FIBA ASIA Cup Qualifiers

[Artek2]

If a foreigner was both born and raised in the Philippines, isn't it FIBA automatically recognizes that person as a Filipino citizen?

FIBA does not decide what citizenship a player is. It will be the country's laws. I think you might be referring to when FIBA will recognize one as a "local player" or a " naturalized" player. But that will also be dependent on a country's citizenship laws
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[JAMSKIE2]

If a foreigner was both born and raised in the Philippines, isn't it FIBA automatically recognizes that person as a Filipino citizen?

I think FIBA would recognize that player as a local Filipino player but since jos soli does not apply to us, that person is not a Filipino citizen. I think that is the case of Alex Compton. He was born here in the Phi (both his mom & dad are not Filipinos), but he is not recognize as a Filipino citizen

 

[DAdmiral2]

Well, but there are those indigenous tribes here in the Philippines who have no documents that will prove that they are Filipino citizens.

I think they will be considered Filipino citizens becoz they belong to a tribe that is idenfied as having been existing here in the Philippines. It is assumed nalang that the parents of these people are Filipinos.

Even in that case , there is documentation (pictures in the Philippines) that they're based in the Philippines, now if someone who's ancestor moved overseas, and can't show any documentation he's really from that tribe. then wala. the bottomline is there has still to be a form of verifiable proof document to one's roots

 

[ja.he2]

If a foreigner was both born and raised in the Philippines, isn't it FIBA automatically recognizes that person as a Filipino citizen?

He needs a PH passport if he wants to have fighting chance to be exempted.

 

[Artek2]

Well, but there are those indigenous tribes here in the Philippines who have no documents that will prove that they are Filipino citizens.

Like which tribe? Care to specify? The lack of documentation has more to do with economic standing than indiginiety. There are many non-indigenous people whose parents did not bother to register them. Again, this is why the late registration exist. It is to accomodate these people.

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I think they will be considered Filipino citizens becoz they belong to a tribe that is idenfied as having been existing here in the Philippines. It is assumed nalang that the parents of these people are Filipinos.

That's like saying "pure" ethnic Chinese should not be Filipinos because their "tribe" is from China, not the Philippines

 

[ja.he2]

On my part, I want us to use our citizenship laws into our advantage. Our own domestic laws play a factor here since one cannot secure a passport or a document without compliance of laws, rules or orders. Other countries do it so should we.

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[Artek2]

Even in that case , there is documentation (pictures in the Philippines) that they're based in the Philippines, now if someone who's ancestor moved overseas, and can't show any documentation he's really from that tribe. then wala. the bottomline is there has still to be a form of verifiable proof document to one's roots

This is true. I have Igorot relatives abroad who cannot claim PH citizenship because their parents were no longer PH citizens and their indiginiety does not exempt them

 

[Artek2]

I'd like to point put that at one point in time, the Philippines was at one time following Jus Soli. So everyone born in the Philippines are citizens. It was only on the Commonwealth era that this change. So if your family has been in the PH before the 1930s, you are a citizen.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

Will you recognize Brownlee's grandkids as having "dugong Pinoy" because they will be natural-born Filipinos even if JBLs children marry a fellow Black American but decides to keep and pass their PH citizenship?

A child of a naturalized citizen is a natural-born citizen.

I'm not complicating things. That is how the law works.

My mom is a naturalized Filipino even if her parents were natural-born Filipinos. Why? My grandfather became a naturalized US citizen and at the time of her birth, dual citizenship was NOT allowed so my mom was registered as a US citizen, not Filipino citizen. My mom naturalized as Filipino so she can take a board exam.

Brownlee's case being a naturalized Filipino citizen his child or children becoming a natural born Filipinos, I think its a special case. That's why we have a strict & lengthy naturalization process that it have to either go thru a legislative process or by means of a presidential decree. Hindi tayo basta basta naga grant ng Filipino naturalization citizenship without strong justification. And most natiralized Filipinos we have now were granted Pinoy citizenship becoz they will be of significant help for our sports as in the cases of Chip Engelland, Marcus Douthit, Dray Blatche, Brownlee, Akiko Thompson.

 

[deku_midoriya2]

Hagop u16 rule is so brilliant that it acts to filter out mercenaries to be classified as local. Countries should spend and develop players.

I blame our federation for not convincing u16s hoopers to get passports. Thats the least they could do.

Also lets not kid ourselves. FIBA gave qatar this special exemptions because they are hosting the world cup.

 

[zairex2]

BTW to add , we also don't even know if Koaume's exception is even being perued , so it's pointless to compare with a harris, as Harris case for exception was filed and pushed , not necessarily true for Kouame.

Based on MVP spending and doing everything for Gilas, I think it easy to side with the notion that they did push it but FIBA didn't allow Koume to be local. What logical reason would MVP had to not pushed for Koume.

 

[JAMSKIE2]

Like which tribe? Care to specify? The lack of documentation has more to do with economic standing than indiginiety. There are many non-indigenous people whose parents did not bother to register them. Again, this is why the late registration exist. It is to accomodate these people.

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That's like saying "pure" ethnic Chinese should not be Filipinos because their "tribe" is from China, not the Philippines

I think we have a lot of Aetas who don't have birth certificates as of this moment. So even if perhaps they do make late registration, how will authorities determine that yung parents nila are Filipinos since there's no document to confirm it.

I say our authorities just assume nalang that since the Aeta tribe is very much identified as Filipinos & since those Aetas have lived in this country for several years, then they should be considered Filipino citizens.

 

[ja.he2]

One has to realize this. FIBA is not probably looking for lineage because what they is the federation itself and its program. So whoever comes out in that program, naturalized or otherwise, they are part of products of the program.

For instance, Abasi spent most of his life in Taiwan. FIBA sees him as a product of Taiwan - of the federation and its program. Same with Newsome, since he is already here for a long period of time, FIBA deems him a part of Philippines's product.

That's how I think FIBA sees it.

 

[Artek2]

That's right. The power of paperwork. That's why making DNA test as the determinant of citizenship is quite ridiculous.

It can determine parentage but not the citizenship.

Even more ridiculous once you learn that indigenous Taiwanese , Malagasy people, Chamorros, people from Sulawesi will be labeled as "Filipino and Austronesian" by DNA tests.

 

[zairex2]

While some might think we're discussing un important things and semantics , it REALLY is NOT in the context of arguing an individual like Clarkson should really be able to play based on meron dugong Pinoy with no establish document to support his parents or grand parents were ever Philippine citizens . It matters alot . and it makes the efforts to get Clarkson exempted quite a joke , really.

Clarkson's mother was still recognized by our law as Filipino because she didn't perform a performative action to say he would relinquish her Filipino Citizenship. Hence, Clarkson, upon birth, could be recognized as Filipino. That's why he has a Filipino passport.

Did someone told you otherwise.

 

[zairex2]

I think we have a lot of Aetas who don't have birth certificates as of this moment. So even if perhaps they do make late registration, how will authorities determine that yung parents nila are Filipinos since there's no document to confirm it.

I say our authorities just assume nalang that since the Aeta tribe is very much identified as Filipinos & since those Aetas have lived in this country for several years, then they should be considered Filipino citizens.

You're correct. A lot of people loss their birth certificate during WW2 and also a lot didn't register their birth. PSA will investigate and talk to people in your village to find out if you have been living in the Philippines. It is not an exact science but unless some other documents that you are not a Filipino like Alice Go then PSA will approve your status.

 

[Artek2]

On my part, I want us to use our citizenship laws into our advantage. Our own domestic laws play a factor here since one cannot secure a passport or a document without compliance of laws, rules or orders. Other countries do it so should we.

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These documentation even becomes more important for those people abroad claiming PH citizenship. There is a way higher chance that one loses their PH when abroad than when living in the PH0

 

[Artek2]

That's right. The power of paperwork. That's why making DNA test as the determinant of citizenship is quite r!diculous.

It can determine parentage but not the citizenship.

Even more absurd once you learn that indigenous Taiwanese , Malagasy people, Chamorros, people from Sulawesi will be labeled as "Filipino and Austronesian" by genetic tests.​

 

[Artek2]

On my part, I want us to use our citizenship laws into our advantage. Our own domestic laws play a factor here since one cannot secure a passport or a document without compliance of laws, rules or orders. Other countries do it so should we.

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You did not answer the question. Since you claimed earlier that "dugong Pinoy" is having a natural-born parent, then it follows that JBLs natural-born citizen grandkids will be "dugong Pinoy"

If you exempt JBLs grandkids from "dugong Pinoy", this just shows that your interpretation of "dugong Pinoy" is not based on being natural born but is in relation to ethnicity or even race. This belies your claim earlier that "dugong Pinoy" is in relation to being "natural born citizens".

And JBLs case is not "special". Many ethnic Chinese had parents or even grandparents who naturalized. The only difference is JBL is of Black American origin

 

[JAMSKIE2]

That's like saying "pure" ethnic Chinese should not be Filipinos because their "tribe" is from China, not the Philippines

Bro, you're missing my point. Your problem is you're digging deeper than U should. My point there was in the absence of documents or material proof that these indigenous people as well as their parents are/were Filipinos, our authorities would just assume that they are legit Filipino citizens becoz they belong to a tribe being identified as to have existed in the Philippines since time immemorial. This is a special case becoz if our authorities would not consider them Filipinos then they must be deported.

For U to conclude that its me like saying pure ethnic Chinese should not be considered Filipinos because their tribe is from China is a complete non sense becoz that's not what I'm implying.

BTW, how can I not consider some ethnic Chinese living here in the Philippines not Filipino citizens when I'm aware that Chinese are part of ethnic minority here in the Philippines? Kaya nga may China Town tayo eh. Even in our province marami talaga dito ang full-blooded Chinese who are legit Filipino citizens.