Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

[DAdmiral2]

What I'm implying is that FIBA doesn't put much weight on jus sanguinis or descent as much as it does on technicality or documentation. The best proof of that is those Qatari players of Bosnian descent whose parents are obviously Bosnian with no Qatari bloodline or descent whatsoever. But these players are treated by FIBA as Qatari local players becoz they obtained Qatari citizenship prior to their 16th birthday. It didn't matter to FIBA that the parents of these players are not of Qatari descent.

On the other hand, to those half-breed or even full-blooded Filipino players who were born abroad, it doesn't matter to FIBA that these players are born of Filipino parents (jus sanguinis), what will matter to FIBA is whether these players laid claim of their Filipino citizenship (most common evidence is Philippine passport) before they reach 16 yrs of age or not.

Hope you get my point.

Your point only refers to the emphasis of the passport before U16 rule , ( this is a no brainer established that it is based mainly on a document).
what we're referrig to recently in light of Abassi snd QMB is for exception cases, not the U16 outright rule or birth in country provision. . ( BTW I thought QMB had a passport before 16 , and was not applying for an exception? Lol, we all know what happened with that (document tampering etc).

now limited to exception caaes , lineage indeed is a factor for consideration, and it is verified by documents ( which Abassi has )., can be argued Abassi has stronger lineage connections to parent of Taiwan, than many Fil foreigners ( who's parents might not even be citizens or permanent residents of the Philippines) again and again it's not sharing similar enthicity blood that matters . Otherwise all African lineage people are connected to an African Nation

 

[DAdmiral2]

While at topic of factors for exception

It's not mere enrollment in a schiol that matters

Also it is not mere residency that matters

but it's establishing extended period of both educational and player development in one's formative youth development years

This is inplied as guidelines ( residency, education connection) are for an AGE cuttoff rule U16

I hope people get this.

Studying 7 years in grade school or High school in a country is totally different from playung 7 years from 25 yrs old in a pro league , totally different

 

[FilWelsh2]

While at topic of factors for exception

It's not mere enrollment in a schiol that matters

Also it is not mere residency that matters

but it's establishing extended period of both educational and player development in one's formative youth development years

This is inplied as guidelines ( residency, education connection) are for an AGE cuttoff rule U16

I hope people get this.

Studying 7 years in grade school or High school in a country is totally different from playung 7 years from 25 yrs old in a pro league , totally different

In short, there should be no question with Abassi’s status. Many posters here saw a glimmer of hope in citing his case as basis for exemption cases with some of our players. Easier said than done indeed…

 

[DAdmiral2]

In short, there should be no question with Abassi’s status. Many posters here saw a glimmer of hope in citing his case as basis for exemption cases with some of our players. Easier said than done indeed…

Exactly, Abassi is a bad example to argue our case for Fil foreigners who have residency as an adult
Abassi was raised in Taiwan from 8 years old and has parental lineage to parents from Taiwan ( they are permanently residing in Taiwan and may even have citizenship).

Having said that Philips is a plausible case , assuming he established residency and schooling from 17 yrs old and has established connection with a parent or ancestor who has Philippine citizenship or residency

Using Qatar Harris exception may be more of a valid argument, but as a principle never good to use rare exceptiexceptions basis for ones case. Use the explicit guildlines

 

[Metta2]

At the end of the day, Fiba's decision is still ultimately up to a person/s "subjective" evaluation. Even with all the documentary requirements, there's still interpretation involved.

It's not black and white...there's room for gray. And it's a whiter shade for countries like Qatar.

 

[DAdmiral2]

At the end of the day, Fiba's decision is still ultimately up to a person/s "subjective" evaluation. Even with all the documentary requirements, there's still interpretation involved.

It's not black and white...there's room for gray. And it's a whiter shade for countries like Qatar.

While true there is subjectivity, at the very least one should make a case using the criteria guidelines set by FIBA for exceptions , which are
1 # of years residency ( with emphasis on formative youth years.
2 # of years play in domestic league
3 other connections, ( particularly parental connction to someone from the country ( resident or citizen)

To apply for an exception for an NBA player with zero years residency is simply taking the piss.

 

[Sikatrix2]

While at topic of factors for exception

It's not mere enrollment in a schiol that matters

Also it is not mere residency that matters

but it's establishing extended period of both educational and player development in one's formative youth development years

This is inplied as guidelines ( residency, education connection) are for an AGE cuttoff rule U16

I hope people get this.

Studying 7 years in grade school or High school in a country is totally different from playung 7 years from 25 yrs old in a pro league , totally different

Or you can be a "developing nation" like the Bahamas whove somehow leaped froged us already. Are we a "developing nation" too?

 

[ja.he2]

Exactly, Abassi is a bad example to argue our case for Fil foreigners who have residency as an adult
Abassi was raised in Taiwan from 8 years old and has parental lineage to parents from Taiwan ( they are permanently residing in Taiwan and may even have citizenship).

Having said that Philips is a plausible case , assuming he established residency and schooling from 17 yrs old and has established connection with a parent or ancestor who has Philippine citizenship or residency

Using Qatar Harris exception may be more of a valid argument, but as a principle never good to use rare exceptiexceptions basis for ones case. Use the explicit guildlines

Curiously, there are FSAs playing in both high school division of the UAAP (u-16 and the junior proper). I learned that one of them is only 14 and might finish his high school there and, possibly, pursue his bachelor's degree here. He is currently in the u-16 team of one of the UAAP schools.

How plausible for this kid to be classified as a local in case he becomes a PH citizen?

 

[DAdmiral2]

Or you can be a "developing nation" like the Bahamas whove somehow leaped froged us already. Are we a "developing nation" too?

I think you're referring to case supports the development of the sport in the country, merits for Jawato and Harris as host for an event that is a minor sport in their country.. Basketball isn't a minor sport in the Philippines

BTW Jawato was a resident of Indonesia as a child and has an Indonesian father

 

[Sikatrix2]

I think you're referring to case supports the development of the sport in the country, merits for Jawato and Harris as host for an event that is a minor sport in their country.. Basketball isn't a minor sport in the Philippines

BTW Jawato was a resident of Indonesia as a child and has an Indonesian father

So basically we are being penalized because we love basketball. FIBA rules are great.

 

[live_evil2]

FIBA rules are simple, actually: Show me the money.

 

[Sikatrix2]

FIBA rules are simple, actually: Show me the money.

I actually agree. Not necessarily corruption but the growth of the sport from a financial sense.

 

[DAdmiral2]

So basically we are being penalized because we love basketball. FIBA rules are great.

It doesn't follow, promoting the growth of the sport is just one of criteria to boost one's case. , it's not one of the main criterion it's normally alloted as extra bonus point to a host ( world cup) , it's a factor not meant to replace the fundamental criteria of Residency and local play .

 

[Sikatrix2]

It doesn't follow, promoting the growth of the sport is just one of criteria to boost one's case. , it's not one of the main criterion it's normally alloted as extra bonus point to a host ( world cup) , it's a factor not meant to replace the fundamental criteria of Residency and local play .

Its basically the only criterion in the Eric Gordon case. That and family relations obviously.

 

[Giannis34GOD2]

Tell that to b.league..

Japan is not a basketball nation... We are a basketball nation... We have those talents, why need to tap no blood Pinoys? Can't Philippines developed useable bigs for Fiba? What the sense of being a basketball country? Why not try Geo Chiu? Other countries mocking Filipinos because they still using foreign players despite basketball is the number 1 sport here....

 

[Metta2]

While true there is subjectivity, at the very least one should make a case using the criteria guidelines set by FIBA for exceptions , which are
1 # of years residency ( with emphasis on formative youth years.
2 # of years play in domestic league
3 other connections, ( particularly parental connction to someone from the country ( resident or citizen)

To apply for an exception for an NBA player with zero years residency is simply taking the piss.

I honestly have not followed Harris' (Qatar) case. Does he meet the requirements?

 

[DAdmiral2]

Curiously, there are FSAs playing in both high school division of the UAAP (u-16 and the junior proper). I learned that one of them is only 14 and might finish his high school there and, possibly, pursue his bachelor's degree here. He is currently in the u-16 team of one of the UAAP schools.

How plausible for this kid to be classified as a local in case he becomes a PH citizen?

Well those cases at least take into account the set guidelines for exception I do want to note that Abassi however not only has residency from his youth years, but has actual parental lineage to a person from the country, thing going against FSA is they may not have a local parent , this however can be addressed if it can be reasonable claimed that a family and parent adopts the child in his youth.

 

[DAdmiral2]

I honestly have not followed Harris' (Qatar) case. Does he meet the requirements?

Note they are limited to guidelines (consider # of years), they are not explicitly measurable standards ( must be 4 years minimum residency). So in that case yes Harris has years residency and domestic Qatar league play, whether it is significant enough is another thing

Now in case of Clarkson there simply is no residency years and league play to even consider..

 

[Giannis34GOD2]

This proves that Gilas wont have role players as NP.. this kind of post proves some filos rather have blatche, kabayan and brownlee type as NP than a hawkinson, gilbeck..

And will complain if our coach relies too much on brownlee..

Because naturalized players should be one of the supposed best players in the team.. You are always looking at Japan, but outside of them, who are other countries picking role naturalized player? Spain tapped scoring guard Lorenzo Brown, Turkey tapped Shane Larkin, another scoring guard, even team USA tapped Embiid, a former NBA MVP... Japan have leverage since Rui, Watanabe and Kawamura can do the load, especially for scoring... They just need a presence downlow... Gilas need a firepower scoring guard/forward since we have Kai and Edu already... So why tap a role player for a naturalized player?

 

[Giannis34GOD2]

Note they are limited to guidelines (consider # of years), they are not explicitly measurable standards ( must be 4 years minimum residency). So in that case yes Harris has years residency and domestic Qatar league play, whether it is significant enough is another thing

Now in case of Clarkson there simply is no residency years and league play to even consider..

Harris didn't met the requirements... He just get his passport only in 2023, He didn't continuous playing in Qatari league, as he played numerous leagues around the world... He didn't have any Qatari blood or origin by his parents or grandparents... It just Fiba gave them a "Gift" for giving them money for hosting the world cup....