naman sila sa criteria right?

I recognize this is a marketing ploy.. PURELY marketing.. because in this time and age marketing is important.. but are we really sacrificing WINNING by this marketing/personal interest plan? again, JUST FOR THIS WORLD CUP 2023! NOW.. not FUTURE.. NOT IN THE YEARS TO COME.. BUT NOW!

I am not against localizing our young guys in philips and kouame.. what i am just saying is NOW.. sorry i needed to emphasis NOW.. reality is there is short term and long term goals.. but again I am for firing Panlilio and chot because the long term is questionable with them at the helm..

BUT NOW, i don't think there is harm in trying to lobby for brownlee to be local.. AGAIN, I cannot emphasize it more.. NOW!!!!!

[reamily]

I cant take a word from Ricky Vargas as a valid statement..didnt he know how many naturalized japanese that has been playing in japan for a decade now.. buo na big man roation nila if they use his argument..

[IPC]

I'm looking at the Phillips and Ange exemptions this way. Rim protection, length, size, hustle, and interior defense at the 5 is a massive need, 'di ba? It's a need not just for the future, it's a massive need NOW. AJ's health is an issue, Kai is not really known for defense, though he can block some shots, Japeth's 36, and June Mar's become a two-way liability. Honestly, I'll take Mike and Ange over June Mar at this point, just because they have more to give NOW.

[zuma169]

Guys, that is why it is called EXEMPTION... because it is out of the rules.. and out of the norm.. and clearly brownlee is out of the rules and out of the norm.. for those Japanese guys, it is their call.. they could if they want to but they chose not to..

dba what is really stopping lobbying for localization of players like brownlee? again EXEMPTION sya eh.. there is no real standard for it.. you just have to present a clear business case.. of course with certain parameters pa ren.. he acquired citizenship CHECK, he has been playing domestic PBA basketball exculsively for Ginebra YEARLY since 2016 CHECK.. family has been residing here already CHECK.. mukhang pasok naman for the basic parameters.. then you present your case as EXEMPTION..

kelangan ba there is blood race connection? as previously discussed mukhang that is not a major factor.. kelangan ba formative years like from ages 12-18 lived in the country and played basketball in the country? i think that is a good factor but not the be all and end all..

so yes, ricky vargas is crazy i do agree.. but just looking at the case of brownlee PWEDE.. un lang naman eh.. it can be considered and worth a try.. will you spend a lot of money i don't think so..so why not try? dba?

does this mean we are shutting the door for the likes of kouame and philipps to not be localized? a resounding NO!!!! that is still on the table..

when was the last time a naturalized player albeit a local player scored 40 points despite a loss (well panalo na sana if iskati made the free throws) against a good asian team (Jordan) - Justin Brownlee - single handedly brought us back in the game..

[DAdmiral]

Resources are not limited to one's financial resources (e.g SMC), there other type of resources, and one of them is "goodwill favors "(for a lack of better term), by using the 1 favor card exception bonus we have as host on a 35 year old 6'5 player isn't wise prudent use of a super rare scarce resource (bonus exception as host ). . Do note the only reason Brownlee is a possibility for exception (based on his background and FIBA principles) is simply because we are host and can allotted leeway. .
essentially use you scarce limited resource wisely that has long term impact. Not 2 or 3 years), note we have to earn a world cup birth for 2027, relying on a 38 Brownlee for our bonus favor 1 exception, is simply reckless

Besides the likelihood of Brownlee being rejected is so much greater than Kouame or Phillipps. It's not like you can simply ask Sec gen please consider wholesale exempt all 3 . Nether can you go back 6 months later after getting Brownlee exception and say Paki sama si Koaume, one more favor please...Sec .
believe me if we get Brownlee expempted, Gilas and SBP will essentially be put on notice , as a federation using lobbying favors for hosting to full max

A Brownlee exception will put us back in terms of reputation for future dialogue for exceptions.. guaranteed..


go ahead go all in for this August, and trade away yoiir future for the.next decade , expect misery for the next decade . And why? Cause we failed to essentially plan.. and went for thr quick reward to win without building and developing.., sorry ha , that's not my definition of what a federation focus and mandate is. Who cares.if you can hire mercenaries , parang tayo Cambodia as host in a sense taking advantage for quick wins, and for what , bano pa rin yung level ng basketball development natin.

[BJ_Reloaded]

As I've said, we can use our 2023 FIBA World Cup hosting as a leverage for FIBA exemption on several players like Philipps, Kouame, Balungay.

Yup..its all about playing our cards on our advantage and theirs nothing wrong on it for as long as there is no bribery nor dirty politics involves.

[carmelo7]

There are top exec meetings (for limited favors) and also RSA-MvP level of conversations (unlimited)

[DAdmiral]

question, has any country been given an exemption for just a POTENTIAL player? just asking.. and when i say potential player, a player who now is not yet serviceable and ready BUT CAN BE (we are not sure) in the future?

What ? This is a regular thing and the real essence of exceptions, giving exceptions to players the federation developed as a youth .
fotu
Gsmber
Zain
Spencer

To name a few , this is what execeptuons are meant to be used for, for development players who essentially meet the essence of confirming allegiance to a country as a youth (demonstrated by getting a passport before 16 or shortly after & residency as a youth)
Using the exception on Brownlee a paid import who moved to a country close to 30 yrs old fully developed in his prime is contrary to essence of the exception guidelines..

[DAdmiral]

That's a terrible decision if use our bonus exception allotted as host (for lack of better term) on Brownlee, note it won't come for free without consequences for the future. Why ? The SBP will be put on notice as abusers of rules , and future dialogue for more genuine exception cases.will be impacted . Big picture it will impact us for the next decade, and to me is no way to build a program.. it doesn't mean anything if we can buy import help we didn't develop to win.

There is no pride in that approach

[DAdmiral]

Sec general will have a lot of explaining to do Japan and China if Brownlee is exempted and results in Gilas winning the Olympics spot, Japan will say if peude yun, what aboit all our NP.. good luck explaining and justifying that decision Mr Sec General, people get fired (voted out) with those kind of controversial decisions.

[JAMSKIE]

Honestly it's blatant incompetence negligence if they apply for Brownlee exceptions and not Kouame's

Agree.
This idea by Vargas further bolsters the opinion of some posters here (including myself) at how shortsighted SBP people are.
If people like Al Panlilio & Ricky Vargas continue to run the SBP, Philippine basketball is bound to get worse.

[JAMSKIE]

Resources are not limited to one's financial resources (e.g SMC), there other type of resources, and one of them is "goodwill favors "(for a lack of better term), by using the 1 favor card exception bonus we have as host on a 35 year old 6'5 player isn't wise prudent use of a super rare scarce resource (bonus exception as host ). . Do note the only reason Brownlee is a possibility for exception (based on his background and FIBA principles) is simply because we are host and can allotted leeway. .
essentially use you scarce limited resource wisely that has long term impact. Not 2 or 3 years), note we have to earn a world cup birth for 2027, relying on a 38 Brownlee for our bonus favor 1 exception, is simply reckless

Besides the likelihood of Brownlee being rejected is so much greater than Kouame or Phillipps. It's not like you can simply ask Sec gen please consider wholesale exempt all 3 . Nether can you go back 6 months later after getting Brownlee exception and say Paki sama si Koaume, one more favor please...Sec .
believe me if we get Brownlee expempted, Gilas and SBP will essentially be put on notice , as a federation using lobbying favors for hosting to full max

A Brownlee exception will put us back in terms of reputation for future dialogue for exceptions.. guaranteed..


go ahead go all in for this August, and trade away yoiir future for the.next decade , expect misery for the next decade . And why? Cause we failed to essentially plan.. and went for thr quick reward to win without building and developing.., sorry ha , that's not my definition of what a federation focus and mandate is. Who cares.if you can hire mercenaries , parang tayo Cambodia as host in a sense taking advantage for quick wins, and for what , bano pa rin yung level ng basketball development natin.

Very much agree on this bro.

[DAdmiral]

Very much agree on this bro.

To be clear there is no diplomatic way to say this other than Vargas idea (hopefully not supported by SBP) is plain BOBO , stupid.. Especially if Philipps is not included for exception in this golden opportunity as host to get a favorable decisions.

Koaume case to be fair I have no issues of deferring pushing for decision until a later date , at least continue the dialogue. What people do not understand is it absolutely matters how a federaion approaches things , there is appropriate process and protocols to follow. .and there are consequences if we do not act the right way.
submitting a request for exception when the case goes against the guiding principles to process exceptions and trying to influence decision through financial benefits, is downright unethical. Stupid and Bobo. Not everyone operates business similar to how it's done in the Philippines.

[Sikatrix]

Just to be clear, has there been effort to get Kouame an exception? Was it already rejected? I remember you DAdmiral saying youll do it once he was naturalized.