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View Full Version : [round1, day1] Game B/3: Macedonia - Montenegro



Joško Poljak Fan
09-02-2013, 11:54 AM
Date: 4.9.2013
Time: 17.45 CET
Venue: Podmezakla, Jesenice

Game between an expected direct opponents for advancing into round 2.

Dr. Martin
09-02-2013, 12:12 PM
In 2011 we lost against Montenegro in the first game of the tournament (Over Time), After that match we won 6 games in a row (Croatia, Greece, Finland, Bosnia, Georgia & Slovenia) and Montenegro lost all other matches in the group. It was their only victory on the tournament. We can expect the opposite scenario this time :D

Good luck to both teams!

Joško Poljak Fan
09-02-2013, 01:29 PM
That's some coincidence :) I forgot that Montenegro actualy won a game that championship, as they were really playing unexpectedly bad.

This time Montenegro played only 6 friendlies before the tournament and the last one 2 weeks ago, meaning they've had a lot of time for coming up with potential in-game surprises. Should be an interesting game, whoever loses will complicate their life for this tournament by a lot.

wardjdim
09-02-2013, 06:47 PM
That's some coincidence :) I forgot that Montenegro actualy won a game that championship, as they were really playing unexpectedly bad.

This time Montenegro played only 6 friendlies before the tournament and the last one 2 weeks ago, meaning they've had a lot of time for coming up with potential in-game surprises. Should be an interesting game, whoever loses will complicate their life for this tournament by a lot.
It can very well be an early knock out one for them, if we buy the story that Serbia and Lithuania are so much better. I don't buy this story btw

auris1
09-02-2013, 07:31 PM
It can very well be an early knock out one for them, if we buy the story that Serbia and Lithuania are so much better. I don't buy this story btwGood enough to win?

Nothing to lose
09-02-2013, 08:11 PM
As much as i wanted to make proper introduction to the forums, i dont think i'll be able to do it now.So i'll just cut to the chase.

Montenegro is young national team, we are not in position to be favorite against anyone and we hope that effort those guys will put in group will be enough to get us to the 2nd phase, which is kinda our goal.

This is a very important game for both teams, a game which might decide traveler to the 2nd phase.I was reading those forums earlier so i noticed there is large amount of Macedonian posters which are confident they are gonna crush us and from prediction game thread hardly anyone giving us a chance.I brought that up because i dont think there is clear favorite in this match and i expect close game which might go both ways.We got rather easy schedule in the begining, so if we manage to win this game it would be a huge moral boost for next games against Latvia and Bosnia and Herzegovina.If we lose vs Macedonia we will be in much worse position in terms of qualifying to the next round and probably would seek a victory over Serbia or Lithuania which is unlikely outcome.

Joško Poljak Fan
09-02-2013, 08:54 PM
It can very well be an early knock out one for them, if we buy the story that Serbia and Lithuania are so much better. I don't buy this story btw
That's only because you've seen too many games :) and imo you're pretty much right here. The differences between teams trully are smaller than they were in 2011 imo - which would logicaly mean this championship will be a lot about surprises, few posessions deciding a lot.
The only team that I believe isn't able to pull an uspet on Lithuania and Serbia (as well as Macedonia as the 3rd) is BiH, due to their lack of defensive orientation, but otherwise an extremely open group (well, basicaly all of them except group A are, anyway)

@Nothing to lose, welcome at interbasket ;)

pimpekaustas
09-02-2013, 09:15 PM
In 2011 we lost against Montenegro in the first game of the tournament (Over Time), After that match we won 6 games in a row (Croatia, Greece, Finland, Bosnia, Georgia & Slovenia) and Montenegro lost all other matches in the group. It was their only victory on the tournament. We can expect the opposite scenario this time :D

Good luck to both teams!

that year peković came completely unprepared and overweight and was worst MNE player. it was clear even than he doesnt care to much for his NT, which is sad

Darrell Armstrong
09-03-2013, 12:50 PM
that year peković came completely unprepared and overweight and was worst MNE player. it was clear even than he doesnt care to much for his NT, which is sad

Just one question. Do you believe, once Pekovic renounced, that Nikola Mirotic's presence could help Montenegro? I'm still at a loss on why he didn't want to play for his home country. With a loaded frontcourt of Pekovic, Vucevic, Dasic, Dubljevic, Bjelica... it's a little more understandable. He wouldn't even be an starter.

xmarcinx
09-03-2013, 02:00 PM
Do you think Vucevic will play in s5? In preparation games he played from the bench, but he has joined later. In my opinion his impact on game will be huge. He is a great rebounder and he will score a lot of second chance points.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 09:21 AM
Do you think Vucevic will play in s5? In preparation games he played from the bench, but he has joined later. In my opinion his impact on game will be huge. He is a great rebounder and he will score a lot of second chance points.

Antic have some Knee-problems and doesnt train with the team for the last 3days but he will play today. This game is very important to win, I dont want my team to go thru that psychlogical stress again like in Lithuania.

pimpekaustas
09-04-2013, 09:24 AM
Just one question. Do you believe, once Pekovic renounced, that Nikola Mirotic's presence could help Montenegro? I'm still at a loss on why he didn't want to play for his home country. With a loaded frontcourt of Pekovic, Vucevic, Dasic, Dubljevic, Bjelica... it's a little more understandable. He wouldn't even be an starter.

probably cause of money :D he left to spain very young. and second thing, nobody knew montengro would have such a strong team after indepence. probably tought he wont make any results with montenegro

about todays game, i think euphory of macedonian fans will be calmed. montenegro will win!

Nothing to lose
09-04-2013, 11:46 AM
Mirotic would certainly help our NT, i'd dare to say he would probably be 1st or 2nd option on this tournament.The problem is that Spain, by names and talent strongest European NT with Ibaka as their naturalized player(which is legit NBA player and probably better player than Mirotic)are looking to add another naturalized player and push that idea using their influence in FIBA.If they manage to do that Mirotic is theirs, if they fail to do that Mirotic will probably play for Montenegro and tell us stories how he always wanted to play for us.

Mirotic already decided to play some mind games with Spanish basketball federation, by telling he doesnt wanna be 2nd choice if Ibaka is available and ended up not even making the squad.Not even that act of Spanish federation was enough for him to realise situation he is into so he published some statement on his twitter profile how he decided to skip this tournament and wont play for either country but he feels like he belong to both Spain and Montenegro .I seriously doubt Spain would choose him over Ibaka if they fail to make FIBA allow 2 naturalized players rule.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 12:31 PM
Mirotic would certainly help our NT, i'd dare to say he would probably be 1st or 2nd option on this tournament.The problem is that Spain, by names and talent strongest European NT with Ibaka as their naturalized player(which is legit NBA player and probably better player than Mirotic)are looking to add another naturalized player and push that idea using their influence in FIBA.If they manage to do that Mirotic is theirs, if they fail to do that Mirotic will probably play for Montenegro and tell us stories how he always wanted to play for us.

Mirotic already decided to play some mind games with Spanish basketball federation, by telling he doesnt wanna be 2nd choice if Ibaka is available and ended up not even making the squad.Not even that act of Spanish federation was enough for him to realise situation he is into so he published some statement on his twitter profile how he decided to skip this tournament and wont play for either country but he feels like he belong to both Spain and Montenegro .I seriously doubt Spain would choose him over Ibaka if they fail to make FIBA allow 2 naturalized players rule.

yeah and people still complain about Mccalebb...why should spain have two naturlized player they dont need even one...this rule was made for small teams to be able to compete.

Darrell Armstrong
09-04-2013, 01:12 PM
probably cause of money :D he left to spain very young. and second thing, nobody knew montengro would have such a strong team after indepence. probably tought he wont make any results with montenegro

about todays game, i think euphory of macedonian fans will be calmed. montenegro will win!


Money? Does he get paid for not playing with Montenegro? In ACB league there's no distinction between spanish and foreign-born player as long as they have spent their formation years in Spain. For example, Todorovic, another Montenegro player, is a counted as a "formation player" and has exactly the same rights as any spaniard. You don't need an EU passport anymore, much less spanish citizenship.

Anyway, Mirotic is NBA-bound. Bulls have his rights, if I'm not mistaken. It isn't like he's going to spend the whole of his career in Spain.

auris1
09-04-2013, 04:28 PM
What a game so far - fun to watch

Nothing to lose
09-04-2013, 04:39 PM
Macedonia is shooting lights out like 60% for 3, they seem like they cant miss their shots contested or uncontested.

auris1
09-04-2013, 05:26 PM
Macedonia is shooting lights out like 60% for 3, they seem like they cant miss their shots contested or uncontested.
It was like 55 percent before the half time,still impressive

macleopard13
09-04-2013, 05:31 PM
So Chekovski misses a tip in off a missed McCalebb attempt to win the game. Ouch. Should've given the ball to Ilievski the clutch shooter.

andz
09-04-2013, 05:31 PM
First big mistake from refs on this EUROBASKET.... that last shot should have counted for Macedonia imo? Can they look at video during the game? If they can then lol why they didn't

auris1
09-04-2013, 05:32 PM
What happened?
Why did Montenegro get the ball with 1,2 seconds left?
Anyway,i am happy i stayed with this game from the beginning

Miškinis
09-04-2013, 05:32 PM
Should the last macedonian basket be counted? Although the basket was barely touched but well, hmm... rules are rules... to my mind the refs did a mistake...

sambaras
09-04-2013, 05:32 PM
It was definitely a basket.That will hurt a lot!

madmax
09-04-2013, 05:32 PM
macedonians screwed up...montenegrins celebrating like they've just won FIFA World Cup too:eek:

Darknemo2000
09-04-2013, 05:33 PM
And yet Montanegro wins. I have to say though, that was an interesting ref decision not to give basket interference though Bjelica clearly had his fingers stuck on the net and moved the rim thus should have been a basket interference, but refs decided it was too minor for such decisive moment.

macleopard13
09-04-2013, 05:36 PM
macedonians screwed up...montenegrins celebrating like they've just won FIFA World Cup too:eek:

The fans, I hope, not the players?

Buzissa
09-04-2013, 05:38 PM
And yet Montanegro wins. I have to say though, that was an interesting ref decision not to give basjet interference though Bjelica clearly had his fingers stuck on the net and moved the rim thus should have been a basket interference, but refs decided it was too minor for such decisive moment.

If the basket was going in or not it doesn't matter. Everytime the defensive player pulls the net 2 points must be given. Terrible decision by the refs. And possibly decisive for the outcome of this group, too.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 05:40 PM
And yet Montanegro wins. I have to say though, that was an interesting ref decision not to give basket interference though Bjelica clearly had his fingers stuck on the net and moved the rim thus should have been a basket interference, but refs decided it was too minor for such decisive moment.

We got cheated big time i cant belive that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

no i will not gratulate any montenegrin player for this win because it was undeserved half of their points where fucikng free throws given for no reason cekovski got 4fouls in quarter 3 of them he didtn even move. The last second was a total teft from the referees..

I saw the repeatition 3 times the montenegrin player pulled the net moving the whole blackboart up an down while the ball was on it... this is unbeleveble

to lose that way hurts because montenegro doesnt deserved the win.

auris1
09-04-2013, 05:41 PM
what happened?
I had a very choppy video in the end.
I am just rying to put the picture together.
So KMD missed the shot(Bob),Chekovski tried to rebound/score.MNE definitely got the ball out of bounds afterwards.
Why did they get the ball in the end ,MNE?

Terrorizer
09-04-2013, 05:43 PM
Refs rob me of some right prediciton. Hanging on the rim when opposing team shoots the ball from the paint in the closing seconds of the game ain't nice. And why the ball went to Montenegro after it? Dumbass Pekovic may be absent but Montenegrin joke 'dream team' still get their wins secured by corrupt refs. I wonder why as Montenegro is a small (and, as I heard, nice and unpretentious) country. In order to make all the 'experts' who put them as 'almost metal contenders' look less silly?
P.S. I have no luck with my predictions as Belgium (on whom I bet) which lead all the game long lost to Ukraine also with 1 point difference.

auris1
09-04-2013, 05:47 PM
Refs rob me of some right prediciton. Hanging on the rim when opposing team shoots the ball from the paint in the closing seconds of the game ain't nice. And why the ball went to Montenegro after it? Dumbass Pekovic may be absent but Montenegrin joke 'dream team' still get their wins secured by corrupt refs. I wonder why as Montenegro is a small (and, as I heard, nice and unpretentious) country. In order to make all the 'experts' who put them as 'almost metal contenders' look less silly?
P.S. I have no luck with my predictions as Belgium (on whom I bet) which lead all the game long lost to Ukraine also with 1 point difference.
Trust me,your feelings are nothing compared to the way the whole Macedonia is feeling the hurt)

macleopard13
09-04-2013, 05:48 PM
Can someone upload a video of the last moments of the game? I want to see what happened.



Trust me,your feelings are nothing compared to the way the whole Macedonia is feeling the hurt)

Just like the whole Lithuania felt hurt after Macedonia won the game 2 years ago.

auris1
09-04-2013, 05:51 PM
Just like the whole Lithuania felt hurt after Macedonia won the game 2 years ago.
I guess we lost that game fair and square,no?
So no,it is not the same.
Losing 50 bucks or being robbed of 50 bucks feels different.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 05:57 PM
I guess we lost that game fair and square,no?
So no,it is not the same.
Losing 50 bucks or being robbed of 50 bucks feels different.

we lost because somone pull the net while the ball was on the rim not a regular tree-pointer in the last seconds we got cheated we have a repetition that shows that clear how you can compare those two games.

macleopard13
09-04-2013, 06:00 PM
I guess we lost that game fair and square,no?
So no,it is not the same.
Losing 50 bucks or being robbed of 50 bucks feels different.

I'm talking about the feeling - the sadness, the hurt. The situations are different, but the feeling's the same.

Terrorizer
09-04-2013, 06:02 PM
Trust me,your feelings are nothing compared to the way the whole Macedonia is feeling the hurt)
Yeah, I know. But I have strong sympathies for Macedonia (despite some of their self-confident fans), especially since their brilliant run
in Eurobasket two years ago. They gave a good fight to any opponent they faced and in the games that mattered they won against teams which were huge favourites. Such a nice team, really a fairytale story came true.

auris, you're right with your 'losing 50 bucks vs getting robbed of 50 bucks' metaphor. Lithuanian loss in QF was very painful and can be seen as a consequence of chain of highly unlikely events in the very end of the game but Lithuanian players can only blame themselves for that stupid loss. So situation is very different here.

trash can
09-04-2013, 06:04 PM
It's a shame that FIBA still don't allow refs to watch replay of delicate situations.

macleopard13
09-04-2013, 06:08 PM
Yeah, I know. But I have strong sympathies for Macedonia (despite some of their self-confident fans), especially since their brilliant run
in Eurobasket two years ago. They gave a good fight to any opponent they faced and in the games that mattered they won against teams which were huge favourites. Such a nice team, really a fairytale story came true.

Well, it's still the first game - there are plenty of chances to make it to the next round, especially because this group's unpredictable. And in the last EuroBasket, Macedonia lost the first game, and ended up winning the rest of the games, so it will probably be motivated to win the next game.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 06:09 PM
It's a shame that FIBA still don't allow refs to watch replay of delicate situations.


6061

still cant believe

klakis
09-04-2013, 06:13 PM
Some times it is pointless to even try to speak about ref mistakes(?) .
This is one of those times.
I must I admit that I haven't seen the rest of the game except the last minute.
But it was clear robbery in the last seconds.

auris1
09-04-2013, 06:14 PM
Oh my fucking god.
Can you guys really read English? Like,take your time and read everything? It just takes like 10 seconds. Not just skim throughout quickly?

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 06:20 PM
Some times it is pointless to even try to speak about ref mistakes(?) .
This is one of those times.
I must I admit that I haven't seen the rest of the game except the last minute.
But it was clear robbery in the last seconds.

refeeres shouldnt decide games if we accept this the whole tournement makes no sense. Id rather would drive home than to be part of that circus call Eurobasket

auris1
09-04-2013, 06:21 PM
Terrorizer - you did not get robbed - you just lost your bet,whatever,no matter how unfair it seems.
All i said afterwards that Macedonian people lost more than this,in comparison.
macleopard13 - apples and oranges,mate -feelings might be similar,but not for the same reason.Hence my comparison.
Pero Antic - i am on your side,it was not me who was compared games

Terrorizer
09-04-2013, 06:26 PM
And in the last EuroBasket, Macedonia lost the first game, and ended up winning the rest of the games, so it will probably be motivated to win the next game.
By the way, they lost their first game against exactly the same opponent in a heartbreaking overtime two years ago. Still my gut feeling tells me that history won't repeat itself this time. Yet their group is very open and, frankly, weak, especially with Serbian B (or C?) team. But let's look how these Serbian team will cope up with Lithuania which has a roster close to optimal. Maybe they will offer us some nice surprise a la 2009, who knows...

auris1
09-04-2013, 06:42 PM
By the way, they lost their first game against exactly the same opponent in a heartbreaking overtime two years ago. Still my gut feeling tells me that history won't repeat itself this time. Yet their group is very open and, frankly, weak, especially with Serbian B (or C?) team. But let's look how these Serbian team will cope up with Lithuania which has a roster close to optimal. Maybe they will offer us some nice surprise a la 2009, who knows...
Yeah,i feel the same way.Probably the game for the third,if that...
But it was a good game nonetheless.
I actually was rooting for Montenegro,no reason at all.Not true)

fasoulaki
09-04-2013, 06:46 PM
I found clear evidence that the referees were paid by greek lobby. :D

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 06:49 PM
I found clear evidence that the referees were paid by greek lobby. :D

well, that could be true it wasnt the only one mistake in that game but the biggest one. The referees gave us 12 freethrows compared to 28 of montenegro. I mean this whole game was horrible to watch.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 07:10 PM
well, that could be true it wasnt the only one mistake in that game but the biggest one. The referees gave us 12 freethrows compared to 28 of montenegro. I mean this whole game was horrible to watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ho_fqJjRYPM#t=86
here we go again even the fiba comentary said its basket interference

CG
09-04-2013, 07:18 PM
well, that could be true it wasnt the only one mistake in that game but the biggest one. The referees gave us 12 freethrows compared to 28 of montenegro. I mean this whole game was horrible to watch.

Dont forget greek loby rulzzzzzzzz;)

keratexas
09-04-2013, 07:29 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ho_fqJjRYPM#t=86
here we go again even the fiba comentary said its basket interference

yeap clear roberry for the former yugoslav rebublic of mac..

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 07:32 PM
Dont forget greek loby rulzzzzzzzz;)

i know, and you dont forget that karma is a bitch

qiangdade
09-04-2013, 09:21 PM
I only saw the video once. This is not an objective opinion on my behalf. Did the refs watch the replay? If they did I can partly understand their ruling. Ball is away from the basket after the original shot by mccalebb, THEN the net is pulled (possible foul on the guy who pulled it) and THEN player tries a put back. As I said I only watched it once, I don't know if the refs looked at the replay and I am not agreeing or disagreeing. I just got the feeling that this was their ruling. I have to watch it again and then look up if it is correct ruling. If the refs didn't check the replay then it's a travesty...

plato-ny
09-04-2013, 09:45 PM
Never mind whether it was interference or not. It should not have come down to the final seconds against a Montenegrin team that is supposed to be inferior.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 09:46 PM
I only saw the video once. This is not an objective opinion on my behalf. Did the refs watch the replay? If they did I can partly understand their ruling. Ball is away from the basket after the original shot by mccalebb, THEN the net is pulled (possible foul on the guy who pulled it) and THEN player tries a put back. As I said I only watched it once, I don't know if the refs looked at the replay and I am not agreeing or disagreeing. I just got the feeling that this was their ruling. I have to watch it again and then look up if it is correct ruling. If the refs didn't check the replay then it's a travesty...

The refs didnt check the video. Its not allowed to pull the net while the ball is in or on the way our around the blackboard which is the case in this one. We already know that its a mistake by the refs because the one guy gives us 2points because of basket-inteverence and the other guy decided to give the ball to montenegro which is a total paradox because they bounced it out. We have two major mistakes in this game Basket- inteverence and after that ball for montenegro without any reason which lead to our lose. Again we didnt lost we got cheated by the refs and we have the proof on tape.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 09:49 PM
Never mind whether it was interference or not. It should not have come down to the final seconds against a Montenegrin team that is supposed to be inferior.

this scene was just the culmination of everything what happend before the whole reffering was one-sided Montenegto got 28 free throws compared to our 12 FTs we got calls for almost nothing we had player with 3 or even 4 personals fouls in the second quarter.

plato-ny
09-04-2013, 09:49 PM
macedonians screwed up...montenegrins celebrating like they've just won FIFA World Cup too:eek: They are celebrating because this is only their second win ever, against the same country again, and it is a former Yugoslav neighbor.

macleopard13
09-04-2013, 09:50 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ho_fqJjRYPM#t=86
here we go again even the fiba comentary said its basket interference

Thanks for the video. The Montenegrin player didn't interfere with the shot that much by pulling on the net - the shot looked like it was going to rim out anyway.

plato-ny
09-04-2013, 09:51 PM
this scene was just the culmination of everything what happend before the whole reffering was one-sided Montenegto got 28 free throws compared to our 12 FTs we got calls for almost nothing we had player with 3 or even 4 personals fouls in the second quarter. Montenegro has defeated your nation twice in back-to-back Eurobasket tournaments.

vembli
09-04-2013, 09:53 PM
It's a big mistake definitely. Here is a gif of the moment (here (http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-2-siz__MgT0/UieArkeTQlI/AAAAAAAAAD0/c3QNOTvExKg/s1600/Ho_fqJjRYPM.gif)).
But what i'm not clear at all, as you can see at the end, Montenegro player throws the ball out, but the ball was for Montenegro team, is that another mistake or something else was judged?

qiangdade
09-04-2013, 09:54 PM
The refs didnt check the video. Its not allowed to pull the net while the ball is in or on the way our around the blackboard which is the case in this one. We already know that its a mistake by the refs because the one guy gives us 2points because of basket-inteverence and the other guy decided to give the ball to montenegro which is a total paradox because they bounced it out. We have to major mistakes in this game which lead to our lose. Again we didnt lost we got cheated by the refs and we have the proof on tape.

No, that is not a mistake. It is a reason for the refs to check the video, but in no means does it constitute a mistake that should be ruled in your favor. As I said I just briefly watched the play so I don't bare an opinion, no need to try to convince me. I will only shape an opinion after I watch the video again a couple of times. As I said the replay could prove it is a fair ruling, but if the refs didn't use replay then it is a poor decision by the refs (to not use the replay, not to rule in favor of Montenegro)

HalfCourTrap
09-04-2013, 10:05 PM
What is the point of submitting official complaint when there is no chance of changing the end result?
I mean, we lost the game , everything is clear but we just need to focus on the other games.

FIBA will not change the result.

HalfCourTrap
09-04-2013, 10:11 PM
Thanks for the video. The Montenegrin player didn't interfere with the shot that much by pulling on the net - the shot looked like it was going to rim out anyway.

Mate :

Interference
occurs when:
•After a shot for a field goal or the last or only free throw a player touches the
basket or the backboard while the ball is in contact with the ring.
•After a free throw followed by an
additional free throw(s), a player touches the
ball, the basket or the backboard
while there is still a possibility that the ball will
enter the basket.
•A player reaches through the basket from below and touches the ball.
•A defensive player touches the ball or the basket while the ball is within the
basket, thus preventing the ball from passing through the net.
•A player causes the basket to vibrate or grasps the basket in such a way that, in
the judgement of an official, the ball has been prevented from entering the
basket or has been caused to enter the basket.
•A player grasps thebasket to play the ball

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 10:15 PM
Thanks for the video. The Montenegrin player didn't interfere with the shot that much by pulling on the net - the shot looked like it was going to rim out anyway.

ok let me help you. I explain it only one more time. If the ball is on his way noone of the defending team is allowed to touch the net not to mention to pull it and bring the whole blackboard into vibration which is a clear atempt as you can see. I dont know why its so hard for you guys to see that its not allowed to touch the Rim the net... everything even if the ball missed the goal the team gets his 2points. due to basketball-interverence.

6062

macleopard13
09-04-2013, 10:30 PM
ok let me help you. I explain it only one more time. If the ball is on his way noone of the defending team is allowed to touch the net not to mention to pull it and bring the whole blackboard into vibration which is a clear atempt as you can see. I dont know why its so hard for you guys to see that its not allowed to touch the Rim the net... everything even if the ball missed the goal the team gets his 2points. due to basketball-interverence.

6062

Well, this may be a rule, but still, I don't think the pulling down of the net interfered with the basket that much. As it looks to me, the shot was going to rim out anyway. Just saying.

Pero Antic
09-04-2013, 10:37 PM
Well, this may be a rule, but still, I don't think the pulling down of the net interfered with the basket that much. As it looks to me, the shot was going to rim out anyway. Just saying.

its not alowed to pull end of story...points should have been given. You will understand just wait those guys will be refeering some LTu games too.

here is how this looks like with professional refeeres:

http://www.csnhouston.com/basketball-houston-rockets/talk/rockets-win-goaltend-clinch-playoff-spot

Victorious
09-04-2013, 11:42 PM
It's a hard call. The ball was out of trajectory. So I don't know if it is basket interference. Refs had to decide one way or the other and in this case they decided in favor of Montenegro. In crucial moments refs usually overlook doubtful fouls.

There is nothing to say. Had they judged otherwise, the Montenegrins would be complaining.

Mogrovs
09-05-2013, 12:16 AM
Mate :

Interference
occurs when:
•After a shot for a field goal or the last or only free throw a player touches the
basket or the backboard while the ball is in contact with the ring.
•After a free throw followed by an
additional free throw(s), a player touches the
ball, the basket or the backboard
while there is still a possibility that the ball will
enter the basket.
•A player reaches through the basket from below and touches the ball.
•A defensive player touches the ball or the basket while the ball is within the
basket, thus preventing the ball from passing through the net.
•A player causes the basket to vibrate or grasps the basket in such a way that, in
the judgement of an official, the ball has been prevented from entering the
basket or has been caused to enter the basket.
•A player grasps thebasket to play the ball

OK, here you have it. It's up to the judgment of the official whether the interference prevented the ball from entering the basket or not.
And obviously it didn't.

Joško Poljak Fan
09-05-2013, 12:31 AM
If that game contributes 1% to Srđan Dožai never ever refereeing a seriuos basketball game again, than I empathise with Macedonians and actually consider it worthwhile. I am a peaceloveing person, that never had the "stress" of meeting that guy on the street... without him Olimpija would get rid of 20+ loses and gain 20+ wins in the last few seasons of adriatic league... corrupted or not, the statistics are seriously against him...

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 12:33 AM
OK, here you have it. It's up to the judgment of the official whether the interference prevented the ball from entering the basket or not.
And obviously it didn't.

but they did decide interference first and later removed the decision and give montenegro the ball for no reason. This incident is not even in the higjlights clip on their site which you can not comment by some strange reason they disable that function only for that video.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 12:38 AM
If that game contributes 1% to Srđan Dožai never ever refereeing a seriuos basketball game again, than I empathise with Macedonians and actually consider it worthwhile. I am a peaceloveing person, that never had the "stress" of meeting that guy on the street... without him Olimpija would get rid of 20+ loses and gain 20+ wins in the last few seasons of adriatic league... corrupted or not, the statistics are seriously against him...

Well they paid him everyone knows how those things in our region work.....i mean it was a very important game and giving them 28 free throws compared to our 12fts for me is ridecilous.

YuGo_BoY
09-05-2013, 01:03 AM
Don't know if someone posted this, but here is short clip how it all happened...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVQxQ3QZCE4

it was broadcasted on RTS 2 in Serbia..

Joško Poljak Fan
09-05-2013, 01:36 AM
Well they paid him everyone knows how those things in our region work.....i mean it was a very important game and giving them 28 free throws compared to our 12fts for me is ridecilous.
Well, Čekovski could've avoid some of those Ft's by controling his temperament :) However there were quite some situations with Bo that could've been whistled differently. Overall I got a feeling those contacts at penetrations are not in focus at this championship, I personaly don't like it... but it's not that anyone really cares about that fact :)

Dr. Martin
09-05-2013, 03:26 AM
I really don't like to comment the refs. We lost the most important game, but we still have chances to win 3 games in this group. I doubt that we are able to repeat the history (2011) when we won 6 games in a row after the defeat from Montenegro.

lafa
09-05-2013, 07:12 AM
ok let me help you. I explain it only one more time. If the ball is on his way noone of the defending team is allowed to touch the net not to mention to pull it and bring the whole blackboard into vibration which is a clear atempt as you can see. I dont know why its so hard for you guys to see that its not allowed to touch the Rim the net... everything even if the ball missed the goal the team gets his 2points. due to basketball-interverence.

6062

Did you know that it is allowed to block the shot even after ball hit the backboard? If ball's trajectory is going up it is not illegal, nevertheless this situation is almost 100% interpreted as a goal-tending. My point is - referees know the rules better than we do, but they usually apply some logic factor to each situation, which in this particular case was not to count the basket. Put all this aside I still don't get why the ball was given to MNE afterwards...

Dr. Martin
09-05-2013, 07:47 AM
Did you know that it is allowed to block the shot even after ball hit the backboard? If ball's trajectory is going up it is not illegal, nevertheless this situation is almost 100% interpreted as a goal-tending. My point is - referees know the rules better than we do, but they usually apply some logic factor to each situation, which in this particular case was not to count the basket. Put all this aside I still don't get why the ball was given to MNE afterwards...

Just because MNE had to win this game.

keratexas
09-05-2013, 08:19 AM
Well they paid him everyone knows how those things in our region work.....i mean it was a very important game and giving them 28 free throws compared to our 12fts for me is ridecilous.

Y they paid him..cause there is no other way to win the new superpower of european basketball..

unnamed
09-05-2013, 08:40 AM
Don't know if someone posted this, but here is short clip how it all happened...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVQxQ3QZCE4

it was broadcasted on RTS 2 in Serbia..

I didn't saw the 2nd half of the game, but in that particular situation refs could have called over the back foul as well, Macedonian player holding his hand on the shoulder of Montenegrin player. I think it was good enough decision to not call anything

Levenspiel
09-05-2013, 09:21 AM
I've just seen it. This is a clear mistake, beyond any doubt. The pull is clear, it definitely affected the shot's success, and the rules say it should be counted as basket. If you have doubts, sorry, but it is only because you're biased :).

Shit happens though. Gotta got over it.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 09:45 AM
I've just seen it. This is a clear mistake, beyond any doubt. The pull is clear, it definitely affected the shot's success, and the rules say it should be counted as basket. If you have doubts, sorry, but it is only because you're biased :).

Shit happens though. Gotta got over it.

For all guys out there who are telling me it was all regular call and all this Bullshit even with the clear proof of the video goal-tending and the ball for MNE was just right. The tournement has just started just wait until those referees will have some of your games. Then we will see how smart you are.

Dreamcatcher
09-05-2013, 10:06 AM
I just watched the replay several times and IMO first of all it should have been a foul by Chekovski who pushed Bjelica's shoulder.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 10:14 AM
I just watched the replay several times and IMO first of all it should have been a foul by Chekovski who pushed Bjelica's shoulder.

Cekovski was sandwiched and pushed from behind please dont try it to explain did Cekovski say to bjelica to push the net? did Cekovski force him to do that?? i mean.....dont try to find a logical answer for that what happend

lafa
09-05-2013, 10:21 AM
Cekovski was sandwiched and pushed from behind please dont try it to explain did Cekovski say to bjelica to push the net? did Cekovski force him to do that?? i mean.....dont try to find a logical answer for that what happend

Oh, I get it now! Cekovski was sandwiched! That's it! Then it's ok to push Bjelica in the back.

Dreamcatcher
09-05-2013, 10:25 AM
Cekovski was sandwiched and pushed from behind please dont try it to explain did Cekovski say to bjelica to push the net? did Cekovski force him to do that?? i mean.....don't try to find a logical answer for that what happend
I just replied that it could have been a foul before everything else happened. That's it. And even if i'm not right (nobody knows exactly) that's happened what happened. I do understund you but it happens in life and in sport. Just remember 2010 WC 1/2 Turkey-Serbia endind.

unnamed
09-05-2013, 10:36 AM
Cekovski was sandwiched and pushed from behind please dont try it to explain did Cekovski say to bjelica to push the net? did Cekovski force him to do that?? i mean.....dont try to find a logical answer for that what happend

Its clear as day -Bjelica touched the net, but it would be better if there is another camera view. I just want to see what exactly occurred under the rim. I want to see if someone pushed Cekovski towards Bjelica, because from the video posted by yugo_boy reason why Bjelica touched the net is because he was pushed towards it by Cekovski, when they were battling for rebound

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 10:38 AM
Oh, I get it now! Cekovski was sandwiched! That's it! Then it's ok to push Bjelica in the back.

No you are talking Bullshit in that case cekovski was pushed from popovic into bjelica which you can see....if the referee decided to give a foul then it would be to popovic and cekovski would have made 2fts. IF you attack You can not make a foul if you are on the way to make a lay up. You only can get fouled by some defender which maybe happend but this wasnt given otherwise.


I just replied that it could have been a foul before everything else happened. That's it. And even if i'm not right (nobody knows exactly) that's happened what happened. I do understund you but it happens in life and in sport. Just remember 2010 WC 1/2 Turkey-Serbia endind.

that witch serbia was robbery just the same shit as yesterday. We have corupt referees and thats the point to many wrong major decision was made.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 10:43 AM
Its clear as day -Bjelica touched the net, but it would be better if there is another camera view. I just want to see what exactly occurred under the rim. I want to see if someone pushed Cekovski towards Bjelica, because from the video posted by yugo_boy reason why Bjelica touched the net is because he was pushed towards it by Cekovski, when they were battling for rebound

here you go, in this one you see even the foul before of sehovic on mccaleb

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JOsIyf-NpQ

unnamed
09-05-2013, 10:46 AM
here you go, in this one you see even the foul before of sehovic on mccaleb

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JOsIyf-NpQ
Yes, clear foul by Aleksa Popovic on Cekovski

lafa
09-05-2013, 10:51 AM
here you go, in this one you see even the foul before of sehovic on mccaleb

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JOsIyf-NpQ

You just shot your own foot here, pal. :)
Firsta of all - I don't seen Cekovski being "sandwiched",
Second - Popovic pushed Cekovski? Are you kinnding me? Compared Popovic's push with Cekovski's push, former would barely qualify as a tap on a buttocs, and since both happened simultaneously - obviously it should have been Cekovski's foul.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 10:56 AM
Hard to believe that you discuss if it wos robbery or not last night. The rules are crystalclear and 2 points most be given Macedonia.

This will probably cost us a place in the quarterfinals, so just imagen how big damage wos made last night.

But listen, nots just the scandal in the end, it wos poor reffering through the game. 28-12 free throw Montenegro. Makaleb after the game told I have never experienced anything like it, they hit me in the back several time witch is a very dangerous play and still no free throws final 5 minutes.


A lot of our players also received a lot of streange fauls whole game from begining.

A third part wos involved last night. Maight be Greece, but most likely Montenegro payd this reff.

This reff sooner or laters will face MZT fans, he will regret this.

unnamed
09-05-2013, 10:57 AM
You just shot your own foot here, pal. :)
Firsta of all - I don't seen Cekovski being "sandwiched",
Second - Popovic pushed Cekovski? Are you kinnding me? Compared Popovic's push with Cekovski's push, former would barely qualify as a tap on a buttocs, and since both happened simultaneously - obviously it should have been Cekovski's foul.
He has both of his hand on the back of player who's in position to rebound, plus he is pushing him. If you didn't know that's clear "over the back" foul.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 11:00 AM
You just shot your own foot here, pal. :)
Firsta of all - I don't seen Cekovski being "sandwiched",
Second - Popovic pushed Cekovski? Are you kinnding me? Compared Popovic's push with Cekovski's push, former would barely qualify as a tap on a buttocs, and since both happened simultaneously - obviously it should have been Cekovski's foul.

No, i am right Cekovski got pushed from popovic and nr.6 while he was on the way to rebound. There is no scenario where cekovski would have get that foul he was alone beteween three montenegro players.
Its not allowed to touch somone and bring him out of ballance while he trys to rebound no matter how hard he pushed please if you have no idea about the rules and the whole game dont try to argue with me its clear we have 2-3mistakes in favour for Montenegro and everyone can see that.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 11:07 AM
Lithuanian Sabonis say http://www.mkd.mk/sport/kosharka/evrobasket-2013/arvidas-sabonis-makedonija-beshe-oshtetena-sudiite-moraa-da-ja-pregledaat#1

This is one of biggest scandal I ever seen and I feel sorry for Macedonia they gott robbed. Why we have TV on arena if reff do not watch replay ???.

Also he mention many streange calls against Macedonia not just the ending.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 11:16 AM
reff stand one yard from the sitaution waching Bjelica not just tuch the net but almost rip it of and also watch fauls on Cekovski.

Still nothing :confused:

waching montenegrom alsmot kill makaleb a few time last 5 min, still nothing.

what the fuck wos going on ???? this is sport for krist sake. still someone involves politics or just coruption.

Dreamcatcher
09-05-2013, 11:22 AM
Oh yes, Montenegro is world and basketball giant, poor FYROM. For god sake, i understund your emotions but lots of neutral watchers don't see the final epizod so obvious as you do.

keratexas
09-05-2013, 11:25 AM
Hard to believe that you discuss if it wos robbery or not last night. The rules are crystalclear and 2 points most be given Macedonia.



A third part wos involved last night. Maight be Greece, but most likely Montenegro payd this reff.


[---deleted]..Take your nationalism and put it somewhere else..Your only achievement as a national team is a 4th place in previous Eurobasket..and still u accuse other countries that paid the refs..pathetic..Yes refs made a mistake but life goes on..You have 4 more games to prove that you deserve to qualify..

Refrain from insults, please. - Levenspiel

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 11:28 AM
what is it you saying ???? just cuz we aint a basketball gaint is OK to robb us.

[deleted]

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 11:29 AM
Oh yes, Montenegro is world and basketball giant, poor FYROM. For god sake, i understund your emotions but lots of neutral watchers don't see the final epizod so obvious as you do.

I take Sibonis word a bit more serious than yours.

Darrell Armstrong
09-05-2013, 11:30 AM
Well they paid him everyone knows how those things in our region work.....i mean it was a very important game and giving them 28 free throws compared to our 12fts for me is ridecilous.

They didn't pay enough, then. Macedonia could have won in spite of all those free throws. A bit of luck in the final seconds, ball goes in, Montenegro loses.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 11:36 AM
just not statistic 28-12 from FT. Also Think about all the FT who wos not given Makaleb and Cekovski. Than damage is a lot bigger.

and still they beat us with just 1 point. we almost beat reff and mne. in the end we did but reff refused to edmit last second.

Dreamcatcher
09-05-2013, 12:07 PM
I take Sibonis word a bit more serious than yours.

It's up to you, life and the tournament goes on.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 12:10 PM
They didn't pay enough, then. Macedonia could have won in spite of all those free throws. A bit of luck in the final seconds, ball goes in, Montenegro loses.

If the ball would have go in they would give some other strange call. For me its crazy how you can dare or even think as a player to pull the net in that situation if you know that you can be punished thats stupid it would be a stupid move for him But maybe bjelica knew that he wouldnt get punished in those cheated games there is always a player involved who knows about the whole robbery.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 12:14 PM
It's up to you, life and the tournament goes on.

think you all focus on only one thing (last second scandal) and forgett the whole picture. Whole picture is 28-12 FT for MNE and at least 12 clear FT not given Macedonia but insted wired fauls to Macedonia.

Of course MNE aint importent, but anyone can pay a reff. I am not a person that thinks that a reff all of sudden just forgett basketball rules.

Look, Makaleb jump and is hit in the back, that would be red card in football let go basketball, still nothing.

this can easy cost us an quarterfinals place as I see group A as a lot lot weaker. for us as a small basketball nations this is a disaster. for big basketball nations quarterfinals is nothing.

lafa
09-05-2013, 12:16 PM
Tell me guys, is Montenegro that much richer, that much more important basketball country than Macedonia, that those things about corrupt referees and etc. would be true?

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 12:24 PM
nothing to do with who is big who is small.

any individual with money can pay a reff.

a lot people with money in montenegro too.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 12:26 PM
listen, this reff Srdjan is well known in ABA liga for his corruption. Most of you have no clue about that.

can not understand that he is given chance at EC.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 12:35 PM
Tell me guys, is Montenegro that much richer, that much more important basketball country than Macedonia, that those things about corrupt referees and etc. would be true?

listen, you are not from the balkans i guess you dont know how things work down here the referee was a croat who has a very negative CV if we talk about bad or clearly wrong decisions in decesive moments. Its not about which country is more important. Money is not a problem if you decide to pay a referee and you have to know that the odds are against montenegro there is a lot money you can make if you invest enough in some betting agencies.

This match was very important for both teams and Montenegro wanted some extra help and yes day paid that croat who was the refeeree i am 100% sure. Why? because thats the only way how they thought they gona win and they did.

End of Story

Darrell Armstrong
09-05-2013, 12:39 PM
If the ball would have go in they would give some other strange call. For me its crazy how you can dare or even think as a player to pull the net in that situation if you know that you can be punished thats stupid it would be a stupid move for him But maybe bjelica knew that he wouldnt get punished in those cheated games there is always a player involved who knows about the whole robbery.

I wasn't referring to that particular play. Imagine McCalebb holds onto the ball and makes a last second three pointer from halfcourt. What influence can have the bribed referee then? A true professional would never let things go that far and make sure to keep Macedonia at least 4 points behind.

Darrell Armstrong
09-05-2013, 12:44 PM
there is a lot money you can make if you invest enough in some betting agencies.


Then that croatian referee was playing with fire. What if Macedonia somehow wins the game with a luck last-second heave? I don't think the guys who bribed him would be happy losing a lot of money, and may take out their anger against him.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 12:47 PM
Its a miracel that Serdjan still is around after all scandals in aba liga. Even Josko Poljak Fan admin on the forum can tell you this.

by paying the refff last night, montenegro edmit to them selfs they are weaker than us that they can not stop Makaleb so they are allowed to play nasty on him.

but still we are the one who will be with out QF place. Stolen or not. And the one who paid the reff wil sleep well. Thats why Fiba most react. This most not happen in sport or basketball, best team most win.

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 12:51 PM
Then that croatian referee was playing with fire. What if Macedonia somehow wins the game with a luck last-second heave? I don't think the guys who bribed him would be happy losing a lot of money, and may take out their anger against him.

This wouldnt happen they would give some call against the team trust me....montenegro gets the ball has 6sec. and finito

PS: the ref. indeed played with fire but thats a dark business you have to if you wanna get paid by randoms for fixing a game.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 01:00 PM
He play with fire. This time in wrong place. Thing is, we are fan group that do not forgett. If not from Fiba he will get his penalty sooner or later from US after ABA liga game.

when you pay a reff you are sure about more FT, fauls, etc.. Not guaranteed wictory.. You will get the extra needed help but you will not be given 80FT thats to obvious even if last night wos obvious too when they do not give FT to our players.

Yes, we did almost beat them last night so it almost happened.In fact we did beat them with 1 second to go.

surfer
09-05-2013, 01:13 PM
I just saw the position, clear basket. call was wrong.
but I don't think it is anything to do with buying refs and games.

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 01:23 PM
how you explaning all other shit against us whole game ????.

Butr a very interesting moment after the scandal. In fact reff behind the basket did actually give Macedonia 2 points. He wos the one with best views over the situation. immediately he wos called by the main reff to talk aboyt the situation and all of sudden changed call no basket. All this make this even more suspiciously.

Pipan is in schook and can not understand why fiba did not reaft after the game.


http://www.ekipa.mk/News.aspx?newsId=20101

Pipan : Ten times I watched the tape , this is a great injustice to Macedonia
team Representation
05/09/2013 14:50


It hurts when it's unfair , and that's it ... coach Ales tampered with , yesterday at a press - conference would not comment without looking further footage now absolute claims to Macedonia 's done great injustice with unrecognized points in the last attack . Montenegrin basketball player Milko Bjelica mrezhichkata played with , and it should be points for our team .
*
*
"I watched the tape a dozen times and it is clear that this was a great injustice . Many are affected and disappointed . The judge initially recognized basket and then pressured by the other two judges reverse the decision . I do not know why they did that , and I do not know why FIBA Europe reacted , " said Ales tampered yesterday for injustice .
*
*
But of course , most important is Macedonia to be fully prepared for today's match against the Lithuanians in 21 hours.
*
*
" We have to forget what happened , go ahead , do not expect a difficult match with Lithuania. The game will be repaired exam for us , but for Lithuanians " , stresses coach .

Dr. Martin
09-05-2013, 01:43 PM
It's ok MZT you have to calm down, we cannot change anything. We will get the wildcard for the WC in Spain, no worries ;)

Pero Antic
09-05-2013, 01:59 PM
It's ok MZT you have to calm down, we cannot change anything. We will get the wildcard for the WC in Spain, no worries ;)

haha no way

MZT Skopje
09-05-2013, 02:31 PM
my ass we will be given WC.