Players that we can have naturalized

[lurklurk2]

to be clear i was taking about whining about how the Hagop rule is stopping us from competitive not whining about the lack of programs (that's different)

The perception that hagop rule is stopping us exists because we don't have the tools/programs to circumvent/take advantage of it. If SBP implements programs that allow philippine basket to work around hagop rule, these complaints will be gone post-haste.

 

[analyzed2]

I know this is moot , but with the benefit of hind sight , was it better to naturalize Blatche or Javalle McGee in 2014? (Javalle looks good with the Lakers)

 

[JAMSKIE2]

At that time Blatche is better choice... Javelle at that time have mental issues (due to lack of basketball instinct and IQ at that time), And he is not a go to guy material.. something that we need at that time due to lack of big time scorer in the 2014 roster..

Agree. And that's almost a no brainer.

 

[Alex072]

And always appearing in Shaqtin A' Fool turned off our officials... unlike in NBA that you can make some mistakes due to longer regular season eh the international tournaments/FIBA tournaments is a short duration of competition.. We can't afford to make mistakes just like he's doing always in the Shaq's video..

I wouldnt mind those as long as he will not do it 3 or more times a game.Blatche has his own share of lousy turnovers, not to mention he's always
overweight and and always look unmotivated.The only thing I think of that would be a turn off for Mcgee is his unavailability and injuries, thats because he's an NBA player but if he could remain available everytime and be professional on his dealings with the NT, then its all good.For me,he's the best long term naturalized player in 2013-14(?).The only thing of course is his talent fee.

Without the over generous talent fee or better yet if money was no object,Mcgee could have matched up better against Heddadi and Zhou Qi or any NBL player.Zhou will definitely have his hands full with Someone having almost identical physical gifts as him.Both of them being over seven feet with 7'7 wingspan, with Mcgee being the better leaper and the better overall player.To sum it up,China will not have much of a physical advantage against us at the center position, although they are still a very tall team, with Mcgee,Gilas would have been more formidable if not more Athletic.Mcgee will require anyone to think twice before challenging him in the basket,with that height,length,athleticism and talent not to mention he is a legit active NBA big.Yes anyone might laugh at him for being Shaq in a fool material but I'm pretty sure they also watched all his "grab the ball while it's still in the air" block videos.

We could have smoked the morale of any adversary.We would not require to double team the post with him on the low block,with Japeth and Javale on the post we could have two very capable shot blockers not that i'm saying that Blatche cannot block shots,but Mcgee is more willing leaper at the post,although this might also mean that he might be foul prone as well.He is more of a post player and probably twice as better defender than Blatche.

Thanks to Blatche we qualified for the World cup but we could have achieved more with Mcgee.With Blatche in the Asian Games i think we could have won a medal but with Mcgee, we could have gone in the finals at the very least and Yes probably a couple of wins in the World stage.in the World cup he could have provided 16 ppg.,12rpg. and 3bpg. but we could have won against Iran and Angola and maybe kept the game close against Tunisia.

In the Asian Games given we could afford two NBA player's salaries and that they could be allowed to play, Mcgee will most certainly compliment Standhardinger better because of Mcgee's dominating presence at the post,basketball will be too easy for Clarkson and Pringle if all they think about is scoring or making Mcgee look good on the Alley oop pass.Another good thing with Mcgee is he is not ball dominant,he would usually get those offensive rebounds and be a recepient of pick n' roll passes if he won't post up.

In the Asian Games, our shooters would have not hesitated to taking their shots.We see the effect of TNT having more confiddnce on their shots with Terrence Jones as their import,what more with an Athletic seven footer cleaning up the offensive glass plus Standhardinger who is a very willing rebounder as well.The fear factor would have been more tremendous on the opponents with Mcgee would could easily get 5 blocks a game something we missed dearly from Blatche.

Another good thing is that, unlike Blatche,Mcgee will not be on LeBron mode trying to act like a 6'11 Tragic Johnson everytime, that is also error prone and i doing that he'll try to shoot more than 2 three point shots a game although that of course is one of Blatche's strengths.Gilas basketball would have been more entertaining with Mcgee and Japeth getting those lob passes,with the probability of Mcgee getting at least 7-10 dunks a game.

Until now he's in top condition and still in the NBA,unlike Blatche who I think will still have trouble getting in any league because of his weight problem.I dont want to sound ungrateful to Blatche's effort but, it is what it is,If Javale were a bit more affordable and with the proper mind set, then he could have been the best naturalized player any country had.Simply put,Mcgee is high risk but high reward type of player.

 

[interxavierxxx2]

https://tiebreakertimes.com.ph/tbt/...ds-need-tall-guy-can-also-play-outside/187770

So they’re looking for another Andray Blatche but are open to a 6’6-6’8 small forward like Brownlee if Kai and Edu develop their skills enough. Hmm. I think JC is enough.

 

[mathematicianrcg2]

https://tiebreakertimes.com.ph/tbt/...ds-need-tall-guy-can-also-play-outside/187770

So they’re looking for another Andray Blatche but are open to a 6’6-6’8 small forward like Brownlee if Kai and Edu develop their skills enough. Hmm. I think JC is enough.

If Kai and Aj will be both nba players by then. Then sure, we can get a wing like Jc as our Naturalized player

 

[analyzed2]

Essentially by around end of 2022, Gilas management will determine if Kai, AJ and Clarkson (NP) and potentially Kouame as local is sufficient enough to meet our goals (e.g make 2nd round) for 2023, if not then decision basically is to find a NP (like Blatche last minute) and how much will it cost.

 

[analyzed2]

Assessment of level of wings vs bigs in Dec 2022

A. Bigs - Kai and AJ
vs
B. Wings- Dwight and Thirdy

This is what it comes down to if the assessment is we need more help in A. Versatile big (aka Blatche like) as compared to B. Wing come Dec 2022. then the decision should be to get a versatile big over Clarkson (a good NP wing) for the 2023 WC. of course cost has to factored relative to goal ( e.g make 2nd round)

The decision to process Kouame's NP is independent of this decision.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

https://tiebreakertimes.com.ph/tbt/...ds-need-tall-guy-can-also-play-outside/187770

So they’re looking for another Andray Blatche but are open to a 6’6-6’8 small forward like Brownlee if Kai and Edu develop their skills enough. Hmm. I think JC is enough.

Agree.

Though Clarkson is only around 6-foot-4 or 6-foot-5 and is more of a shooting guard than a small forward, he can obviously alternate at the 2 & 3 positions with relative ease. And being a legit NBA talent (Clarkson is not just an average NBA player), his skill level, athleticism & quickness are really up there.

Judging from the way he played for us in the 2018 Asian Games where he joined the team in the "11th hour", we can see that his skill level is really up there.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

Also, one positive thing about Clarkson being our naturalized player is that, he is a legit Filipino citizen in every sense of the world becoz he has Pinoy bloodline. Its just that he is not considered Filipino by the crap FIBA citizenship rule.

So its a pride thing for us Pinoys having someone like Clarkson (whom we consider Pinoy) as our naturalized player rather than having someone like a Justin Brownlee or Angelo Kuoame who has no Pinoy bloodline.

 

[Alex072]

Agree.

Though Clarkson is only around 6-foot-4 or 6-foot-5 and is more of a shooting guard than a small forward, he can obviously alternate at the 2 & 3 positions with relative ease. And being a legit NBA talent (Clarkson is not just an average NBA player), his skill level, athleticism & quickness are really up there.

Judging from the way he played for us in the 2018 Asian Games where he joined the team in the "11th hour", we can see that his skill level is really up there.

I disagree, unless we are going to be content at having Kobe Paras as our primary small forward then maybe. If JC is going to play small forward,looking at the world cup/Olympics outside Asia,he may be giving up 2,3,4 inches of height against NBA quality forwards.Asia's small forward may not be small as well specially the Kiwis,the Aussies, the Chinese and Japan's Hachimura or Watanabe .They are not only taller but physically stronger as well.I can't imagine JC guarding Hachimura or Watanabe, he may guard them but there's the risk of getting more fouls than the usual.

 

[BJ_Reloaded2]

The good thing about JC aside from his basketball skills and IQ is the attitude of the dude..madali daw pakisamahan very typical gesture of a pinoy konting ta ngo(nod of the head) kindat ng kilay at mata(wink) and ngiti(smile) you know the person is approachable and easy to talk to as per his Asian Games teammates and fellow athletes. I think that's one of the many traits as a Filipino that we need to consider for our future naturalized player(s). I think putting him as naturalized for final lineup is just a piece of paper because the world knows what's his DNA, it's just that FIBA says otherwise.

 

[hmbopbaduwap2]

 

[analyzed2]

I disagree, unless we are going to be content at having Kobe Paras as our primary small forward then maybe. If JC is going to play small forward,looking at the world cup/Olympics outside Asia,he may be giving up 2,3,4 inches of height against NBA quality forwards.Asia's small forward may not be small as well specially the Kiwis,the Aussies, the Chinese and Japan's Hachimura or Watanabe .They are not only taller but physically stronger as well.I can't imagine JC guarding Hachimura or Watanabe, he may guard them but there's the risk of getting more fouls than the usual.

for World SF and attributes. when you view it from the perspective of simply getting to the next level as a goal (essentially 2nd round) . most of the teams at that mid level like Puerto Rico, New Zealand have SF (3's) that are around 6' 5" but are really real natural wings. can play 2/3 . with Clarkson and Dwight alternative at 2 and 3 not only are we of competitive height at the 2/3 but are competitive both skill and athletic wise. It's important the third perimeter player should be around 6 foot so the three perimeter spots can be switchy. While i understand the tendency to overact when you look at the possibility of Japan say playing Rui, Watanabe and say a NP center, the key is really not to overact (NZ and alot of these southern American teams have been fine with the two wing spots 2/3 just being 6'5 , but good , if this is our strength , explosive / speedy wings .guards use it to full advantage . I honestly believe Clarkson becomes more of an offensive weapon if the defender on him is NOT like a Marcus Smart with guard quicknes but a white European tall forward. That is a bigger mismatch for Clarkson , we actually can play to our strength with essentially a 3 guard line-up with decent size , rather than playing with a traditional size SF but isn't that fast or good offensively.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

I disagree, unless we are going to be content at having Kobe Paras as our primary small forward then maybe. If JC is going to play small forward,looking at the world cup/Olympics outside Asia,he may be giving up 2,3,4 inches of height against NBA quality forwards.Asia's small forward may not be small as well specially the Kiwis,the Aussies, the Chinese and Japan's Hachimura or Watanabe .They are not only taller but physically stronger as well.I can't imagine JC guarding Hachimura or Watanabe, he may guard them but there's the risk of getting more fouls than the usual.

I'm thinking of a Dwight Ramos-Jordan Clarkson tandem at the wing spots with Dwight at 3 & Clarkson at 2. Well, there aren't too many 6-foot-7 & above small forwards in the Asia-Pacific basketball. Usually the small forwards of our Asian counterparts are around 6-foot-6 to 6-foot-7.

 

[analyzed2]

I'm thinking of a Dwight Ramos-Jordan Clarkson tandem at the wing spots with Dwight at 3 & Clarkson at 2. Well, there aren't too many 6-foot-7 & above small forwards in the Asia-Pacific basketball. Usually the small forwards of our Asian counterparts are around 6-foot-6 to 6-foot-7.

and even if our main rivals we're competing for at 2nd round have 6' 8" SF they're not really good. Clarkson will have a bigger advantage going against these type of players... Play to our strength ! Like if you're NZ you're actually more scared if Abercombrie (who's not fast) has to guard Clarkson.. (kakainin yun) than if you have a prime Brownlee .. mas gusto ng NZ ganoon yung match-up..

 

[ja.he2]

for World SF and attributes. when you view it from the perspective of simply getting to the next level as a goal (essentially 2nd round) . most of the teams at that mid level like Puerto Rico, New Zealand have SF (3's) that are around 6' 5" but are really real natural wings. can play 2/3 . with Clarkson and Dwight alternative at 2 and 3 not only are we of competitive height at the 2/3 but are competitive both skill and athletic wise. It's important the third perimeter player should be around 6 foot so the three perimeter spots can be switchy. While i understand the tendency to overact when you look at the possibility of Japan say playing Rui, Watanabe and say a NP center, the key is really not to overact (NZ and alot of these southern American teams have been fine with the two wing spots 2/3 just being 6'5 , but good , if this is our strength , explosive / speedy wings .guards use it to full advantage . I honestly believe Clarkson becomes more of an offensive weapon if the defender on him is NOT like a Marcus Smart with guard quicknes but a white European tall forward. That is a bigger mismatch for Clarkson , we actually can play to our strength with essentially a 3 guard line-up with decent size , rather than playing with a traditional size SF but isn't that fast or good offensively.

I agree sir. Many in this forums wants to have 6'7-6'9 wingmen which I find incredibly exaggerated and unrealistic. Latin American teams have around 6'4-6'6 (2/3) wingmen which naturally move as wings. Even european teams like spain do have 6'5-6'6 wing players. Those teams like serbia, greece and russia are the only ones with 6'7-6'9 tall wings because they have a generally tall populace (in general sense and in basketball sense). Hachimura and Watanabe are indeed 3 but definitely not swingmen (2/3) but combo forwards (3/4) by just looking the way they move.

IMO, having 6'4-6'5 tall wingmen is already good gilas.

 

[carmelo72]

The good thing also about Clarkson eh he's a natural scorer.. something that we needed the most.. if our guys are off day, he can deliver (just like the gilas vs China match).. he's not a typical small sf that players can bully him.. unless if Durant, Leonard and LeBron play in world cup..in that way eh doon natin masasabi na Clarkson is in disadvantage..

A rotation of Clarkson,Ramos,Parks,Thirdy,Perez & Tuffin for the 1-3 positions should be good enough (Oftana, Paras & Ildefonso possibly if they improve in the next 2-3 years)

 

[ja.he2]

A rotation of Clarkson,Ramos,Parks,Thirdy,Perez & Tuffin for the 1-3 positions should be good enough (Oftana, Paras & Ildefonso possibly if they improve in the next 2-3 years)

I don't see paras to be a swingman (2/3) in the very near future tbh. He resembles much of a combo forward (3/4).

 

[JAMSKIE2]

If Clarkson would be our naturalized player in 2023, I find it more logical that the other wingmen would be more of shooters & role players rather scorers. Well, I think it would be enough to have CJ Perez as another big scorer in the wings then that's it. The rest would be shooters & defensive specialist. With this, I'm interested of testing the mettle of Allain Bulanadi who is probably among the best shooters in the youth level at present. Ken Tuffin is another prospect. Hope he polishes his game well in the New Zealand pro league. Then there's Calvin Oftana who has decent shooting & seem to be willing to take a backseat in offense when the situation calls for it. I don't know but I feel Oftana has a more matured game than Kobe Paras at present. Kobe has the tendency to get super excited (which would be too good for his own good) & has this tendency to take ill-advise shots & seems to be error-prone. Oftana on the other hand doesn't really force his shots, doesn't take ill-advise shots & is willing to take a backseat in offense.

The hiccup is: Both Bulanadi & Oftana have yet to be tested in higher level basketball for everyone to determine whether they both possess the right stuff. Kailan pa kaya?