Philippines Senior National Team Thread Vol. V

[DAdmiral2]

While Ange has basketball heritage and residency ( e.g # of years domestic play and residency years ) the 2 explicit guidelines for exception for FIBA, what he has against him are the following
1. the year he secured his passport ( was already 22 years old )
2. His parents / grand parents were never Philippine citizens (note this is not a lineage requirement , so JC, Green etc who all never had a parent or grandparent as a citizen does not matter )

if people are asking why are the 2 points above factors for approval , when they are not explicitly in FIBA guidelines, the reason is context of the rule , it's an exception to an age cutoff rule ( U16 ) so the younger the better , ( principle is citizenship acquired by common law, - e.g residency and influence on one's growing up years . (e.g educated in the country), age of residency as a minor

if Eze is not yet a citizen , then it's moot.. unfortunately FIBA has no control of each nations citizenship laws, if there is no common path to gain citizenship, like Cone is still a non citizen , then that's the nations problem

 

[Sikatrix2]

While Ange has basketball heritage and residency ( e.g # of years domestic play and residency years ) the 2 explicit guidelines for exception for FIBA, what he has against him are the following
1. the year he secured his passport ( was already 22 years old )
2. His parents / grand parents were never Philippine citizens (note this is not a lineage requirement , so JC, Green etc who all never had a parent or grandparent as a citizen does not matter )

if people are asking why are the 2 points above factors for approval , when they are not explicitly in FIBA guidelines, the reason is context of the rule , it's an exception to an age cutoff rule ( U16 ) so the younger the better , ( principle is citizenship acquired by common law, - e.g residency and influence on one's growing up years . (e.g educated in the country), age of residency as a minor

if Eze is not yet a citizen , then it's moot.. unfortunately FIBA has no control of each nations citizenship laws, if there is no common path to gain citizenship, like Cone is still a non citizen , then that's the nations problem

There is a common path for citizenship in the Philippines, basically 10 yr residency or 5 yr residency if with a Philippine spouse.

 

[ja.he2]

There is a common path for citizenship in the Philippines, basically 10 yr residency or 5 yr residency if with a Philippine spouse.

The naturalized parents can no longer become eligible as local in FIBA but their minor children and their would-be offspring will.

 

[DAdmiral2]

^
so acquiring citizenship via relationship ( marriage ) this is common law , the thing with this in regards to FIBA under 16 rule , is obviously only adults normally can get married , so granting of citizenship is way past the U16 age.. and as such within context of the age cutt off rule they're hoping to get an exemption from will basically not work..

The principles are actually aligned with common criteria of granting of citizenship for immigrants ( or people born outside of the country) , which basically involves merits on : Residency , age of residency ( preference as a minor) , relationship to a citizen ( parents , brother, grand parents etc) , they are all sound common criteria's

 

[DAdmiral2]

The naturalized parents can no longer become eligible as local in FIBA but their minor children and their would-be offspring will.

Correct , so assuming Kouame was the son of Doulthit or Jeff Moore ( even if born overseas) he would definitely be eligible as a local ( exempted) , regardless if both parents did not have Pinoy blood

 

[ja.he2]

Correct , so assuming Kouame was the son of Doulthit or Jeff Moore ( even if born overseas) he would definitely be eligible as a local ( exempted) , regardless if both parents did not have Pinoy blood

I believe that if that minor child is under 16 years old when his or her father or mother or both was naturalized, he/she can be classified as local without going through the exemption route, provided that he/she applies for passport before age 16.

 

[DAdmiral2]

^
that is why basically all these Sudanese or African players are eligible to play for Australia , essentially parents or themselves as minor immigrants ( whether refugee ) are granted citizenship.. do note Australia has the largest % of their population either born overseas or parents born overseas ( more than 50 %) . so basically in terms of Filipino status classfiication , Australia's population is majority ( more than 50 %) made up of foreign nationals ( they were just naturalised by common law )

 

[ja.he2]

^
that is why basically all these Sudanese or African players are eligible to play for Australia , essentially parents or themselves as minor immigrants ( whether refugee ) are granted citizenship.. do note Australia has the largest % of their population either born overseas or parents born overseas ( more than 50 %) . so basically in terms of Filipino status classfiication , Australia's population is majority ( more than 50 %) made up of foreign nationals ( they were just naturalised by common law )

In ideal setting, MVP or RSA can actually offer refugees and asylum seekers from Ukraine, Russia, Venezuela and South Sudan an opportunity here. Following the route I stated in my previous posts, minor children or would-be offsprings of these asylum seekers and refugees can go different routes under FIBA rules: 1) let their parents be naturalized and the kids' passport should be processed and issued before 16 years old; or 2) use the refugee clause in FIBA rules.

 

[IPC2]

Yeah I broke what I intended to do, but anyway the main reason for leaving or stopped posting is i was fed up with the SBP and Gilas program, so probably won't engage in that hopeless aspiration. And just stick to posting info (such as reason for coalition of commonwealth nations against Ukraine invasion policy to not allow teams to visit..

Yeah, management hasn't been the best, so I'm just hoping for our best NT players to go to SoKor, Japan, and then Aussie, Europe, and eventually the NBA.

In terms of management, my alma mater (UP) is frankly a better managed team. Good coaching, competent manager, and skillsets are being honed.

 

[ja.he2]

^
that is why basically all these Sudanese or African players are eligible to play for Australia , essentially parents or themselves as minor immigrants ( whether refugee ) are granted citizenship.. do note Australia has the largest % of their population either born overseas or parents born overseas ( more than 50 %) . so basically in terms of Filipino status classfiication , Australia's population is majority ( more than 50 %) made up of foreign nationals ( they were just naturalised by common law )

In ideal setting, MVP or RSA can actually offer refugees and asylum seekers from Ukraine, Russia, Venezuela and South Sudan an opportunity here. Following the route I stated in my previous posts, minor children or would-be offsprings of these asylum seekers and refugees can go different routes under FIBA rules: 1) let their parents be naturalized and the kids' passport should be processed and issued before 16 years old; or 2) use the refugee clause in FIBA rules.

 

[C2Hamm2]

In ideal setting, MVP or RSA can actually offer refugees and asylum seekers from Ukraine, Russia, Venezuela and South Sudan an opportunity here. Following the route I stated in my previous posts, minor children or would-be offsprings of these asylum seekers and refugees can go different routes under FIBA rules: 1) let their parents be naturalized and the kids' passport should be processed and issued before 16 years old; or 2) use the refugee clause in FIBA rules.

that would most likely be coordinated with UN for a few thousands of people. how will RSA or MVP give them ways of living? can they generate enough work, housing, education medicare etc? What you are saying needs to be initiated and heavily backed by the government. also, you cant pick or choose who you'll get. if you get people who are not into sport, are you just going to spend for their welfare for years until an offspring or is born wanting to play(and being good enough)?

 

[DAdmiral2]

^
Yup , if we tweak our laws, it will basically change the availability of players, I am confident if Kouame was granted a passport at 18 years old he would be exempted ( it's the laws that are making things difficult)
also if we could grant passports easily to fil foreigners without the lenghtly process under so called a sports passport streamline processing we could have guys like Tolentino as eligible players .
makes a big difference with just tweaking the process , to much red tape etc ,,,

 

[ja.he2]

that would most likely be coordinated with UN for a few thousands of people. how will RSA or MVP give them ways of living? can they generate enough work, housing, education medicare etc? What you are saying needs to be initiated and heavily backed by the government. also, you cant pick or choose who you'll get. if you get people who are not into sport, are you just going to spend for their welfare for years until an offspring or is born wanting to play(and being good enough)?

That's why it is in IDEAL setting.

Anyway, I would like to discuss how plausible is this:

- first, we need to know how many people from those places are we going to accept. 5,10, 20, 50? With these numbers depend the plausibility of such act.

- about ways/means to live: we have to remember that MVP and RSA are billionaires handling conglomerates here. Ofcourse, they have all the means to take care of these people. Besides, you will also ask these foreigners to find livelihood here.

- again, you are not asking the adults to go into sports. It's their children.

 

[CoJ2]

In ideal setting, MVP or RSA can actually offer refugees and asylum seekers from Ukraine, Russia, Venezuela and South Sudan an opportunity here. Following the route I stated in my previous posts, minor children or would-be offsprings of these asylum seekers and refugees can go different routes under FIBA rules: 1) let their parents be naturalized and the kids' passport should be processed and issued before 16 years old; or 2) use the refugee clause in FIBA rules.

this is the French and Spanish Model right?

 

[C2Hamm2]

That's why it is in IDEAL setting.

Anyway, I would like to discuss how plausible is this:

- first, we need to know how many people from those places are we going to accept. 5,10, 20, 50? With these numbers depend the plausibility of such act.

- about ways/means to live: we have to remember that MVP and RSA are billionaires handling conglomerates here. Ofcourse, they have all the means to take care of these people. Besides, you will also ask these foreigners to find livelihood here.

- again, you are not asking the adults to go into sports. It's their children.

That's why it is in IDEAL setting.

Anyway, I would like to discuss how plausible is this:

- first, we need to know how many people from those places are we going to accept. 5,10, 20, 50? With these numbers depend the plausibility of such act.

- about ways/means to live: we have to remember that MVP and RSA are billionaires handling conglomerates here. Ofcourse, they have all the means to take care of these people. Besides, you will also ask these foreigners to find livelihood here.

- again, you are not asking the adults to go into sports. It's their children.

just to be clear, I am not against this. all i'm saying is government needs to initiate this and should heavily be involved. not just financially, but all the required laws both national and local(i think LGUs should cover most of this bit). education to the resident of the area where the refugees will go to would need to happen lest we end up like Sweden.

ok, lets go with your points.
- first, we need to know how many people from those places are we going to accept. 5,10, 20, 50? With these numbers depend the plausibility of such act.

AU took roughly 23,000 from Afghanistan only since 2013. Sweden took roughly 160,000 from Syria, Iraq, and Afghanistan since 2015. lets say MVP and RSA take in 10K each. 1/5 elderly, 1/5 infants, 1/5 disabled, and the rest you can integrate to the either work force or send to school after you teach them to be able to communicate to Filipinos.

- about ways/means to live: we have to remember that MVP and RSA are billionaires handling conglomerates here. Ofcourse, they have all the means to take care of these people. Besides, you will also ask these foreigners to find livelihood here. - same as above, you need to teach them how to communicate. I know a few people here in Sydney whose parents can barely talk in english until now even if their children\grandchildren were born here and raised here. it is safe to assume less than half of who you'll get will have no skill to start with and you would have to upskill them

- again, you are not asking the adults to go into sports. It's their children. - i know, but what will you do to those who has no children? not accept them?

 

[ja.he2]

just to be clear, I am not against this. all i'm saying is government needs to initiate this and should heavily be involved. not just financially, but all the required laws both national and local(i think LGUs should cover most of this bit). education to the resident of the area where the refugees will go to would need to happen lest we end up like Sweden.

ok, lets go with your points.
- first, we need to know how many people from those places are we going to accept. 5,10, 20, 50? With these numbers depend the plausibility of such act.

AU took roughly 23,000 from Afghanistan only since 2013. Sweden took roughly 160,000 from Syria, Iraq, and Afghanistan since 2015. lets say MVP and RSA take in 10K each. 1/5 elderly, 1/5 infants, 1/5 disabled, and the rest you can integrate to the either work force or send to school after you teach them to be able to communicate to Filipinos.

- about ways/means to live: we have to remember that MVP and RSA are billionaires handling conglomerates here. Ofcourse, they have all the means to take care of these people. Besides, you will also ask these foreigners to find livelihood here. - same as above, you need to teach them how to communicate. I know a few people here in Sydney whose parents can barely talk in english until now even if their children\grandchildren were born here and raised here. it is safe to assume less than half of who you'll get will have no skill to start with and you would have to upskill them

- again, you are not asking the adults to go into sports. It's their children. - i know, but what will you do to those who has no children? not accept them?

Ofcourse, the government will be heavily involved here. No arguments.

- No arguments in my first point since it really depends upon the number and the composition of the refugees. It also depends on how these people can integrate with their adopted country.

- If it is South Sudan and Venezuela, yes, these people that we will most likely get are either jobless or less skilled to start a livelihood. This is not the case for Ukrainians and Russians. Most of these people fleeing out of their country are etiher professional or skilled people.

- we'll accept them either because why not? Again, they can be productive here.

 

[ja.he2]

this is the French and Spanish Model right?

I think so. France heavily relies on this one. Actually, Australia is doing this as of late.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

Guys, what are your takes on Jamie Malonzo?

I'm impressed with his defense, hustle & rebounding. His stats may have dipped since moving to Ginebra from Northport but that's understandable since Ginebra is a talent loaded team. What is important is that he plays his role very well & he provides significant impact to the team. I really like his defense & hustle.

 

[CoJ2]

I think so. France heavily relies on this one. Actually, Australia is doing this as of late.

and its not only for basketball, france also had a lot of african migrants on their football team, much to the chagrin of Lithuania

 

[IPC2]

Guys, what are your takes on Jamie Malonzo?

I'm impressed with his defense, hustle & rebounding. His stats may have dipped since moving to Ginebra from Northport but that's understandable since Ginebra is a talent loaded team. What is important is that he plays his role very well & he provides significant impact to the team. I really like his defense & hustle.

He's a more efficient shooter now, and his man defense has improved. He hustles hard too. In addition, Cone's giving him reps as a decision maker, and the results are mixed at best, but that's the only way you learn. He's NSD personified.

Still a good complementary piece to the NT, with his defense, hustle, and movement without the ball.