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Joško Poljak Fan
04-22-2011, 06:09 PM
Marko... Ožbolt being charged with offensive foul vs. Katić was beyond the "mistakes on both sides"... just as Katić's elbow on any occasion he got under the rim, or Jawai's push against Boisa.... Kecman's intentional punch against Ožbolt... those 3 for example (minus the elbow, which is to be honest more of an criteria thing) weren't either a "coincidence" or "mistake"... and theyussualy don't occur on every single game, yet alone all in 40 minutes...

yes, mistakes were made on both sides, but far from being evenly dispersed.
Also anyone that whistled some basketball games will tell you it's mostly the timeing of the calls that makes the difference, not the quantity.

In any way Olimpija screwed up for themselves, shouldn't be looking for an excuse with referees, but hopefully Dožai won't be whistleing another final again. I am getting a bit tired of him... no club deserves what Dožai is repeatedly doing to Olimpija.

Marko-
04-22-2011, 09:05 PM
Marko... Ožbolt being charged with offensive foul vs. Katić was beyond the "mistakes on both sides"... just as Katić's elbow on any occasion he got under the rim, or Jawai's push against Boisa.... Kecman's intentional punch against Ožbolt... those 3 for example (minus the elbow, which is to be honest more of an criteria thing) weren't either a "coincidence" or "mistake"... and theyussualy don't occur on every single game, yet alone all in 40 minutes...

yes, mistakes were made on both sides, but far from being evenly dispersed.
Also anyone that whistled some basketball games will tell you it's mostly the timeing of the calls that makes the difference, not the quantity.

In any way Olimpija screwed up for themselves, shouldn't be looking for an excuse with referees, but hopefully Dožai won't be whistleing another final again. I am getting a bit tired of him... no club deserves what Dožai is repeatedly doing to Olimpija.

I honestly didn't understand what was foul for Odzbolt against Katic and i still dont understand how did he make foul when he was the one falling down.
Dzawais elbow is criteria thing... so this is or isn't a mistake... depends on judges.
Now Kecman's hit on Odzbolt was intentional just like Odzbolts hit on Kecman second or two before that. It was Odzbolt who made very unsportsman move and Kecman acted back. If you try to recall when was the last time you seen Kecman in that kind of situation? I can't really remember(if we don't count Hemofarm fight where everyone participated, even players who didn't play xD).
So there was mistakes but there was also mistakes on Parizans behalf. Dzawais dunking and () moving into him so he can elbow him was really bad thing to do(dzawai was minor injured at that foul).
Then there was few fouls in block while black was moving with both feets and it wasn't counted so our guard have to run more around and then judges call fouls for it.

I think that Zdovc made a mistake in last few minutes whit his crying at judge instead of playing a game, since he lost the game in last 2-3 minutes.

AirBall
04-24-2011, 09:36 PM
OFg4zWRzNrQ

serbianhoops
04-24-2011, 11:58 PM
Partizan Belgrade also know as "the end justifies the means". :rolleyes:

Oky
04-25-2011, 03:01 AM
1. - First of organization of FF - joke. Fans of Partizan allowed to be behind their bench even though they didn't buy tickets to be there (they bought tickets to be on top like all organized fans) while fans of Olimpija were put on top. Organizator of FF didn't do shit to prevent this.

1. – I don’t see why are you prominence that? You should ask from your club management to give immediate resignations cause they were involved in organization of this F4 together with city of Ljubljana.


2. - Second of - reffs: Croat Serb Srdjan Dožai was MVP of the game. Calls were unbelieveble.

2. – Srdjan Dozai = Croat Serb, now that’s a new one, you just now how to make people laugh ;)


3. - It was simply directed that Olimpija couldn't have won the game.

3. – Now that’s a statement! It was directed that Olimpija may not win the game, especially when we know that neither Partizan or any Serbian club has no people in ruling board of the league, knowing that NLB is main sponsor of the competition, that you were given F4 organization for the fourth time (a record), even tough Buducnost, as a debutant should be the only logic and normal choice. Some should be really a narrow minded to create such theory, and belive in it…. Directed…. Epic!


4. - Photographer who was standing near the basket heard Dožai telling Gist (after foul) when he was all nervous: "Don't worry, you will win today".

4. – So a Croat referee, that was refereeing Euroleague final game in 2008, risks his career and reputation ruling in Partizan favor cause of the directions from god knows who, and than saying it loud and clear in the middle of the game in front of everyone and puts his career on stake, can that be ...? Well I guess if that Photographer said it, it’s pretty reliable. No way he is just pissed of Olimpija fan, just couldn’t be, :D


5. - They weren't calling those nasty fouls of Katić/Jawai under basket,

5. – Ok, honestly speaking our centers and Partizan in general is forcing a physical game with lots of contact, on the edge of foul calling, so to say. So its normal that there were some fouls in our paint that referees overlooked, 2 or 3 maximum. And on the other side there were similar situations as well.
Still you’re not taking a count a fact that Olimpija played almost whole game outside the paint, forcing a three pointer, and perimeter shots, and almost a half game you played without true center, with Boisa or Markota on that position. When you play like that, avoiding a duel with physical dominant opponent, you cannot expect to have same amount of free throws or fouls. Why Zdovc didn’t tried with Anagonye playing more, he played only 4 minutes and managed to bump out Katic pretty easy couple times.


6. - not mentioning unsportsmanlike foul of Kecman on Ožbolt and many of those calls.

6. – I agree, clear unsportsmanlike foul by Kecman, but second before that clear foul ON Kecman by Ozbolt referees did NOT see.


7. - Partizan already won the first semis by the help of reffs against Budućnost.

7. – This is silly, no one , I repeat no one from Buducnost complained, or even given a hint on referees deciding the game. Some of my friends, Buducnost supporters watched the game and they to didn’t mentioned that. I guess you’re trying to be more catholic than the Pope, or those it just hurt that much?


8. - Joke of FF. Being robbed by Croat Serb reffs in middle of Ljubljana. Pamti pa vrati. Mayor of Ljubljana Janković should be giving away rings and trophy after finals but due the spite against organizator (Roman Lisac and Rado Lorbek) he said everyone to fuck off and had a private "talk" with Lisac and Lorbek.

8. – The reactions from mayor Jankovic, Zdovc, and leading management of Olimpija just shows how sure they were in their victory, and how hard is now to accept the fact that Partizan was better, and outplayed them both physical and tactical, well in almost every aspect of one basketball game. So pointing out to referees is just a final resort to justify first themselves, then all the money that was poured in Olimpija (Club budget + debt forgiveness) this season.
And that kinda rhetoric is reminding me on one eternal losers club from Serbia… It’s a shame, I never seen Olimpija as losers.


9. - This is priceless: Vujošević after finals: "You should be working more with the reffs in the future." I guess he knows what he's talking bout, right?

9. – Now 4 days after the game, there is no where to find this article on Serbian internet or newspaper media. I’m pretty sure Dule didn’t said it that way, maybe it’s wrong interpretation?

And yes, MVP was Nathan Jawai, while Curtis Jerrels was the match winner ;)

Peace out, and relax.

elaj
04-25-2011, 08:52 AM
1. – I don’t see why are you prominence that? You should ask from your club management to give immediate resignations cause they were involved in organization of this F4 together with city of Ljubljana.I know for a fact who was involved in organization and responsible for this. City and club had nothing to do with organization itself.


2. – Srdjan Dozai = Croat Serb, now that’s a new one, you just now how to make people laugh ;)It was made for people to laugh, if you didn't understand the joke...


3. – Now that’s a statement! It was directed that Olimpija may not win the game, especially when we know that neither Partizan or any Serbian club has no people in ruling board of the league, knowing that NLB is main sponsor of the competition, that you were given F4 organization for the fourth time (a record), even tough Buducnost, as a debutant should be the only logic and normal choice. Some should be really a narrow minded to create such theory, and belive in it…. Directed…. Epic!Directed, once again.


4. – So a Croat referee, that was refereeing Euroleague final game in 2008, risks his career and reputation ruling in Partizan favor cause of the directions from god knows who, and than saying it loud and clear in the middle of the game in front of everyone and puts his career on stake, can that be ...? Well I guess if that Photographer said it, it’s pretty reliable. No way he is just pissed of Olimpija fan, just couldn’t be, :DI know the photographer who said this. I believe him and he's actually Serbian.


7. – This is silly, no one , I repeat no one from Buducnost complained, or even given a hint on referees deciding the game. Some of my friends, Buducnost supporters watched the game and they to didn’t mentioned that. I guess you’re trying to be more catholic than the Pope, or those it just hurt that much?Gavrilo Pajović and Momčilo Popović were complaining and Radonjić but they didn't want to speak up in public, same as Zdovc didn't and players of Olimpija.


9. – Now 4 days after the game, there is no where to find this article on Serbian internet or newspaper media. I’m pretty sure Dule didn’t said it that way, maybe it’s wrong interpretation?Yes, probably wrong interpretation. Dude, who are you kidding? :rolleyes:

Slovenian sponsors, starting next season, are gone from the league, btw. Thank god.

Anyway, conversation ended from my behalf, congrats on winning this. I have no problems with Partizan winning it, they were better at accepting whatever was going on on court.

Joško Poljak Fan
04-25-2011, 11:10 AM
... elaj, do elaborate about the sponsors, even if on private messages.

Few seasons ago, I'd actually jump out of my seat if I heard that, right now don't really care.
Out of 2 million € of sponsorship for the league waste majority is politicaly directed anyway, meaning if only one million would stay within our basketball, even losing NLB league wouldn't be much of an issue in general.

SunOverHStreet
04-25-2011, 01:10 PM
I know for a fact who was involved in organization and responsible for this. City and club had nothing to do with organization itself.

Directed, once again.
Do tell, let the world knows who's responsible!

I know the photographer who said this. I believe him and he's actually Serbian.
I highly doubt this story! Him being Serbian brings even more doubt...

Yes, probably wrong interpretation. Dude, who are you kidding? :rolleyes:
Even if he said that, I can't see what's Partizan's fault at it... Dule is a master at putting pressure on refs and he actually have right on this matter.
But, Olimpija will have to earn this right.

Slovenian sponsors, starting next season, are gone from the league, btw. Thank god.
So? Will this league disintegrate?
And why "thank God"? It's not that Serbs lured and black-mailed you into this league, it was the other way around, as I can recall.

Anyway, conversation ended from my behalf, congrats on winning this. I have no problems with Partizan winning it, they were better at accepting whatever was going on on court.
Partizan played finals twice in Ljubljana and both times there were problems, even some assaults... Both times Partizan was accused of shady business. I would like someone (for God's sake) to annex some evidence for instance, or just STFU! Demagogy is very popular throughout ex-Yu, among politicians, tycoons, religion representatives, sports officials, but enough is enough...

Joško Poljak Fan
04-25-2011, 02:07 PM
SunOverHStreet, you'd be surprised by all the things and people some individuals on this forum know.

SunOverHStreet
04-25-2011, 04:37 PM
SunOverTheStreet, you'd be surprised by all the things and people some individuals on this forum know.

I'm not interested in 'behind the curtain' doings... But if he have some infos, please, he should tell everything he knows, otherwise it's nothing but misleading. I would love to know how Partizan is doing those things, is it money, influence, what? I know for sure that money and influence isn't something that Partizan could brag about...

I watched the game, refereeing wasn't good, but I wouldn't say that it was in Partizan's favor. Refs made several mistakes on both sides, than compensating in very next possession. The obvious being Ožbolt's bumping into Kecman (wasn't sanctioned), which provoked Kecman's unsportsmanlike reaction (which also wasn't sanctioned, but should've been)...
I'm aware that little bit of cockiness is desirable, but something else is needed, too. I got the impression that Zdovc made his players more nervous, instead of calming them down. Maybe Ožbolt thought he'll hit every freackin' shot, like he did against Krka, thus his frustration... Partizan is not Krka, obviously, and 'you' need to play your arse off to beat them in such important game, especially in such aggressive manner. I mean, they were close and it wouldn't be wrong if they won it, also.
Now, the worst thing would be to abandon this project of new Olimpija, just because something went wrong for them in the finals...

Joško Poljak Fan
04-25-2011, 04:55 PM
Of course things goes on both sides, I am not that naive to believe in ultimate innocence of Olimpija's players :) For example I am surprised on few recent games by the ammount of low hits Ožbolt is sharing against his opponents and Jagodnik... well, you've seen him in Hemofarm for the last few seasons.
but that's not the point.

Elaj didn't make that quote up. It was also published here within majority of the media, which you can imagine, what kind of an outrage it provoked with the people within the club, within some of the Olimpija/NLB league sponsors, basketball journalists, fans or general public. I won't argue if it's true or not (I wasn't there to hear it), but in case it is, those referees have to be sanctioned as strictly as possible. Not trying to take anything away from Partizan by saying that, there are very few clubs I respect as much as I respect Partizan.
Sanctions are up to Lisac, Radić and Lorbek, I guess... but I kind of doubt anything will happen here.

There also shouldn't be any excuses about the abandoning the "new Olimpija project" due to all this. Olimpija is all about supporters and even if it would collapse one year ago, it would still be more of an basketball clubs than 90% of them out there :) as a fan of a club with devoted supporters that love their club and basketball I know you share the same feeling for Partizan ;)
Issues with Olimpija are elsewhere...

I wish Partizan fans would understand that all this anger isn't towards Partizan, but towards Dožai (and his alikes) and the management of the league.

SunOverHStreet
04-26-2011, 06:24 PM
2011. Adriatic league finals between Olimpija and Partizan.
FXZy0vxQ0qc&feature=player_embedded

SunOverHStreet
04-26-2011, 06:35 PM
Of course things goes on both sides, I am not that naive to believe in ultimate innocence of Olimpija's players :) For example I am surprised on few recent games by the ammount of low hits Ožbolt is sharing against his opponents and Jagodnik... well, you've seen him in Hemofarm for the last few seasons.
but that's not the point.
Jagodnik is another story and I deliberately didn't want to mention him, but Ožbolt was indeed a surprise...

Elaj didn't make that quote up. It was also published here within majority of the media, which you can imagine, what kind of an outrage it provoked with the people within the club, within some of the Olimpija/NLB league sponsors, basketball journalists, fans or general public. I won't argue if it's true or not (I wasn't there to hear it), but in case it is, those referees have to be sanctioned as strictly as possible. Not trying to take anything away from Partizan by saying that, there are very few clubs I respect as much as I respect Partizan.
You should be honest to yourselves. Hole city, sponsors, supporters, Janković, had high expectations and didn't even thought about possibility of losing the finals. That's the biggest problem. For the first time in God knows how many years, Olimpija manged to build respectable roster and to have successful European campaign. Not to mention that they never won Adriatic league(in it's current format) and this was the best opportunity for it, and also to justify the money invested. This is why this defeat hurts so much and I kinda sympathize with Olimpija's supporters, but some things are getting out of proportion. The story of Dožaj saying to Gist that he shouldn't worry is really out of this world. No body's that stupid!
I posted entire game here, so everybody will be able to see and judge by themselves. BTW, I have huge respect for your opinions and your way of thinking, but here I will have to disagree with you. If you have so much doubts about the game, it indirectly means that 'you', especially your medias, are trying to take this victory away from Partizan...

There also shouldn't be any excuses about the abandoning the "new Olimpija project" due to all this. Olimpija is all about supporters and even if it would collapse one year ago...
I'm aware of this, but as you can witness, Zvezda is in such situation and I'm pretty sure Zvezda's supporters would rather see it fighting for some trophy than see it just existing... I hope you understand what I mean.
And of course that I'm aware how much Olimpija is loved and followed in Ljubljana and that no one there would let it extinct and fade away.

I wish Partizan fans would understand that all this anger isn't towards Partizan, but towards Dožai (and his alikes) and the management of the league.
This league is desperate need for ownership restructuring, for fresh faces and new ideas. This league is turning into clone of Euroleague, but with it's bad things emphasized the most... Refereeing being one of the greatest problems.
Also, Serbian clubs deserve bigger respect and bigger stake in it's management than they have ATM. Having F4 for the fourth time in Ljubljana is just one of the examples of it's one-sidedness...