Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

[Rds2]

Tab's comment about Ateneo direction and modern game is consistent witb the NBL, where frontline are fast and Guards are big with pace.


“I think our frontline will get a little bit smaller, our guard lineup might get a little bit bigger, and the speed of the game might be a little bit faster. This is how we project going forward, which as I said, kind of shadows how the whole game of basketball is going these days,” he said.​

I think it is also because guys like Kouame who are tall, mobile, teachable and have a good work ethic are not easy to find.

Or Tab might be going another direction. Obasa seems eloquent but is shorter than Kouame. He is not the rim protector Kouame is. Is it because there are no tallee options? The other schools are getting taller FSAs. Didnt La Salle get the tall CEU FSA?

For whatever reason, Tab chose a shorter FSA. With lesser rim protection Ateneo, by necessity, will need to ramp up the offense. Is the Philippines ready for positionless basketball? GSM seems to be headed that way. But CS is kind of a hybrid. He can grind it a bit when games become physical. But Ateneo will not have that kind of guy. Obasa will need to be at least strong as Kouame. Can Amos be as strong as Daves?

UP is still the main contender here. Diouf is so long and tall that he can block you even if you get physical with him. Guys like Pablo can play physical but are skilled and mobile enough to play fast. Lopez is still a big question mark. Spencer is actually the guy they need that brings toughness in the perimeter.

Basically, with Kouame gone, there is no single dominant player on the UAAP right now. Not only is there no favorite. It also leaves open what play styles and pace will dominate and be effective in the league.

 

[IPC2]

I think it is also because guys like Kouame who are tall, mobile, teachable and have a good work ethic are not easy to find.

Or Tab might be going another direction. Obasa seems eloquent but is shorter than Kouame. He is not the rim protector Kouame is. Is it because there are no tallee options? The other schools are getting taller FSAs. Didnt La Salle get the tall CEU FSA?

For whatever reason, Tab chose a shorter FSA. With lesser rim protection Ateneo, by necessity, will need to ramp up the offense. Is the Philippines ready for positionless basketball? GSM seems to be headed that way. But CS is kind of a hybrid. He can grind it a bit when games become physical. But Ateneo will not have that kind of guy. Obasa will need to be at least strong as Kouame. Can Amos be as strong as Daves?

UP is still the main contender here. Diouf is so long and tall that he can block you even if you get physical with him. Guys like Pablo can play physical but are skilled and mobile enough to play fast. Lopez is still a big question mark. Spencer is actually the guy they need that brings toughness in the perimeter.

Basically, with Kouame gone, there is no single dominant player on the UAAP right now. Not only is there no favorite. It also leaves open what play styles and pace will dominate and be effective in the league.

Beda and CSB might be candidates (both trotting out either tall wings, versatile lineups, or both), although it will be difficult without the FSA.

Even TNT had that but although Oftana, Khobuntin, and RHJ are almost as dynamic as Miah, Malonzo, and Brownlee, they don't have a CStand-type player.

 

[Metta2]

I think it is also because guys like Kouame who are tall, mobile, teachable and have a good work ethic are not easy to find.

Or Tab might be going another direction. Obasa seems eloquent but is shorter than Kouame. He is not the rim protector Kouame is. Is it because there are no tallee options? The other schools are getting taller FSAs. Didnt La Salle get the tall CEU FSA?

For whatever reason, Tab chose a shorter FSA. With lesser rim protection Ateneo, by necessity, will need to ramp up the offense. Is the Philippines ready for positionless basketball? GSM seems to be headed that way. But CS is kind of a hybrid. He can grind it a bit when games become physical. But Ateneo will not have that kind of guy. Obasa will need to be at least strong as Kouame. Can Amos be as strong as Daves?

UP is still the main contender here. Diouf is so long and tall that he can block you even if you get physical with him. Guys like Pablo can play physical but are skilled and mobile enough to play fast. Lopez is still a big question mark. Spencer is actually the guy they need that brings toughness in the perimeter.

Basically, with Kouame gone, there is no single dominant player on the UAAP right now. Not only is there no favorite. It also leaves open what play styles and pace will dominate and be effective in the league.

The younger backup FSA to Obasa seems projected to be better. There are a lot of true 18 and young 19 year olds coming in that will form a core. Feels like they're architecting another long-term dynastic type of team that will develop together. UP also has the personnel to achieve this, but with the way they recruit it seems like they're not waiting for organic development. Similar to what DLSU has been doing.

If Stevens and QMB rumors are true, heck UP can form 2 teams and both will be contenders. That's how loaded they are.

 

[IPC2]

so, is Mikey Williams eligible? lol

​

hahaha , speaks volumes about the league, a NBA G league discard dominating a series even if it appears that he is disinterested and doesn't show much effort

Mikey should be a default member of any Gilas team in a non-FIBA sanctioned tournament

Maybe for the Asian Games.​ Beyond that, I dunno. I'm kinda partial to youth and long-term youthfulness, and Mikey will be 35 in the next Asian Games. Let's see about his health and ability, and if he's still good by 2026 Asian Games.

For SEA Games, come on, youth pa rin dapat. The best youth, unless preparing for the WC, in which case the best eligibiles.

 

[CoJ2]

​

Maybe for the Asian Games.​ Beyond that, I dunno. I'm kinda partial to youth and long-term youthfulness, and Mikey will be 35 in the next Asian Games. Let's see about his health and ability, and if he's still good by 2026 Asian Games.

For SEA Games, come on, youth pa rin dapat. The best youth, unless preparing for the WC, in which case the best eligibiles.

got your point, especially that qualifying for the next world cup would be a uphill battle and we need to develop the next gen gilas. If only Mikey is younger, somehow the fact that he is 30 plus keeps slipping my mind.

 

[Metta2]

We've been blessed again with a potentially promising batch with our prospects that are within the 18 yr old range. With Mason, LSGH duo, Bahay, Gamber, Konov, Harris, etc. This batch needs to be developed and pushed ASAP. Imagine building this group's chemistry and teamwork continually and led by vets like Kai and Edu...in 5-10 years this group might be something.

But key is continual development and pushing them into tough competition early (*ehem* next SEA Games).

 

[JAMSKIE2]

We've been blessed again with a potentially promising batch with our prospects that are within the 18 yr old range. With Mason, LSGH duo, Bahay, Gamber, Konov, Harris, etc. This batch needs to be developed and pushed ASAP. Imagine building this group's chemistry and teamwork continually and led by vets like Kai and Edu...in 5-10 years this group might be something.

But key is continual development and pushing them into tough competition early (*ehem* next SEA Games).

Hayss! If only we are living in a near perfect world! But in Phi basketball, things are extremely very very far from perfect.

As you mentioned, in 5 to 10 years, the batch of Mason Amos, Harris, Konov, Kai, Edu, etc. would be something if they would be regular fixtures of the national team. Well, this reminds of a the "23 for '23" Gilas cadet pool in 2018 which became the Gilas pool handled by coach Tab Baldwin in 2021. We all know what happened to that pool/team & as well to coach Tab. Again, if only we are living in a near perfect world.

 

[IPC2]

Hayss! If only we are living in a near perfect world! But in Phi basketball, things are extremely very very far from perfect.

As you mentioned, in 5 to 10 years, the batch of Mason Amos, Harris, Konov, Kai, Edu, etc. would be something if they would be regular fixtures of the national team. Well, this reminds of a the "23 for '23" Gilas cadet pool in 2018 which became the Gilas pool handled by coach Tab Baldwin in 2021. We all know what happened to that pool/team & as well to coach Tab. Again, if only we are living in a near perfect world.

Well, gago naman federation natin (our federation is really smart), so next best thing is hope that as many players as possible go abroad just for Gilas availability. Then hope schools like Ateneo, Beda, FEU, and maybe UP and CSB can develop our prospects.

Etong SEA Games nga, we're a win-now mode with us considering locals in CStand (33 going 34) and Mikey (31 going 32), which is puzzling considering that we have a WC to prepare for (meaning we need our best eligibles there), and we have younger ineligibles who have a better chance to represent us long term. That wouldn't have happened had Chot had a better gameplan on defense instead of allowing Indonesia to shoot 13-31 from 3 (41%), and 47% from the field (when they had been shooting 37% from 3 in their last 3 games), and subbed in defensive players like Navarro, Lopez in lieu of guys like Troy and even Pogoy.

 

[carmelo72]

speaking of the LSGH duo what's their ceiling? Erram&Almazan? hope not

 

[Rds2]

speaking of the LSGH duo what's their ceiling? Erram&Almazan? hope not

They are more skilled than both and Pablo has great motor. But let's not shortchange Erram. The guy has good length and good defensive instincts but a bit foul happy and emotional. But he is good enough to matchup against CS. Both Pablo and Gagate need to improve their perimeter defense. They have to be tweeners in Fiba.

 

[IPC2]

Mikey Williams provided loads of offense. He was lucky though his teammates produced two stops after he misses 2 FTs that couldve iced the game.
RHJ was brilliant. It goes to show what NBA level athleticism and length can do to even thePBAs best import ever.

Kudos to TNTs defensive 5 of RHJ, Erram, Oftana, Rosser and Khobuntin. Not sure why GSM didnt hunt an Erram Brownlee switch.

Does anyone know what is the 3pt% of RHJ in the pba? That's partly the reason he couldn't stick in the nba because he shot around 20% from 3pt.

He was 10-35 (28.6%) from three in the PBA in 15 games. Not great.

Didn't even matter because he was excellent in everything else during his stint. And teams could not take advantage of his weakness.

Kinda OT but there's a bunch of posts in r/nba asking why he's out of the league. The consensus was he was above average on D but terrible on the other end. Even though he's kinda youngish teams would rather develop younger guys or get gamble on unknown prospects.

To be honest his offense is not NBA level but his D, athleticism and length is. If he improves his 3 pt shooting he can still be a 3&D player in the NBA. Actually he is not the usual import you get in this cup. His shooting stroke is really inconsistent. But he is so long and athletic, nobody can block his mid range. But most important is his defense. JB cannot take over with him around. And with TNT also having tall and long players to matchup the other players GSM was stopped.

He's not that bad of a player and is probably better than most end of bench guys in the NBA. I like his fit better for our NT than Brownlee with our relatively tall wings now. But for sure he'll be a lot more expensive to naturalize. JB is getting up there in age and is probably tiers below other NPs except Japan.

Yeah, RHJ's good for us as a tweener forward if we naturalize him. If the other 4 are good shooters, he can fit.

Oftana and Malonzo are good shooters, and both are 6'5"-6'6". Even Will Navarro improved his shooting in the PBA. I hope all of them get used in Gilas as wings, as they are our best local options there. They can complement an RHJ-type.

 

[Rds2]

Yeah, RHJ's good for us as a tweener forward if we naturalize him. If the other 4 are good shooters, he can fit.

Oftana and Malonzo are good shooters, and both are 6'5"-6'6". Even Will Navarro improved his shooting in the PBA. I hope all of them get used in Gilas as wings, as they are our best local options there. They can complement an RHJ-type.

One thing I liked about this win is that it repudiates how Chot used Oftana in TNT as mostly a stretch 4. Chot has a small guard bias. Even a small SF bias. Oftana can be used as 2, 3 or 4. He was a key in this series because he he is a decent defender with size and you cant also leave him on offense. Him as SF compensates for Castro and Mikeys defense in the back court. Castro is not bad but Scottie can score over him in the paint. Mikey is taller but a lesser willing defender.

I hope this teaches Chot that a tall 3 with decent offense and defense will help. They dont need to be the next Gabe if they can also contribute on the other end.

 

[IPC2]

One thing I liked about this win is that it repudiates how Chot used Oftana in TNT as mostly a stretch 4. Chot has a small guard bias. Even a small SF bias. Oftana can be used as 2, 3 or 4. He was a key in this series because he he is a decent defender with size and you cant also leave him on offense. Him as SF compensates for Castro and Mikeys defense in the back court. Castro is not bad but Scottie can score over him in the paint. Mikey is taller but a lesser willing defender.

I hope this teaches Chot that a tall 3 with decent offense and defense will help. They dont need to be the next Gabe if they can also contribute on the other end.

Chot has a preference for shooters and/or shot creators at the 3 spot, unless the 3 is Gabe Norwood. Our best in those regards are usually guards like Wright, Parks, Dwight or 6'2"-6'3" off-guards like Pogoy (who's been erratic in this regard in FIBA), Chan, Fonacier, Marcio, and Dondon Hontiveros. E, Oftana's the perfect two-way shot-creating 3. Navarro and Malonzo are developing in that regard as well.

 

[IPC2]

I started to despise Sangalang more because of that series. He acted like a fake tough guy and was playing to hurt Junemar. Dude acts tough when he is protected by the refs but plays scared in FIBA.

Sangalang never had the heart to play for flag & country. Napilitan lang yan maglaro during the few times he played for Gilas. And he hardly made any impact.

​Not only the heart, he also lacks the ability. A 6'6" low-post specialist with no 3-ball and no defense won't cut it in FIBA.

At least Carl Tamayo can create from midrange, shoot the 3 a bit, and switch onto guards, and Mason Amos can shoot the three.

 

[Rds2]

​Not only the heart, he also lacks the ability. A 6'6" low-post specialist with no 3-ball and no defense won't cut it in FIBA.

At least Carl Tamayo can create from midrange, shoot the 3 a bit, and switch onto guards, and Mason Amos can shoot the three.

In a way he was the second coming of Alvin. In that he was dominant in the post while not being particularly athletic. However, unlike Alvin he was never able to extend his range. He tore his ACL and MCL in his rookie year. Maybe those injuries make it harder for him to shoot outside.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

In a way he was the second coming of Alvin. In that he was dominant in the post while not being particularly athletic. However, unlike Alvin he was never able to extend his range. He tore his ACL and MCL in his rookie year. Maybe those injuries make it harder for him to shoot outside.

Yeah, I remember that hype made by the media about Sangalang being the 2nd coming of Alvin Patrimonio.

Alvin though made some impact playing for the national team (especially in the 1994 Asian Games) despite being an undersized power forward. Sangalang on the other hand was a dud in his limited games with Gilas. Skill wise & moreso heart wise, Sangalang doesn't come close to Alvin.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

​Not only the heart, he also lacks the ability. A 6'6" low-post specialist with no 3-ball and no defense won't cut it in FIBA.

At least Carl Tamayo can create from midrange, shoot the 3 a bit, and switch onto guards, and Mason Amos can shoot the three.

Well Carl Tamayo has the handles & the long range shooting that Sangalang doesn't have. But in fairness to Sangalang, I think had he played for the national team during the 90's, I think he would have performed better due the different manner how the game was played in the 90's as compared to how the game is played at present. Sangalang might have made a Dennis Espino-like impact had he played in the 90's.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

Chot has a preference for shooters and/or shot creators at the 3 spot, unless the 3 is Gabe Norwood. Our best in those regards are usually guards like Wright, Parks, Dwight or 6'2"-6'3" off-guards like Pogoy (who's been erratic in this regard in FIBA), Chan, Fonacier, Marcio, and Dondon Hontiveros. E, Oftana's the perfect two-way shot-creating 3. Navarro and Malonzo are developing in that regard as well.

I remember during the 1998 Asian Games, I couldn't help but envy the Chinese national team parading those 6-foot-5/6-foot-6 shooting guards & small forwards which proved to be a handful for our Centennial team's wingmen like Allan Caidic, Kenneth Duremdes & Vergel Meneses who stood 3 to 4 inches shorter than their Chinese counterparts.

I asked myself at that time, "kailan pa kaya tayo magka players ng 6-foot-5 Allan Caidic, Vergel Meneses & Kenneth Duremdes?"

Somehow I'm now seeing those kind of players in Dwight Ramos, Calvin Oftana, Jamie Malonzo & Will Navarro.

 

[IPC2]

Well Carl Tamayo has the handles & the long range shooting that Sangalang doesn't have. But in fairness to Sangalang, I think had he played for the national team during the 90's, I think he would have performed better due the different manner how the game was played in the 90's as compared to how the game is played at present. Sangalang might have made a Dennis Espino-like impact had he played in the 90's.

I think Espino was a better defender by a mile, though. He also had the mentality.

 

[IPC2]

For me, Chot's PBA legacy has dimmed a little with Jolas' victory. Jolas was able to win a championship basically with the same formula as Chot, let Mikey do the shooting. I liked how Jolas used his defensive lineup to produce stops. Something that I don't remember Chot doing much. Also, I am not sure if Chot would've made plays for Oftana in the SG/SF spot. I hope Chot has learned something here. Like, a tall guy doesn't need to be at Gabe Norwood's level defensively to be effective at the SF spot if you involve him in offense.

Agree bro, especially in the last part.
While Oftana isn't in the level of a Gabe Norwood defensively, I think Oftana isn't a bad defender at the 3 spot. But compared to Norwood, Oftana is the better offensive player. For one, Oftana has more confidence in his offensive game than Norwood, plus Oftana is more assertive offensively than the usually passive Gabe Norwood. Besides, defense is a collective effort that requires coordination, cohesion & teamwork. Of course its a big plus if you have some defensive specialist in the team like a Norwood, Glen Capacio, Mark Pingris.

Well, who was at the level of Gabe defensively? Only Ping, his fellow defensive anchor is in that level, period.

As for Oftana, some like Hoops Highlights are calling him a 6'5" James Yap. He can be effective at the 2, he just needs a coach that will use him there. Who between him and CJ Perez is preferable at the 2 spot for Gilas, though?

And yeah, credit to Jolas na rin for having the acumen to use Oftana at 2, interchangeably with Khobuntin, especially after losing Pogoy. Maybe he listened to coach Gorunovic (because Chot wouldn't recommend it), and/or took some tips from Yeng (who put Oftana as a shot creating 3, and said that "playing 2 and 3 is essentially the same"). And, goddamn, a defensive lineup of MGR, Oftana, Khobuntin, RHJ, and Erram is nice. Could be a template for Gilas positionless basketball going forward (if we have coaches willing to play that).