Lithuanian Point Guards

[Straight forward2]

how you don't get what I'm saying?

Tell me one benefit of Zemaitis being in the NT 2022? One single tiny benefit please I'm saying have young talented PG in that tourist spot. He will suck and sit his ass on the bench as Zemaitis did, but that at least will have future. Now Zemaitis was 100% waste.

And you are missing the point that Jokubaitis is the best player in the country with the ball. He's not your random raw player He was the best facilitator in 2022, not even Grigonis was at that level. Stop being passport export. Jokubaitis may be raw only in comparison with absolutely best PGs in the world, not in LTU NT context.

I'm not suggesting rebuilding. I'm saying we will waste spots anyway if we will have to go with mediocres like Zemaitis (or previously Kariniauskas, Vasiliauskas and so on). Waste the spot for most talented youngsters. Don't waste it at all if all pieces available. That's all I'm saying.

 

[LuDux2]

Jasikevicius played in 1997

Stop trolling

Apps to Avoid Drunk Texting and Posting (lifewire.com)​

 

[Straight forward2]

Jasikevicius played in 1997

Stop trolling

That justify my point perfectly. Jasikevicius was thrown in 1997 and in1999 already was main PG with 9ppg, 3,5apg. He could play in 1996 already though.

 

[Shawshank2]

Ok Jasikevicius 1997-2000 what kinda guard was near him? other kid or kazlauskas trusted,matured Maskoliunas?

Im saying what coaches does if they have young inexperienced guard they want to put near him experienced one .Thats called building a team for every scenerios that can happen ,not collecting raw tallents.


Dinosour expert you dont understand because you watches kids tournaments more , i watching best men leagues and what best team coaches does in playoofs


Go i check boxscores of top 8 teams in euroleague or top 8 nba teams and goodluck finding teams who play 2 diffrent under 23 old inexperienced guards

 

[Straight forward2]

More like you don't understand bruh In that stretch 1997-1999 Maskoliunas was solid defender and decent facilitator (very poor scorer though). What do we have as a back up now? We have undersized combo Lekavicius who has issues defensively and rather poor team control skills (only solid scoring skills). Yeah, now we definitely take Lekavicius as a back-up, he's a lock, but as we know he's questionable for 23 and looking long term his career in NT is kinda overall questionable. He doesn't bring what NT needs and likely when he will lose a bit of his quickness it will be basically over for him. So we can't count on him for next Olympic Cycle and even now he's a bad fit next to our poor centers defensively. When you have poor defenders and 5 and a midget at 1 (with all love and respect, I'm a fan of Lekavicius), you have a problem. Besides, have in mind that Kazlauskas took 24yo Jasikevicius and 23yo K. Marciulionis to Olympics 2000. Maskoliunas was still trying to back up Saras, but he was really poor already generally. Marciulionis also couldn't help cause he was trash and overrated (IMO). In other words, in 2000 NT already had the issue of "back-up" point guard and Kazlauskas had no solid options once Maskoliunas nearly completely declined. A bit later, in 2003 we will solve this issue putting young, super flexible and athletic Siska as a back up at 1 (again, fits my theory, young Siska got his feet wet in 2000 and in 2003 he was already fully ready). At that time he had that nickname "plastilinas".

My point is, that coaches choose the best options, not most experienced one. Maskoliunas was experienced in 2000, but he was already trash. For now we could live with Jokubaitis, Lekavicius, but overall we have a problem. Lekabvicius/Dimsa might be satisfactory solutions for 23 and 24, but I think LTU definitely should be building on young studs already if there's an opportunity. Marciulionis should be tested. Theoretically he's a good fit. We need defensively strong guard and offensively true floor general, pass first PG. Marciulionis fits the mould. 23yo Marciulionis should be ready to be solid back-up for Marciulionis in Eurobasket 2025. If that won't happen, we'll have an issue of a back-up. FIBA these days is different, it's really hard to play 30 minutes with this every increasing pace. Today starting players are more like playing 26mpg. L. Brown played 25mpg, Jokubaitis 26, Micic 27, Huertel 25. Some played more like Doncic, Schroder, Larkin, but that's more like exception these days and not a good fit for contemporary FIBA tournaments. Doncic looked gassed at the end. Larkin also got injured or something. Schroder seems to have great stamina and is extreme athlete, so he's different. But the fact is the back-up is very important. We'll see how things will work with Dimsa as a backup, but I feel a big need to have a fundamentally sound back up point guard.

 

[Shawshank2]

Im saying your point is wrong playoofs team coaches is not playing multiple inexperienced guards in desicion making positions .Max 1 super tallent or none at all.

Nba tanking teams with 25% winning record yes they usually have more than 2 such raw tallents



I didnt see yesterday in Real,Monaco,Olympaikos playing kids at desicion making positions.

I saw one Jokubaitis getting 12minutes thats it all other were 25+ old battle tested guards in 4 best europe teams.



If you cant see what playoofs teams coaches does,cant help u. Maybe change your glasses it possibly could help

 

[Straight forward2]

Im saying your point is wrong playoofs team coaches is not playing multiple inexperienced guards in desicion making positions .Max 1 super tallent or none at all.

Nba tanking teams with 25% winning record yes they usually have more than 2 such raw tallents



I didnt see yesterday in Real,Monaco,Olympaikos playing kids at desicion making positions.

I saw one Jokubaitis getting 12minutes thats it all other were 25+ old battle tested guards in 4 best europe teams.



If you cant see what playoofs teams coaches does,cant help u. Maybe change your glasses it possibly could help

FIBA is not EL or NBA (playOFFS). Off course you won't see youngsters running best clubs cause there's a huge market. In the NT you take what you have. We never had 2 high profile PGs coming at the same time, unless time will prove me wrong about Marciulionis. My thesis is that in 2025 Marciulionis will be way better at 1 than, say, Dimsa, cause Dimsa is not even PG. My projection is that 24yo Jokubaitis and 23yo Marciulionis will be our PG section in 2025. That's why I say it would be nice to take Marciulionis as a tourist now for 23, to get his feet wet, if we will have "tourist" spot.

 

[Dreamcatcher2]

How a ''tourist'' role is beneficial for a youngster? He may gain some experience, but for him working individually would bring more profit. At least in this way he could become better, unlike going to a champ and not having any role there.

 

[Straight forward2]

How a ''tourist'' role is beneficial for a youngster? He may gain some experience, but for him working individually would bring more profit. At least in this way he could become better, unlike going to a champ and not having any role there.

I think it's huge experience to be there mentally. Once you go through this you get certain immunity to that kind of environment. If you get some playing time, even more so. Be it for one or two games, but still. Marciulionis obviously can do both. NCAA season ended early. I doubt however that Maksvytis will invite him. He didn't even tested Sirvydis last summer for no reason. And that would be a mistake. I liked what Marciulionis provided in Match Madness.

 

[Shawshank2]

Siskauskas 8 games in 2000 summer Olympic didnt make him player he was in 2003 eurobasket

3 seasons 9 months game marathon being Rytas leader 2000-2003 made him who he become


Imagination that if Nt coach will bring kid tourist and give 15 trash minutes in entire tournament suddenly that players become future NT star and taking top 20 ltu players ever as examples is funny fantasy stories by Dinosour expert.

Neither Siskauskas or Jasikevicius was taken because they were just raw tallents they were taken because they were decent player already at young age like Jokubaitis now.

This is critical diffrence

Jokubaitis wasnt taken to 2021 NT because he just tallent,kid showed real things in euroleague. When Marciulionis or Sirvydis will show that in euroleague very good chance Nt coach also gonna take them too.

 

[Straight forward2]

You're making too many factual mistakes. Jasikevicius didn't come to NT from EL or not even top LKL club. He came straight from NCAA club Maryland.

Marciulionis yet didn't show much in NCAA, so I give you this, but that's why I suggest more like tourist spot, not role player's spot yet (he's not on Saras, Siska, Jokubaitis level). Throw him only for getting his feet wet if there's some room. If I'm NT coach and looking long term (I think there are a lot of chances Maksvytis will continue for another cycle knowing how successful he was with Zalgiris), I'm already starting to worry how to build my PG (most important) section. Specially that Jokubaitis is not a defensive player. So we need real deal defensive, pass first PG and I see only Marciulionis as candidate who is close now. Later some other will be close, specially Jakucionis, but now I think Marciulionis should be watched and tested closely.

Another thing, NT is different animal. NT experience is different than club's experience. Ask R. Giedraitis. The guy has been a stud in EL for many years, but in NT felt kinda lost. NT experience is different and you have to go through this. The same Lekavicius was already something in EL, but choked in 2015 EB, he needed that. He was ready for 2017 EB, but got injured and only made debut in 2019.

 

[Straight forward2]

So Jakucionis as a 16yo had a monster EL ANGT U18 season. In Kaunas he shot threes a bit worse, but overall this season 7 games - 18,6ppg, 4,7apg, 5,6rpg, 2,3spg, 23eff and very very solid shooting (70/35,3/82,9). His main issues is 4.1 TOs. I have no doubt that is very much fixable cause most of these are concentration problems. There's no single doubt he has higher IQ and better decision making than Velicka.

We never had such explosive 16yo PG prospect. Velicka was huge early bloomer with his beefy body, but Kasparas exceed even him. Jakucionis is most complete prospects because of his quick, fluid jump shot from three, off the dribble too and with a good range. Jokubaitis doesn't have so quick and so rangy jump shot. Plus, Jakucionis is extreme hustle player and very good defender. So, no doubt biggest PG prospect in the country. That doesn't mean he'll be the best PG necessary, but as the prospect he has the best package.

Here's highlights from Kaunas:

https://twitter.com/Eurospects/status/1660743077458333711

 

[Shawshank2]

dinosour expert


I repeat u coaches took all those kids who later become all time 20 ltu players because they were good at young age and could help on the floor,not because they were just raw tallents

Jokubaitis he balled in some euroleague games before he was took to NT .Suggesting 5pts ncaa kid is biased fantasy not reality

Brazdeikis in first and only ncaa season was 14,8pts player.Thats what most best ncaa 2020s kids does 1 year and bye



In 1990s best americans played in colleges till they were 21-22 ,now elite american kids turns 19 and goes to nba.

Tim Duncan played in ncaa in 1997 at 21 ,in 1998 at 22 he already was first team nba. Ncaa levels in 1990s was way better than in 2020 with one year and bye by elite usa kids


Jasikevicius 10,6pts in strong 1997 ncaa is not comparable to 5 pts average from Marciulionis in weak 2020s ncaa.



Suggest to NT euroleague/nba kids like Jokubaitis/Brazdeikis such kids can help but not in weak ncaa 5 pts average kids in 2020s basketball

 

[Straight forward2]

PE,

Again, you're not operating flexibly enough with all the data, can't handle all the picutre. At the very least you had to say "in most cases". I never questioned that coaches want the best and preferably proven players on the big stage, it would be naive to deny that and I have no time for trivialities. But it doesn't happen like that with NT all the time, far from it.

FOA, Garastas took 21yo or so Pazdrazdis to 1992 OT. In 1995 Garastas took G. Markevicius, not a youngster, but probably something even worse. He was complete no-body, but Garastas tried to solve ballhandlers issue. In 1996 Garastas took 25yo Paceas, he wasn't even LKL elite club's material at that point. In 1997 Kazlauskas took young Jasikevicius. In 2000 Kazlauskas took K. Marciulionis, with huge credit and he wasn't "balling" anywhere. In 2003 Giedrius Gustas made the team as 23yo, not exactly EL stud. In 2008 random trash Prekevicius. In 2009 Mazutis. In 2004 Vasiliauskas. In 2015 Lekavicius. In 2016 Kariniauskas from second league of Greece. In 2022 Zemaitis...

We had all sort of an attempts to fill back-ups PG, or 3rd PG spot...

Another thing, speculation that NCAA was way better back than is pure speculation. Just as EL and NBA exceeded in talent and quality, NCAA moves a long too. I bet in 90s there were few international prospects in NCAA. Now we have teams like Wildacats or Gonzaga where one team can have 4 international NBA prospects and overall likely we have more NBA prospects now than it used to be. I'm not sure all NBA team could have 18 teams basically in their depth in 90's. Now the money is much bigger in the NBA. So NCAA is NCAA.

Have in mind that Marciulionis delivered in Martch Madness. He was unleashed for 21mpg in 2 games and delivered 10ppg, 1,5apg, 2rbs. We will simply have to see where he is at ATM. Very good idea to have reserve NT.

 

[LuDux2]

Step 1: Imagine that NCAA now is the same as in mid 90s
Step 2: Augustas in first 2 NCAA seasons 310 pt, Saras 195 pt
Step 3: Augustas is 1,6 times better than Saras
Step 4: Wake up sheeple

 

[Shawshank2]

ok if you think that ncaa 18-19 old kids is as good as ncaa 21-22 kids from 1990s ok i will not try to prove very obviuos things

Do you also think that u-18 kids tournament players is not weaker than u-20 kids tournament players?



Marciulionis have no chance making NT zero. Lets forget main 5 guards Jokubaitis,Lekavicius,Grigonis,Brazdeikis,Dimsa

Even Normantas and D.Giedraitis is way higher as nt coaches eyes as Nt candidates.Even Velicka most likely is,because he was in all window games of B NT.



NT coaches historically shown very clearly they prefer player with experience in backup guard desicion making position.

Why i should think something will change after 30years of repeating same pattern? I dont



5th guard will be somebody from Dimsa or Margiris matured experienced guard like always.

 

[Straight forward2]

ok if you think that ncaa 18-19 old kids is as good as ncaa 21-22 kids from 1990s ok i will not try to prove very obviuos things

Do you also think that u-18 kids tournament players is not weaker than u-20 kids tournament players?



Marciulionis have no chance making NT zero. Lets forget main 5 guards Jokubaitis,Lekavicius,Grigonis,Brazdeikis,Dimsa

Even Normantas and D.Giedraitis is way higher as nt coaches eyes as Nt candidates.Even Velicka most likely is,because he was in all window games of B NT.



NT coaches historically shown very clearly they prefer player with experience in backup guard desicion making position.

Why i should think something will change after 30years of repeating same pattern? I dont



5th guard will be somebody from Dimsa or Margiris matured experienced guard like always.

I'm not saying that NCAA is better or equal to 90's. I have no idea TBH. My point is that some players as say Obbi Topin or Chris Duarte were drafted very late when they were 22-24yo. Not every single prospect gets drafted at 19-20. Another thing to consider - more international top prospects in NCAA. Look at Wildcats next season - Murauskas, Krivas, Veesaar. Lastly, overall the market is bugger and role players today are stronger than it used to be (you're big advocate of this BTW). So my point is that it's more complex and requires broader research, but I admit my profanity on this topic.

U18 usually is more stacked in star power. Some biggest stars skip U20 usually, but, no, I didn't say U20 is worse than U18. Have no idea what you had in mind.

I wouldn't say zero. OK, it's unlikely. I'm just saying what I would do if I have a tourist spot. I would look to the future, instead of taking some mediocre guy. Who thought Zemaitis will make NT? Or Kariniauskas in 2016? No-one. But they made it, and that turned out to be complete waist.

Normantas, yes. D. Giedraitis probably yes. Velicka, no. He turns the ball over too much. The game control is not particularly there yet.

How Pazdrazdis, Markevicius, Pacesas, Vaisvila, Jasikevicius, K. Marciulionis, Prekevicius, Mazutis were experienced at any higher level? OK, Vaisvila and Pacesas had some good LKL experience, but all these guys didn't have international PRO experience. Jasikevicius actually never played PRO prior NT.

All I'm saying I see traits in Marciulionis that I think will make him a good player. It's not even about his numbers. He has the material to become a good player and that's most important to me. That's why I advocate for him long term cause I think there will be continuation. Also have in mind that in 20/21 season Marciulionis played for Rytas in LKL and CL and didn't do all that bad knowing his minutes. Zemaitis was playing for the worst LKL team Dzukija at that point...We just have to see (and it's great that we will) where Marciulionis is. I didn't say he will make the team. I said he has to be monitored closely as he can become the piece that NT highly lacks one day.

 

[Shawshank2]

Step 1: Imagine that NCAA now is the same as in mid 90s
Step 2: Augustas in first 2 NCAA seasons 310 pt, Saras 195 pt
Step 3: Augustas is 1,6 times better than Saras
Step 4: Wake up sheeple

Step 5 : Jasikevicius made NT in 1997 after his 3rd ncaa season where he was already starting guard for Maryland with 10,8pts average

 

[Shawshank2]

U18 usually is more stacked in star power. Some biggest stars skip U20 usually, but, no, I didn't say U20 is worse than U18. Have no idea what you had in mind.

because about 2 years age diffrence is between best ncaa player from 1990s compare 2020s best ncaa players

Im number dude and going by this simple logic im saying Ncaa in 1990s was higher quality competion to way younger 2020s ncaa competion



Duncans,Pierces,Carters at 21 old age was simply better in 1990s than Zions or Morants at 19 in 2020s

 

[Straight forward2]

because about 2 years age diffrence is between best ncaa player from 1990s compare 2020s best ncaa players

Im number dude and going by this simple logic im saying Ncaa in 1990s was higher quality competion to way younger 2020s ncaa competion



Duncans,Pierces,Carters at 21 old age was simply better in 1990s than Zions or Morants at 19 in 2020s

In NCAA usually just one or two guys of such level Or there's none of them like recently.

Actually it seems that now the trend is becoming like in 90's. More and more quality players decide to stay in NCAA longer:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/college-basketball-old-drew-timme-6469720b