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Philippine PBA Trades, Releases, Sign-ups, Rumours (vol. III)

  • Thread starter Thread starter rikhardur2
  • Start date Start date
zairex said:
Lets stick to EuroLeague. How do you gauge if a team has a high chance of making the playoffs? For example, Olympiacos and Real Madrid has been in the final four in the past two year. Is that parity.
Greece Olympiacos
You also say that all teams has high chance of making the playoffs then why is Zalgiris Kaunas​ hasn't been in final 4 except for 2018 for ten years now ​
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Team records.. we all know euroleague is one of the toughest league to play with given the parity they have.. the number of teams above .500. not all will experience final four in 10 year span..

here in nbl teams almost all teams has a shot of playoffs last season..
 
Silent Killer said:
Team records.. we all know euroleague is one of the toughest league to play with given the parity they have.. the number of teams above .500. not all will experience final four in 10 year span..

here in nbl teams almost all teams has a shot of playoffs last season..
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Again in EuroLeague, is it parity when if the top 6 will always be Real Madrid, Barca, and Olympiacos? So why they keep getting top seeds if their is parity. Does the league a top heavy. Repeating to get top 6 should be rare, correct?
 
Making it about Parity is deflecting the real issue. Disparity is a symptom and not the root problem.

Like I said, even in the most open/free market leagues, there will always be teams like the LA Lakers who will have built in advantages (weather, glamour, business/brand opportunities, competent owners/leaders). A city like Sacramento will never be equal to Los Angeles. Therefore, top marquee players will always prefer LA over teams like Sacramento. While LA can just trade for a player like LBJ and AD and instantly contend, Sacramento has to do it the long and tedious way.

But Kings fans don't hold that against the NBA. Because they know their team is trying and they are content with it. They truly have a chance for becoming champs, but their margin for error is so much more small compared to the Lakers.

And that is the crux of PBA's problem (that results in disparity among other things), do all teams aim to truly win? And how can a league be successful when many teams don't even value success.

Those who want to muddy the issue is making it about Parity because it is such an easy thing to argue.
 
zairex said:
Again in EuroLeague, is it parity when if the top 6 will always be Real Madrid, Barca, and Olympiacos? So why they keep getting top seeds if their is parity. Does the league a top heavy. Repeating to get top 6 should be rare, correct?
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european fans says it has parity and other fans itself as well.. irregardless of what you’re pushing it about olympiacos and other teams unable to make the final four.. the league itself is balance and has parity..
 
Metta said:
Making it about Parity is deflecting the real issue. Disparity is a symptom and not the root problem.

Like I said, even in the most open/free market leagues, there will always be teams like the LA Lakers who will have built in advantages (weather, glamour, business/brand opportunities, competent owners/leaders). A city like Sacramento will never be equal to Los Angeles. Therefore, top marquee players will always prefer LA over teams like Sacramento. While LA can just trade for a player like LBJ and AD and instantly contend, Sacramento has to do it the long and tedious way.

But Kings fans don't hold that against the NBA. Because they know their team is trying and they are content with it. They truly have a chance for becoming champs, but their margin for error is so much more small compared to the Lakers.

And that is the crux of PBA's problem (that results in disparity among other things), do all teams aim to truly win? And how can a league be successful when many teams don't even value success.

Those who want to muddy the issue is making it about Parity because it is such an easy thing to argue.
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draft system suppose to address the issue on pba parity but its not the case.. unlike pba before, we can say theirs a parity because we can see team built thru draft..
 
Silent Killer said:
draft system suppose to address the issue on pba parity but its not the case.. unlike pba before, we can say theirs a parity because we can see team built thru draft..
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...because before, teams were actually trying to win chips. Parity is a byproduct.
 
I think one guy here is missing the point on purpose and trying to steer the discussion away from the real issue. In the NBA the draft system although with its flaws was designed so that all teams would have a chance at securing top incoming players. The NBA has designated and fixed contracts for lottery picks and 1st rounders while the PBA does not, as we can we see with all these incoming players trying to hold out and haggling about number of years and salary (since its an open secret the PBA doesnt strictly impose the salary cap but teams will use it to lowball players). Imagine if the NBA had farm teams, small market teams like Milwaukee, San Antonio, Orlando, Atlanta, Sacramento etc would have no access to top talents and those top rookies will eventually all go to the Lakers, Celtics, Warriors or Clippers. In the PBA if independent teams dont tank like what Converge did they wont be able to secure the top picks since its always Terrafirma, Blackwater and Northport always losing on purpose to secure draft position. It has nothing to do with money, the PBA can fix it so rookies will be obligated to play 2 to 3 years on the teams that drafted them but they wont do it. We already saw BGR got harvested right away without finishing his rookie season in Blackwater. I cannot fathom just how half witted some people are to not recognize this problem
 
Silent Killer said:
european fans says it has parity and other fans itself as well.. irregardless of what you’re pushing it about olympiacos and other teams unable to make the final four.. the league itself is balance and has parity..
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WHat I said can be checked in EuroLeagues and not based on no name or face fans. And it's reality that not all teams in Euro can compete except does that can spend at that time.

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Metta said:
Making it about Parity is deflecting the real issue. Disparity is a symptom and not the root problem.

Like I said, even in the most open/free market leagues, there will always be teams like the LA Lakers who will have built in advantages (weather, glamour, business/brand opportunities, competent owners/leaders). A city like Sacramento will never be equal to Los Angeles. Therefore, top marquee players will always prefer LA over teams like Sacramento. While LA can just trade for a player like LBJ and AD and instantly contend, Sacramento has to do it the long and tedious way.

But Kings fans don't hold that against the NBA. Because they know their team is trying and they are content with it. They truly have a chance for becoming champs, but their margin for error is so much more small compared to the Lakers.

And that is the crux of PBA's problem (that results in disparity among other things), do all teams aim to truly win? And how can a league be successful when many teams don't even value success.

Those who want to muddy the issue is making it about Parity because it is such an easy thing to argue.
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I can see that in NBA have effective parity. But most leagues dont because of how the difference in revenues of teams.

In PBA, how will you implement salary cap, should it be 420K per month or based on how much can top team can afford to pay.
 
A salary cap in the PBA is useless because the league doesnt enforce it despite numerous leaks via the media that players are getting paid more than the standard max monthly salary. Heck even Greg Slaughter posted on social media that he was getting paid 800k a month while he was with Ginebra. I think its idiotic to blame the independent teams for their circumstances since its the corporate teams and their farm teams that prevent them from securing top tier talent.
 
r1ck said:
"Yes, there can never be equal teams. But parity isn't that. Parity is the equal applicatin of rules to all teams. Parity is the equal oppurtunity for all teams to improve by getting players in a level playing field. Parity is the equal desire of teams to win, Let's not kid ourselves". - Noli Eala
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Eala is just making excuses, parity has a definition, and its definitely not that. Here is one from google:


the state or condition of being equal, especially regarding status or pay.​
 
r1ck said:
A salary cap in the PBA is useless because the league doesnt enforce it despite numerous leaks via the media that players are getting paid more than the standard max monthly salary. Heck even Greg Slaughter posted on social media that he was getting paid 800k a month while he was with Ginebra. I think its idiotic to blame the independent teams for their circumstances since its the corporate teams and their farm teams that prevent them from securing top tier talent.
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The salary cap exists to justify independent teams offering lower than market to its players if we are 100% honest about how things work.
 
Sikatrix said:
The salary cap exists to justify independent teams offering lower than market to its players if we are 100% honest about how things work.
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Its true although the corporate teams dont follow it when signing up top talent but they do take advantage of it to lowball other players and players that have slighted them.
 
r1ck said:
Its true although the corporate teams dont follow it when signing up top talent but they do take advantage of it to lowball other players and players that have slighted them.
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Yes they did this to Greg Slaughter as revenge for not going to Northport.
 
zairex said:
I can see that in NBA have effective parity. But most leagues dont because of how the difference in revenues of teams.

In PBA, how will you implement salary cap, should it be 420K per month or based on how much can top team can afford to pay.
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Do you have any ideas of your own on how the PBA can improve? It seems you think the PBA officials are the only ones coming up with good ideas.

And again on that word parity. In the NBA, yes all the teams have a chance at winning championships, but not all teams are on equal footing. Teams like the LA Lakers (like I explained) have built-in advantages that will never exist with other cities and it shows in the number of championships they have. In that case, Parity becomes debatable and subjective.

Parity is not the root problem of the PBA, it's a misdirection. The problem is farm teams who's ultimate goal is not to win championships. How will parity emerge if that is the underlying problem. "Hindi mo kayang gisingin ang nagtutulog-tulugan."
 
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Metta said:
Do you have any ideas of your own on how the PBA can improve? It seems you think the PBA officials are the only ones coming up with good ideas.

And again on that word parity. In the NBA, yes all the teams have a chance at winning championships, but not all teams are on equal footing. Teams like the LA Lakers (like I explained) have built-in advantages that will never exist with other cities and it shows in the number of championships they have. In that case, Parity becomes debatable and subjective.

Parity is not the root problem of the PBA, it's a misdirection. The problem is farm teams who's ultimate goal is not to win championships. How will parity emerge if that is the underlying problem. "Hindi mo kayang gisingin ang nagtutulog-tulugan."
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This current thread talks about parity as the main problem. Other leagues teams might want to win but if they don't spend they will not have a high chance of winning. Effectively making the league top heavy which means no parity. Teams aspiration to have parity but in reality the situation doesn't show it. They can all say they trying to compete but eventually top teams will win.

Just like in PBA. We all want parity but what setup will get us there when there is a big economical differences between teams. That why I ask question what type of setup will give us parity.

The NBA situation is unique in the sense has teams has enough money to pay top players all over the league.


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zairex said:
This current thread talks about parity as the main problem. Other leagues teams might want to win but if they don't spend they will not have a high chance of winning. Effectively making the league top heavy which means no parity. Teams aspiration to have parity but in reality the situation doesn't show it. They can all say they trying to compete but eventually top teams will win.

Just like in PBA. We all want parity but what setup will get us there when there is a big economical differences between teams. That why I ask question what type of setup will give us parity.

The NBA situation is unique in the sense has teams has enough money to pay top players all over the league.


​​​​
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Like I said, making it about Parity is misdirection. And those who keep making it about Parity are misdirecting. It is a symptom, not the problem.

Let me make it simple, forget Parity. How do we ensure that all teams are genuinely aiming to win championships? That's how the NBA in its very essence works even without equal resources among teams.

Do you have ideas of your own?
 
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