Top Lithuanian Coaches

[Mindozas6]

Fair enough. I watched 1995 EC final a year ago and the D was so ridiculously loose. That walking zone all the time. Off course, Sabonis couldn't and didn't want to step up, but that was more like pseudo D than real. I'm not familiar with pre-NT Garastas, but one can learn little from Garastas from current perspective, IMO. He may have been great in 80s, but in the NT there were little tactics and with better organised D we could really take gold in 1995. Sasha was shooting one open jimmy after another and there was zero adjustments.

The problem was that we had no tools for adjustments. Of course some coaching mistakes could've happened, I watched the game long time ago to remember all the details, but IMO most vital thing was fatigue. Don't forget that this was 3rd game in 3 days for our limited and a bit aged roster, all main guys played almost 40mins each in knock-out stage and bench was very short back then. Another issue was that our key defender of that generation - Chomicius was already aged and pretty much done. He was beast at defence and could cover lot of holes till 1992 more or less, but 1995 he was not able to bring that anymore. Anyway, if we coped well defensively with Yugos in group stage, then in final it looked like there are not much gas left in our tank for both offense and defense. As you wrote - Sabas was slow, Kurtinaitis was slow as hell and fouled out if I recall correctly, Marciulionis gave it all in offense, Lukminas never was a good defender, youngsters were too raw to help. Yugoslavia simply was younger, fresher, with a bit longer bench with more experienced players there. If we could match them in 1st half, then in 2nd it was harder and harder to do that and they finally broke us. Actually they were simply a bit better than us back then. It hurt to lose a lot, but now it looks like a bit better team won

 

[Straight forward2]

Damn, this scandal around Sireika is really something. I didn't read all the article, but obviously tons of ex players are saying that Sireika was super disrespectful, inadequate, cruel and so on. Super long exhausting trainings, direct humiliations of players while studying video, mysterious tactics and ect. I always wanted to be a player as teenager, but when you think about it's a tough business when you land on someone like Sireika and not Schiller Dude, so Garastas knew what he's talking about when he was really critical towards him. Here's Urbonusas takling about it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eI7YfTCcvKk

 

[Mindozas6]

I never was a fan of Sireika, to say the least, but why does it all reminds me of some sort of basketball'ish #metoo movement, when current soft generation can't handle some oldschool stuff. The same shit was happening with Saras and his supposed to be "monstrous" and "tyrannical" methods of work... Before that Kazlauskas was the target for media. Maybe I'm wrong and Antanas really lost his coolness a bit in latest years, don't know that. He used to get cocky and made bunch of wrongs decision cause of that, like stripping Nelson off his duties in 2004 for no reason after winning Eurobasket. Anyway, I didn't read all the article, not going to pay a cent for that, but if the worst thing he did was giving players some names, then it's just laughable. "I lost love for the game cause of such coach".. jeez. Such players are done, weak, unless they are hoping to play all career under the same coach, who can't say a harsh word on them. Good luck with that. That's the same wrong thing like coaches who are screaming for no reason (Seskus e.g.)

 

[Straight forward2]

I never was a fan of Sireika, to say the least, but why does it all reminds me of some sort of basketball'ish #metoo movement, when current soft generation can't handle some oldschool stuff. The same shit was happening with Saras and his supposed to be "monstrous" and "tyrannical" methods of work... Before that Kazlauskas was the target for media. Maybe I'm wrong and Antanas really lost his coolness a bit in latest years, don't know that. He used to get cocky and made bunch of wrongs decision cause of that, like stripping Nelson off his duties in 2004 for no reason after winning Eurobasket. Anyway, I didn't read all the article, not going to pay a cent for that, but if the worst thing he did was giving players some names, then it's just laughable. "I lost love for the game cause of such coach".. jeez. Such players are done, weak, unless they are hoping to play all career under the same coach, who can't say a harsh word on them. Good luck with that. That's the same wrong thing like coaches who are screaming for no reason (Seskus e.g.)

Well, I see your point. I agree to degree, in sports you can't expect to meat Gandhi type of personalities as coaches (you super lucky if you jump on someone like Schiller or Joan Plaza), but to me all this "old school" coaching, IMO, is destined to fade away. It's the trait of closed society where the hierarchy can't be moved and individuals have little options. I think A. Javtokas is right saying that now young players are about opportunities and motivation and not constraint. You can't get what you want with the "crack of whip", but only with motivation and attention. Most of the best new coaches are all classy, reserved and "players' coaches" who brake the distances between player and coaches, looking for connection, trust and mutual respect. Like Brad Stevens, Nick Nurse or Schiller. IMO, there can't be the team where there's no respect. Saras can yell the shit out of you, but you still feel he's giving you a tough love, nothing else. But even he to some degree I think stuck with some old school methods and he still can improve with that. Be strict, but not violent. Be strict, but emphatic, not authoritarian. IMO, with time teams will simply cut lose with players who needs authoritarians to get their ass moving. NBA is a player's league for a long time now and the ball game is all great, simply teams invest tons to scouting, exploring player's mentality and even mentoring them in the open society fashion. You can't motive player by saying "I'll fuck you up if you won't do it what I ask you", it worked in the past, but the direction is towards open society and you won't handle current youngsters with that shit IMO, even Saras will have to cut with his style soon. Europe will catch up with NBA rather sooner than later. We saw how much Obradovic achieved recently with his F word using all over the board. The guy is done.

 

[LuDux2]

I never was a fan of Sireika, to say the least, but why does it all reminds me of some sort of basketball'ish #metoo movement, when current soft generation can't handle some oldschool stuff.

OK, boomer. Thanks for winning WWII by the way

 

[Mindozas6]

Well, I see your point. I agree to degree, in sports you can't expect to meat Gandhi type of personalities as coaches (you super lucky if you jump on someone like Schiller or Joan Plaza), but to me all this "old school" coaching, IMO, is destined to fade away. It's the trait of closed society where the hierarchy can't be moved and individuals have little options. I think A. Javtokas is right saying that now young players are about opportunities and motivation and not constraint. You can't get what you want with the "crack of whip", but only with motivation and attention. Most of the best new coaches are all classy, reserved and "players' coaches" who brake the distances between player and coaches, looking for connection, trust and mutual respect. Like Brad Stevens, Nick Nurse or Schiller. IMO, there can't be the team where there's no respect. Saras can yell the shit out of you, but you still feel he's giving you a tough love, nothing else. But even he to some degree I think stuck with some old school methods and he still can improve with that. Be strict, but not violent. Be strict, but emphatic, not authoritarian. IMO, with time teams will simply cut lose with players who needs authoritarians to get their ass moving. NBA is a player's league for a long time now and the ball game is all great, simply teams invest tons to scouting, exploring player's mentality and even mentoring them in the open society fashion. You can't motive player by saying "I'll fuck you up if you won't do it what I ask you", it worked in the past, but the direction is towards open society and you won't handle current youngsters with that shit IMO, even Saras will have to cut with his style soon. Europe will catch up with NBA rather sooner than later. We saw how much Obradovic achieved recently with his F word using all over the board. The guy is done.

I agree that nowadays this oldschool strict style is fading away bit by bit, everything changes in society, all these human rights stuff and etc. I don't mean to say that all these movements are wrong, but simply goes over the top lately in some cases. The same goes with coaching. That crucifying of Saras some year ago was just laughable. The case with Zeljko, how media were reacting about his time-outs. I mean he did that all his career and it worked-out, it's sports, it's emotions, it's not like some boss screaming at some employee in office... so for media and some part of society it became a problem only now...
Generally speaking, every coach needs to be flexible. There are moments when you must stay calm, there are moments when you need to shout to get the best from players. But not like Seskus does, who is screaming his ass off just to do that, you still need to send some message with it. Players see that and spots the difference. Also some players needs to be screamed at to get the reaction from them, you need exactly F*** stuff to motivate them, try to be polite and you might lose control on them. While others needs some good words and to be cheered up even after bad moments to get the best from them. Coach has to be good psychologist. Let's say I still see exactly this as thing to improve for Saras - maybe I'm wrong tho, maybe in practices he is different, but on court he treats every player the same, while I think it's not the best way to go to get the best from each individual, but his emotions takes over

 

[Straight forward2]

I think even this F word using will decline as it is super rare in the NBA and the culture there is much different. EL always catching up with NBA and the shift is being felt even now. There will be other methods that will replace it. However, I agree that individual approach to each player is one of the keys. Here's what "player's coach" mean, by general definition and I have no doubt that's the future of basketball:

A players’ coach is a coach who embraces the individuality of their team and enables players to have a say in how the team operates.

https://lusussport.com/2016/09/21/players-coach/

 

[Mindozas6]

NBA is different thing. It's players' league, superstars rules there, coaches must adjust. I don't think that such culture will ever be established in Europe, we simply won't have individuals of such level/status playing in EL to turn the league into players league. But we'll still have European elite coaches here IMO and they will have big impact on bball culture. Sure it should change to some degree as whole world is changing around us bit by bit, but I hope it never will be like in NBA, it looks too fake to my liking

 

[madmax2]

I'll admit I was never a fan of these so called loud and proud "tyrannical" coaches in Europe, who have to scream their lungs out just to point out an obvious mistake from a highly paid professional player lol - if these pampered millionaire players have to be screamed at in order for them to get their mistake, maybe they are in a wrong profession then? It's funny how some of these clowns are actually even encouraging coaches to scream at them by acting all dumb and clueless - you would not see stuff like that fly in NBA in a million years imo, simply because everything in that league is wayyy more professional than in Europe, starting from clubs management and ending with the relationships between players and coaches. All of the best NBA coaches are reserved, quiet intellectuals with an exception of Popovich maybe, who is not exactly a pure blood american either...

 

[Dreamcatcher2]

After Zalgiris - Barca game Saras was asked about only 3pts scored by Grigonis in the whole game and Saras paid attention that there were 5 pts made by Grigonis, not bad, isn't it? Defense and details are 2 huge pieces of Saras's coaching.

 

[Hepcat2]

OK, boomer. Thanks for winning WWII by the way.

There's no need for personal remarks.

 

[Straight forward2]

If Šernius would be able to talk (I mean read few books of fiction in his life ), then he would be promising coach, right? Some meh Cbet at 5th spot? Also Žibėnas is a promising coach. Perfect in communication, social skills, good medium, keeps things simple, but spot on. With experience and some intangibles maybe he can achieve something.

These 2 names are more or less relevant looking long term.

 

[Mindozas6]

Zibenas looks as perfect assistant, not a head coach. All that he brought to Rytas is some psychological balance after everything was lost, so it wasn't that hard either, anyway he looks like a nice dude, has good tongue, can cheer up the players, basically everything what assistant should do, but tactics,strategy, didn't see anything worthy, even during that winning streak in lot of occasions game was unconvincing. IMO Rytas would make a mistake if they will keep him as headcoach, unless their ambitions are more or less like now - LKL final, BCL groups

 

[Straight forward2]

Zibenas looks as perfect assistant, not a head coach. All that he brought to Rytas is some psychological balance after everything was lost, so it wasn't that hard either, anyway he looks like a nice dude, has good tongue, can cheer up the players, basically everything what assistant should do, but tactics,strategy, didn't see anything worthy, even during that winning streak in lot of occasions game was unconvincing. IMO Rytas would make a mistake if they will keep him as headcoach, unless their ambitions are more or less like now - LKL final, BCL groups

Now, yes, he's just getting his feet wet, but I think he has potential to become legit head coach. He's still very young, 37yo, seems to be a hard worker, intelligent, has some natural qualities as a coach (communication), has sense for timeouts, reacts live solidly. If he can add a lot KNOW HOW with experience, he might be a coach. Let's consider that he couldn't change much in the mid season, he didn't have time, players come and go (literally or due injuries/virus), it's logical to keep it simple now, to build on hustle and team spirit. Or maybe he will remain mediocrity, but a good feeling about him. Oh, boy, how some guys would suck in his position, I wouldn't underrate what he did recently. The thing that there's no obvious BS from his side under these circumstances and how he managed to balance and unite the team it's pretty impressive. The word is said that Zavackas did a good job as well, setting strict understand team's inside policy and shit...

 

[Mindozas6]

Now, yes, he's just getting his feet wet, but I think he has potential to become legit head coach. He's still very young, 37yo, seems to be a hard worker, intelligent, has some natural qualities as a coach (communication), has sense for timeouts, reacts live solidly. If he can add a lot KNOW HOW with experience, he might be a coach. Let's consider that he couldn't change much in the mid season, he didn't have time, players come and go (literally or due injuries/virus), it's logical to keep it simple now, to build on hustle and team spirit. Or maybe he will remain mediocrity, but a good feeling about him. Oh, boy, how some guys would suck in his position, I wouldn't underrate what he did recently. The thing that there's no obvious BS from his side under these circumstances and how he managed to balance and unite the team it's pretty impressive. The word is said that Zavackas did a good job as well, setting strict understand team's inside policy and shit...

I don't underrate what he did, I just think it wasn't that hard or impressive, bearing in mind that when he was appointed team was at rock bottom and only LKL left to play, so no more pressure, not much faith, not big expectations. Any new coach in such situation usually finds that balance and brings fresh air. He basically did what he had to, but that's it. I don't see much of improvement game wise, only psychological balance and Rytas still winning games with just individual skills. Even against Zalgiris his pre-game tactics/risks almost cost Rytas the game early, but Zalgiris screw up the same way like vs Maccabi. Maybe he'll be good with time to come, improve his knowledge, but I don't see him as full time coach in Rytas for next season. Again, unless Rytas doesn't have bigger ambitions. In some BCL they'll need more than just good chemistry to win the games

 

[Dreamcatcher2]

I don't underrate what he did, I just think it wasn't that hard or impressive, bearing in mind that when he was appointed team was at rock bottom and only LKL left to play, so no more pressure, not much faith, not big expectations. Any new coach in such situation usually finds that balance and brings fresh air. He basically did what he had to, but that's it. I don't see much of improvement game wise, only psychological balance and Rytas still winning games with just individual skills. Even against Zalgiris his pre-game tactics/risks almost cost Rytas the game early, but Zalgiris screw up the same way like vs Maccabi. Maybe he'll be good with time to come, improve his knowledge, but I don't see him as full time coach in Rytas for next season. Again, unless Rytas doesn't have bigger ambitions. In some BCL they'll need more than just good chemistry to win the games

What i understood from the experience watching basketball is that a coach who does not bad (not great but quite decent) usually is not appreciated and the thing is that to find a coach who would do better is less chances than to find a one who would do worse. Let's take the same Rytas. The team by Adomaitis wasn't great but generally he did well with that squad. In spite of the fact, pretty much everybody welcomed Kairys instead of him. Some Straight Forward especially should have liked him because of intelligence, good speaking and communication that are the qualities that suits a coach the best by him. And what? Or the same Adomaitis would still be a coach of NT? In most cases worse things don't happen if a decent coach gets a credit.

With your logic you could say the same about Shiller. He do mistakes there and there and should be responsible for a bad LKL rotation and that the team lacked power in the end of EL season. So unless Zalgiris doesn't have bigger ambitions to reach top8 he is ok.

 

[Mindozas6]

What i understood from the experience watching basketball is that a coach who does not bad (not great but quite decent) usually is not appreciated and the thing is that to find a coach who would do better is less chances than to find a one who would do worse. Let's take the same Rytas. The team by Adomaitis wasn't great but generally he did well with that squad. In spite of the fact, pretty much everybody welcomed Kairys instead of him. Some Straight Forward especially should have liked him because of intelligence, good speaking and communication that are the qualities that suits a coach the best by him. And what? Or the same Adomaitis would still be a coach of NT? In most cases worse things don't happen if a decent coach gets a credit.

With your logic you could say the same about Shiller. He do mistakes there and there and should be responsible for a bad LKL rotation and that the team lacked power in the end of EL season. So unless Zalgiris doesn't have bigger ambitions to reach top8 he is ok.

It's your logic not mine

 

[Straight forward2]

Summa summarum Jasikevicius proved his worth. 2 titles in ACB. Euroleague's final after a long time for Barsa. Good first season. I think objectively Efes had more talent and more chemistry than rebuilding Barsa, so can't blame Jasikevicius on this one.

 

[Toruko2]

Summa summarum Jasikevicius proved his worth. 2 titles in ACB. Euroleague's final after a long time for Barsa. Good first season. I think objectively Efes had more talent and more chemistry than rebuilding Barsa, so can't blame Jasikevicius on this one.

But he made many mistakes. Especially leashing all the players not trusting them was a mistake. His archaic and ugly game plan was also an obstacle. He is guilty by not trusting his players. He cant be blamed fully because of the bad engineering for the roster last season but the move this season so far is worse tbh.

Playing final in a season Real and CSKA lost almost all pillars to the NBA is not a success. I wouldnt say he is a bad coach but he is surely not a good coach as well.

 

[Straight forward2]

But he made many mistakes. Especially leashing all the players not trusting them was a mistake. His archaic and ugly game plan was also an obstacle. He is guilty by not trusting his players. He cant be blamed fully because of the bad engineering for the roster last season but the move this season so far is worse tbh.

Playing final in a season Real and CSKA lost almost all pillars to the NBA is not a success. I wouldnt say he is a bad coach but he is surely not a good coach as well.

I agree that he should reconsider some of his ways, to allow more natural flow and a bit more liberal shooting overall, but he believes that he can give players even better chances to take their shots under set offense. On other hand, who besides Higgins could really go ISO? Basically, none. Mirotic is not an ISO scorer. Davies is pretty good at it, but he's a center with non reliable jumper.

Saying that Saras is not a good coach is too far reaching He lead mediocre Zalgiris' to several PO appearances and even final 4. Now he brought Barsa to final 4, he won regular season, that's something Pesic wasn't able to do with similar quality rosters.