Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

[JAMSKIE2]

Guys, do U think the Gilas team that played in the recent Olympic Qualifying Tournament (partida pa yan becoz AJ Edu, Isksti Thompson & Jamie Malonzo didn't play) would beat the 2013 FIBA Asia Championship gold medalist Iran national team? Since coach Tim Cone wants to use the golden generation of Iran national team as a model for the Gilas program, then I want to ask the opinion of U guys if how our current Gilas team would measure up against the golden generation of Iran national team & I think the strongest iteration of Iran national team is the 2013 Asia Championship gold medalist Iran team. At that time, Hamed Haddadi, Samad Nikkah Bahrami, Oshin Sahakian & Mehdi Kamrani were on the peak of their respective basketball careers.

So for instance that 2013 Iran national team squares off with the current Gilas team, who do U think will win?

 

[paliganibossalfrancis2]

Guys, do U think the Gilas team that played in the recent Olympic Qualifying Tournament (partida pa yan becoz AJ Edu, Isksti Thompson & Jamie Malonzo didn't play) would beat the 2013 FIBA Asia Championship gold medalist Iran national team? Since coach Tim Cone wants to use the golden generation of Iran national team as a model for the Gilas program, then I want to ask the opinion of U guys if how our current Gilas team would measure up against the golden generation of Iran national team & I think the strongest iteration of Iran national team is the 2013 Asia Championship gold medalist Iran team. At that time, Hamed Haddadi, Samad Nikkah Bahrami, Oshin Sahakian & Mehdi Kamrani were on the peak of their respective basketball careers.

So for instance that 2013 Iran national team squares off with the current Gilas team, who do U think will win?

Iran's golden generation lasted from 2007-2021

- In 2007 we beat Iran golden generation in the Jones Cup. Without a naturalized player. We got drawn into the Group of Death bracket. They eventually marched on to the 2008 Olympics.

- In 2009 they were head and shoulders above us. That Powerade team had star power but ill constructed. Iran qualified to the 2010 World Cup along with China and Jordan.

- In 2011 Smart Gilas 1 finished 4th place while Iran placed 5th. China qualified to London.

- In 2013 Marcus Douthit got injured in the semis. We only lost to them because we were shorthanded.

- In 2015 we beat them convincingly with Jason Castro and semi-fit Andray Blatche. We qualified to the 2016 OQT.

- In 2017 we placed 7th in Asia Cup. Iran placed 2nd.

- In 2019 they manhandled us in the World Cup. Almost beat Spain. They peaked in this game. They qualified to the 2020 Tokyo Olympics.

but post WC2023 current Gilas team vs Iran so far?

- In 2023 we beat them in the Asian Games quarterfinals. Gilas eventually won Gold.

- In 2024 Iran is in obscurity. Gilas OQT appearance. Beat Latvia. Eliminated Georgia. Went to the semis. A Kai Sotto away from Olympic qualification.

If our ill-constructed old iterations were able to outmatch and beat the golden generation of Iran in some instances what more the current. They don't have Haddadi, Kamrani and Bahrami anymore. We're well-coached (finally), taller, and much more skilled than Iran.

But if you're asking who will win? 2014 World Cup Gilas vs 2013 Asian Champs Iran would have been a lopsided contest in favor of Gilas. Who's stopping Andray Blatche and a cohesive, well-conditioned crew?

2024 Gilas vs 2013 Iran will be a massacre. Who's stopping Kai Sotto and Dwight? Who's going past AJ Edu? Add Brownlee Magic and Tim Cone's brains. Who's gonna press and tire out Newsome? We also haven't seen how KQ and Carl Tamayo will just drive by, outsmart and shoot over inferior Iranian defenders.
2013 Iran will be in foul trouble and gassed out by 3rd quarter just trying to keep up with the pace and tempo of our offense.

Just watch how slow and flat footed Iran was. They were just bigger and smarter.

Compare that vs. 2024 Gilas. Our players are gonna feast inside and outside.

 

[paliganibossalfrancis2]

The Boomers will send its Team C full of NBL players in FIBA Asia Cup 2025.

Another intriguing question is, can the current Gilas pool assuming all are healthy, beat NBL-Boomers next year?

 

[JAMSKIE2]

paliganibossalfrancis

OK great points bro.
For me, it's going to be a close match up with Gilas enjoying a slight edge. I feel if current Gilas team faces the 2013 Iran team in 10 games, Gilas would win 6 of those games & its not going to be easy wins for Gilas. I think Haddadi, Bahrami, Sahakian & Kamrani were formidable in 2013. They were really in their prime at that time.

But I think things would be different if we are talking about Gilas team in next year's 2025 FIBA Asia Cup versus 2013 Iran national team. I feel Gilas by next year would be significantly stronger than the current Gilas team. I mean, Gilas with a healthy AJ Edu, Isksti Thompson & Malonzo. And more importantly, Gilas players would be more familiar & more assimilated with coach Tim's system by next year. Plus, the team would be more cohesive & players jelling better with one another.

 

[Silent Killer2]

I've read that article but I don't believe the FIBA Secretary General stating that "no one suggested a better rule", when every federation is clamoring for a revision regarding eligibility. They know it's beneficial both for SBP and FIBA to exempt JC. But surely, they want upfront $$$ for it. They know SBP is capable of paying, but they won't. This is all speculation though.

if that happens, many will complain about that because they bend the rules for allowing clarkson to be local as he didn’t met the criteria set by fiba..

 

[Giannis34GOD2]

Guys, do U think the Gilas team that played in the recent Olympic Qualifying Tournament (partida pa yan becoz AJ Edu, Isksti Thompson & Jamie Malonzo didn't play) would beat the 2013 FIBA Asia Championship gold medalist Iran national team? Since coach Tim Cone wants to use the golden generation of Iran national team as a model for the Gilas program, then I want to ask the opinion of U guys if how our current Gilas team would measure up against the golden generation of Iran national team & I think the strongest iteration of Iran national team is the 2013 Asia Championship gold medalist Iran team. At that time, Hamed Haddadi, Samad Nikkah Bahrami, Oshin Sahakian & Mehdi Kamrani were on the peak of their respective basketball careers.

So for instance that 2013 Iran national team squares off with the current Gilas team, who do U think will win?

For me, 2009 Iran team is the best version.. 2009 FIBA Asia cup is one of the toughest competitions.. tough Koreans were just ended as 7th place, that was the prime years of Fadi led Lebanon, Abbas bros, Wright of Jordan, Yi led China, prime Qatar team, Kazakhstan led by Ponomorev, Taiwan led by prime Li Chie Chien and Tsen Weng Ting... Iran was undefeated with that run and beating China in the finals in Chinese soil is more impressive... 2013 competition is weak, Lebanon was suspended, Qatar best generation became older, Jordan's best generation became older, Kazakhstan became weaker team too and 2013 China version had their problems in their roster due to rebuilding phase post Yao...

 

[IPC2]

i just noticed our players are getting smaller again tbh. built and height wise. and they aren't that good. skill wise they're subpar, wanna-be nonchalant NBA players. very short shorts, dancing like a woman on TikTok instead of working on their game.
It's very alarming the best in 2024 batch is Gemao and Alas. They're not even physically imposing or noteworthy or as promising as previous prospects like Kobe Paras.

our Golden generation is really Tamayo Kai Aj Edu Dave KQ Ildefonso era. It will be extremely hard our young local players to match what they have accomplished in their careers.

I guess back to over relying on Fil-foreign recruitment again. Grassroots and HS basketball coaches are slacking.

As for golden generation, if it's true, then we need to maximize it and surround it with the right players. Carl's a 4, Kai and AJ are our bigs, Dave's an off-guard, and Quiambao's a tweener 4/3. Forgot Dwight, who's a do-it-all off-guard.

We will need a big who can reasonably protect the paint if neither of AJ and Kai are on the floor. We need wings who can defend (Navarro, Malonzo, Lopez, Bayla), and some guards who can run point. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Giannis34GOD2]

The Boomers will send its Team C full of NBL players in FIBA Asia Cup 2025.

Another intriguing question is, can the current Gilas pool assuming all are healthy, beat NBL-Boomers next year?

Yes for sure.. Lebanon exposed them in 2022 that they can be beaten.. they just 2 min game late run to beat the Aussies.. imagine if there atleast 2 - 3 mins more when they starting a huge run late in the 4th.. Arakji can't be stop by any Aussies in that match.. imagine this, Japan with Watanabe that time was outmatched by team C Aussies by 20 pts but Lebanon almost beat them in the finals.. that's why I have no completely trust with Japan as the "best Asian team" today.. Japan still not proved yet they are the best.. last 2 FIBA Asia cup stints of Japan was disappointing, even the last 2 Asian games stint of Japan is also disappointing... Sorry for those dickriding Japanese fans here.. but I will pick Lebanon than Japan as best Asian team today..

 

[paliganibossalfrancis2]

if that happens, many will complain about that because they bend the rules for allowing clarkson to be local as he didn’t met the criteria set by fiba..

Zagklis shared that he has walked member nations through the rule several times and was candidly blunt about how countries make repeated requests to amend it.

“It’s a very difficult rule. I spent this year in continental assemblies quite a lot of time reexplaining it to our members. [They’ll] understand it, but when we have our own case, everybody forgets the rule and says I would like a different rule.

And then when we say propose us a rule that’ll bring a fairer result—from a competitiveness point of view. Nobody has proposed something better than [the existing rule], I have to be honest with you,” he said.


https://sports.inquirer.net/528701/...naturalized-player-despite-his-filipino-roots​

Yeah i know, i'm just speculating that that rule can be bended for a couple million dollars but SBP wasn't keen on paying that price. By bending means lifting or revising the Hagop rule in favor of us by paying a steep amount. The way business and basketball world works, I'm sure this was discussed between MVP and FIBA.

I mean, they can always say to other countries that we follow jus sanguinis, whenever FIBA exempts Fil-foreign players that didn't acquire passport before 16. Just say they're Filipinos by blood​, it's not their fault they didn't get documents before turning 16, therefore they can play for the flag. Just another provision in there stating this special rule which favor us changes everything. Other countries may protest but end of the day it's FIBA's discretion and they can't do anything about it.

Anyway just ignore this, this is just a stupid thought of mine from my twisted mind lol.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

paliganibossalfrancis

I don't think current Gilas team/pool will easily breeze past 2013 Iran. The Iranians may be not that quick & athletic but they have the size, have the tactical skills & was a cohesive team. Of course current Gilas team can now match Iran's size & we have some athletic guys on our team - Newsome, Oftana, Malonzo, Edu, Dwight Ramos. But we are not yet that cohesive & is still on the process of assimilating coach Tim Cone's system.

If we look at the match-ups, I think the frontline trio of Haddadi, Sahakian & Khardoust would enjoy a slight edge over the frontline trio of Kai Sotto, Junmar & Edu. Bahrami versus Justin Brownlee will be a very good match-up though I think Brownlee enjoys some edge overall. Kamrani is the better point guard compared to Iskati Thompson. I think in the 2-guard spot Gilas enjoys some edge with Dwight & Newsome in there. I believe one aspect that Gilas is better than Iran is line-up depth. Off the bench we have players like CJ Perez, Malonzo, Oftana, Carl Tamayo. I don't think 2013 Iran team had those kind of players coming off the bench.

 

[paliganibossalfrancis2]

great points.

Fact is Iran qualified to the Olympics twice, this Gilas team not yet. Objectively Iran golden gen is better because they've achieved their ultimate goals. But since this is a new GIlas team, we don't know yet how they look like in peak form. We've already seen Iran at its best and it's ok... almost beat Spain, moral victories here and there... can't say they shocked the world.

...but this Gilas team on the other hand, though, has real upset potential over top 10 teams, on a consistent basis. That's why it'll be a huge disappointment if they miss LA 2028. We can only judge which team is better once this core is disbanded.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

great points.

Fact is Iran qualified to the Olympics twice, this Gilas team not yet. Objectively Iran golden gen is better because they've achieved their ultimate goals. But since this is a new GIlas team, we don't know yet how they look like in peak form. We've already seen Iran at its best and it's ok... almost beat Spain, moral victories here and there... can't say they shocked the world.

...but this Gilas team on the other hand, though, has real upset potential over top 10 teams, on a consistent basis. That's why it'll be a huge disappointment if they miss LA 2028. We can only judge which team is better once this core is disbanded.

All I can say is, since coach Tim Cone has been doing a good job so far with Gilas, dapat huwag ng gambalahin pa ang program nya. Let him finish the job until 2027 or 2028.

Ang hirap dyan is baka next year lang or in 2026 umiksina na naman si Chot Reyes & would once again steal the Gilas head coaching job from Tim Cone.

Yun ang magiging mitsa ng Gilas program kung sakali!

Trans: Put Chot Reyes way way away from the current Gilas program. Don't let him have anything to do with Gilas.

 

[IPC2]

All I can say is, since coach Tim Cone has been doing a good job so far with Gilas, dapat huwag ng gambalahin pa ang program nya. Let him finish the job until 2027 or 2028.

Ang hirap dyan is baka next year lang or in 2026 umiksina na naman si Chot Reyes & would once again steal the Gilas head coaching job from Tim Cone.

Yun ang magiging mitsa ng Gilas program kung sakali!

Trans: Put Chot Reyes way way away from the current Gilas program. Don't let him have anything to do with Gilas.

For the good of the program, but also for his own. Come on, the guy's 60, he should step away to avoid the bashing. Let him just coach in the PBA in peace.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

My dream for this current Gilas is a gold medal finish in next year's 2025 FIBA Asia Cup. I think it's achievable considering that Australia usually doesn't send its elite national players in this tournament. I'm confident Gilas can beat an Australian national team-B. Of course it won't be easy winning the 2025 Asia Cup title. Teams like Australia, Lebanon, Japan, Jordan, New Zealand (if it parades most of its elite players) are formidable opponents. Then we can never overlook China, Korea & Iran.

The key for Gilas success is preparation. A 10-day preparation for the 2025 FIBA Asia Cup won't cut it. We need at least 4 weeks of full time training & about 8 tune-up games (hopefully around 5 tune up games vs. European teams) to get our Gilas players battle ready. Also we need "all" our Gilas players to be present in the training camp right from the start. Hindi yung ang 1 or 2 players eh magjo join sa training camp about only a week before the tournament.

We need Gilas to be at its best form to claim Asia-Oceania basketball supremacy.

 

[live_evil2]

Good luck with the long prep. Tim Cone is just lying through his teeth regarding his cumulative results based on only 10 days of prep. The 10 day prep is an imposition of the stupid PBA.

 

[paliganibossalfrancis2]

My dream for this current Gilas is a gold medal finish in next year's 2025 FIBA Asia Cup. I think it's achievable considering that Australia usually doesn't send its elite national players in this tournament. I'm confident Gilas can beat an Australian national team-B. Of course it won't be easy winning the 2025 Asia Cup title. Teams like Australia, Lebanon, Japan, Jordan, New Zealand (if it parades most of its elite players) are formidable opponents. Then we can never overlook China, Korea & Iran.

The key for Gilas success is preparation. A 10-day preparation for the 2025 FIBA Asia Cup won't cut it. We need at least 4 weeks of full time training & about 8 tune-up games (hopefully around 5 tune up games vs. European teams) to get our Gilas players battle ready. Also we need "all" our Gilas players to be present in the training camp right from the start. Hindi yung ang 1 or 2 players eh magjo join sa training camp about only a week before the tournament.

We need Gilas to be at its best form to claim Asia-Oceania basketball supremacy.

This. FIBA Asia Cup will be held between August 5 and August 17 2025. While Eurobasket will be from Aug 27 to Sep 14, 2025.

That Latvia win was VERY CRUCIAL for Gilas moving forward because that's the win that earned the respect of Europeans. Remember back in 2023, Lithuania and Estonia were only sending the B teams to play with us. They don't see any benefit in playing against us but now they surely do. I hope they can get tuneup games against teams preparing for Eurobasket. 3 games against say Jordan, Japan and Korea and then 5 games against European teams is enough prep. If we do this Asia Cup will be a walk in the park.

Knowing SBP and PBA though, maximum 1 week training camp and then 2-3 tuneup games against weak teams. lol

 

[paliganibossalfrancis2]

All I can say is, since coach Tim Cone has been doing a good job so far with Gilas, dapat huwag ng gambalahin pa ang program nya. Let him finish the job until 2027 or 2028.

Ang hirap dyan is baka next year lang or in 2026 umiksina na naman si Chot Reyes & would once again steal the Gilas head coaching job from Tim Cone.

Yun ang magiging mitsa ng Gilas program kung sakali!

Trans: Put Chot Reyes way way away from the current Gilas program. Don't let him have anything to do with Gilas.

imo, he should step away from TNT as well.

After tab baldwin's contract ends with ateneo this year, I think he should go back to the amateur ranks. That could be a breath of fresh air for him.

No point in trying to win for TNT anymore, he's already proven he can win chips. and no point involving himself with Gilas anymore, he already did his job by bringing us to 1 World Cup and some moral victories.

In Ateneo though, if he can revive that program from the dead and win championships for his alma mater he'll redeem himself and retire a winner.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

Good luck with the long prep. Tim Cone is just lying through his teeth regarding his cumulative results based on only 10 days of prep. The 10 day prep is an imposition of the stupid PBA.

PBA 2024-2025 season can end by late June next year, so Gilas can start it's training by early July. If for instance Ginebra & SMB figures in the finals of the 3rd conference, then Junmar, CJ Perez, Brownlee, Iskati & Malonzo can be given about 10 days of rest after the championship series before they join Gilas training. That should give Gilas about a month of full time training prior to the 2025 FIBA Asia Cup.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

This. FIBA Asia Cup will be held between August 5 and August 17 2025. While Eurobasket will be from Aug 27 to Sep 14, 2025.

That Latvia win was VERY CRUCIAL for Gilas moving forward because that's the win that earned the respect of Europeans. Remember back in 2023, Lithuania and Estonia were only sending the B teams to play with us. They don't see any benefit in playing against us but now they surely do. I hope they can get tuneup games against teams preparing for Eurobasket. 3 games against say Jordan, Japan and Korea and then 5 games against European teams is enough prep. If we do this Asia Cup will be a walk in the park.

Knowing SBP and PBA though, maximum 1 week training camp and then 2-3 tuneup games against weak teams. lol

Playing friendlies against even lower tier European teams like Ukraine, Estonia, Belgium, Georgia would be beneficial to Gilas. That's the beauty of European basketball - halos lahat ng national teams ay very competitive.

 

[Giannis34GOD2]

Playing friendlies against even lower tier European teams like Ukraine, Estonia, Belgium, Georgia would be beneficial to Gilas. That's the beauty of European basketball - halos lahat ng national teams ay very competitive.

I also think we should have a tune up game vs SSD, An agreement for both countries.. we will help them to build their preparation and their needs for their basketball program, while we will benefit from them playing against tall, athletic, versatile players who are simulation of playing against Australia... Since SSD has many players developed their skills in Australia...