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Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

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  • That lineup of TnT with Mickey,MGR,Oftana,RHJ and Erram really held up well against Iskati,Gray,Malonzo,JB and CS...and w/ JB not a 100% due to food poisoning, Jap still recovering and the absence of LA, just too much firepower from TnT w/ Ginebra unable to match those

    Plus MGR was a forgotten man under Chot good thing it was Jolas and that Serbian consultant

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    • Originally posted by Metta View Post
      We've been blessed again with a potentially promising batch with our prospects that are within the 18 yr old range. With Mason, LSGH duo, Bahay, Gamber, Konov, Harris, etc. This batch needs to be developed and pushed ASAP. Imagine building this group's chemistry and teamwork continually and led by vets like Kai and Edu...in 5-10 years this group might be something.

      But key is continual development and pushing them into tough competition early (*ehem* next SEA Games).
      Hope we get guys like Bahay, Gamber, Konov, Harris, Lopez, Demisana, Gagate, and Pablo some exposure in the next SEA Games. Even ineligibles like Lucero, Ballungay, and Koon to establish eligibility. Preferably, those guys would be under a coach like Goldwin, or Charles, or Topex, maybe Napa. Heck, maybe Nenad if they can bring him back (he's already with the MERALCO bench).

      That is, if the SBP is more interested in player and coaching development than retaining the gold in the SEA Games. If even in 2025, they still want to retain gold, they'll send the best, regardless of age, meaning, even vets like Bolick (who'll be 29-30; well, if they want him again), Scottie, Parks, Malonzo (who'll be 28-29, but still), Japeth, Perez (who are in my opinion the only good veterans for Gilas by 2025), etc. Heck, even guys like CStand and Mikey. We'll win, but at the expense of player and coaching exposure.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by IPC View Post

        I think Espino was a better defender by a mile, though. He also had the mentality.
        The guy was tough. To be balanced the Phantom punch would have been bad if were on the other side. And the guy had some post-career shenanigans IRC. But put that aside Espino was tough as nails. He was an undersized center but he was tough at the post and faster than the taller bigs. He had good length and a wide base and you could rely on him. I was an SLR fan. He was the opposite of Jun Limpot. Jun Limpot was supposedly skilled but in the Asian games he was exposed to be a tweener. Not skilled and fast enough for the perimeter and too soft for the post. Espino outplayed him by a mile in the Asian games as well as in the PBA.

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        • Originally posted by carmelo7 View Post
          That lineup of TnT with Mickey,MGR,Oftana,RHJ and Erram really held up well against Iskati,Gray,Malonzo,JB and CS...and w/ JB not a 100% due to food poisoning, Jap still recovering and the absence of LA, just too much firepower from TnT w/ Ginebra unable to match those

          Plus MGR was a forgotten man under Chot good thing it was Jolas and that Serbian consultant
          Shows that you do not need to sacrifice size in order to have a small ball lineup. This applies to both teams. RHJ and Brownlee are the small ball fours, being natural wings, although they sometimes could be classified as tweeners. Still, you don't sacrifice much size with them, with RHJ being 6'6" and Brownlee being 6'5". In addition, MGR, Oftana, Khobuntin, Gray, and Malonzo provide big wings at 2 and 3 while not sacrificing mobility and in the case of Miah, Malonzo, and Oftana, firepower.

          I remember Chot saying that it's the age of small ball. Hope he remembers that you can have big small ball lineups which don't sacrifice size and defense.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by IPC View Post
            SBP will partner with SMC for the WC.

            https://www.facebook.com/PhilippineSTAR/posts/pfbid02cdWBQsUyzv1TAZNZUoBRkStGpNDmwryc2wnk2HRSZPC 4VmsS9bwipaMyhEJY7MuNl

            As if we don't already know that. They've been at it for months.
            I'd been watching a lot of Star Wars lately, and to borrow from it, "I have a bad feeling about this." In terms of the national team's future.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by IPC View Post

              I'd been watching a lot of Star Wars lately, and to borrow from it, "I have a bad feeling about this." In terms of the national team's future.
              if Long Hair’s tenure in SMC would be the precedent, win mode now would be the norm in expense of developing players.

              and UST would now be the dumping ground for the cadets, ao long Ateneo and Tab

              Comment


              • Originally posted by CoJ View Post
                if Long Hair's tenure in SMC would be the precedent, win mode now would be the norm in expense of developing players.

                and UST would now be the dumping ground for the cadets, ao long Ateneo and Tab
                Ginebra's developed some good players after farming or drafting, and similar with Mags (who have developed good PBA role players, but not so much Gilas-worthy guys), but SMB hasn't had that same track record.

                Even Letran with their championships hasn't contributed much to the development of a Gilas-worthy player. I dunno if Abando counts, because his emergence started with UST.

                Comment


                • I may be in the minority but i don't see a problem with a win now mode to be honest.. ae we always on developing mode? when is the right time to be in develop mode and win mode?
                  doesn't it go hand in hand? develop while winning??? besides, to be in a win now mode means the players have been developed already..

                  sorry if I may sound stupid or ignorant.. but logically that's how I view it..

                  do we mean there would be times we must lose to be in development mode.. then go full throttle to be in win mode?? again i go back, doesn't it go at the same time???

                  For me WIN MODE and DEVELOPMENT MUST BE IN OUR MINDS ALL THE TIME..

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by zuma169 View Post
                    I may be in the minority but i don't see a problem with a win now mode to be honest.. ae we always on developing mode? when is the right time to be in develop mode and win mode?
                    doesn't it go hand in hand? develop while winning??? besides, to be in a win now mode means the players have been developed already..

                    sorry if I may sound stupid or ignorant.. but logically that's how I view it..

                    do we mean there would be times we must lose to be in development mode.. then go full throttle to be in win mode?? again i go back, doesn't it go at the same time???

                    For me WIN MODE and DEVELOPMENT MUST BE IN OUR MINDS ALL THE TIME..
                    I actually agree with this mindset. Develop skills and winning mentality. Best veterans steady the ship and mentor, while the best young players develop. That's why for this WC, it's good that our best 12 is a mix of steady, productive vets and promising young players.

                    The problem is, win-now here means as many veterans as possible, even if some youngsters could reasonably take the place of some of the vets, especially talent-wise. That's when win-now comes at the expense of development.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by IPC View Post

                      Ginebra's developed some good players after farming or drafting, and similar with Mags (who have developed good PBA role players, but not so much Gilas-worthy guys), but SMB hasn't had that same track record.

                      Even Letran with their championships hasn't contributed much to the development of a Gilas-worthy player. I dunno if Abando counts, because his emergence started with UST.
                      oh yeah Cone has developed Thompson, Mariano, Tolentino while Mags makes the most of what they have

                      SMB and Letran would be the case of stockpiling established stars for immediate results regardless of the long term sustainability of the team. Like that 06 Miami Heat team, one a championship with veterans like Shaq,Zo, Payton, Jwill and Toine, the ff years they sucked until they got Lebron.

                      I hope Chua is open to hiring foreign coaches, knowing his bcap roots.

                      UST incoming season will be the best gauge if SMC can develop players.There’s no shortcuts in creating a long term Nteam program (unless SMC pays boatload of cash to a NBA mvp level player for naturalization)

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by CoJ View Post

                        oh yeah Cone has developed Thompson, Mariano, Tolentino while Mags makes the most of what they have

                        SMB and Letran would be the case of stockpiling established stars for immediate results regardless of the long term sustainability of the team. Like that 06 Miami Heat team, one a championship with veterans like Shaq,Zo, Payton, Jwill and Toine, the ff years they sucked until they got Lebron.

                        I hope Chua is open to hiring foreign coaches, knowing his bcap roots.

                        UST incoming season will be the best gauge if SMC can develop players.There’s no shortcuts in creating a long term Nteam program (unless SMC pays boatload of cash to a NBA mvp level player for naturalization)
                        Thompson,Mariano and Tolentino were already collegiate stars before they were drafted. Thompson won a lot of awards in the NCAA including MVP. To be fair Cone trusted them but the talent was already there.

                        Letran was hoarding a lot of veteran transferees even before Chua came. In college that matters a lot as players only has a few years of eligibility which they need to maximize. You need to make sure you fully utilize your roster as you don't know how long your championship window is going to be (like what happened to SBU, players transferred/FSA got banned/COVID-19 affected recruitment/players suddenly went pro etc).

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by zuma169 View Post
                          I may be in the minority but i don't see a problem with a win now mode to be honest.. ae we always on developing mode? when is the right time to be in develop mode and win mode?
                          doesn't it go hand in hand? develop while winning??? besides, to be in a win now mode means the players have been developed already..

                          sorry if I may sound stupid or ignorant.. but logically that's how I view it..

                          do we mean there would be times we must lose to be in development mode.. then go full throttle to be in win mode?? again i go back, doesn't it go at the same time???

                          For me WIN MODE and DEVELOPMENT MUST BE IN OUR MINDS ALL THE TIME..
                          It will depend on what is the ultimate goal, what do we want to win.

                          For example, I have suggested before that we have a promising batch of prospects within the 18-year-old-range. If the ultimate goal is for that batch to become "world-level" by the time they hit their peak...as early as now we have to be keeping that group playing together and developing them long-term. And that means making them compete against superior teams and getting their butts kicked (losing). Keep doing that until they catch up to those superior teams.

                          Unless we have a long-term developmental mindset like that, we'll never get to that next level in terms of world competitiveness.

                          And to clarify, majority of players in the PBA are done with development. 25+ year olds are finished products, their improvement will mostly come from experience especially since there is no offseason to work on skills.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by sroth3839 View Post
                            Every potential top baller in this country needs to avoid the PBA like a plague.
                            As long as Marcial and Long Hair are in that league, it will remain a hopeless case.
                            Originally posted by JAMSKIE View Post
                            The main problem about Gilas players playing in the PBA instead of playing in Japan or Korea, is availability to play with the national team in FIBA tournaments which are scheduled during the months of July, August & Sept. - period when PBA season is very much ongoing while all other professional basketball leagues in the world are on their off season.
                            Until there is a guarantee that the PBA will adjust to FIBA tournaments for good in terms of scheduling, yeah, potential top ballers should avoid it for the time being.​ Plus, you need to land with a team like RoS, Phoenix, and to an extent Magnolia, Ginebra, and even MERALCO to even have a chance at proper development.

                            College teams and leagues are mostly responsible for development here, but in some cases, development continues in the pros.

                            Oh well, at least after 2023, the only real needs from the PBA are Scottie, Malonzo, and probably Bolick and Navarro (who are free agents), maybe Japeth and Oftana. Who do we replace them with is the question. At least the reliance on the PBA should grow less and less if we're looking at talent.

                            Comment



                            • Originally posted by JAMSKIE View Post
                              This I say, SBP & PBA haven't taken SEA Games as lightly as they took FIBA Asia Cup lately. I say lately becoz SBP & PBA naman took it seriously during the 2013 & 2015 editions of FIBA Asia Cup (which was then known as FIBA Asia Championship). Hence, we won the silver in those 2 editions of the tournament.

                              Take the case of last year's SEA Games for instance, that Gilas team had some PBA players -Fajardo, Wright, Troy Rosario, Tautuaa. Yet during the FIBA Asia Cup, no PBA player was made available (except only Poy Erram). See how PBA puts weight on SEA Games over the more prestigious FIBA Asia Cup. Nangamote na nga tayo sa SEA Games for failing to win the gold, instead na bumawi sa FIBA Asia Cup, the roster that they sent in the FIBA Asia Cup was even weaker than the one they sent in the SEA Games.
                              Originally posted by IPC View Post
                              In last year's SEA Games, the only useful players were June Mar, Wright, Ravena brothers, Navarro, Lopez, and maybe Tungcab. Problem was, the latter three were DNPs in the Indonesia game; instead, Pogoy, Troy, and Montalbo, who could not contribute much, got rotation minutes. Of course the lack of defense on the three didn't help.

                              The only downgrade from the SEA Games to the Asia Cup was from the center position, because June Mar is better than Erram and Chiu. The rest were upgrades, and we still placed 9th.

                              Here's my personal comparison of the roster changes (the commonalities were the Ravena brothers, Navarro, and Lopez):

                              Guards: Belangel, Abarrientos, Parks > Wright, Montalbo, Tungcab
                              Wings: Abando = Pogoy
                              Tweeners: Tamayo, Quiambao > Rosario
                              Bigs: Chiu, Erram < Fajardo, Tautuaa, Go
                              But yeah, the lack of PBA players in that Asia Cup was telling of the lack of support. We needed a rim protector like Japeth out there. Kahit siya lang, after Kouame got hurt. Dwight's absence didn't help too.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by thatweirdguy View Post
                                Saw a post that Winston was told to not bother even practicing with the team as they had already picked out the players they wanted.
                                If that's true, that's how you get someone who could be a key piece to not commit to the national team.

                                Fucking morons. GarPax Bulls-level stupid, man.

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