Would you call Okur and Turkoglu back?

[Levenspiel]

I noticed this question revolves around almost any topic related to our national team. So, let's discuss this here.

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The possibility of ruining team chemisty and friendship environment, built up by non-selfish, hungry-for-success players is the main disadvantage. Okur and Turkoglu gave awful examinations in the past, and it won't be easy to change their playing habits.

But, imo, we do need them in order to compete in a one step-higher level. Our present nt players fought hard, yes. But their offensive capabilities are limited. Besides we need some more size. Hido is an excellent SF for international play in a 2.10m body. As some of my fellow countrymen already remarked, both Nocioni and Nachbar created big problems for us in that position. Okur can create inside scoring. Anyway, we know they're talented. All we need to do is to bring them into the right attitude.

I don't think Okur will pose a problem in this respect. He's a humble player and came from very low steps of bball. Except the last EC, he always put a decent fight on court.

Eventhough Turkoglu is a risky player, I would call them both. I believe they already understood what they should have.

I mean, let's give them one last chance!

[Akyol]

So, here's my opinion:

Nobody can ignore the fact that both of them are very good players and two of the best European players in the NBA. We all know what happened in the last years but we also know that our game would be much better with two unselfish players like Hedo and Memo. Nobody can predict how they would do if Tanjevic nominates them.

Our goal is 2010 WC and we have at least two tournaments between it (EC 2007&2009). So I think we should invite them and carefully look at their behaviour and performance in those two tournaments

[ncroc]

Before USA vs Greece game, I thought the same way that we should invite them all. However after Greece incidents both in Euro 2005 and world 2006, I started to think again. Greece has never had a good youth generation. Probably they will never do. How come did they get this far ?
Greece's players are not NBA stars and they were not this good when they were 17-18. Whats going on here ? Is it just their luck ? I havent figured it out yet. Whay do you think ?
US has Dwayne, LeBron, Carmelo, Howard, etc... I like both Hedo and Memo a lot but they are not better that these guys. May be Memo plays at the level of Carmelo but again even though US has 6-7 players like Memo and Hedo, they couldn't beat Greece. Ok may be if this was a league type of thing, USA will lose only once out of 4 but its not a league and we will call Memo and Hedo for tournaments so in that respect, we may be better without them. I honestly want them both back in the team but I am not sure anymore.

[Levenspiel]

I never thought Hido and Memo were in the same level as Carmelo, or even close. They are not, absolutely. However, it's not important. We need them not as "stars" but as versatile, big, talented, and "fighting" players.

Think, we came this far, with the roster we have . I love all the guys in our current nt, but it's not their talent. It's their obstinacy and fighting spirit that brought us this far. I'm sure they'll do even better in the next years, as the confidence is flowing in their blood now.

I suppose I could follow the Greek team's development, and they present a perfect example for us. They couldn't make even the second round in 2001. But they showed some signs of this great team, then, imo. So, it takes a few years.

My suggestion is, let's try and see how it will work with true offensive (and defensive, in fact) weapons like Okur and Turkoglu. If they do not fit, just kick them out for good!

But if they blend well, then it becomes a different story! Besides, they're still young and can well play in 2010. Now, let's think EC2007, first. Kutluay won't be there most probably. How does this team look like?

Arslan, Atsür, Demirel (or Tunçeri)
Erdogan, Akyol
Turkoglu, Ilyasova
Gönlüm, Kuqo
Okur, Peker, Savas (or Erden)

[Akyol]

I would definitely take Tunceri over Arslan and Atsür. We can't wait for Arslan exploding in a game like he did against Lithuania. Tunceri is perfect at organizing the offense and I feel muc more comfortable when he has the ball. We have to consider that this is a EC. I don't know how far we can go with inconsistent PG's which also have a high numer of turnover. So I would leave out Arslan and pick Tunceri

[Juan Carlos Nadal]

Greece has never had a good youth generation. Probably they will never do. How come did they get this far ?
Greece's players are not NBA stars and they were not this good when they were 17-18. Whats going on here ? Is it just their luck ? I havent figured it out yet. Whay do you think ?

Reading this comes as a huge surprise to me. Greece has never had a youth generation? WTH? When was the last time you checked any u-20, u-18 tournament results? They haven't done great this year, but for the last decade Greece has been one of the dominant forces in Europe winning medals in most youth competitions (a few of them gold). Not to mention the medals and titles in world competitions over the last 10 years. I honestly don't know where you drew the above conclusions from...

Back on topic now. If it was up to me I wouldn't invite Hedo and Memo back to the NT. Or if I had to, I would only do so with Memo. There are many examples of NTs that perform fine without their NBA stars. And besides I feel that the current chemistry will be inevitably disturbed. Hedo has a pure NBA mentality similar to that of the US team, which makes him great for the NBA but inadequate for interantional competitions. Just my two cents.

[Levenspiel]

I, myself, was the biggest Tunçeri defender in the past , (and spent many words defending him in batug.com's forums, too. I don't know, maybe they still keep those records. I quit that forum quite a while ago).

But, I'm tired of his weak mentality. He could be the most talented pg, but he has zero self-confidence, and that thing is in flooding amounts in Ender. If only we could combine these two.

Both will play in foreign leagues this year, and let's judge them by their performances. I have a deep faith in Demirel, but he's very young (19), so probably Engin, Ender, Kerem trio will constitute our pg group.

[Levenspiel]

Back on topic now. If it was up to me I wouldn't invite Hedo and Memo back to the NT. Or if I had to, I would only do so with Memo. There are many examples of NTs that perform fine without their NBA stars. And besides I feel that the current chemistry will be inevitably disturbed. Hedo has a pure NBA mentality similar to that of the US team, which makes him great for the NBA but inadequate for interantional competitions. Just my two cents.

I remember your words before the WBC, JCN. You said it was a good thing that Memo, Hido and Türkcan would not come, and Turkish nt would perform better without them.

But this time, I wanna try my chances (as if I'm the coach ) without any external influence; so, please remove those two cents .

[Spike]

I agree with sariss, I know a lot of people are mad at them (and some points are valid), but I want them back so badly! I am proud of this team, I truly am, they gave me such joy in the world cup. But after this tournament is over and done, we need to look to some realities.

Reality is we have seriously match up problems, if Slovenia played the miss-matches better we wouldn't even be here now. Reality is we have been hold to <10 point quarters 3 times (against Greece (6), Argentina (9) and Lithuania (4)). So when we go cold, we gooo waaaaay cold. Reality is that we haven't even won 1 game easily (except the Qatar game maybe), so we don't have the skills to hold a lead. Brazil and Slovenia matches come in mind, we had quite a big lead in both of them, but we gave it up to easily. Is this inexperience or do we not posses something extra, a thing that countries like Argentina and Spain have. Reality is that we don't have a consistent player, I think it's great that everybody in this team can step up, but wouldn't it be great that we have a player who can score a set amount of points in every game instead of scoring 15+ one and 3- the other (which is now the case in this team).

Now let me tell you what those 2 guys will add to this team (if they play with the right attitude that is). It?s weapons and match up problems, you know how much of a headache the likes of Nocioni and Nachbar gave us! Well if we have Hedo, the roles will be reversed, because there is nobody in Slovenia or Argentina that can match up normally against Hedo. Memo with it?s outside shooting will take one of the inside men with him. This means less protection under the basket. This all will lead to less pressure in the game, when I am watching this team it?s with a lot of passion (for sure) and they jump and hustle for every ball, but it?s never at ease. I want to see this team able to built a lead and coldly finish it, without giving the opponents the impression that they can come back. And I don?t see this team pulling this game after game after game like Spain has without our NBA duo!

Anyway this is how I think about it and we will find out next year what happens.
________
EXPERT INSURANCE

[parso]

Turkish Homecourt Advantage In 2010

I got this from the blog of Swen Simon of Germany... sweet!
Hope he is right.


TURKISH HOMECOURT ADVANTAGE IN 2010

Guten Tag Everybody,

today I want to write something about Turkey. The quarterfinals are a big success for this team, not because it is missing players like Hedo Turkoglu, Mehmet Okur and Mirsad Turkcan, but because Turkey got such a young team.

The team has chemistry problems since the success in the EC in 2001 in Turkey (3rd place). And players like Turkoglu and Turkcan were a big part of it. I've heard and saw many times that Hedo often wants special treatment (read: superstar treatment) and do you remember the fist fight between Turkcan and Okur at last years EC? How do you spell team cancer?

Now national coach Bogdan Tanjevic invited some of the talented youngsters born in 1987 or 1986. Four of them got a spot at this WC: forwards Cenk Akyol and Ersan Ilyasova (both already drafted by the Atlanta Hawks and the Milwaukee Bucks), point guard Hakan Demirel (a left handed floor general with a pass first attitude) and center Semih Erden. They were part of the U18-team, that won the famous Albert Schweitzer Tournament in 2004 in Germany. I saw the team several times in Mannheim and was very excited about it. Turkey got - besides the four guys in Japan - some more very talented players born in 1986 and 1987.

The team here in Japan already showed a wonderful hard fighting attitude and never gave up. That's why they won against a much better slovenian team. And in 2010 the world cup is in Turkey … that means four years more experience for a talented group and homecourt advantage (and you know that homecourt advantage can be a big thing with all that wonderful crazy turkish fans in the stands).

My advice: forget about guys like Hedo and Turkcan and continue to build on the young rising generation. They proved at the WC 2006 that they deserve it.

Okay, that's it for now. Excuse me? Ask that question once again, please … I couldn't understand you … Ahh, you wanna know about my predictions for the world cup 2010. It is really, really, really a little bit early, but … my gut feeling as of today is: Turkey is gonna win. Why? Just because I like the team.

PS: Here are my predictions for the quarterfinals. Argentina will beat Turkey, Spain will beat Lithuania, Greece will beat France … and Germany will beat the USA for sure (Sorry, but I can't predict against my country).

[Levenspiel]

Tanjevic interview!

Some notes from an interview with Tanjevic on this very subject.

Link to the original webpage (Turkbasket.com, in Turkish)

"Of course I'd like to see two big talents like Memo and Hido in my team, but they first must harmonize with the team chemistry."

Tanjevic said that this recent national team managed to revive the prestige that had been lost in the last years, and the achieved stability would be sustained at all costs. "It's too early to talk about the next year, but our major target will be the sustenance of this perfect atmosphere. It's difficult to predict at this moment who will be on the team for Spain 2007 or 2008 Olympics. Of course, we want to invite the most talented ones, but their talent alone will not be enough. They have to be team-oriented, compatible, self-sacrificing, fighting, and bold, also. We will set sail with the players willing to comply with these conditions. The national team now has some principles, and our roads will never cross with those who will defy these rules."