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Kaunas Zalgiris Thread

  • Thread starter Thread starter Straight forward2
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Given that Marius Grigonis is currently under contract with Žalgiris, how is that not tampering on CSKA's part? Does Euroleague not have rules with sanctions against that kind of behaviour? And if not, how can Euroleague expect to be treated seriously as a top notch league?

:confused:
 
So Central Sports Club of the Army, huh? The same army that kept Lithuania enslaved and killed thousands of our fellow country men and millions world wide. Some people call Kazlauskas elite coach...He never was elite coach cause he could go to any authoritarian sh...hole...as Russia, China just because money. If it's true, I will never understand Grigonis move as well. Just as I have super hard time to understand Siska. I can partly understand Kazlauskas and Siska, those 2 are oldtimers, Kazlauskas barely spoke English, but Grigonis...Dude, that's super disappointing.
 
I know that there are many idiots kids (probably adults as well) in Lith webs, but didn't expect SF to be so.
 
It's "fortunate" that Žalgiris isn't playoff bound. With Marius Grigonis having indicated that he doesn't want to stay, he's become a lame duck on the team. Should he now continue to be pencilled onto the starting lineup?

That's precisely why there are strict rules against tampering with players under contract in every North American sport.

:(
 
Very much disappointed to see such hatred post like this here.
I don't feel like elaborating on this at all,but just the fact that people feel they can go like this on international forum makes me feel uneasy
 
Shocking news for everyone. It seems that CSKA was going all-in for him, whilst other teams probably have not even made an offer. Although, it's already a done deal as I was told earlier today, well before all the rumors appeared in the media.

Why it's shocking? It was expected that Marius will leave, CSKA will need SG, cause their SG position is empty for next season. CSKA seemed like one of the possible destinations. Only one wish here is that James would be completely gone till that, game conception with him is the least Grigonis needs

Given that Marius Grigonis is currently under contract with Žalgiris, how is that not tampering on CSKA's part? Does Euroleague not have rules with sanctions against that kind of behaviour? And if not, how can Euroleague expect to be treated seriously as a top notch league?

:confused:

There are no such rules. It's completely normal thing here to agree with player early. Such things are done by Zalgiris too, mostly cause if you find some gem, you want to get him early for big sharks not to steal him away or raise his value. Big clubs does the same too. It was like that for ages, but I understand that it's uncommon thing for American leagues

Very much disappointed to see such hatred post like this here.
I don't feel like elaborating on this at all,but just the fact that people feel they can go like this on international forum makes me feel uneasy

Completely agree
 
Elaborate. What's idiotic about what I said?

Like everything.

History is a big bunch of wars and conflicts. To hate someone today because of historical things is exactly stupid. Grigonis played also in Germany that occupied Lithuania as well. In nazi "New Europe" there wasn't a place for Lithuania and Lithuanians. So Germany wanted to erase our country and nation (as well as most of the world). They were a bigger evil than Russia ever was. So?

In history basically all the countries who were powerhouses were occupants. Lithuania and Poland-Lithuania also were so for a couple of centuries enslaving many lands (slavian as well) and ended to do it when were forced to. Almost all the western contries had many colonies all around the world. America was founded by killing and forcing to move out local people and etc. Basically all the world history was about that. The world would be completely crazy and whole of enemies if it would still live lasting what was happening. Fortunately, it's not like that. But unfortunately, it's used to take (for wtw reasons) something one from the many dirty things in history and to rely on. A good example when western civilization decided that they should be very guilty for slavery and what a pathetic shit appeared because of that.

To speak more CSKA isn't a central army club anymore. I would understund if it would be about whole Russia because our politic is rusofobian. It would be stupid as well though. Many Lithuanians played or worked in all syrong Russian clubs. NT's were very friendly. Zalgiris and CSKA veterans played in a friendly atmosphere before EL game and it was broadcasted on TV. Aren't those CSKA vets living simbols of central army club (real one, not today's) by your point of vies? Relationships between people shouldn't be negatively affected by politics but unfortunately it's not always like that.

Opinion that Kazlauskas wasn't an elite coach because he worked in Russia and China is very funny. It's killing logic. It would be the same if you would say that Siskauskas wasn't an elite player because he played there. Or Grigonis isn't a good player anymore if he goes there. A good physical trainer Kondratavicius also worked there. More people than you think did so and it's completely OK because they are professionals. Even in the past when CSKA was that army club Kurtinaitis moved there (yes, he played in Moscow before Zalgiris). Nobody forced him, he could easily stay in Riga, but playing in CSKA was simply tons time better than in SKA. How it's not understandable i don't know. But fortunately, overall it's all fine here. I don't remember any bad things saying about all those who played or worked in Russia (or in CSKA if you care only about it). Just i thought that anyway in Grigonis's case some idiots from Lith webs would appear, but didn't expect to see it here from you. Even if i don't agree with you often, you are a solid poster. But this one is simply an idiotic one.

P.S. Some "argument" like English language i couldn't understund even if i tried. Maybe Songaila who also played in CSKA didn't speak English too after four years in NCAA?
 
Oh, sure, let's ignore imperialism, colonialism, racism, sexism, everything...it's just dialectics of history :) Let's ignore Lukashenka's regimen. We also had authoritarians in the past, right? Or were occupied by such, so who cares? Yeah, current Russia is the same country as current Germany, sure...:rolleyes: It's just that Germany admitted the horrors of Hitler and paid the price and for decades now is the engine of democratic Europe. While Soviet Russia or even Russia today never admit the horrors of Stalin or Soviet Russia. I never blame common people other than theirs conformism (the form that you suggest here), but I hate corrupt, imperial thirsty, killing and dominating thirty Russian government, which is based on mafia model. If you want to understand Putin and how things work in Russia, read Godfather. While Germany and other ex authoritarian regimes (like Spain's f.e.) went democratic ways, Russia never did and they still demoralize and oppress their people. Finally Belarus people woke up and stood up, showing that they are worth something as society, that they are not slaves, but they have been silenced and oppressed for more than 2 decades and they still are, but at least they stood up for struggle! Hobbes described the state of nature as "the war of all against all" and civic society was the society of law. Eventually that law became democratic, that's the best what we are capable of thus far. I can put it even more clearly: either you want to enslave and dominate or you sublimate your inner beast to moral act and egalitarian goals. Sure, let's justify Russia, China, all the the political oppression in the world because "other countries did something like that in the past". Exactly, in the past. History goes forward. Unfortunately, some old regimes still play the same authoritarian games enslaving millions of people. It's naive to think that current CSKA doesn't have any ties with Putin's clan, actually any big capital is Russia is related with it one way or another. It has nothing to do with russophobia, I love Russian post punk, KINO and stuff and read Russian novels, but it doesn't mean I forget history. If you're not turned on to politics, politics will turn on you. You don't run to people who enslaved your families 30 years ago, you don't work and ask money from the country (specially from formations as CSKA which has direct ties with bloody "governement") which denies all the brutalities that they committed upon us. Grigonis will become the entertainer of Putin and CSKA plays a huge role of Russian imperialist sentiment in sports area. If you don't understand that, you don't ever read G. Orwell and his words should be carefully contemplated: “Those who control the present, control the past and those who control the past control the future.”
 
There are no such rules. It's completely normal thing here to agree with player early. Such things are done by Zalgiris too, mostly cause if you find some gem, you want to get him early for big sharks not to steal him away or raise his value. Big clubs does the same too. It was like that for ages....

I'm saying that there should be such a rule. For there to even be a perception that a player might have divided loyalties compromises the game. Quite simply, if the players might not care due to divided loyalties, why should fans care and thus continue to buy tickets?

...I understand that it's uncommon thing for American leagues.

It's just not done at all because it's forbidden. Until a player's contract has expired, no other club can even indicate interest in the player even when baited with direct questions by reporters. Permission from a club must be obtained to negotiate with any staff member. This happens on occasion when it comes to coaches but permission is typically only given in the case where a coach would be moving up to a more senior position, e.g. from assistant coach to head coach. That's the way it's been as long as I can remember - meaning well over half a century.
 
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I'm saying that there should be such a rule. For there to even be a perception that a player might have divided loyalties compromises the game. Quite simply, if the players might not care due to divided loyalties, why should fans care and thus continue to buy tickets?

It's just not done at all because it's forbidden. Until a player's contract has expired, no other club can even indicate interest in the player even when baited with direct questions by reporters. Permission from a club must be obtained to negotiate with any staff member. This happens on occasion when it comes to coaches but permission is typically only given in the case where a coach would be moving up to a more senior position, e.g. from assistant coach to head coach. That's the way it's been as long as I can remember - meaning well over half a century.

But the thing is that there're conversations going on under the table even in NBA, NHL, NFL. Unofficially. Anyway, it's easier to create such rules when all the clubs are in only one league. In Euroleague clubs comes from different countries and plays in local leagues too. Euroleague has no such power to restrict such moves. The same like create some salary caps to make things more even, some drafts and etc. NBA and Europe it's two different worlds.
Also if a player agreed with other club during the season it's still not 100% that he will play there. Done deal, verbal agreement - yeah, but you can't have two signed contracts at the same time, also you need to go through medical testing for contract to be valid. That's done only during off-season. At times such "done deals" collapses, so it's not official until it's official = announced by all parts involved. Another thing - in agents/clubs circles it's usually not a secret if some player agreed with some other club during the season, so if that player will start fooling around in current one, he would just do harm to his reputation as professional and own future. Overall, I'm fine with that as long as player stays pro
 
But the thing is that there're conversations going on under the table even in NBA, NHL, NFL. Unofficially.

Wayyyyy under the table perhaps. The leagues strictly police the rule. The NFL sends two or three reminders per year to its member teams not to tamper with CFL players under contract and that's not only a different league and a different country but a substantially different game in the CFL.

Anyway, it's easier to create such rules when all the clubs are in only one league. In Euroleague clubs comes from different countries and plays in local leagues too.

Is there not some type of council of European federations? Such a rule would be to the benefit of all - the game, the fans and the teams. Quite simply fan interest and thus club revenues are built upon fans trusting the integrity of the game/sport and anything that could even create the perception that the integrity of the game might have been compromised is a very bad thing.

:(
 
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Lekavicius is back. In 2019 NT was very lucky to have Lukas in his best shape. It will be crucial for the NT to have Grigonis, Giedraitis, Lekavicius in a good shape while playing in Kaunas and hopefully OG. If that happens, we have a backcourt. Not elite, but we have a backcourt. For the first time since 2012.
 
Petrauskas is such a sl.t :o It was clear foul by Louvergne...I turn on LRT and the redneck blackhole basketball planet open up. Rytis Kazlauskas is the most patient guy in the planet.
 
Very much disappointed to see such hatred post like this here.
I don't feel like elaborating on this at all,but just the fact that people feel they can go like this on international forum makes me feel uneasy

it's really ironic to hear SF chirping here about "oppression" and bloodthirsty ruskies on the international basketball forum of all places lmao.
Guy doesn't even understand that he's coming off as a massive hypocrite and uninformed nazi, forgetting that our own lithuanian and polish ancestors were killing and enslaving russian lands for many centuries before the Russian Empire finally has risen from the ashes and hit back at their oppressors. Do I really need to dwelve into our not-so-glorious history of Rzhechpospolita and their bloody ventures into russian lands? Probably not, coz it's not the time and place to preach the righteousness on the sports forum lol
 
If anyone doubted that everyone in Lithuania is basketball expert, doubt no more. Fact that Algirdas Paleckis and Vardenis Pavardenis (first I wrote Petras Grazulis but remembered that these days he's fighting cosmopolitism homosexualism and other scary-isms together with Putin) are so well versed in basketball proves it beyond any doubt
 
Wayyyyy under the table perhaps. The leagues strictly police the rule. The NFL sends two or three reminders per year to its member teams not to tamper with CFL players under contract and that's not only a different league and a different country but a substantially different game in the CFL.

Is there not some type of council of European federations? Such a rule would be to the benefit of all - the game, the fans and the teams. Quite simply fan interest and thus club revenues are built upon fans trusting the integrity of the game/sport and anything that could even create the perception that the integrity of the game might have been compromised is a very bad thing.

:(

There's FIBA Europe, but FIBA cares only about money what so ever. Overall, I can only repeat it again - there're absolutely no problems with integrity and most fans doesn't see that as a problem at all. So player agreed to move elsewhere after the season - we are sad to lose some key guy, but not about a fact that we found out about it before the end of the season. Who cares? Actually it's even better to know it earlier as club can move forward and make plans for future. Better than find out about it in some July/August with month or a bit more to go till new season, and only then start rebuilding. Now Zalgiris knows the fact that Grigonis is gone and can start look for solutions early
 
it's really ironic to hear SF chirping here about "oppression" and bloodthirsty ruskies on the international basketball forum of all places lmao.
Guy doesn't even understand that he's coming off as a massive hypocrite and uninformed nazi, forgetting that our own lithuanian and polish ancestors were killing and enslaving russian lands for many centuries before the Russian Empire finally has risen from the ashes and hit back at their oppressors. Do I really need to dwelve into our not-so-glorious history of Rzhechpospolita and their bloody ventures into russian lands? Probably not, coz it's not the time and place to preach the righteousness on the sports forum lol

Yeah, and some people fight with racism today...what an idiots...they can't even understand that they all come off as massive hypocrites and ununiformed nazis. We all nazi because our ancestors were brutal, uneducated barbarians. We all nazi bastards! Fuck everything, let's not be hypocrite.
 
You only bring more nonsense. If it's about "Putin and his clan" why the hell you related only to CSKA in the first post? It should be about all Russian clubs as all the big capital one or another way is related to bloody Putin and his friends like you mentioned. "Red Army" isn't even on the first place. It's Zenit because of Gazprom. Then it should be a shame to Gudaitis first of all, isn't it? Maksvytis isn't a promising coach anymore cause he ran for money to the country that in the past occupied Lithuania, is he? (It's a huge nonsense, but i only took your "logic" in Kazlauskas's case). And many others who played, coached and worked in Russia. Even from hardcore (in a bad way) Lith. fans i haven't heard nothing similar to that. From you as well. Maybe you hit your head so you called Grigonis "an entertainer of Putin"? Because it's not only stupid, but also illogical. Why then only him?

I think you should have ignored Lithuanian basketball at all then because it had too many connections with Russian and Chinese basketball, haven't you? Olympics shouldn't have happened in China as well and million of tourists who visited China financially supported a bloody regime, didn't they?

And if it's not about rusophobia, then you can add some Turkey here because Erdogan and his regime is even more authoritarian. What about EL being sponsored by Turkish Airlines and watched by you? What about Ulanovas going for Turkish money? What about Zalgiris fans having good relations with Fener fans? They shouldn't do it and in general as well because of political shit all over the world?
 
Oh, nonsense? Right, Mister. Hm, may I call you Dean or at least Dr.? Cause you know when I read this "History is a big bunch of wars and conflicts. To hate someone today because of historical things is exactly stupid." and the same person come to me and give lecture about stupidity and nonsense it's either incredible genius or absolute imbecile. Are you fucking out of your mind? If someone will smash your wife's head or will make you a slave, you will just shook your shoulders saying "well, history is big bunch of conflicts". Are you retarded? Cause, I think I need to wake you up with proper words just that you would make a decent shot understanding what you wrote. How would the world be today if everyone would think so? If there wouldn't be ideas of morality, democracy, human rights, equality, feminism, piece and everyday struggle to make these values sustainable? How do you even try to fucking pretend that you have anything to say while you allow yourself to write this 5 years old crap? Sure, now I will justify the imperialist violence by Russia and Turkey because Grigonis and Ulanovas happened to play there? Dude, you're completely lost and you have to stop this insanity. Just try to understand what you wrote about the history, it's insane.
 
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