Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

[ccharmed2]

Without an np, the pinoy nt will play a more aggressive offense and defense. Iba kapag sariling sikap na. Once the team learns how to win and lose without making excuses, it will go far.

 

[BJ_Reloaded2]

Sonny Alvarado got "buking" as a fake Fil-am though & was deported.

Good Day Sir Jams,

issues about Earl 'Sonny' Alvarado Jr., and others should already been resolve during that time if only those batch of stakeholders at that time are "Men of Visions".

what happened at the PBA indeed during our younger days involving those people are indeed a "red flag" no argument there.

but if the mindset at that was more than the PBA and beyond that...I'm talking about the National team, FIBA's rule on naturalization, the so-called exemption among others.

then, as I mentioned, it should already been resolve considering "all those been involved already uttered that they are more than willing to represent PHI if given a chance during

several ambush interviews".

I've been searching some old newspaper clips during the 80's NCC team and it's entire basketball programs by parading several naturalized ballers in a sanctioned tournament

but so far I haven't discovered any old news article that local players at that time are complaining nor rumbling about "why the likes of coach Chip, Jeff Moore and Dennis Still are donning

the 3 Stars and a Sun...unless the likes of Sir Dotch, Sir Paoylo among others posted something fresh hindsight from the past that wasn't publicize in any Sports Mags or Newspapers of that time.

now fast forward Japan's B. League are now the trailblazer of Asian basketball and they introduce many innovations that are "taboo(?)" on other Asian leagues like allowing all teams to include

naturalize ballers as part of their local line-up..

I've already posted several items related on this on other thread.

and for me I called it "Vision" as far as "Globalization of the Sport" are concern.

 

[Dotch2]

AFAIK, Philippines federation ( BAP) through padrino Danding exploited the loophole about Naturalized players in the NT, i think in the 80s, there were no limit provided there's a minimum years of residency. Note in the 80's a simple Presidential decree can make you a Filipino citizen, ( hello Ronnie Nathanielz) . Danding being Marcos' biggest crony can easily arrange that.

1983 ABC, RP NT, despite being 3-0 in ABC ( Asian Championship) group phase was relegated to Classification Round because they played with ineligibles Jeff Moore And Dennis Still. They were deemed ineligibles due to lack of residency. China, the 1983 cahmpions went on to rep Asia in 1984 LA Olympics

1985 ABC, RP NT came back with a vengeance, featuring Chip and now eligible Dennis And Jeff, and locals Hec, Caidic, Samboy etc. won the whole tournament. RP supposed to go to the Worlds in 1986. where the likes of Mugsy, Robinson, Sabonis, Petro. Oscar Schmidt all played, But People Power happened and Ninongs Danding and Marcos got ousted.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

Good Day Sir Jams,

issues about Earl 'Sonny' Alvarado Jr., and others should already been resolve during that time if only those batch of stakeholders at that time are "Men of Visions".

what happened at the PBA indeed during our younger days involving those people are indeed a "red flag" no argument there.

but if the mindset at that was more than the PBA and beyond that...I'm talking about the National team, FIBA's rule on naturalization, the so-called exemption among others.

then, as I mentioned, it should already been resolve considering "all those been involved already uttered that they are more than willing to represent PHI if given a chance during

several ambush interviews".

I've been searching some old newspaper clips during the 80's NCC team and it's entire basketball programs by parading several naturalized ballers in a sanctioned tournament

but so far I haven't discovered any old news article that local players at that time are complaining nor rumbling about "why the likes of coach Chip, Jeff Moore and Dennis Still are donning

the 3 Stars and a Sun...unless the likes of Sir Dotch, Sir Paoylo among others posted something fresh hindsight from the past that wasn't publicize in any Sports Mags or Newspapers of that time.

now fast forward Japan's B. League are now the trailblazer of Asian basketball and they introduce many innovations that are "taboo(?)" on other Asian leagues like allowing all teams to include

naturalize ballers as part of their local line-up..

I've already posted several items related on this on other thread.

and for me I called it "Vision" as far as "Globalization of the Sport" are concern.

I understand your sentiments bro but I think the PBA's action during the late 90's & early 2000's to weedout those fake Fil-ams or Fil-foreign players only demonstrated how we Filipinos put weight on blood ties or jus sanguinis. Pag walang dugong Pinoy eh you have no business playing in the PBA as a local player. That's the mentality of most Pinoys. Of course, the clamor of Filipino naturalized players being allowed to play in the PBA as locals like an Ange Kouame is another story.

If I'm not mistaken, Sonny Alvarado is of Latin America descent. Madali tayong napaniwala that he's a Fil-foreigner because Alvarado is also a Pinoy surname, though it actually is a surname of Spanish origin. Of course Latin American countries are Spanish colonies, hence Spanish surnames, like Alvarado, are common in those countries.

 

[BJ_Reloaded2]

I understand your sentiments bro but I think the PBA's action during the late 90's & early 2000's to weedout those fake Fil-ams or Fil-foreign players only demonstrated how we Filipinos put weight on blood ties or jus sanguinis. Pag walang dugong Pinoy eh you have no business playing in the PBA as a local player. That's the mentality of most Pinoys. Of course, the clamor of Filipino naturalized players being allowed to play in the PBA as locals like an Ange Kouame is another story.

If I'm not mistaken, Sonny Alvarado is of Latin America descent. Madali tayong napaniwala that he's a Fil-foreigner because Alvarado is also a Pinoy surname, though it actually is a surname of Spanish origin. Of course Latin American countries are Spanish colonies, hence Spanish surnames, like Alvarado, are common in those countries.

Sir Jams,

that is why the next ideal naturalize guy for us after 2027 to 28 cycle must have the same quality as "The Punisher" who at 6'7 can play multiple position

no doubt(hoping no major injuries moving forward) Kai would be at the NBA at that time and already had the body, experience and skills ets to compete at that level

same with AJ hoping no more major injuries moving forward.

Michael Philips are beginning to show signs of that "Punisher Mode" minus the consistent outside shooting(he really need to develop that)

but for now, he is still ineligible.

imagine, having 2 taller version of Alvarado on the next cycle of Gilas to support Kai, AJ, Carl. Kevin, Mason in the SF and PF spots

plus having the next taller version of Eric Menk, Freddie Abuda, Rudy Hatfield and Nic Belasco(we all know the work rate of this ballers) indeed we would be consistently competing in the medal

rounds on every FIBA World and Olympics for the next 10 to 15 years barring no major injuries and always in good physical condition..who knows maybe 20 yrs.

QMB(?), Balti(?), Kamaka(?), Sage(?), Caelum(?) let's see..if they had the mojos.

every Gilas fans are hoping and praying that the stars may align properly on our basketball program.

the worrisome for now is our PG spots after Scotty, Chris and Dwight..CJ is not an ideal PG type.

who's next in line? those in the on-going conversation(even from the other thread) are still babies in the elite level.

 

[Metta2]

the worrisome for now is our PG spots after Scotty, Chris and Dwight..CJ is not an ideal PG type.

who's next in line? those in the on-going conversation(even from the other thread) are still babies in the elite level.

On my list are Heading, SJ, Padrigao. Also Thirdy can be given a try-out if he can fit with the system.

It's so noticeable how our team barely dribbles now. It's like night and day. Guys are moving without the ball and just doing short passes (which is why tall guards are preferred). Now more than ever do we not need a traditional PG.

We would still need a great iso scorer/creator though (right now we still have JB) for last second moments. But it doesn't necessarily have to be from the PG position.

 

[IPC2]

On my list are Heading, SJ, Padrigao. Also Thirdy can be given a try-out if he can fit with the system.

It's so noticeable how our team barely dribbles now. It's like night and day. Guys are moving without the ball and just doing short passes (which is why tall guards are preferred). Now more than ever do we not need a traditional PG.

We would still need a great iso scorer/creator though (right now we still have JB) for last second moments. But it doesn't necessarily have to be from the PG position.

We just need an initiator, not really the playmaking PG. Of course, playmaking is still a huge asset, so we'll take it.

We might need to develop initiators outside the PG spot too. Guys like Joe Devance, Gabe Norwood, now Dwight, Newsome, and CJ. Hopefully, Quiambao can be one of those guys in the future.

 

[ccharmed2]

Home-and-away and tournament play requires different sets of players. Cone and the sbp obviously know this. For away games, eg, against nz, you need "contra pelo" (against the grain) players. For instance, you need a malonzo or lopez type and size player against master chef corey webster, or his home game cooking will upset your stomach.

For anything other than aus and other top ten teams, the pinoy nt will probably work out well even without an np. There are power players like kouame and phillips who are not really nps: they can eat home cooked fishballs, kikiam and kwekwek just fine as they lived here for years. Why no exemption was arranged for them is surprising.

A healthy frontline crew of kai, abai, kouame, qmb and edu can probably withstand and neutralize opposing bigs of several world top ten teams, even today.

We also have enough non-np guards and forwards to sustain a top 20 world standing for the next ten years.

Still, special nps are comforting against superstars of top 20 nations in olympic and fiba tournaments, as do-it-all brownlee has shown. Something like a clarkson and green together.

Btw, i have read silly comments about certain prospective nt pool players being "stoppable". They are if they dont work very well as duos or trios. For one, stopping kai and abai individually is probably doable enough. But playing together is another matter, as you now have a well-oiled machine with extra size, power and skills. And so too would be a heading and abando pairing at guards. They assassinate effectively with contrasting attacks.

Let's not forget about the trio of jordan, pippen and rodman. Nothing really worked against them. If they played together in their prime, they could have anchored 10 straight nba championships.

 

[live_evil2]

Jordan, Pippen, and Rodman together was simply unfair. There is no way you will penetrate their defense and no way will you stop their offense.

 

[Metta2]

We just need an initiator, not really the playmaking PG. Of course, playmaking is still a huge asset, so we'll take it.

We might need to develop initiators outside the PG spot too. Guys like Joe Devance, Gabe Norwood, now Dwight, Newsome, and CJ. Hopefully, Quiambao can be one of those guys in the future.

The beauty in this is... we can concentrate on choosing elite defenders and length/athleticism. A lot of the offensive skills needed in other systems (which is usually possessed by lesser defenders and/or shorter players) isn't as required.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

I think the basic requirement for our national team players is that he should be decent defender. Not really a defense specialist naman in the mold of a Gabe Norwood or a Chris Newsome. Ibang level na kasi sina Norwood & Newsome, although I believe Gilas should have around 3 or 4 defense specialist (like Norwood, Newsome, Pingris). So the idea is that there should no longer be a defensive liability in the national team. Everyone should have at least decent defensive skills. Looking at our current Gilas team, I think there isn't any defensive liability naman. Junmar Fajardo may lack some mobility to defend the perimeter but in terms of interior defense, he is I think decent.

The way I see it, our Centennial team in the 1998 Asian Games being composed of PBA superstars/stars was really rich in talent - offensive talent that is. But I think one glaring weakness of that team is in defense. It was really loaded with scorers with the likes of Alvin Patrimonio, Vergel Meneses, Marlou Aquino, Kenneth Duremdes, Jun Limpot, Allan Caidic, Dennis Espino, Jojo Lastimosa. But that team lacked defensive specialist & most of those players while excellent scorers, were defensive liabilities, especially the likes of Vergel Meneses, Alvin Patrimonio, Allan Caidic, Jolas, Jun Limpot.

I think our defense specialist with the current Gilas team are Chris Newsome, Iskati Thompson, Dwight Ramos & AJ Edu, the rest like JB, Kai, Junmar, Oftana, CJ Perez, Carl Tamayo, being decent defenders.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

On my list are Heading, SJ, Padrigao. Also Thirdy can be given a try-out if he can fit with the system.

It's so noticeable how our team barely dribbles now. It's like night and day. Guys are moving without the ball and just doing short passes (which is why tall guards are preferred). Now more than ever do we not need a traditional PG.

We would still need a great iso scorer/creator though (right now we still have JB) for last second moments. But it doesn't necessarily have to be from the PG position.

I think Schonny Winston is worth a try. He's a natural point guard or lets say a combo guard. At 6-foot-1, he is a good size guard in the Asian level. His defense is also decent as well.

 

[BJ_Reloaded2]

On my list are Heading, SJ, Padrigao. Also Thirdy can be given a try-out if he can fit with the system.

It's so noticeable how our team barely dribbles now. It's like night and day. Guys are moving without the ball and just doing short passes (which is why tall guards are preferred). Now more than ever do we not need a traditional PG.

We would still need a great iso scorer/creator though (right now we still have JB) for last second moments. But it doesn't necessarily have to be from the PG position.

Sir Mets,

Padrigao is a big no-no for me(for now)

that lad, alongside Terrence Fortea of UP hasn't change a lot since their backcourt team-up during coach Sandy's BG stint

lot's of hail mary's here and there on those 2..that's a big red flag for me.

Forthsky needs to tighten his screws while in college

that cracking elbow sneaks on QMB is not a good sign for a candidate.

if he is very allergic on(continues) wall picks provided by the other teams

well in international level it is an integral part of the battle plan of the majority.

Gilas Pilipinas cannot afford to experience another Royal Rumble if he doesn't change.

3rdy is like having another CJ on the team...shaky handles.

heading and SJ, well, they are decent esp. heading..we badly need those velvet shot of that Fil-Aussie

I want to see him for the final window against TB..let see his mojo against that cry-baby Corey and

hopefully the other Webster will play as well...those bros. are really a big torn on our back court dudes ever since.

 

[IPC2]

I think the basic requirement for our national team players is that he should be decent defender. Not really a defense specialist naman in the mold of a Gabe Norwood or a Chris Newsome. Ibang level na kasi sina Norwood & Newsome, although I believe Gilas should have around 3 or 4 defense specialist (like Norwood, Newsome, Pingris). So the idea is that there should no longer be a defensive liability in the national team. Everyone should have at least decent defensive skills. Looking at our current Gilas team, I think there isn't any defensive liability naman. Junmar Fajardo may lack some mobility to defend the perimeter but in terms of interior defense, he is I think decent.

The way I see it, our Centennial team in the 1998 Asian Games being composed of PBA superstars/stars was really rich in talent - offensive talent that is. But I think one glaring weakness of that team is in defense. It was really loaded with scorers with the likes of Alvin Patrimonio, Vergel Meneses, Marlou Aquino, Kenneth Duremdes, Jun Limpot, Allan Caidic, Dennis Espino, Jojo Lastimosa. But that team lacked defensive specialist & most of those players while excellent scorers, were defensive liabilities, especially the likes of Vergel Meneses, Alvin Patrimonio, Allan Caidic, Jolas, Jun Limpot.

I think our defense specialist with the current Gilas team are Chris Newsome, Iskati Thompson, Dwight Ramos & AJ Edu, the rest like JB, Kai, Junmar, Oftana, CJ Perez, Carl Tamayo, being decent defenders.

Being good defensively usually determined our performances in international tournaments. In the 2013 and 2015 Asia Cup silvers, in last year's Asiad gold, and in this past OQT where we made the knockout round, we were good defensively. In the 2017 and 2022 Asia Cup and in the 2022 SEA Games, we were bad on that end, hence the underperformances (although the lack of guys like June Mar, Newsome, Dwight and Kai were also a factor; our best interior defender then was Erram).

I think defense and hustle should be a core part of our team's identity. Add physicality as well.

 

[Metta2]

It's wild that in all our games in recent memory, we have been bigger than our opponents. Even against the likes of NZ and Latvia.

Our identity is old school 90s...size, defense, triangle offense. With everybody else going small-ball pace-and-space, it's hard to get reps/experience against a unique team like ours.

"Sometimes it's better to be different than good."

 

[ccharmed2]

We have very good 2-way young 6'5ers like quiambao and lopez who can chase and go against the best of asia. In a decade, we will probably see more than a handful of these highly athletic players in the 6'7-6'9 range. Our nt can go full-on against australia within a decade, as size and athleticism will not favor them anymore.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

With our golden performance in last year's Asian Games, our mighty upset of world No. 6 Latvia in the 2024 Olympic Qualifying Tournament & our unblemished record in the 2025 FIBA Asia Cup qualifiers after 2 windows including our historic win over New Zealand, I hope coach Tim Cone & his coaching staff anticipate the adjustments that our Asia-Oceania counterparts would do especially New Zealand & the much improved Chinese Taipei team which would be our opponents in the 3rd window next February. You bet New Zealand would be too eager for a vengeance while Chinese Taipei would also want to score a win over Gilas after several years of being beaten by Gilas. We must anticipate that our opponents would do thorough scouting & study of coach Tim's triangle offense. Coach Tim must assume that the opponents have already figured out his system & scheme (even if not) so that he will be able to make the adjustments the moment he sees that the opponent have made their own adjustments.

In sports as well as in war, those who are able to anticipate the moves of the enemy/opponent & make the necessary adjustments will have the highest chance of winning.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

the worrisome for now is our PG spots after Scotty, Chris and Dwight..CJ is not an ideal PG type.

who's next in line? those in the on-going conversation(even from the other thread) are still babies in the elite level.

Well, as I've mentioned in my previous post, Schonny Winston is worth a try as a successor to the ageing Chris Newsome. Winston is already 26 yrs old, though he has no experience playing in the FIBA game, I think he can play in the elite level (kaya nga he needs to be tested). I think if Schonny starts playing the FIBA game & international basketball ASAP, in 2 years time maging hinog na rin sya for the high level.

Another point guard that I see as being a good Gilas material is SJ Belangel. Sorry Ginebra fans but if I have to choose between Belangel & RJ Abarrientos as a prospect for Gilas, I'll prefer the former. While I think RJ is the better offensive player, I think Belangel is the better defender. I also like Belangel's "gulang". Belangel playing in a competitive pro league like the KBL would prepare him to play in the high level.

 

[bluenote492]

I'm starting to hate how Calvin plays. What happened to his offensive game? When he was under Yeng he looked like a bigger version of Duremdes.

 

[sroth38392]

I'm starting to hate how Calvin plays. What happened to his offensive game? When he was under Yeng he looked like a bigger version of Duremdes.

More reason to consider Heading, BRP Jr, Navarro, and Tuffin in his place.

Oftana has been underwhelming since the first window.