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Is Shaq in the top 5 of All Time?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Saskibaloia2
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Saskibaloia2

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When a basketball fan contemplates on the list of the Five Greatest Players of All Time the names, Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Bill Russell and Wilt Chamberlain comes to mind.
However, does Shaquille O'Neal the man who has achieved so much does he have enough achievements to supersede Wilt Chamberlain? On what basis one might ask? In terms of Championships, I say: Two versus Four and he unselfishness to create superstars Kobe Bryant and Dwayne Wade. However, of course there is the counter argument of Chamberlain's increadible individual achievements (of course the list is too long). In addition, one could argue that Shaq was not even as good as Kareem much more trying to supersede Chamberlain's place in the top 5 of All Time.
What is your opinion?
Does Shaquille belong in the top 5?
If not now will he eventually after he retires in 3 to 4 years time?
If he wins another championship with Miami and possibly another before he retires would you then say that he belongs in this list of immortals?
Some would suggest that we have to first answer the question of whether Shaq is ahead of Kareem on the All Time list then we can ask whether or not he can replace Chamberlain.
 
Shaq can never supersede Wilt. Wilt is the most dominant. He was an amazing athlete. Shaq could never beat him. Not to mention, SHaq never had to face Russell and the Celtics.
 
No.
Top 4 that is locked (in no order)
Wilt
Kareem
Bill Russell
MJ
next 3(no order)
Bird
Magic
Big O
 
Shaq is one of the greatest Centers of all times. How could anyone disagree? There has never been a man like him. Not even Russell or Wilt could overpower 5 guys in the paint, they use to move away from the basket and get fouled. Shaq hauled power.

In no way am I saying Shaq is better than them, but Ive always seen Shaq receieving little or no credit. They guy weighed a ton and had a vertical higher than most centers coming out of LSU. The guy learned how to shoot, and even run with the ball. I doubt we will see a guy like him for a long time :)
 
I think it all depends on the definition of "greatest" are we are talking strictly dominance? Winning percentage and Championhip rings? Statistics? Were they the unquestioned leaders of their squads? And where do those teams stand up to the test of time?

Wilt was dominant and holds a ton of records, but never won as many championship rings as Kareem and Shaq. Russell never put up the stats but was a complete winner. That's why I think Magic Bird and Jordan deserve to be up there, they were the unquestioned leaders of 3 of the toughest Nba teams ever.

Stuart
 
Not even Russell or Wilt could overpower 5 guys in the paint, they use to move away from the basket and get fouled.

Not really, Wilt overpower anybody and everybody. Wilt was triple-teamed regularly.

They guy weighed a ton and had a vertical higher than most centers coming out of LSU. The guy learned how to shoot, and even run with the ball. I doubt we will see a guy like him for a long time

Actually, you're talking about Wilt, not Shaq. Wilt had an incredible vertical (he was a champion long jumper at his college), he had incredibly long arms, and he was a point guard for the Globetrotters.

And how in the world can you say Shaq learned to shoot? He can't shoot at all.
 
Forgive me, I was assuming the thread meant top 5 Centers!

Not really, Wilt overpower anybody and everybody. Wilt was triple-teamed regularly.
Oh? like who? Little guards in the paint? He didnt overpower no where near Shaqs playing...He used to stretch his long arms and dunk. Would Russell have dunked on Ewing, Oakley and Anthony Mason together? No.

Actually, you're talking about Wilt, not Shaq. Wilt had an incredible vertical (he was a champion long jumper at his college), he had incredibly long arms, and he was a point guard for the Globetrotters.

And how in the world can you say Shaq learned to shoot? He can't shoot at all.
Im sorry I didnt mean to say he couldnt jump...your right he could jump indeed! :D But I meant Shaq could jump pretty high considering his body mass. And yeah Shaq "kinda" improved on his free throws AND fade-aways (If I can say that)....Soo...I still stand by Big daddy. Not enough credit at all. :)
 
come on,
when Wilt was playing the other centers were midgets next to him!
i think Russel was 6-10 and he was the only one who could be a match for Wilt... and Wilt was 7-2 ..?!
who were the other great players of that time that were big and strong enough for Wilt?

besides dont you realize that in athetism there is an evolution as there is in every aspect of humankind?

saying Wilt (the best center a few decades ago) is better than Shaq (the best center nowdays) is like saying that Jesse Owens or even Carl Lewis were better sprinters than Montgomery!

Humankind evolves, so athletes do, nowdays they are stronger and faster
and after 30-40 years they will be even more stronger and faster

"Its the evolution, babe!"
 
KokkinosVasilias said:
come on,
when Wilt was playing the other centers were midgets next to him!
Yep players like Bill Russel, Willis Reed, Walt Belamy, Wes Unseld, Zelmo Beaty, Wayne Embry, Kareem Abdul-Jabar, Big Nate Thurmond
 
Shaq is better, all these people are over 60 years old or dead :D

on the other hand Shaq had to face weaklings like Ewing, Hakeem, Robertson, Malone, Mourning, Mutombo, Barkley, Sabonis, Kemp, Garnett... no physical strength at all... :D
 
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KokkinosVasilias said:
Shaq is better, all these people are over 60 years old or dead :D

on the other hand Shaq had to face weaklings like Ewing, Hakeem, Robertson, Malone, Mourning, Mutombo, Barkley, Sabonis, Kemp, Garnett... no physical strength at all... :D
KokkinosVasilias said:
Shaq is better, all these people are over 60 years old or dead :D

on the other hand Shaq had to face weaklings like Ewing, Hakeem, Robertson, Malone, Mourning, Mutombo, Barkley, Sabonis, Kemp, Garnett... no physical strength at all... :D
I didnt know that Oscar Robertson played during the 90s:D :D

Ok lets see during the 5 years span(only in playoffs) player who faced Shaq and Wilt
Wilt-1967-1972
Jerry Lucas(6'9), Happy Hairston(6'8 build like Big Ben+extra point for his name:), Walt Wesley (7'0), Connie Dierking(6'10), Bill Russell(6'11), Nate Thurmond(7'0), Fred Hetzel(6'9), Clyde Lee(6'11), Willis Reed(6'11), Walt Bellamy(6'11), Bill Bridges(6'7), Zelmo Beaty(6'10), Paul Silas (6'8 + beast), Jim Fox(6'11), Neal Walk(6'10), Tom Boerwinkle(7'1 with deadly outside shot), Kareem Abdul-Jabbar(7'2), Dick Cunningham(6'11 well know for his HARD fouls), Gary Freeman(6'10), Clifford Ray(6'10)
Edit:most of those players were measured withowt shoes so I added +'1 but in todays NBA they list some of the player even with +'2 or even +'3

Shaq 2000-2005
Vlade Divac(6'10), Chris Webber(6'10), Scot Pollard(6'11), Lawrence Funderburke(6'9), Oliver Miller(6'9), Tom Gugliotta(6'10), Clifford Robinson(6'10), Arvydas Sabonis(7'3), Rasheed Wallace(6'10), Brian Grant(6'9), Jermaine O'Neal(6'11), Rik Smits(7'4), Dale Davis(6'10), Tim Duncan(6'10), David Robinson(7'1), Malik Rose(6'7), Dikembe M.M.M.J.J.W. Mutombo(7'2), Todd MacCulloch(7'0), Aaron Williams(6'9), Jason Collins(7'0), Kevin Garnett(6'11), Rasho Nesterovic(7'0), Yao Ming(7'5), Kelvin Cato(6'11), Ben Wallace(6'9..yeah right), Elden Campbell(6'11), Mehmet Okur(6'11), Brendan Haywood(7'0), Etan Thomas(6'9).

Outside Smits, Sabas, Mutombo and Yao the diffrence is usualy about '2 or 5 centimeters not THAT big-Wilt didnt play against midgets
 
Nikoo said:
I didnt know that Oscar Robertson played during the 90s:D :D

i was refering to David Robertson :D

i guess you are right, Wilt has played in Conan the Destroyer and Shaq has played in...kazzam!!

damn! Wilt's acting is much superior to Shaq's
 
has anyone of u seen wilt play?i mean a full match not just highlights or stats...one thing i can surely compare is their low ft percentage :p
every era had its own big dominant man from george mikan to wilt to kareem to hakeem(technically not physically) and finally to shaq.for me it's very difficult 2 compare.
what i can't overlook about shaq is the fact that everywhere he has played he changed the level of the team from his first year!orlando were a bad team without him-they almost made the playoffs with him(lost 2 the pacers in the tiebreak) the lakers were a mediocre team and became title contenders at once and miami was a team struggling 2 make the playoffs and became champions within 2 years!
 
T.W.Is.M. said:
no!!!!keep sofo here and let him build a dynasty 4 olympiakos:cool:

Aggelopoulos and Gerson want him to stay but if Clippers make him a big offer next summer will he stay? buy-out is only half a million $
 
KokkinosVasilias said:
Aggelopoulos and Gerson want him to stay but if Clippers make him a big offer next summer will he stay? buy-out is only half a million $

According 2 this article:
http://www.contra.gr/Basketball/Hellas/A1Basket/Olympiacos/128753.html
Sofo plans 2 stay in Greece probably 4 the next couple of seasons.
The Clippers have already offered him a contract twice this summer but he rejected it.It seems that after seeing his career one step from disaster Sofo has been shaken, he takes right decisions and works hard.
So the next Shaq may come from Greece:p
 
No, he is not on my top five but others may make a case about this. My personal top five would be:

#1 Michael Jordan
#2 Bill Russell
#3 Kareem Abdul Jabbar
#4 Magic Johnson
#5 Larry Bird

Maybe O'Neal could be on #6. Shaq and Bryant can fight it out amongst themselves.
 
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