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JAMSKIE2
Guest
IIRC, Chris Ross was already a good player prior to his stint with SMB. He was even a quality player way back in the amateurs when he played in the now defunct PBL.
IIRC, Chris Ross was already a good player prior to his stint with SMB. He was even a quality player way back in the amateurs when he played in the now defunct PBL.
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Rds2
Guest
I have to go with Robert here. He may be all of those but in SMB he had to adjust a lot. I dont think his teams were any good. Being good in a so si team vs being good in a perennial champion are two entirely different things. IRC he came in to SMB as more of a facilitator and not an offensive threat. He had to grow into his role. He became arguably the best defender in the PBA. People forget that a second aspect of SMBs dominance was its defense. And Ross was a big part of it. His offense when he started in SMB was pretty bad. No outside shot, no sure shot on layups. But he needed to score if in order to stay. His passing was not as needed as the offense passed through JMF. His outside shot improved and he posted up smaller guards. His game changed a lot from when he came to SMB and when they developed the death 5. Same for Arwind.
I’ve repeated this many times. Leo’s problem was he was so afraid to lose his job that when he stumbled on the death 5 he never tried other things. He was so afraid to lose that he played his death 40 minutes early in the elims. He was terribly afraid not to gain twice to lose advantage. His predecessor Gee Abanilla had a working two style system that reached the finals against SMC in the previous Commissioner’s cup. But because Arwind’s role was diminished, in the AFC coach Gee was given a foreign consultant and was forced to use the guys Flex offense. Junemar missed several games because of a sprained ankle. They lost the AFC and Abanilla was never given the chance to use his system that led to them to 7 games in the finals against SMC.
If you were a fan then you knew that Comms cup Petron team was even more dominant than the death 5 SMB. Its average winning margin was 20 plus points. Unfortunately, Arwind had a diminished role. And maybe more importantly they were a big impediment to SMCs Grand slam plans. SMC was temporarily the jewel of the SMC teams. Becoming the sole San Miguel name for a time. So now Im not surprised that in the AFC, they saddled Abanilla with Purves and his flex system despite his system a game 7 away from winning a championship.
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Giannis34GOD2
Guest
Now look at Adrian Nocum.. If he was drafted by SMB, will he get his groove there? My point here is not on Nava that he was good or not, All players drafted by PBA teams are very good.. But what they need is exposure and trust by their teams.. Nocum is not even a best player at Mapua in his college days.. but he was lucky that ROS drafted him and become one of the best today, it is because CYG is good developing talents.. SMB is not good on that.. And if they are the ones of drafted Nocum, He will likely already out of the league because SMB is not keen trusting rookies...
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zairex2
Guest
Yeng is a very unique coach. I don't know if there is another coach in NBA or Asian Leagues who gives his players opportunities.
His coaching style is most likely to be beneficial to a player's career. But there is an issue with his coaching and that is efficiency. As you give all the players playing time it also lessen the time those players minutes to be consistent. As most of them will try to get their rhythm they will try to shoot the ball more and will try to maximized their playing time as the next game they might only play below 10 minutes, unlike how top teams maintain their efficiency as they only use less than 8 or 9 players.
Yeng has won two championships with this strategy also he ONLY has two championships as ROS coach.
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Rds2
Guest
Again I think it’s not that SMB is just bad at developing. It’s because Coach Leo’s system allows only for a specific offensive and defensive skillset that it is hard to get players that fit exactly. It is is so hard that they still play Marcio and Ross major minutes despite both obviously beyond their prime.
I contend that SMB developed Ross and Arwind. They were still trying to build the players to play along JMF. Arwind in fact flunked it. Gee used the import or even Doug Kramer as PF. Arwind’s minutes gradually diminished. Ironic that he won the BPC because he disappeared in the latter elims and in the whole post season. But because he was close with RSA and he was a good defender he was allowed to play major minutes at PF. In the early years he was hunted by other teams. PFs like Vic Manuel would post him up. In the early years he was embarassing from three. He would shoot 1/9 or 1/11 from 3 but he was allowed to so it. He would be acclaimed a hero because the only 3 he hit was a clutch one despite missing around 10 3s the rest of the game. He became a better shooter though.
Same with Ross. He became a defensive stopper and a sometimes decent shooter. He even became a postup guard to become an offensive threat. His defense was needed to help Junemar and Cabagnot out.
But when Leo got his death 5 to win he stopped developing other players. The main problem was he only one game plan, dump the ball to JMF. Whereas Gee had a 2nd system with Kramer as center and rhe import being the point forward along with guys like Lutz. Leo only depended on JMF. Players that excelled in fast paced games became useless if they could play with JMF or couldnt help him on defense. Unlike Tim Cone in SMC who had a deliberate pace centers on Sanggalang and De Vance but also had a trapping fast pace centered on Barocca.
The only starter that got into the death 5 consistently was CJ. A first pick and BPC contender. CS was thrown out because Leo couldnt use him. Even his replacement Tautuaa became a glorified sub and even lost minutes to Brondial. Leo couldnt think of a faster paced system that took advantage of Mo’s outside shooting and ability to drive for a center.
Leo was too dependent on JMF. So now that JMF isnt as dominant as before and calls are not able to protect him on defense SMB cant adjust. It’s funny because Mo actually did a good job on defending imports and scoring with JMF on the bench in the latter games. If SMB had a semi-decent import they couldve enetered the playoffs with Mo having a bigger role.
I contend that SMB developed Ross and Arwind. They were still trying to build the players to play along JMF. Arwind in fact flunked it. Gee used the import or even Doug Kramer as PF. Arwind’s minutes gradually diminished. Ironic that he won the BPC because he disappeared in the latter elims and in the whole post season. But because he was close with RSA and he was a good defender he was allowed to play major minutes at PF. In the early years he was hunted by other teams. PFs like Vic Manuel would post him up. In the early years he was embarassing from three. He would shoot 1/9 or 1/11 from 3 but he was allowed to so it. He would be acclaimed a hero because the only 3 he hit was a clutch one despite missing around 10 3s the rest of the game. He became a better shooter though.
Same with Ross. He became a defensive stopper and a sometimes decent shooter. He even became a postup guard to become an offensive threat. His defense was needed to help Junemar and Cabagnot out.
But when Leo got his death 5 to win he stopped developing other players. The main problem was he only one game plan, dump the ball to JMF. Whereas Gee had a 2nd system with Kramer as center and rhe import being the point forward along with guys like Lutz. Leo only depended on JMF. Players that excelled in fast paced games became useless if they could play with JMF or couldnt help him on defense. Unlike Tim Cone in SMC who had a deliberate pace centers on Sanggalang and De Vance but also had a trapping fast pace centered on Barocca.
The only starter that got into the death 5 consistently was CJ. A first pick and BPC contender. CS was thrown out because Leo couldnt use him. Even his replacement Tautuaa became a glorified sub and even lost minutes to Brondial. Leo couldnt think of a faster paced system that took advantage of Mo’s outside shooting and ability to drive for a center.
Leo was too dependent on JMF. So now that JMF isnt as dominant as before and calls are not able to protect him on defense SMB cant adjust. It’s funny because Mo actually did a good job on defending imports and scoring with JMF on the bench in the latter games. If SMB had a semi-decent import they couldve enetered the playoffs with Mo having a bigger role.
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Giannis34GOD2
Guest
Miami heat's Erik Spoelstra is the version of CYG in the NBA.. like CYG, Coach Spo often to develop players than recruiting stars.. Robinson, Herro, Adebayo are underrated or unknowns before draft but strive at Miami..
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zairex2
Guest
Well Gee didn't win, Leo did. Why are we arguing with success.
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Rds2
Guest
He was a game 7 away from winning the Govs cup against crown jewel at that time San Mig Coffee. His system worked so well they were blowing teams by 20 pts or more. Junemar didnt have to play more than 30 minutes IRC. Answer me this. If Gee’s system was so close to winning a championship for Petron, why was it changes in the next conf for Purves flex system?
Gee didnt fail in the basketball court. His failure was not for lack of winning. It was because of two things. His failure to play RSA favorite Arwind Santos who was crying left and right to the media that he was not used right despite his team steamrolling to the finals. And two because it was not yet the newly rechristened SMBs turn to win it was Sanmigs turn to win a Grandslam. Otherwise why change the system that got you 7 games in the finals in the previous conf?
You know as a JMF fan why it hurts? That Govs cup Junemar was the most athletic one Ive ever seen. Attempting putback dunks. Dunklng on a fast break over Blakely. Not a drop pass from a guard. A one on one flying dunk from Junemar ala Japeth.
In an alternate timeline, Abanillas system was kept. Junemar would only play 30 minutes not 40. And he would play fast and explosive. That kind of Junemar would have been a stronger force in Gilas. Unfortunately we are in that timeline where Junemar became a slow defensive liability.
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zairex2
Guest
I have no issue with Gee but his record was a Gov Cup finals stint in 2013 and Then loss to ROS 4-1 semifinals in Philippine Cup. So its not like his coaching was better than Leo
SMB won by 20pts. or more only in 3 of 9 games on Governors cup. So don't know where you got those figures.
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Rds2
Guest
Sorry about that. It seems my memory about that was a bit exaggerated. But they were still dominant. 8-1 win loss. 13.33 pts differential. Jmf averaging less than 30 mins I think.
The ROS loss was half expected. Do you understand what I said that Gee had to drop his system because management ordered to use Purves’ system along with the guy as consultant? You never answered if you agreed with me that that Govs cup Junemar was the most athletic and explosive he had ever been. But management wanted a slower and half court approach with much more minutes for JMF. Of course guys like Lutz were not maximized at this pace. JMF became heavier and slower. SMB got their AFCs. But the promise of 2014 WC JMF never came to fruition. SMB got their small pond championships but in the bigger picture they had the potential to develop the best Pinoy Fiba player. But small pond championships got in the way over international competitiveness. Slow heavy JMF at 40 minutes PT ensured their AFC domination. It didnt matter JMF couldnt be relied on in defense in Fiba and could only be used in short spurts because of this. As a fan it pained me that the active 2014 WC rookie was reduce to a plodding one. Al Chua and SMC didnt care. They even withheld Super Marcio when he was in his prime. All because of small pond championships. An example of personal and corporate objectives getting in the way of helping the country.
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zairex2
Guest
Firstly, he agreed to it so no discussion to that. I mean he is not a minor anymore, if he didn't agree, he can choose not to. SMC is the company hiring him so they have all the right to do what they see fit for their team unless its human rights violation.
Was JF more athlethic?? I would say he is more mobile before just like he was more mobile when he was playing in Cebu. JF choose to play in PBA because he wanted to be near his home. He was encourage by TC to even try out in Summer League but he didn't want to. He was satisfied with what he is doing and didn't venture anymore unlike the likes Kai or other Asian Imports. He was advised by the coaching staff but wanted to eat rice because he was poor growing up. https://fastbreak.com.ph/lol-junemar-fajardo-avoids-diet/hoop-snoop/
So accept it, it was JF wish to eat more before
They won the championship which is their mission. SMC's mission also was that. What can I do, I don't pay for their livelihood. That happens everywhere, NBA, BLeague and Euro
Do I wish he could be more for us in Fiba, yes but to many factors played in those times including SMC not allowing its player to play in Fiba. I said here before that I blame SMC for not allowing JF to play in some Fiba Tournaments including Marcio.
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hmbopbaduwap2
Guest
Dave signs with the Abra in the MPBL
https://www.spin.ph/basketball/dave...bfkheD_VPzIBmKWRBQ_aem_IXlsJQC7amKXveukrFjl7w
https://www.spin.ph/basketball/dave...bfkheD_VPzIBmKWRBQ_aem_IXlsJQC7amKXveukrFjl7w
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greenarcher2
Guest
Snow with a Mikey Williams trade rumor possibly involving Barefield and Arana.
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CoJ2
Guest
Will Northport/SMC allow them??
https://tiebreakertimes.com.ph/tbt/...s-to-acquire-terrafirma-pba-franchise/327140?
https://tiebreakertimes.com.ph/tbt/...s-to-acquire-terrafirma-pba-franchise/327140?
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hmbopbaduwap2
Guest
From Gerry Ramos twitter: Starhorse Shipping Lines has formally file a letter of intent in the PBA.
Sikatrix2
Moderator
The old Snow rumor was they were gonna take over Northport. Maybe Northport is too good so here is Terrafirma.
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CoJ2
Guest
Bigger issue is starhorse is in the same industry as northport,
though SMC eventually allowed Phoenix, but it was during the peak of Duterte’s power
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hmbopbaduwap2
Guest
https://sports.inquirer.net/607634/terrafirma-sale-to-starhorse-gains-traction
PBA officials did not return queries about the potential sale, but sources said that Starhorse had submitted a letter of intent while its representatives met with commissioner Willie Marcial and Terrafirma team governor Bobby Rosales.
Jax Chua, who had been involved in the Basilan teams that competed in the MPBL and the PBA D-League, and Bernard Yang, longtime team manager of Hapee in the defunct PBL and D-League, were among those who attended on behalf of Starhorse.
PBA officials did not return queries about the potential sale, but sources said that Starhorse had submitted a letter of intent while its representatives met with commissioner Willie Marcial and Terrafirma team governor Bobby Rosales.
Jax Chua, who had been involved in the Basilan teams that competed in the MPBL and the PBA D-League, and Bernard Yang, longtime team manager of Hapee in the defunct PBL and D-League, were among those who attended on behalf of Starhorse.
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greenarcher2
Guest
Northport is a terminal business. Starhorse is a shipping/transport line. I don't see a conflict.