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Kaunas Zalgiris Thread

Toruko said:
Augustas is a very skilled passer but a very bad decision maker so far
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Why I feel this is remark from 17yo Augustas crappy campaign in U18 EC? :D Believe me, his decision making is at high level for 18yo nipple, and i like that he's wild sometimes. That's how it should be.

As for the guys who can really unlock the D with their ISO effort, it's not only Augustas and Rokas as candidates, but also Brazdeikis and Velicka. Specially Brazdeikis, he's an ISO scorer. Struggles at D and system BB, but he can really go ISO.
 
Straight forward said:
I see what you mean and I agree. However, it matters because true NBA prospect/material means that you have special player, the one who can prevail in all leagues of the world and likely can drag NT on his own shoulders literally (if that's not traditional center because traditional bruisers are limited in tiny and rigid FIBA courts). And looking historically, most of the times we were lead by NBA players. 1992–1999 Marciulionis, Sabonis. 2009–2013 Kleiza, 2014–2019 Valanciunas. Golden stretch 2000–2007 is an exception, and we still had Songaila, Jasikevicius, Macijauskas as NBA players to some extent and even maybe the best fit to NBA Siskauskas as potential NBA player all these years. The best example is always this: who would you take? Prime Jasikevicius, or prime Marciulionis? There's no question prime Marciulionis would rip Jasikevicius apart and would spit his blood all over the court, it wouldn't even be close. If we ever again have solid NBA guard, most likely that will be huge (even if NBA changed and soften since Rooney days a lot, but still) and special most likely. I'm all fine with good or elite EL players, you can win titles and Olympic medals with such breed, but true NBA player probably means that you have someone who can climb all over USA team defences, something special.
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I would take Jasikevicius over any other player. Of course prime Marciulionis was stronger due to his physicality, but Saras was the highiest IQ and coach on the court. Even when he couldn't run he could make the difference. I would choose his brain here. Him and Macijauskas imo were not suited for NBA at all but they were better than many solid NBA players in FIBA tournaments thar are different than American basketball. Greek freak was NBA MVP but he wasn't scary in FIBA games last time. Any strong team firstly should be lead by the fact it's a good and strong team with a string coach and defence. And only secondly by the individuals. Like Kazlauskas's Lithuania. Or f.e. an opposite one like Italy who had couple of strong NBA players like Belineli, Galinari, Bargnani and was lead by them but lacked the team and its chemistry. Of course having NBA material is exciting but i'm affected by Lithuanian basketball and because of that EL prospects don't excite me less.
 
Dreamcatcher said:
I would take Jasikevicius over any other player. Of course prime Marciulionis was stronger due to his physicality, but Saras was the highiest IQ and coach on the court. Even when he couldn't run he could make the difference. I would choose his brain here. Him and Macijauskas imo were not suited for NBA at all but they were better than many solid NBA players in FIBA tournaments thar are different than American basketball. Greek freak was NBA MVP but he wasn't scary in FIBA games last time. Any strong team firstly should be lead by the fact it's a good and strong team with a string coach and defence. And only secondly by the individuals. Like Kazlauskas's Lithuania. Or f.e. an opposite one like Italy who had couple of strong NBA players like Belineli, Galinari, Bargnani and was lead by them but lacked the team and its chemistry. Of course having NBA material is exciting but i'm affected by Lithuanian basketball and because of that EL prospects don't excite me less.
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It's just that Saras sucked at D :) Man, it's tough... I believe Saras is a bit overrated when it comes to such comparisons. F.e. 2004 OG. He was great in group stage, but then sucked against China in 4 finals and against Italy in semis. And overall I don't see how his IQ and everything (it's not like Rooney couldn't facilitate) transcends the fact that his 14pts and 8assists as best tournament is nowhere near to Marciulionis' 23.4pts and 8assists. Marciulionis was way better player any where as long as it's a basketball court. My take anyway.
 
I don't even argue that individually he was a better player. But the topic was a bit different - who you would choose in the team. It would be easier to find other players who would fill the gaps of what could provide Marciulionis and replace him (not fully of course). On the other hand there simply wouldn't be any Lithuanian players who could bring Saras's IQ. Also IMO you underrate this point here which is like i said was "coach on the court". Jasikevicius showed his elite coach potential not when he became Zalgiris's head coach but already a long time before when he played.
 
It's pleasure to watch "Lithuanian" core in Grigonis, Lekavicius, Jokubaitis. Now Zalgiris needs to bring back Kaunas' and Zalgiris' product Velicka in a year or two instead of Walkup, and Zalgiris has the backcourt for entire decade :D Great start of the season.


The fact that all Zalgiris' school products in Grigonis, Lekavicius, Jokubaitis and Velicka prevailing into true EL material is an impressive precendent. Specially that even Paulius Motiejunas talked that Zalgiris is not able to rise their own players. This should increase their belief in Youth sector.
 
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Imagine this hypotetical team of Zalgiris' school of last 10 years:

Lekavicius, Jokubaitis, Velicka
Grigonis, Valinskas
Ulanovas, Dimsa
Kulboka, Murauskas, Miniotas
Echodas, Birutis

It's not like Zalgiris' youth system is completely useless. I'm sure I missed someone.
 
Jokubaitis was 17 when he played in WC U19. Right after he joined Zalgiris2 team. I give Zalgiris all the credit.
 
Svajunas said:
Jokubaitis was 17 when he played in WC U19. Right after he joined Zalgiris2 team. I give Zalgiris all the credit.
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Yep I was wrong
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NEP = https://www.rkl.lt/zaidejai/rokas-jokubaitis
 
Straight forward said:
Probably, but he's like brain and scull Zalgiris' product overall. Beliauskas also played his first NKL season for Zalgiris, so we can count him in too.
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Kuzminskas before moving to Siauliai played a season in Perlas, but you wouldn't count him for Rytas school just like Bieliauskas and Miniotas who were raised by Klaipeda and Vilnius schools but then they were signed by Zalgiris second team and played there a season or two.

Jokubaitis btw also didn't play in Zalgiris school, but in Klaipeda, but then he was signed for long term by Zalgiris when he was already a promising one. I would say it's more a good scouting. It would be a case of Velicka and Barcelona if he would succeed in their youth system and then got to the first team.
 
Dreamcatcher said:
Kuzminskas before moving to Siauliai played a season in Perlas, but you wouldn't count him for Rytas school just like Bieliauskas and Miniotas who were raised by Klaipeda and Vilnius schools but then they were signed by Zalgiris second team and played there a season or two.

Jokubaitis btw also didn't play in Zalgiris school, but in Klaipeda, but then he was signed for long term by Zalgiris when he was already a promising one. I would say it's more a good scouting. It would be a case of Velicka and Barcelona if he would succeed in their youth system and then got to the first team.
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Sure. I meant Zalgiris product in a broad sense. But youth Zalgiris school isn't that bad when you look restrospectively now. When Rytas had Sirvydis, Tubelis, Marciulionis, Blazevic, the common sense was that Zalgiris school is toothless. But with closer look it produced pretty nice amount of talent. Good scouting and ability to attract interesting players is a heck of a skill. We also should mention Gudaitis. So plenty of true EL players came in last 10 years and things look nice with already prevailing Jokubaitis, Velicka and Murauskas balling in the reserve team.
 
Lekavicius shooting numbers thus far though :rolleyes: 73/57/100. Young vet balling. Grigonis also shooting with absolutely elite accuracy 47.1% threes. Jokubaitis' midrange game is scary, the pull up looks oiled, 62.5% 2FG. If he will develop three shooting, gonna get scary. Elite decision making and solid D already there.

From trash to goat? Wonder what folks like Tiskevic thinks now, he was ready to rip Schiller apart and to eat his ticking heart, even mocked his speaking style :D Exceeding expectations thus far, I'm so happy initial plan (recipe for disaster) to go with "Lith stud" didn't work out.

What's your opinion on T. Sabonis? I noticed his emotional consulting to Jokubaitis on the bench. How to know he has any clue what is he talking about? As a player, wasn't a high IQ player, also seemed to have laid back, cocky personality...Really looks like typical nepotism case, but I hope I'm wrong. To me he reaches too far as a beginner. Not exactly the PRO that I would like to see Jokubaitis taking notes from during the game, LOL.
 
Straight forward said:
Lekavicius shooting numbers thus far though :rolleyes: 73/57/100. Young vet balling. Grigonis also shooting with absolutely elite accuracy 47.1% threes. Jokubaitis' midrange game is scary, the pull up looks oiled, 62.5% 2FG. If he will develop three shooting, gonna get scary. Elite decision making and solid D already there.

From trash to goat? Wonder what folks like Tiskevic thinks now, he was ready to rip Schiller apart and to eat his ticking heart, even mocked his speaking style :D Exceeding expectations thus far, I'm so happy initial plan (recipe for disaster) to go with "Lith stud" didn't work out.

What's your opinion on T. Sabonis? I noticed his emotional consulting to Jokubaitis on the bench. How to know he has any clue what is he talking about? As a player, wasn't a high IQ player, also seemed to have laid back, cocky personality...Really looks like typical nepotism case, but I hope I'm wrong. To me he reaches too far as a beginner. Not exactly the PRO that I would like to see Jokubaitis taking notes from during the game, LOL.
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He just seems passionate about the game. Kind of in Saras way. Obv Im not comparing them.
 
Straight forward said:
What's your opinion on T. Sabonis? I noticed his emotional consulting to Jokubaitis on the bench. How to know he has any clue what is he talking about? As a player, wasn't a high IQ player, also seemed to have laid back, cocky personality...Really looks like typical nepotism case, but I hope I'm wrong. To me he reaches too far as a beginner. Not exactly the PRO that I would like to see Jokubaitis taking notes from during the game, LOL.
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Nah, he is not cocky at all, maybe he was back in his teen days, I don't know that, but lately absolutely down to earth guy, really devoted to the work he is doing. That's what pushes him forward the most. I can't tell in details about his tactical input to Zalgiris, cause not aware about that yet, but as a person he is intelligent guy. That's the case where I couldn't say that nepotism brought him to the duties he has, maybe a little, maybe with some credit, but I think he might be really good as assistant, but so far I hardly would see him becoming a headcoach e.g.
 
Mindozas said:
Nah, he is not cocky at all, maybe he was back in his teen days, I don't know that, but lately absolutely down to earth guy, really devoted to the work he is doing. That's what pushes him forward the most. I can't tell in details about his tactical input to Zalgiris, cause not aware about that yet, but as a person he is intelligent guy. That's the case where I couldn't say that nepotism brought him to the duties he has, maybe a little, maybe with some credit, but I think he might be really good as assistant, but so far I hardly would see him becoming a headcoach e.g.
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Yeah, I meant his young days. Now seems to be much more humble and matured, agreed. But giving tips already during the EL games...Maybe it's just some detail about personal fouls or similar, but if he gives his insights about the game plan, direct suggestions to the players, it's a bit too far reaching, IMO. His role should be more passive and distant, more of a student's. That would make sense. Anyway, hopefully he proves doubters wrong.
 
Straight forward said:
Yeah, I meant his young days. Now seems to be much more humble and matured, agreed. But giving tips already during the EL games...Maybe it's just some detail about personal fouls or similar, but if he gives his insights about the game plan, direct suggestions to the players, it's a bit too far reaching, IMO. His role should be more passive and distant, more of a student's. That would make sense. Anyway, hopefully he proves doubters wrong.
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I don't think he is offering some of his own ideas, but just doing typical assistant job, being familiar with game plan, giving some notifications and that's it. As we can see Schiller is not Saras, he is not giving away comments of every episode to players, he relies more on assistants to do the job too. It's not like Maskoliunas was the main bodyguard of Saras during the game, who's main task was to keep Saras away from troubles :)
 
Straight forward said:
Yeah, I meant his young days. Now seems to be much more humble and matured, agreed. But giving tips already during the EL games...Maybe it's just some detail about personal fouls or similar, but if he gives his insights about the game plan, direct suggestions to the players, it's a bit too far reaching, IMO. His role should be more passive and distant, more of a student's. That would make sense. Anyway, hopefully he proves doubters wrong.
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Are you jealous?
 
LuDux said:
Are you jealous?
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Do you want me to be? :) When Skvernelis wife screws ridiculously with her insights about "the road" just before elections and people start to mock her, you ask them, ARE YOU JEALOUS, is that the case? :) Don't forget Kaunas government supports the club (even the state to some degree), it's not entirely private thing where you can throw even your teenage kids to do the job if you like so. All Zalgiris moves should make sense and people will surely question them.

Jokubaitis with all the right decisions against EFES. The pass to Rubit was nasty:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHnZ5S05pIg
 
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